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Hi Brandi's Man,

You ask, "I always wondered why men should take off hats but women should wear them in church. Is it in the Bible?"

That was more of an issue in the Old Testament times and in the times of the early church following the ministry and crucifixion of Jesus Christ.  There is an application, or allusion, to that in Scripture -- but, not necessarily referring to a hat, scarf, or other physical head covering.

The article below gives a good explanation of how the issue of head covering applies today in the Christian church fellowships:

 

Question: "Should Christian women wear head coverings?"
http://www.gotquestions.org/head-coverings.html

Answer:  1 Corinthians 11:3-16 addresses the issue of women and head coverings.  The context of the entire passage of 1 Corinthians 11:3-16 is submission to the God-given order and "chain of command."  A "covering" on a woman's head is used as an illustration of the order, headship, and the authority of God.  The key verse of this passage is 1 Corinthians 11:3, "But I want you to know that the head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God."  The implications of this verse are found in the rest of the passage. 

The order is: God the Father, God the Son, the man or husband, and the woman or wife.  The veil or covering on the head of a believing Corinthian wife showed that she was under the authority of her husband, and therefore under submission to God.

Within this passage is also verse 10: "For this reason the woman ought to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels." Why is that important to angels?  The relationship of God with men is something that angels watch and learn from (1 Peter 1:12).  Therefore, a woman's submission to God's delegated authority over her is an example to angels.  The holy angels, who are in perfect and total submission to God, expect that we, as followers of Christ, be the same.

This covering not only means a cloth but also can refer to a woman's hair length.  How can we say that?  We must take this verse in the context or the setting in which it is presented.  "Does not even nature itself teach you that if a man has long hair, it is a dishonor to him? But if a woman has long hair, it is a glory to her; for her hair is given to her for a covering" (1 Corinthians 11:14-15). 

Therefore, in the context of this passage, a woman who is wearing her hair longer marks herself out distinctively as a woman and not a man.  The Apostle Paul is saying here that in the Corinthian culture, when a wife's hair was longer than her husband's, it showed her submission to his headship.  The roles of the male and female are designed by God to portray a profound spiritual lesson, that is of submission to the will and the order of God.

But why is hair an issue in this passage?  The apostle Paul is addressing an issue related to the Corinthian culture that was being allowed to disrupt the church.  For a woman to have a shaved head was a disgrace (and, in Jewish thinking, a sign of mourning, Deuteronomy 21:12).  Her hair was her “glory” (1 Corinthians 11:15).  In the Corinthian culture, women normally wore a head covering as a symbol of their submission to their husbands. 

Paul affirms the rightness of following that cultural mandate -- to dispense with the head coverings on women would send the entirely wrong signal to the culture at large.  In fact, Paul says that, if a Christian woman refuses her head covering, she might as well shave her hair off, too (verse 6).  A woman who refused to wear a covering in that culture was basically saying, “I refuse to submit to God’s order.”  Therefore, the apostle Paul is teaching the Corinthians that hair length or the wearing of a “covering” by the woman was an outward indication of a heart attitude of submission to God and to His established authority.

God's order is that the husband is the head of the wife as God is the head of Christ, but there is no inequality or inferiority implied

God and Christ are equal and united, just as the husband and the wife are one.  This is not a passage that teaches the woman is inferior to man or that she should be submissive to every man.  It is teaching God's order and spiritual headship in the marriage relationship.  In the Corinthian culture, a woman who covered her head during worship or when she was in public displayed her submission to authority.

In today's culture, we no longer view a woman's wearing of a head covering as a sign of submission.  In most modern societies, scarves and hats are fashion accessories.  A woman has the choice to wear a head covering if she views it as a sign of her submission to the authority of her husband.  However, it is a personal choice and not something that should be used to judge spirituality.

The real issue here is the heart attitude of obedience to God's authority and submission to His established order “as to the LORD” (Ephesians 5:22).  God is far more concerned with an attitude of submission than an outward display of submission via a head covering

First Timothy 2:9-10, "I also want women to dress modestly, with decency and propriety, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or expensive clothes, but with good deeds, appropriate for women who profess to worship God."

 

Brandi's Man, I see this article as a good answer to your question.  And, I thank you for bringing this issue to our attention.   As this article tells us, God wants man to be the spiritual leader in the home, in the family -- but, in all other respects man and wife are equal and one in Christ.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill (Dory's Man)

 

God Defined It

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Last edited by Bill Gray
 
 
 
 
 
 
          Small Talker
 
December 31, 2013 6:42 PM

Dunno who's worse Quail Dog or semichick for their hate. Can't ever body have a happy new year?

 

          Small Talker
 
          January 11, 2014 6:40 PM

What did she do?

 

          Small Talker
 
          February 22, 2014 7:50 PM

Can't tell who's more like Satan, Quaildog or Semi. Quail rambles and semi plays both sides when she wants to. Never saw so much hate.

