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Note: This is posted below under a prior nickname, which--for reasons I don't understand-- comes into play when I use Google Chrome.  Google Chrome or Tennessee Valley Talks do not allow me to delete that duplicative post, even within the 10-minute limit, for reasons I don't understand, Those who have been here very long know that I had to change my ID a few months ago, so don't try to accuse me of using two IDs to escape detection or for any other nefarious reason.

 

Meet Scott Prouty, the man who videoed the infamous, all-revealing, elitist-confirming remarks of Mitt Romney at that $50,000-per plate fundraising dinner in a posh San Diego mansion.  Another example of the power that modern technology gives the common man. Prouty used his cell phone to record the offensive remarks of Romney toward those who, he alleged, want nothing more than to feed at the public trough where, presumably, $50,000-per plate food is not available.

 

 http://www.reuters.com/article...dUSBRE92D03M20130314

 

http://www.motherjones.com/pol...uty-47-percent-video

 

Romney's remarks were bad enough, but in the aftermath his squirrelly attempts to distance himself from them just made things worse.  The Bible says, "Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh," and when the Romney mouth spoke about that 47%, it was coming from his elitist heart and there was no way to erase the d**ning effects of that.

 

Scott Prouty--may his tribe increase.  He and his little cell phone did more to influence the election than all the zillions of dollars the Koch Brothers ladled into those pro-Romney PACs. One vigilant citizen probably had more to do with the outcome of the election than did that scheming weasel, Karl Rove.  Here's to the power of the common man!!

 

 

Power to the common man? Wow, that would be nice. Maybe when we toss all the democrats out of office that can finally happen. The only thing you're crowing about is how the truth, as usual, got twisted and used against someone, that twisting the democrats are so good at doing. Elitist? Well, here we go, "so's yer old man". Gee, elitist, that describes a few thousand in the democratic party. Where to start-oh  let's see, kerry? Or soros, the kennedys, who fancy themselves some sort of royalty? Gee, so many to pick from, where do we begin.

Originally Posted by Bestworking:

Power to the common man? Wow, that would be nice. Maybe when we toss all the democrats out of office that can finally happen. The only thing you're crowing about is how the truth, as usual, got twisted and used against someone, that twisting the democrats are so good at doing. Elitist? Well, here we go, "so's yer old man". Gee, elitist, that describes a few thousand in the democratic party. Where to start-oh  let's see, kerry? Or soros, the kennedys, who fancy themselves some sort of royalty? Gee, so many to pick from, where do we begin.

_______________________

right, because the republicans are surely protecting and trying to get new tax breaks for the common corporation! you can't be so blind as to think only one party is responsible for everything. you've become one of those rt. wingnuts who believe everything the republicans tell you.

Originally Posted by F350:

It escapes me how otherwise intelligent persons can buy into a twisted interpretation of a statement simply because it fits their political agenda.


___

The only twisted interpretation is the public one Romney retroactively applied to his private  remarks in a vain effort to bleach out the glaring elitist slant.  Well, not actually a slant--more like a 90-degree dropoff.

WHat he said was true, but the truth hurts and it hurts folks' feeling to know that somone was talking about taking away their entitlements.

Ironically, similar things are said about the "rich" at some of these $3500 a plate fundraising dinners thrown by the Democrats, but it is never played up to the media like this incident.  So kudos to the bartender with a videophone and an overwhelming  need for attention. He is still aloser in my book, and before one of you points out that so is Romney....at least Romney has a large bank account to fall back on.

Originally Posted by teyates:

WHat he said was true, but the truth hurts and it hurts folks' feeling to know that somone was talking about taking away their entitlements.

Ironically, similar things are said about the "rich" at some of these $3500 a plate fundraising dinners thrown by the Democrats, but it is never played up to the media like this incident.  So kudos to the bartender with a videophone and an overwhelming  need for attention. He is still aloser in my book, and before one of you points out that so is Romney....at least Romney has a large bank account to fall back on.

t, i look for you to disappear soon as the new Obama Care will open up so many doors for you to make money you will have to hire somebody to come here a tell us how bad things are While you are crusin the Carribean dressed in a linen suit wearing alligator shoes and sippin mint julips and smokin long cigars on us po folks nickle.

Originally Posted by teyates:

WHat he said was true, but the truth hurts and it hurts folks' feeling to know that somone was talking about taking away their entitlements.

Ironically, similar things are said about the "rich" at some of these $3500 a plate fundraising dinners thrown by the Democrats, but it is never played up to the media like this incident.  So kudos to the bartender with a videophone and an overwhelming  need for attention. He is still aloser in my book, and before one of you points out that so is Romney....at least Romney has a large bank account to fall back on.

___________

Teyates---

Romney did not say that some folks were too lazy to work and just wanted to feed at the public trough; he used that infamous 47% figure. Do you really agree with that? Do you really subscribe to Romney's notion that almost half of all Americans fit that description? If so, then you need to reconsider.

