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This is to finish the purgatory segment which hardly got started but this will

wrap it up. All souls day is that particular day the Catholic Church offers

prayers and liturgies for the repose of the dead.

 

As Catholics, we are called by the Church to focus our spiritual energies to

assist these poor souls, who, though saved, are still in need of purification.

Our prayers and sacrifices assist them in this process of purification as a

means used by God to communicate purifying grace to them. After all,

He is the vine, we are the branches so that He produces his fruits of grace

through us.

 

The practice of praying for the dead actually predates Christianity. In 2 Maccabees 12: 41-45, Judas offers prayers and sacrifices for his fallen comrades to make “atonement for the dead that they might be absolved from their sin.” Some argue that the books of the Maccabees are not inspired scripture. Leaving that argument aside for now, we can at least look at them as historical books detailing accepted pious practices of God’s people some 300 years before Christ.

 

If that is the only place in the Bible where we find any reference to purgatory, many Protestant Christians argue, then that is a weak support for such a practice. Fortunately, we know as Catholics that all of our doctrines are indeed found in the Word of God, as is the doctrine of Purgatory. Hence what follows is a biblical understanding of the Catholic doctrine of Purgatory.

 

The book of Genesis recounts for us the far reaching repercussions of Adam and Eve’s disobedience in the Garden. This sin, we find, brought about four consequences which I will summarize here (Gen 3: 16-24):

 

First, their sin brings about disharmony between persons. God tells Eve that both her relationship to her husband and children will now be characterized by pain and mistrust (Gen 3:16). Further, God has to make garments for man and woman because now, as the text implies, they feel shame (Gen 3:21).

 

Second, their sin brings about disharmony between man and creation. God tells Adam that he will produce the fruit of the earth with toil and difficulty (Gen 3: 17). Even the ground itself is cursed because of their sin (Gen 3: 17).

 

Third, their sin brings about disharmony between man and himself. He no longer has spiritual control over his body; thus, his body returns to the dust of the ground (Gen 3: 19). Adam and Eve are no longer able to receive everlasting life (Gen 3: 22).

 

Lastly and most importantly, sin brings disharmony between God and man. This consequence results in mistrust and fear of God (Gen 3: 10), and, worse, spiritual death. Without God, neither physical nor spiritual life can be sustained (Gen 3: 19, 24).

 

The first three disharmonies mentioned above are called ‘Temporal punishments due to sin.’ Temporal refers to things pertaining to this world. The last disharmony, the disharmony with God, is called eternal punishment, because it refers to things pertaining to the eternal world with God.

 

All four of these disharmonies are healed by Christ. The only healing we experience fully in this life, however, is from eternal punishment–or disharmony with God. That’s why Christ is the One Mediator between God and man.

 

It should be clear that we don’t experience a full healing from the temporal disharmonies/punishments as Christians, because we still struggle. We experience suffering, illness, catastrophes, and even death. Yet, Christ heals these problems, too, it’s just that we don’t experience the full healing in the temporal sphere until He returns.

 

Until then, we are called to struggle for His Kingdom. As St. Paul puts it, “But we have this treasure (the healing grace of salvation) in earthen vessels, to show that the transcendent power belongs to God and not to us. We are afflicted in every way but not crushed; perplexed, but not driven to despair; persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed; always carrying around in the body the death of Jesus, so that the life of Jesus may also be manifested in our bodies.” (2 Cor 7-10)

 

To overcome these temporal disharmonies, we are called to cooperate with Christ’s power in grace so as to bring about the healing with Him in these areas. This is why we are called to pray, fast, and alms give so as to forgive our neighbor’s sins and be forgiven, and to receive the reward promised by our heavenly Father that we will once again regain temporal peace/harmony on earth and in heaven (Mt 6:5-23).

 

What happens if we die and are reconciled to God (the eternal punishment for sin), but have not entirely cooperated with grace to overcome the temporal punishments for sin? St. Paul gives us the answer in 1 Cor 3: 12-16. He says that after death, our works will be tested “as though by fire, and the fire will test what kind of work we have done,” and we will suffer loss, though we will still be saved (1 Cor 3:13-15).

