DEMOCRATIC HEALTHCARE ... aka Obamacare

It was debatable whether to post this under the News category or Political forum but given the recent news about HUGE (outrageous) increases in cost for Democratic Healthcare I chose to post it under the "News" category. 

I call it Democratic Healthcare because the Democrats PUSHED this through over total objections from republicans.  It should be noted that NO Republicans voted for this and not one single Republican had input into this bill so it is totally brought to you by, forced upon you by, Democrats.  It's titled Obamacare but it should be seen as Democratic Healthcare and among all the things it's known by the worst is calling it the "Affordable" Healthcare act because the last thing it was and is ... is affordable.

Why was Democratic Healthcare needed?  IF you listen to Democrats its because so many were not insured.  What the Democrats have done is essentially create a system whereby several MILLIONS more are not insured even though they paying for Insurance.  What the Democrats have done is make sure that the majority of Americans are NOT INSURED even though they pay huge amounts for Insurance.  

How is this so?  For one people, families are paying double, triple, and even quadruple what they paid before for their health insurance but why then do I say they are UNINSURED?   The reason is that deductibles for individuals and families has risen so high, $14,000.00 deductibles in some cases, that people, families are paying 100% of their medical cost out of their pockets because Insurance never gets to the place where they pay the first dime against claims. 

In other words a family that has $10,000.00 in medical  bills has to pay 100% (all of) that $10,000.00 in cost out of their pockets, out of their savings, and that insurance company that they pay  $400 - $600 a month, for their policy, pays $0.00 (ZERO).  Even in cases where the family has met their deductible the insurance companies pay up to 80% but in many cases pay less because the provider is out of network  So in essence what the Democrats have done is make sure that effectively most Americans are now NOT INSURED because they never, ever, see any insurance company reimbursements for their medical care.

It is my hope that voters, the electorate, realize and recognize this and reward the Democrats accordingly by voting for ANYONE BUT DEMOCRATS because it was Democrats that brought us this mess, forced this mess upon us and made sure that they were not subject to the very bill that they forced upon everyone else.  In other words they exempted themselves from their Healthcare bill so that they continued to pay what they did before and only the American people were subject to having to pay for it.  So for you who get your cost raised greatly in the coming month, your deductibles raised even more, IF you voted for a Democrat then realize that you are in part responsible for all of this mess.

I encourage everyone that wants to reward the Democrats accordingly that you register to vote, you make efforts to vote this year and if you are happy with things then vote for Hillary for she will continue them or if you don't like what's going on or forced upon you then vote for Donald Trump for he alone has promised to eliminate it.

 

Be as the Bereans ( Acts 17:11 )
Original Post

Supposedly, the Dems want to replace Obamacare with a single payer system. They truly believe that central planning, reams of new regulations and government with its thumb in every medical endeavor will yield better care at a reduced cost.  No competition, of course.

When the Soviets went to collectives, Russia went from a major grain exporter to famine and importation.  Now, they are exporting grain, again. Read about the area around Rostov-on-Don, where the harvest was particularly good.  During the last years of the Soviet Union, there were constant food riots in that area.

How is this so?  For one people, families are paying double, triple, and even quadruple what they paid before for their health insurance but why then do I say they are UNINSURED?   The reason is that deductibles for individuals and families has risen so high, $14,000.00 deductibles in some cases, that people, families are paying 100% of their medical cost out of their pockets because Insurance never gets to the place where they pay the first dime against claims. 

Jt will ask you what their deductible was before, or claim you are lying. The insult to injury part is that people have to pay for this useless mess. Again, jt and the others like him should have that insurance.