 
Originally Posted by teyates:

WHat he said was true, but the truth hurts and it hurts folks' feeling to know that somone was talking about taking away their entitlements.

Ironically, similar things are said about the "rich" at some of these $3500 a plate fundraising dinners thrown by the Democrats, but it is never played up to the media like this incident.  So kudos to the bartender with a videophone and an overwhelming  need for attention. He is still aloser in my book, and before one of you points out that so is Romney....at least Romney has a large bank account to fall back on.

t, m boy, the citizens owe the rich only one thing and that is to be elected to political office. That's all.

upside,

I think that there is a very large population of this country who think that they are owed something, that they are entitled to things just because they are members of this country.  We can blame it on past generations and administrations who created this problem, but it truly is a problem.

I think that Romney's number was probably derived at the vote count from the past election, which was not statistically different than the one which followed and he probably hit the nail on the head.

Does not matter which party, each of them get into office by making promises and giving away things, whether it be a tax break for a corporation or a cell phone.

The scales are tipping and the producers are slowly being overtaken by the consumers. When that occurs there will be no one to support them, so the system will collapse.

Now I am sure you will tell me I am being fatalistic and pessimistic and things are all rosy and recovering, but from my perspective I do not see this.

The Left have given Ryan a hard time for a budget, that for the record I do not agree with totally, which promises to balance the budget using tax reformation and cutbacks.  Their only proposal is to continue to spend more and make more promises and kick the can down the road.

I am surprised that you do not agree with it.  It reformats Medicare and SS for those under 55, including means testing for those evil rich people who paid into the system but should not be allowed to withdraw from it.  It does away with deductions and tax credits, effectively increasing taxes on the rich.  It cuts about 73B$ out of Medicare, which comes directly out of the evil physicians pockets. Sounds like a Liberal wish list to me.

IMO, there are only a ahdful of people in DC who are serious about actually dealing with the problems we have, and none of them are ever given a serious consideration.  Why?  Because we continue to put people in office who are experts at giving away things to voters in order to get back in office.  All they need is over 50% of the vote to do it. 

Originally Posted by teyates:

WHat he said was true, but the truth hurts and it hurts folks' feeling to know that somone was talking about taking away their entitlements.

 

===================

Before I reassess my rather respectable opinion of you , let me make sure I understand what I think you believe:

Romney said 

"There are 47% of the people who will vote for the President no matter what . All right, there are 47% who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe they are victims, who believe the government has a responsability to care for them , who believe they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing , to , you name it. That , that's an entitlement and the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what. ... "

 

Now, just to be clear,  do you really and truly believe : 47% who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe they are victims, who believe the government has a responsability to care for them , who believe they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing , to , you name i ?

Are you saying that you believe half the people in this country are worthless bums ?


I posted a link to a youtube in another thread , maybe you should take a minute and view it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8I1dheHQ9s



SW,

I don't know the exact numbers, nor did Romney, I think he just pulled it out of his tail.  Like most politicians, about 86.5% of all their statistics are pulled out of thin air...  I do however believe that there is a large populattion of people in these United States who would vote for Adolph Hitler if you ran him on a certain ticket, and in the case of Romney, he was talking about the Democratic ticket.  The reason, as I said, is that because you have a population of people who think that it is in their OWN interest to vote a simple straight party ticket because of the entitlements and things that have either been promised to them or they have received.  I have heard it from my own mouth.  Look at the election on the lines of race for example.  A much much higher proportion of blacks voted for Obama than whites or hispanics.  Almost three times the ratio.  On a general election where race means nothing, the numbers for each race are much similar in their distribution.  Now I am not playing the race card, I am simply telling you that the race was not purely based on the issues.

 

We now have people complaining that the new health care forms are too complicated and too long, and that they ask for too much information.....have they never heard the ole saying that there is "no such thing as a free lunch"?  Do they simply believe that all that would be required was to simply sign their name on a piece of paper and viola! they would be covered?

So the answer to your question is "yes" and "no".  I do believe there is a populace on both sides of the aisle who have no common sense and yet are still blessed with the opportunity to exercise a vote. I doubt it is fully 47%, but it is much higher than you imagine.  And if you ask these people outright, and they are honest, the majority of them will tell you that they get "much more free stuff" because of the person they supported.

Obama made no bones about it.  in some of his speeches he talks about redistribution of wealth and taking from one group to give to another.  it is easy to lead people to believe that they are in the group who will be receiving the goods, rather than the group that will be giving it up.  Eventually however the money will run out.  I am not stupid enough to believe that we will ever achieve some type of tuopia.

If your impression of me is changed, so be it.  I have refrained from calling anyone a Repuglican or a Dumocrat.  Like I said both parties are to blame.