 

This is a very clear passage regarding the purification (which we call purgatory) that takes place after death. This fire purifies us from our temporal disharmonies mentioned above, if we die without having them entirely purified in this life.

 

I mentioned earlier the explicit biblical reference to this in 2 Maccabees 12: 41-45. When Luther read this passage, he so disagreed with it that he removed it from the Bible. He believed that he had the authority to do this, although he didn’t believe anyone else had this authority. Where does the Bible say that Luther has the authority to do this? It doesn’t.

 

By his own standard, he had no authority to remove any book from the bible. This book was included in the Septuagint, the Bible used by Jesus.

 

Thus, Purgatory is how our temporal disharmonies are cleansed after death, should we not cooperate with grace to achieve purification before death.

 

In his letter to the Colossians, St. Paul teaches that our sufferings can be united to the sufferings of Christ in order to benefit other members of His Mystical Body (Col 1: 24). From this it follows that the prayers and sacrifices of the faithful can be offered to assist other members of the Mystical Body of Christ (see 1 Cor 12:26).

 

Therefore, the prayers and sacrifices, especially the sacrifice of Holy Mass which is the purpose of All Souls Day, offered for the souls in Purgatory, which bring the grace of Christ to these souls to heal their temporal consequences after death, is biblical. Pray for those in Purgatory, but also make the resolution not to waste any time here on earth!

 

http://www.prayerandperspectiv...atory-and-the-bible/

 

 

 

 

 

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Vic & Chick, my dear dance team Friends,

 

Sorry to disappoint you both.  But such blatant false teachings must be exposed.

 

Vic, your mystery writer whom you copy/pasted (and even without your period - what a pregnant idea!) tells us:

 

This is to finish the purgatory segment which hardly got started but this will wrap it up.  All souls day is that particular day the Catholic Church offers prayers and liturgies for the repose of the dead.

 

Please show us in the Bible, all 66 books, where we can find purgatory -- and where God tells us to pray for that dead -- or even that it will do any good to pray for the dead.  

 

If a person does not become a Christian believer in this life -- there is NO SECOND CHANCE once he/she has left this mortal body and gone into eternity.  With your last breath -- goes your last chance to choose to follow Christ.  If you have not -- then, you will spend eternity in hell.  That is what the Bible teaches.

 

Then, your mystery writer tells us:

 

The practice of praying for the dead actually predates Christianity.  In 2 Maccabees 12: 41-45. . . 

 

Well, there you have it!   Praying for the dead is NOT in the Bible -- it is only found in the Roman Catholic Apocrypha and in Vatican writings.

 

My Friends, IF you want to have eternal life in Christ, in the presence of God the Father -- you better get right with Him in this life.   Otherwise, you are just "spitting into the wind!"

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Bible - 66 BOOKS

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Originally Posted by INVICTUS:

This is to finish the purgatory segment which hardly got started but this will

wrap it up. All souls day is that particular day the Catholic Church offers

prayers and liturgies for the repose of the dead.

 

As Catholics, we are called by the Church to focus our spiritual energies to

assist these poor souls, who, though saved, are still in need of purification.

Our prayers and sacrifices assist them in this process of purification as a

means used by God to communicate purifying grace to them. After all,

He is the vine, we are the branches so that He produces his fruits of grace

through us.

 

The practice of praying for the dead actually predates Christianity. In 2 Maccabees 12: 41-45, Judas offers prayers and sacrifices for his fallen comrades to make “atonement for the dead that they might be absolved from their sin.” Some argue that the books of the Maccabees are not inspired scripture. Leaving that argument aside for now, we can at least look at them as historical books detailing accepted pious practices of God’s people some 300 years before Christ.