I keep hearing no, no, no concerning Obama care. I keep hearing replace Obama care. I haven't hear what would replace it. Tell what the replacement is. Over the 30 years before Obama care, medical insurance costs had gotten out of the reach of a middle class, blue collar worker. If you got it through your employer, insurance costs ate up your pay increases. In 1966, I spent a week in ECM hospital, the cost was $27 per day. To be fair, most of it was observation, not treatment.  Also, before Obama care, a 62 year old man and his wife, in North Carolina I think, had a policy they liked for $127 per month. That's BS. You just can't buy it that cheap.

jtdavis posted:

I keep hearing no, no, no concerning Obama care. I keep hearing replace Obama care. I haven't hear what would replace it. Tell what the replacement is. Over the 30 years before Obama care, medical insurance costs had gotten out of the reach of a middle class, blue collar worker. If you got it through your employer, insurance costs ate up your pay increases. In 1966, I spent a week in ECM hospital, the cost was $27 per day. To be fair, most of it was observation, not treatment.  Also, before Obama care, a 62 year old man and his wife, in North Carolina I think, had a policy they liked for $127 per month. That's BS. You just can't buy it that cheap.

How do you know they couldn't buy it that cheap? So because someone says no and doesn't jump up with a plan means you slops bulldoze the train wreck obamadon'tcare through anyway? A pregnant woman was taken to B'ham for her baby to have life saving surgery while in the womb. She was kept in the hospital until the baby was born, given a place to stay in B'ham while the baby was in the hospital for weeks. They were brought home and her house was decked out with all sorts of machines and nurses coming in day and night to monitor the baby's progress. How many hundreds of thousands of dollars do you think that cost? The parents didn't pay a dime. Today, with that wonderful obamadon'tcare, and up to a $14,000 or more deductibles they would be up **** creek. Yet still you defend it. Yes, I wish you had to have it pushed on you like the slops pushed it on the other folks.

jtdavis posted:

I keep hearing no, no, no concerning Obama care. I keep hearing replace Obama care. I haven't hear what would replace it. Tell what the replacement is. Over the 30 years before Obama care, medical insurance costs had gotten out of the reach of a middle class, blue collar worker. If you got it through your employer, insurance costs ate up your pay increases. In 1966, I spent a week in ECM hospital, the cost was $27 per day. To be fair, most of it was observation, not treatment.  Also, before Obama care, a 62 year old man and his wife, in North Carolina I think, had a policy they liked for $127 per month. That's BS. You just can't buy it that cheap.

How about replacing it with the novel idea that has made our Nation great from conception and that is Capitalism, open FREE competition across state borders.  Eliminate the Government's reach all together as it was before the Democrats got involved in their quazi socialist/communistic experiment that (regardless of what the Supreme Court said) was and is unconstitutional. 

What about those with pre-existing conditions or who can't afford insurance in free competition because they have a pre-existing condition.  For them and for them only then the government can establish help and assistance but not dictate for the 95% of the others.  Others, before Democratic Healthcare debacle, were assisted by charities and Churches and other donors, as it should be.  

I'm no expert on insurance but I do believe that there are experts out there that could fix this system apart from the government only the Democratic politicians never cared to do it that way, they had too much politics to deal with, they wanted to embed reliance upon the government in the system and lead to single payer.  They, the Democrats, felt so confident in their imposed system that they exempted themselves ... how about that?  Government has no Constitutional right or power to be in life, health, dental, or any other kind of insurance nor any other business.  For some strict constitutionalist they even feel the government shouldn't be in the mail business but rather should establish private mail system run by competition as FedEx and UPS are now.  The thing is the Democrats IMPOSED/FORCED this upon us while exempting themselves.  The lot of them should be impeached and forced out of their jobs.  ALL POLITICIANS, Democrats, Republicans, and Independents, should have to abide by every law/bill they pass and they should not be able to exempt themselves.  