Well, I can say that I know a lot of people, having lived in 4 cities in 3 states. Of all the people I know , or know of, I know only one person who gets any assistance from the government , and he is a working person who makes low wages and gets some subsidy for his housing. Also, since 85%b of the people who work at WalMart can qualify for food stamps, I guess I probably know people who get help, I just don't know they are getting it. Maybe , I should better have stated that I don't know of anybody who just lays around, not working, and drawing that welfare. (there is actually a limited amt of time a person can draw it thanks to Clinton)

I have now arrived at an age where I collect SS and Medicare is my primary insurance, so that also includes many, many , of my friends. If you consider collecting insurance and retirement that I paid for since I was 14 to be "on the dole" , then I guess I'm one of those, but in that same line, so is Romney because as I understand it, he does not work , and gets most of his income from investments and savings he has made. Morally, as I see it , it's only a matter of scale that is the difference. Turns out it was he and his VP running mate that were, and still are pushing redistribution of wealth - from people like me to people like him. In other words , they want people like me and my friends even more. BTW, I pay taxes, SS is not my only income, and I also work a few months a year and for sure pay taxes , lot of taxes, on that.

At any rate, I know there is at least one forum member here who seems to think she is the only working person in the entire country and that everybody else is worthless scum, and I am glad that you are not like her, but I also disagree with your assessment on the number of people in this country who are worthless trash. I just find it difficult to believe that , even in this relatively poor area of the country, that every other person I see walking down the street is one of those worthless trash people that Romney spoke of.

As to Romney's  47% figure, turns out that is about the percent of people who voted for him. Kinda ironic isn't it.

 

Edited to add: Even I am one of those "entitlement drawing persons" I don't consider myself a victim. In fact for that matter, I don't know anybody , anywhere who considers themselves a victim.


what did you think of that youtube clip ?

I NEVER have said that people drawing SS and Medicare did not deserve it nor earn it.  We both know that tese things are earned by contributions from your wages. So lets not get confused at what I am saying.

The problems I am speaking of are programs that perpetually assist people and encourage in some cases their continuance.  I have seen more than my fair share of people who know how to abuse the system and teach their offspring how to do so.  And before I am accused of racism, I will preface that by saying I have  many more whites than blacks or hispanics who are involved in thei type of perpetual shell game.  I spent time in West Virginia and Mississippi.  Both of those places are much worse than you see here.  Many will work for cash only to protect their checks and to prevent paying taxes on their income. 

No, SW, don't confuse my distaste for government giveaways with SS or Medicare, because I do not think that is a giveaway.  Do not confuse my distaste with short term unemployment benefits or food stamps for the eldery, because I do not begrudge them either.  My problem is with the younger generations who are drawing checks for disability due to ADHD, or "nerve problems", who are continually seen in the ER and clinics with drug overdoses, or caught in sting operations and meth labs.  I have a problem with free cellphones and cable to people other than the elderly or the homebound. I have a problem with EIC given to mothers of children when it is increased after the fifth or sixth child.  I could go on, but I am sure I can never make my point.  We have too much waste in the system, and we cannot continue to be a government that gives everything to everybody.  The teat is about to dry up.

SW says " As to Romney's  47% figure, turns out that is about the percent of people who voted for him. Kinda ironic isn't it."

 

Ironically, look at the poll numbers.  About 7.1M people less than voted in the 2008 election, voted in the 2012 election.  About 7M people who claimed they voted for Obama in the 2008 election, voted for Romney in 2012.

Iin 2008, 99% of all blacks who voted, voted for Obama, as opposed to about 55% Hispanic, and 45% White-non-hispanic.  In 2012, only about 90% of the blacks who voted cast for Obama, with a slight increase in Hispanic vote, and a decrease in non-hispanic white voters.

If the loss of voters attributed to a loss of of enthusiasm for Romney had actually voted, the 2012 results might have been different.  in the states where Obama won, like Ohio and Florida, there was apathy among the white voters, with a decrease in their numbers at the poll.  Most of these was probably because they did not see the changes promised by Obama from 2008 and felt like he was just more of the same.

i think this trend will continue.  hope and Change brought nothing new to the table, as our debt continues to escalate and we build an economy on straw principles of printing money as fast as we can spend it.

Originally Posted by teyates:

SW says " As to Romney's  47% figure, turns out that is about the percent of people who voted for him. Kinda ironic isn't it."

 

Ironically, look at the poll numbers.  About 7.1M people less than voted in the 2008 election, voted in the 2012 election.  About 7M people who claimed they voted for Obama in the 2008 election, voted for Romney in 2012.

Iin 2008, 99% of all blacks who voted, voted for Obama, as opposed to about 55% Hispanic, and 45% White-non-hispanic.  In 2012, only about 90% of the blacks who voted cast for Obama, with a slight increase in Hispanic vote, and a decrease in non-hispanic white voters.