 

If that is the only place in the Bible where we find any reference to purgatory, many Protestant Christians argue, then that is a weak support for such a practice. Fortunately, we know as Catholics that all of our doctrines are indeed found in the Word of God, as is the doctrine of Purgatory. Hence what follows is a biblical understanding of the Catholic doctrine of Purgatory.

 

The book of Genesis recounts for us the far reaching repercussions of Adam and Eve’s disobedience in the Garden. This sin, we find, brought about four consequences which I will summarize here (Gen 3: 16-24):

 

First, their sin brings about disharmony between persons. God tells Eve that both her relationship to her husband and children will now be characterized by pain and mistrust (Gen 3:16). Further, God has to make garments for man and woman because now, as the text implies, they feel shame (Gen 3:21).

 

Second, their sin brings about disharmony between man and creation. God tells Adam that he will produce the fruit of the earth with toil and difficulty (Gen 3: 17). Even the ground itself is cursed because of their sin (Gen 3: 17).

 

Third, their sin brings about disharmony between man and himself. He no longer has spiritual control over his body; thus, his body returns to the dust of the ground (Gen 3: 19). Adam and Eve are no longer able to receive everlasting life (Gen 3: 22).

 

Lastly and most importantly, sin brings disharmony between God and man. This consequence results in mistrust and fear of God (Gen 3: 10), and, worse, spiritual death. Without God, neither physical nor spiritual life can be sustained (Gen 3: 19, 24).

 

The first three disharmonies mentioned above are called ‘Temporal punishments due to sin.’ Temporal refers to things pertaining to this world. The last disharmony, the disharmony with God, is called eternal punishment, because it refers to things pertaining to the eternal world with God.

 

All four of these disharmonies are healed by Christ. The only healing we experience fully in this life, however, is from eternal punishment–or disharmony with God. That’s why Christ is the One Mediator between God and man.

 

It should be clear that we don’t experience a full healing from the temporal disharmonies/punishments as Christians, because we still struggle. We experience suffering, illness, catastrophes, and even death. Yet, Christ heals these problems, too, it’s just that we don’t experience the full healing in the temporal sphere until He returns.

 

Until then, we are called to struggle for His Kingdom. As St. Paul puts it, “But we have this treasure (the healing grace of salvation) in earthen vessels, to show that the transcendent power belongs to God and not to us. We are afflicted in every way but not crushed; perplexed, but not driven to despair; persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed; always carrying around in the body the death of Jesus, so that the life of Jesus may also be manifested in our bodies.” (2 Cor 7-10)

 

To overcome these temporal disharmonies, we are called to cooperate with Christ’s power in grace so as to bring about the healing with Him in these areas. This is why we are called to pray, fast, and alms give so as to forgive our neighbor’s sins and be forgiven, and to receive the reward promised by our heavenly Father that we will once again regain temporal peace/harmony on earth and in heaven (Mt 6:5-23).

 

What happens if we die and are reconciled to God (the eternal punishment for sin), but have not entirely cooperated with grace to overcome the temporal punishments for sin? St. Paul gives us the answer in 1 Cor 3: 12-16. He says that after death, our works will be tested “as though by fire, and the fire will test what kind of work we have done,” and we will suffer loss, though we will still be saved (1 Cor 3:13-15).

 

This is a very clear passage regarding the purification (which we call purgatory) that takes place after death. This fire purifies us from our temporal disharmonies mentioned above, if we die without having them entirely purified in this life.

 

I mentioned earlier the explicit biblical reference to this in 2 Maccabees 12: 41-45. When Luther read this passage, he so disagreed with it that he removed it from the Bible. He believed that he had the authority to do this, although he didn’t believe anyone else had this authority. Where does the Bible say that Luther has the authority to do this? It doesn’t.

 

By his own standard, he had no authority to remove any book from the bible. This book was included in the Septuagint, the Bible used by Jesus.

 

Thus, Purgatory is how our temporal disharmonies are cleansed after death, should we not cooperate with grace to achieve purification before death.