What ruined Democratic Healthcare (aka Obamacare)?  The GOVERNMENT!  They (the government/politicians) can't run anything else efficiently and better than private industry what makes us feel that healthcare would be different.  Here is the rub though.  TYPICAL Democratic voter believes they are going to get something for nothing from the Government and the Government is going to make THE RICH (aka Republicans) pay for all of it.  Also typical of the Democrats ... Totally conceive of it, develop it among themselves, 100% vote for it and push it through with total Republican opposition yet when it fails scream it's not their fault it's the Republicans knowing full well their typical, usual Democratic voter will believe it hook, line, and sinker.  They conceived of it they passed it, they broke it  and they convince people that they alone can fix what someone other than themselves broke about it. 

Healthcare could have been better but now it's horrible and much worse than ever and the Democrats are solely at fault.  100% at fault and should pay the political price for it.  In private industry you mess up this bad and you usually pay with your job but in politics and with politicians they continue to get re-elected and get fat golden parachute pensions and continued huge donations because they KNOW most of their voters don't know any better and will vote for them again regardless of what they do or how they legislate.

Healthcare could have been better but now it's horrible and much worse than ever and the Democrats are solely at fault.  

Keep in mind that the "Obama Care" was kicked around for a year and the only republican response was no, no, no. When the actual vote started, the republicans said, "but we haven't had a chance to have any input into it".  They had a year and did not take advantage of it.

jtdavis posted:

Healthcare could have been better but now it's horrible and much worse than ever and the Democrats are solely at fault.  

Keep in mind that the "Obama Care" was kicked around for a year and the only republican response was no, no, no. When the actual vote started, the republicans said, "but we haven't had a chance to have any input into it".  They had a year and did not take advantage of it.

But, you forget, when brought to the floor of both houses, only limited debate was allowed and no amendments were allowed.

"there was such a rush to get this done—no Republicans voting for it—and now there are unintended effects of this that were foreseen at the time, that you couldn’t know the impact of, and that now this is coming home to roost?"

**** Gregory

 

“But we have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it – away from the fog of the controversy.”

Pelosi

Ha! The man's name is D i c k Gregory. Jt, do you think a year was enough time? You keep posting that no one else came up with any answers as if that excuses the mess. What if they did have a better plan? How would it have been written and introduced before the left pushed this mess through? Do you think the left, especially Obama, would have listened to anyone else?

Crash.Override posted:

someone made obama pull the 'safe-guards' from the AHA... just exactly who was that, i wonder?

It must have been Democrats as they ramrodded the bill through congress over Republican objections and the mentality of Nancy "we have to vote the bill in to find out what is in it"!!  What Idiots!

HIFLYER2 posted:
Crash.Override posted:

someone made obama pull the 'safe-guards' from the AHA... just exactly who was that, i wonder?

It must have been Democrats as they ramrodded the bill through congress over Republican objections and the mentality of Nancy "we have to vote the bill in to find out what is in it"!!  What Idiots!

The bill was written in secret at the senate. No Republican input was allowed.  They couldn't even attend. 

I believe rash was referring to the Republicans in Congress forcing Ol'bama to live by the language of the law he begat. There were three "risk corridor" slush funds that the insurers burned through, so Ol'bama has been trying to move money around to bailout the insurance companies.

 

Large Bailout For ObamaCare Insurers May Be Coming

Average premium increases above 25%, roughly one-third of U.S. counties projected to lack any competition in the Affordable Care Act (ACA) exchanges next year, and enrollment less than half of initial expectations provide strong evidence that the law’s exchange program is failing. Moreover, the failure is occurring despite massive government subsidies, including nearly $15 billion of unlawful payments, for participating insurers. As bad news pours in and with a potentially very rough 2017 open enrollment period ahead, the Obama administration signaled on Friday that it may defy Congress and bail out insurers through the risk corridor program. Congress should take all steps at its disposal to prevent the administration from doing so.