If the loss of voters attributed to a loss of of enthusiasm for Romney had actually voted, the 2012 results might have been different.  in the states where Obama won, like Ohio and Florida, there was apathy among the white voters, with a decrease in their numbers at the poll.  Most of these was probably because they did not see the changes promised by Obama from 2008 and felt like he was just more of the same.

i think this trend will continue.  hope and Change brought nothing new to the table, as our debt continues to escalate and we build an economy on straw principles of printing money as fast as we can spend it.

______ 

Lament of Lugubrious Losers: 

 

"Of all sad words of tongue or pen,  the saddest are these: 'It might have been.'"

Originally Posted by teyates:

I NEVER have said that people drawing SS and Medicare did not deserve it nor earn it.  We both know that tese things are earned by contributions from your wages. So lets not get confused at what I am saying.

The problems I am speaking of are programs that perpetually assist people and encourage in some cases their continuance.  I have seen more than my fair share of people who know how to abuse the system and teach their offspring how to do so.  And before I am accused of racism, I will preface that by saying I have  many more whites than blacks or hispanics who are involved in thei type of perpetual shell game.  I spent time in West Virginia and Mississippi.  Both of those places are much worse than you see here.  Many will work for cash only to protect their checks and to prevent paying taxes on their income. 

No, SW, don't confuse my distaste for government giveaways with SS or Medicare, because I do not think that is a giveaway.  Do not confuse my distaste with short term unemployment benefits or food stamps for the eldery, because I do not begrudge them either.  My problem is with the younger generations who are drawing checks for disability due to ADHD, or "nerve problems", who are continually seen in the ER and clinics with drug overdoses, or caught in sting operations and meth labs.  I have a problem with free cellphones and cable to people other than the elderly or the homebound. I have a problem with EIC given to mothers of children when it is increased after the fifth or sixth child.  I could go on, but I am sure I can never make my point.  We have too much waste in the system, and we cannot continue to be a government that gives everything to everybody.  The teat is about to dry up.

On that , I fully agree with you, as I am opposed to undeserving people who work the system, and I am fully aware that it is happening. 

I think I know that you are in the medical profession and you probably see more than your share of freeloaders. I posted back a year or so ago, that I had taken my Mother to the ER and so many people were there young and with flu symptoms. I ask the admitting nurse why they were there at the ER and not the dr's office and she told me that 85% of the people who come there have no insurance and the doctors require payment or insurance. She also made the comment that "you'd be surprised at the people who don't  have insurance that can afford it"  

This was the comment I made that Jennifer called me a liar on, but Jennifer notwithstnading , that event and that conversation did actually happen.

So, yes, there are a lot of freeloaders, and I probably feel as pizzed off at them as you. ON the other hand, I still don't believe that half the people in this country are like that (well, 47% is almost half)  Maybe I'm naive, but I just refuse to believe that when I walk down the street, or go to the store, or eat out at a restaurant, that half the people there are on some kind of relief, or if they are, like say a WalMart employee with a couple of kids, or some other worker not making top dollar, that they are some kind of worthless trash. 

Maybe a better idea is to raise the minimum wage to something that is livable, and less of the working class will have to resort to SNAP. ( I can't find the figures right now, but I seem to recall that a very high percentage of people on SNAP are elderly and families witth young children)

As to the people actually abusing the system I believe two things 1> that this administration is trying to ferret out those people and prosecute them, 2. If you know of anybody abusing the system, especially disability , turn them in , don't just complain about it. I personally know someone who got turned in, and had to repay all that money. Fortunantly, they are relatively rich, (and Republicans BTW) and they had the resources to pay it back.

One other point I would like to make on the safety net system, while we all can complain and get all pizzed off , the real world (not to be confused with Newt, or Fox) is that it accounts to 0.9% of the total US budget. I said that to make the point that I think too many people worry entirely too much about this thing that is such a small part of the overall picture.While I agree with Sen Durkson "a billion here and a billion there, and first thing you know your talking about real money", there are so many things that we should be worrying about.

One of the things that is really hitting our budget hard is health care , and especially now health care for vets coming home from Bush's little wars with all kinds of injuries , and that will go on for a generation. Vets for sure deserve good medical care , especially from their war injuries, but that is going to eat us alive far faster than whatever percentage of the "takers" are undeserving slugs.  Paying billions of dollars to purchase tanks that the Army dosen't want, and on TV stated they will just mothball them in the desert, as well as planes and ships. I know , these are jobs programs for senators and representatives, but , if you are working, building a tank that the Army does not want, are you not just as stuck to a government teat as some slug? - well, maybe not, but you get the point. 


I still enjoy dialog with you, and as I said before , I doubt if we are as far apart as we may seem on this forum;

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