 

In his letter to the Colossians, St. Paul teaches that our sufferings can be united to the sufferings of Christ in order to benefit other members of His Mystical Body (Col 1: 24). From this it follows that the prayers and sacrifices of the faithful can be offered to assist other members of the Mystical Body of Christ (see 1 Cor 12:26).

 

Therefore, the prayers and sacrifices, especially the sacrifice of Holy Mass which is the purpose of All Souls Day, offered for the souls in Purgatory, which bring the grace of Christ to these souls to heal their temporal consequences after death, is biblical. Pray for those in Purgatory, but also make the resolution not to waste any time here on earth!

 

http://www.prayerandperspectiv...atory-and-the-bible/

 

Paul does offer a well taken note here.......

 

 In his letter to the Colossians, St. Paul teaches that our sufferings can be united to the sufferings of Christ in order to benefit other members of His Mystical Body (Col 1: 24). From this it follows that the prayers and sacrifices of the faithful can be offered to assist other members of the Mystical Body of Christ (see 1 Cor 12:26).

 

 

 

If prayer is effective in bailing out those poor suffering souls in Purgatory, why designate one special day to this effort?  Why not have marathon prayers every day for every such person sweating it out to get "purified" in preparation for graduation to Heaven?

 

I encourage forum participants to look up those two scriptures you cite (Col 1: 24; 1 Cor 12:26) and advise us just how in thunder they can rationally be interpreted as remotely validating the heretical concept of Purgatory.  Note also that your formal, capitalized term "Mystical Body," which you associate with both passages, does not appear in either or  anywhere else in the entire New Testament Another unnecessary piece of Catholic vocabulary clutter!

Originally Posted by Contendah:

If prayer is effective in bailing out those poor suffering souls in Purgatory, why designate one special day to this effort?  Why not have marathon prayers every day for every such person sweating it out to get "purified" in preparation for graduation to Heaven?

 

I encourage forum participants to look up those two scriptures you cite (Col 1: 24; 1 Cor 12:26) and advise us just how in thunder they can rationally be interpreted as remotely validating the heretical concept of Purgatory.  Note also that your formal, capitalized term "Mystical Body," which you associate with both passages, does not appear in either or  anywhere else in the entire New Testament Another unnecessary piece of Catholic vocabulary clutter!

What you don't know you don't know. Actually that's not the biggest day.

It's just "a" day designated to all souls but it does go on everyday of the

year. All day since long before Christ the Jews knew this and for some

reason these first Christian apostles continued with it to the present day.

 

Why don't you, Contendah help the forum participants with the understanding

of those two scriptures? Col 1: 24 and 1 Cor 12: 26. Mainly Col 1: 24.

 

quote:  Originally Posted by INVICTUS: 

 

 Paul does offer a well taken note here.......  In his letter to the Colossians, St. Paul teaches that our sufferings can be united to the sufferings of Christ in order to benefit other members of His Mystical Body (Col 1: 24). From this it follows that the prayers and sacrifices of the faithful can be offered to assist other members of the Mystical Body of Christ (see 1 Cor 12:26).

Vic, my Friend, 

 

First, since your original posts are always copy/paste versions of the writings of some mysterious writer and my be long -- you do not have to continue to copy/paste, one, two, three, four times -- the same redundant plagiarism.

 

That said, let's take a look at what YOU wrote:

 

In his letter to the Colossians, St. Paul teaches that our sufferings can be united to the sufferings of Christ in order to benefit other members of His Mystical Body (Col 1: 24). 

 

Let's look at that verse and the surrounding passage:

 

Colossians 1:24-27, "Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I do my share on behalf of His body, which is the church, in filling up what is lacking in Christ's afflictions.   (25) Of this church I was made a minister according to the stewardship from God bestowed on me for your benefit, so that I might fully carry out the preaching of the word of God, (26) that is, the mystery which has been hidden from the past ages and generations, but has now been manifested to His saints,  (27) to whom God willed to make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory."   

 

What you seem to want to call His Mystical Body -- is what Paul is calling the mystery which was hidden in the Old Testament, i.e., the church, worldwide body of Christian believers.