Administration Has Already Delivered Nearly $15 Billion in Unlawful Funds to Insurers

In May, U.S. District Court Judge Rosemary Collyer sided with the U.S. House of Representatives in a suit brought against the Obama administration for making payments to insurers through the cost sharing reduction (CSR) program without a congressional appropriation. According to Judge Collyer, “Paying out [cost-sharing subsidies] without an appropriation violates the Constitution. Congress is the only source for such an appropriation, and no public money can be spent without one.” CSR payments are sent to insurers to enable them to reduce cost sharing amounts, such as deductibles, for certain exchange plan enrollees. Insurers received about $7 billion in CSR payments through 2015 and have likely received nearly $11 billion in such payments to date.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/th...coming/#7724b9d54431

jtdavis posted:

Again, the republicans had a year.

Most of that time the Dems and allied "independents" had a super majority, so no Republican input was allowed. The law only passed as it is now by using a cheap parliamentary rule to get around the 60 vote rule in the Senate after Ted Kennedy's replacement was a Republican .  

direstraits posted:
jtdavis posted:

Again, a year to do what exactly?

A year to have input or to say no, no, no

Aren't you listening? No input allowed and they did shout NO from the capitol dome to no avail!

Something is wrong with Jt. He doesn't understand anything, and just makes nonsensical posts and replies. The perfect Dem.

Something is wrong with Jt. He doesn't understand anything, and just makes nonsensical posts and replies. 

Nothing is wrong with jt. I understand what a year is. I do know that the republicans shouted no, no, no for a year and when the time for a vote came, "but we haven't had a chance to have any input. 

jtdavis posted:

Something is wrong with Jt. He doesn't understand anything, and just makes nonsensical posts and replies. 

Nothing is wrong with jt. I understand what a year is. I do know that the republicans shouted no, no, no for a year and when the time for a vote came, "but we haven't had a chance to have any input. 

So, you don't mind being daft? LOL!

giftedamateur posted:
direstraits posted:
jtdavis posted:

Again, a year to do what exactly?

A year to have input or to say no, no, no

Aren't you listening? No input allowed and they did shout NO from the capitol dome to no avail!

Something is wrong with Jt. He doesn't understand anything, and just makes nonsensical posts and replies. The perfect Dem.

Repost.

If, a private business had made the promises that the Democrats made about Obamacare, they would be serving long sentences in the Grey Bar Hotel for fraud.  While, SCOTUS ruled that politicians aren't required to keep the promises they make in their campaigns, the decision didn't apply to promises made once in office...!

republicans made the 'states participation' optional...  the major problem... states like alabama didn't participate... there's no competition. basically giving BCBS a monopoly in alabama. you can thank the wonderful alabama republicans for their 'moral values' and not participating... driving our costs, here, through the roof.

btw, how are those great 'moral values' republicans working out for alabama... head of the legislative branch.. in jail.. head of the executive branch... up on charges.. head of the judicial branch... removed from office. tell me again about those horrible democrats and their corruption. ha!

Crash is right in some respects. When you look at the rate differences, the states which opted for the Medicaid monies typically have lower premiums.  the reason is because more people went into the Medicaid coffers instead of the typical exchange where they caused a bigger skew of costs to the insurance companies. However, those states are now on the hook for the money for these policies, and they much raise their tax rates or fall behind in supplementing the Medicaid budget. If Trump wants to succeed at ridding us of this Obamination he could do a few things differently.

Take the government dollars out of the hands of the insurance companies.  It should have never been there to begin with. Make them continue to cover people until they are 26 years old on their parent's plans, but do away with the pre-existing clause.  Those with pre-existing  conditions that cannot get a policy can petition for government coverage under Medicare, and when proper vetted financially, go into the medicare coverage plan.  The money that was going to the insurance companies goes into Medicare coverage. Purchase or appoint an insurance company to provide a catastrophic insurance plan that will cover up $100,000 in benefits to those will critical illness, so that they cannot be financially non-viable. If people then continue to not carry optional coverage, make the penalty work by allowing hospitals or providers to seek financial payment more easily.  

Decrease the costs of medical school by making more government loans available to students, but hold those people to two years of health service in government run health centers or hospitals.  Private loans will still be available to those who do not want to go this route.

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