 

          Small Talker
 
          March 5, 2014 11:12 PM

Originally Posted by semiannualchick:
Originally Posted by jtdavis:

Where is the justice?

________

From what I hear, God answers prayers. All you got to do is ask God to kill him & it's done.

 ---------------------

Nah, I've asked god to stop certain people from posting and it hasn't worked.

 

          Small Talker
 
          May 15, 2014 9:15 PM

I enjoy Bills posts, but I'm a Baptist. I'd say if we counted semis they would be mainly about bill. Thinks she has a crush?


          Small Talker
Ya do know that Medicare is not the same as Medicaid, don't ya? Everyone who lives long enough gets Medicare.
 
          Small Talker
 
          May 15, 2014 9:15 PM

I enjoy Bills posts, but I'm a Baptist. I'd say if we counted semis they would be mainly about bill.

Thinks she has a crush?

 

          Small Talker
 
          May 18, 2014 8:19 PM

Originally Posted by semiannualchick:

Where is Sperry's?

 

 

Doh! It's Dales.

 

          Small Talker
 
          May 18, 2014 8:43 PM

Originally Posted by Seven:

That name sounds vaguely familiar. Birmingham is a rough place these days. Wouldn't want to live there.

 

Musta been after some more young boys.

 

          Small Talker
 
June 22, 2014 2:16 PM

Originally Posted by semiannualchick:

Oh, well! The option to delete has been removed. Some people are going to be negative & get angry no matter what you post or how you intended it. This topic went to Hell in a handbasket.......fast!

But I still believe what I posted was right on!

Well I believe ya just hate everybody. Sad woman or whatever it is. Sorta like that quaildog is really a man. Bet that semi "woman" is too.

 
  

 

=========================================         

 
Looks like the Troll is talking to himself again....
 
 
 
 
Last edited by INVICTUS

Vic, my Friend,

 

As usual, all you do is to copy/paste and NEVER add a word from your own mind, that is, assuming it is still working.

 

And, you did not even add your PERIOD.  Should we take that to mean that your post is pregnant?  Or is that just a long pregnant pause?

 

Sorry, my Friend, but I do not see what point you were feebly attempting to make in your "one more time" copy/paste.  If you had a point (giving you some credit) -- would you mind sharing it with us?

 

Bless your little heart!

 

Bill

Casper The Friendly Ghost

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A lot of women still wear hats in church? Didn't they used to wear hats everywhere, as part of their outfits, the same as a necklace, earrings and gloves? Well, anyway, my guess about why men remove/removed their hats would be as a sign of respect, and the reason women didn't/don't remove theirs is because, as posted, it was a part of their ensemble.

quote:   Originally Posted by Bestworking:

A lot of women still wear hats in church?  Didn't they used to wear hats everywhere, as part of their outfits, the same as a necklace, earrings and gloves?  Well, anyway, my guess about why men remove/removed their hats would be as a sign of respect, and the reason women didn't/don't remove theirs is because, as posted, it was a part of their ensemble.

Hi Jennifer Best,

 

I agree with you completely.  The reasoning is no longer based upon religious or Biblical reasons.  Men have been taught all their lives to remove their hats upon entering a home or church -- and only those imitating the "rap" culture refuse to do that today.

 

In the military, men are still taught to remove their hats upon entering any facility.

 

And, you are right that women have long not removed their hats which were a part of their outfits.  Never been a problem unless the woman in front of you is wearing a really big hat.

 

When I was in the Roman Catholic church, I know that women were expected to wear some type of head covering when they entered the church.  But, I believe that is just another part of their religion's rituals which never went away.  Since I have not been in a Roman Catholic church in years, I don't know if this is still the same -- or if it went the way of eating fish of Fridays.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Last edited by Bill Gray
quote:  Originally Posted by Brandi's Man:

Thanks, Bill & Best for the answers.  No I'm not Bill or anyone else.  Am I the only one who thinks Semi and QD are trolls.  I said so, that's all. No biggie.  I notice at least one has left religion and maybe some more.  I'm guessing it was Semi's idea.  Anybody miss anybody?

Hi Brandi's Man,

 

Since you have been on the TD Forums for less that a year, let me give you a bit of history.  For a few years I used to come online to read the TimesDaily just to keep up with my hometown area.  But, I always avoided anything resembling a forum or chat room, for they always seem to be places to encourage childish "spitting contests."

 

However, in Jan 2007 while reading the TD online, I noticed in the Forum section a discussion titled "What Is A Christian?"   So, knowing that the Shoals area of Alabama is in the heart of the Bible Belt, I wanted to see what my hometown friends had to say about being a Christian.

 

When I opened the Forums that day, the discussion about "What Is A Christian" was totally dominated by two very militant atheists -- DeepFat and GoFish.   So, to refute their atheist religion I joined in the discussion.  And, I have been here since; always using my own name, Bill Gray.  I have never used any other name.