 

Nothing here about Purgatory or praying for the dead.

 

Then, you suggest:

 

From this it follows that the prayers and sacrifices of the faithful can be offered to assist other members of the Mystical Body of Christ (see 1 Cor 12:26).

 

Let's take a look a that verse and the surrounding passages:

 

1 Corinthians 12:12-14, "For even as the body (the church) is one and yet has many members, and all the members of the body, though they are many, are one body, so also is Christ. (13) For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit. (14) For the body (the church) is not one member, but many. "


1 Corinthians 12:25-27, "So that there may be no division in the body (the church), but that the members may have the same care for one another. (26) And if one member suffers, all the members suffer with it; if one member is honored, all the members rejoice with it. (27) Now you are Christ's body (the church), and individually members of it."

 

 Once again, my Friend, nothing here about Purgatory or praying for the dead.

 

In both Scripture passages Paul is dealing with the living church, the body of all Christian believers who are living in Christ.

 

In 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 Paul deals first with those Christian believers who have died, i.e., who sleep.  When they died, their bodies went into the grave -- but, they, their soul and spirit, went immediately into the heavenly presence of Jesus Christ.

 

How do we know this?  Glad you asked.

 

1 Thessalonians 4:13-14, "But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope.  (14) For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus."

 

When Jesus Christ returns in the clouds to Rapture His church (1 Thessalonians 4:15-18) -- those who have died as believers, i.e., died in Christ, will be with him to be reunited in their now immortal bodies.

 

So, absolutely NO reason to pray for the dead.  Dead believers are with Christ right now in heaven.  And dead non-believers are in Hades/Torment awaiting their Great White Throne Judgment - then to be ushered into eternal hell.  

 

We do not need to pray for those already in heaven.  And, it will do no good to pray for those destined for hell.

 

So, once more -- no Purgatory and no need to pray for the dead.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

 

1 John 5-13 - Bible Inspired By God

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Vic, my Friend,

 

One last thought.   Your mystery writer tells us:

 

"As Catholics, we are called by the Church to focus our spiritual energies . . . "

 

Christian believers are called by God.   But, according to your mystery writer -- Roman Catholics are NOT called by God -- but are called by the Roman Catholic church, i.e., the Vatican.

 

My Friend, there is a huge difference between being called by a man-made organization -- and being called by God.   Personally, I am happy to acknowledge to the world that I have been called by God -- and ONLY GOD.

 

With that, I have the assurance of spending eternity WITH GOD.  While it would appear that our Roman Catholic Friends are only assured of spending eternity with the Roman Catholic church.  In the latter situation -- the question has to be:  Where will they be spending eternity?  Just a thought.  But, one which should be given great consideration.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

 

1 - Jeremiah 17-7

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Last edited by Bill Gray
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by Contendah:

If prayer is effective in bailing out those poor suffering souls in Purgatory, why designate one special day to this effort?  Why not have marathon prayers every day for every such person sweating it out to get "purified" in preparation for graduation to Heaven?

 

I encourage forum participants to look up those two scriptures you cite (Col 1: 24; 1 Cor 12:26) and advise us just how in thunder they can rationally be interpreted as remotely validating the heretical concept of Purgatory.  Note also that your formal, capitalized term "Mystical Body," which you associate with both passages, does not appear in either or  anywhere else in the entire New Testament Another unnecessary piece of Catholic vocabulary clutter!

What you don't know you don't know. Actually that's not the biggest day.

It's just "a" day designated to all souls but it does go on everyday of the

year. All day since long before Christ the Jews knew this and for some

reason these first Christian apostles continued with it to the present day.

 

Why don't you, Contendah help the forum participants with the understanding

of those two scriptures? Col 1: 24 and 1 Cor 12: 26. Mainly Col 1: 24.

 

 

Vic, my Friend,

 

You ask Contendah:

 

Why don't you, Contendah help the forum participants with the understanding of those two scriptures? Col 1: 24 and 1 Cor 12: 26. Mainly Col 1: 24.