 

Many folks such as Deep, Fish, Quail, et al, have changed names often because they kept getting banned for abusive posts and had to keep creating new posting names.  I was banned once, for a week, because of a disagreement with Fish and because he ran to the Mod.  During that week, I just did other things and came back after the week was over.  But, I have never posted here, nor on any other venue, under any name except my own.

 

In the beginning I was giving both my name and my e-mail address.  A TD Mod contacted me and suggested I use a pseudonym like everyone else.   And that I should not give my e-mail address.  I did stop the e-mail address, but, as I told him, "I am on the forums to share the Word of God.  I would not feel comfortable sharing God's Word while hiding behind a false name."

 

You mention Semi-Chick and Quail.  Some years ago, when Chick first came on the Forums, I did attempt to share with her -- and, as I recall, we did share some Private Messages at that time.  But, because I have never changed my position on God's Word, prayer, abortion, homosexuality, etc., she has, over the last couple of years, become more and more hostile toward me -- declaring that, "Bill Gray has condemned me to hell!"

 

Over and over, I, and others, have explained to her that no one, not Bill Gray, not even God -- can condemn anyone to hell.  That person, through his/her own personal choice, has to chose between heaven or hell for himself/herself.   But, like speaking to a stone wall -- she will not hear.  All she can hear is her own voice declaring, "Bill Gray has condemned me to hell!"

 

So, a few months ago, she spearheaded her drive to get all her buddies, atheists and other non-believers, along with a few pseudo-Roman Catholics, to put Bill Gray on Block or Ignore.  This is her way of punishing me for condemning her to hell.  What can I say to she who will not hear?

 

Anyway, her devised "punishment" of Bill Gray -- has, in reality, become a great blessing.  For now, instead of having to spend time refuting their childish and inane "spitting contest" posts -- I can spend more time writing new articles to post. 

 

I post them here on the Religion Forum, on my Facebook Notes, and in my Friends Ministry eNewsletter e-mails.   So, her condemnation of Bill Gray -- has become a blessing to Bill Gray, and to all my Friends who do read what God has put in my heart to write.   A real Win-Win situation.

 

And, Quail, well he is another story.  For a long time he and I were Religion Forum and Facebook Friends.  But, because I openly speak out against his god, Obama, and because I have always felt that, while unions were a good thing in their early days -- unions have now driven America to the brink of bankruptcy -- Quail began to see me as the enemy.   Not all unions are bad; but, there are enough rotten apples in the basket to cause a definite odor. 

 

Since Quail enters his "union" sanctuary to pray to his leader, Obama, on a daily basis -- he started getting downright nasty in his posts to me.  I have just shined him on in the Religion Forum.  But, on Facebook, he and a buddy started posting such nasty outhouse style posts -- I had to block both of them.  

 

On the TimesDaily Forums since Jan 2007 and on Facebook for about five years -- they are the only two I have ever blocked.  So, I guess that will give you an idea of how vile their posts became on Facebook before I took that final step.

 

Brandi's Man, please keep posting on the Religion Forum.  We need to hear the voice of more conservatives and conservative Christians here.  Most conservative Christians are too passive to enter into forums like this.  And, when they do, the immediate battering they receive from the secularists, atheists, vanilla-flavored non-believers, and militant liberal Christians have driven them to leave the Religion Forum.

 

Yet, Jesus Christ has given ALL believers the Great Commission to:  "Go, Make disciples, Teach them. . . Be My witnesses in all the world"    You may notice that I left out, "Baptize them."  Not that I consider baptizing to be irrelevant; but that I feel that it is something which should be done within their new Christian family.

 

If we share His Word and disciple folks, guiding them toward involvement in a local Christian fellowship -- then, when they do believer and get involved in their new Christian family -- their new pastor and their new Christian family will share their baptism with them.  That helps to bring the new believer into a closer, more intimate relationship with his/her new Christian family, and therefore into a closer relationship with our Lord.

 

So, please do not allow their bullying to force you off the Religion Forum.  Join hands with other Christian believers and let's share God's Word with the world.  Does that mean that we will always agree with one another on all Biblical issues.  No.  We may often disagree on Non-Essential Biblical issues.  But, that is okay as long as we agree on the Essential Christian Doctrines which define a Christian believer and a Christian fellowship.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

 

1 Peter 3-15 - Walk In The Park-1

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Last edited by Bill Gray

Vic, my Friend,

 

THANK YOU SO MUCH!  I had warned Brandi's Man about the few pseudo-Roman Catholic who will attempt to hijack and destroy all Christian witness on the Religion Forum.

 

And, YOU, my Friend -- have given him, and all of us, THE PERFECT EXAMPLE of that!

 

Thank you and God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Gimme A Hug

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