 

No need for Contendah to do that -- I already did.  All you have to do is visit your last post -- THEN LOOK UP -- and you will see my full explanation of those Scripture passages.

 

AND, you will notice that nowhere in there do we find Purgatory or praying for the dead.

 

Matter of fact, even your mystery writer could not quote the Bible to prove Purgatory and praying for he dead.  He had to revert back to the ONLY proof of Roman Catholic doctrines to be found -- the Apocrypha!

 

He writes:

 

In 2 Maccabees 12: 41-45, Judas offers prayers and sacrifices for his fallen comrades to make “atonement for the dead that they might be absolved from their sin.” 

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Bible - 66 BOOKS

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Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by Contendah:

If prayer is effective in bailing out those poor suffering souls in Purgatory, why designate one special day to this effort?  Why not have marathon prayers every day for every such person sweating it out to get "purified" in preparation for graduation to Heaven?

 

I encourage forum participants to look up those two scriptures you cite (Col 1: 24; 1 Cor 12:26) and advise us just how in thunder they can rationally be interpreted as remotely validating the heretical concept of Purgatory.  Note also that your formal, capitalized term "Mystical Body," which you associate with both passages, does not appear in either or  anywhere else in the entire New Testament Another unnecessary piece of Catholic vocabulary clutter!

What you don't know you don't know. Actually that's not the biggest day.

It's just "a" day designated to all souls but it does go on everyday of the

year. All day since long before Christ the Jews knew this and for some

reason these first Christian apostles continued with it to the present day.

 

Why don't you, Contendah help the forum participants with the understanding

of those two scriptures? Col 1: 24 and 1 Cor 12: 26. Mainly Col 1: 24.

 

 

 

Vic, my Friend,

 

So, you are going to be childish -- and claim that you did not see my post? Then, why did you copy/paste your same post again?   

 

You, my Friend, are like the small child laying on the floor and throwing a tantrum.

 

And, obviously no one can have an adult dialogue with a small child rolling on the floor and screaming.

 

Bless your childish little heart!

 

Bill

Baby-Boy-Crying

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Last edited by Bill Gray
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by Contendah:

If prayer is effective in bailing out those poor suffering souls in Purgatory, why designate one special day to this effort?  Why not have marathon prayers every day for every such person sweating it out to get "purified" in preparation for graduation to Heaven?

 

I encourage forum participants to look up those two scriptures you cite (Col 1: 24; 1 Cor 12:26) and advise us just how in thunder they can rationally be interpreted as remotely validating the heretical concept of Purgatory.  Note also that your formal, capitalized term "Mystical Body," which you associate with both passages, does not appear in either or  anywhere else in the entire New Testament Another unnecessary piece of Catholic vocabulary clutter!

What you don't know you don't know. Actually that's not the biggest day.

It's just "a" day designated to all souls but it does go on everyday of the

year. All day since long before Christ the Jews knew this and for some

reason these first Christian apostles continued with it to the present day.

 

Why don't you, Contendah help the forum participants with the understanding

of those two scriptures? Col 1: 24 and 1 Cor 12: 26. Mainly Col 1: 24.

 

 

 

 

Originally Posted by Contendah:

If prayer is effective in bailing out those poor suffering souls in Purgatory, why designate one special day to this effort?  Why not have marathon prayers every day for every such person sweating it out to get "purified" in preparation for graduation to Heaven?

______________
It makes the accounting easier. 
Originally Posted by CrustyMac:
Originally Posted by Contendah:

If prayer is effective in bailing out those poor suffering souls in Purgatory, why designate one special day to this effort?  Why not have marathon prayers every day for every such person sweating it out to get "purified" in preparation for graduation to Heaven?

______________
It makes the accounting easier. 

Now the accounting of it can be tough, but not as tough as trying to make

that Bible say something different than what it was meant to say.

The encouragement to help the participants with the verses you pointed

out Contendah still holds. Now if only you could keep your puke eating dog 

billiee on the porch. I didn't claim that I didn't see your post dog, I claim to

ignore it

 

 

Hi all,

 

Well, there you have it, my Friends.   Show Vic the Truth of the Bible -- and he will choose to ignore it!

 

He would rather believe what his god, the Pope, and his heaven, the Vatican, teaches -- rather than what is written in God's Word, the Bible. 

 

It would appear that his motto in life is:  "Don't Bother Me With Facts -- I Believe What I Have Been Told To Believe!"   Good luck!

 

Bless his blindfolded little heart!

 

Bill

Bible Clarity Or Sin

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Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by Contendah:

If prayer is effective in bailing out those poor suffering souls in Purgatory, why designate one special day to this effort?  Why not have marathon prayers every day for every such person sweating it out to get "purified" in preparation for graduation to Heaven?

 

I encourage forum participants to look up those two scriptures you cite (Col 1: 24; 1 Cor 12:26) and advise us just how in thunder they can rationally be interpreted as remotely validating the heretical concept of Purgatory.  Note also that your formal, capitalized term "Mystical Body," which you associate with both passages, does not appear in either or  anywhere else in the entire New Testament Another unnecessary piece of Catholic vocabulary clutter!

What you don't know you don't know. Actually that's not the biggest day.

It's just "a" day designated to all souls but it does go on everyday of the

year. All day since long before Christ the Jews knew this and for some

reason these first Christian apostles continued with it to the present day.

 

Why don't you, Contendah help the forum participants with the understanding

of those two scriptures? Col 1: 24 and 1 Cor 12: 26. Mainly Col 1: 24.

 

___

You brought those scriptures up but you did nothing whatsoever with them to support your Purgotoriness. Why don't YOU show the forum how either of those scriptures has ANYTHING to do with  the supposed Purgatory?

 

 

 

 

 

Originally Posted by Contendah:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
Originally Posted by Contendah:

If prayer is effective in bailing out those poor suffering souls in Purgatory, why designate one special day to this effort?  Why not have marathon prayers every day for every such person sweating it out to get "purified" in preparation for graduation to Heaven?

 

I encourage forum participants to look up those two scriptures you cite (Col 1: 24; 1 Cor 12:26) and advise us just how in thunder they can rationally be interpreted as remotely validating the heretical concept of Purgatory.  Note also that your formal, capitalized term "Mystical Body," which you associate with both passages, does not appear in either or  anywhere else in the entire New Testament Another unnecessary piece of Catholic vocabulary clutter!

What you don't know you don't know. Actually that's not the biggest day.

It's just "a" day designated to all souls but it does go on everyday of the

year. All day since long before Christ the Jews knew this and for some

reason these first Christian apostles continued with it to the present day.

 

Why don't you, Contendah help the forum participants with the understanding

of those two scriptures? Col 1: 24 and 1 Cor 12: 26. Mainly Col 1: 24.

 

___

You brought those scriptures up but you did nothing whatsoever with them to support your Purgotoriness. Why don't YOU show the forum how either of those scriptures has ANYTHING to do with  the supposed Purgatory?

 

----------------------------------

You're the one saw fit to direct everyone to reading those scriptures.

I thought you were going to enlighten the unenlightened............huh

 

 

 

 

 

 

Invictus blithers thusly:

 

"You're the one saw fit to direct everyone to reading those scriptures.

I thought you were going to enlighten the unenlightened............huh"

 

LOL!

'Huh' your own self.  It was YOU who introduced those two scriptures in alleged support of your defense of the concept of Purgatory.  It was YOU who provided absolutely zero interpretive or

 explanatory basis for that claim.  It is YOU, therefore, who need to put up or shut up. 

 

 

Last edited by Contendah
Originally Posted by Contendah:

Invictus blithers thusly:

 

"You're the one saw fit to direct everyone to reading those scriptures.

I thought you were going to enlighten the unenlightened............huh"

 

LOL!

'Huh' your own self.  It was YOU who introduced those two scriptures in alleged support of your defense of the concept of Purgatory.  It was YOU who provided absolutely zero interpretive or

 explanatory basis for that claim.  It is YOU, therefore, who need to put up or shut up. 

 

Phase two, they get nasty freaky, read the thread, it will tell you all you

don't want to know about it. You started directing traffic and didn't back up

your comment. I was happy to discuss it with you until you did your

azz hole impression, which I should've remembered you always do.

 

I did put up, you just don't know what the hell to say next, or you would've

already...........You didn't put up a damm thing except your snotty nose.

 

Hi all,

 

There is a simple solution to this "You said, no you said" dilemma.  Since Vic first introduced the Scripture passages Colossians 1: 24 and 1 Corinthians 12: 26 into this discussion of Purgatory and Praying For The Dead -- I suggest that Vic make the effort of explaining, in his own words and thoughts -- where he finds those issues in those verses, or anywhere in the full 66 books of Scripture - and how they prove Purgatory and Praying For The Dead.

 

Vic, my Friend, if you can prove, from the entire 66 books of the Bible -- how Purgatory and Praying For The Dead are supported in Scripture; then it would behoove Contendah to apologize and accept your explanation.

 

If not, then obviously Contendah is right -- and you need to rethink your view and understanding of God's Written Word, the Bible.

 

Sounds like a workable solution to me.   So, how about it, Vic, are you up to sharing your thoughts on Colossians 1: 24 and 1 Corinthians 12: 26?

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill 

Bible Inspired By God

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  • Bible Inspired By God

Upon an attempt to share my thoughts, I was interrupted a few times by the

freaking mindless moron midnight rest stop foot tapping marauder of the

third gender. The broadband wasting bra boy incited his item of partner

into a fury of narcissistic pleasure in which I was dealt from the bottom of

the deck of reform. I choose not to pizz into the breath of a freshly eaten

s*** sandwich.....There will be no make up tests...........huh 

  

Vic, my Friend,

 

I cannot recall when I have ever seen such a childish, first grader, attempt to sound like a big person using words based upon their length -- instead of his understanding of their meaning.  You ramble and rage in words that are longer than you are tall -- and show all the world the true meaning of a really "no-class" person.

 

My Friend, I truly feel sorry for you -- a person with a child's mentality trying to sound like an adult.

 

Oh, well, it takes all kinds to make up the world.   In earlier days, when carnivals and side-shows used to travel to all the small towns -- they always had an attraction called the Geek.  When did you escape?

 

Bless your little geek heart!

 

Bill

Charlie-Brown-Baseball

 

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Originally Posted by INVICTUS:

Upon an attempt to share my thoughts, I was interrupted a few times by the

freaking mindless moron midnight rest stop foot tapping marauder of the

third gender. The broadband wasting bra boy incited his item of partner

into a fury of narcissistic pleasure in which I was dealt from the bottom of

the deck of reform. I choose not to pizz into the breath of a freshly eaten

s*** sandwich.....There will be no make up tests...........huh 

  

 

It appears our resident troll showed his ignorance/confusion of the terms geek, nerd and dweeb... He used the term geek in an attempt to describe Vic in a derogatory fashion and instead showed his own ignorance... These terms have variously be defined as follows:

 

There are many categories of geeks, such as: science geeks, math geeks, computer  geeks, history geeks, gaming geeks,  etc... The contemporary comparison  of "Geek " to other associated descriptive terms is sometimes described in the following manner: Geek: A person that utilizes new technologies to do interesting or useful things. Nerd: Someone that knows all about new technologies as well as popular culture, and collects those things associated with both (and considers them "cool"). Dweeb: Someone confused about exactly what technologies really are, and has less discretion in what they think is cool.

 

Now, is Vic a geek? While not that familiar with Vic but from what I've seen and the definition above, I would say probably yes...

 

Knowing more than I care to know of the resident troll, I would definitely assign him the term dweeb... Duh!

 

 

Last edited by Dove of Peace

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