Is it True? is our sweet, loving Billy boy gone?

i haven't been here in awhile. and i pop back in to make fun of bill, only to find he's no longer among those present?
did he give up? did he get thrown out? did he <chuckle> die horribly?

i didn't stop coming round here because of bill, exactly. i stopped coming around because with bill here, it was always the same tired old arguments, and you get tired, eventually, of calling the old fool an old fool and of reminding the pathetic chickensucker the world wouldn't miss him if he fell into an open volcano. 
me, i'm happy that's he's shuffled off to consume a bag of richards, but i admit vague curiosity of the nature of his exit.

Never Underestimate the Power of Human Stupidity



Original Post

Bill is gone and ironically enough Semi seems to have also chosen to leave and no longer is present in the forums.  There are some others who have left, for their own reasons, and no longer appear.    The arguments are still here though, from time to time, but it's actually, at times, quiet and peaceable.

Has their ever been a time that one could discuss religion or topics in a rational way, at least on here?  First of all when it comes to religion and discussions then one would be talking about discussions that would possibly involve Islam, Christianity, Judaism or the like.   While Christians have made up the bulk of those who are religious, in America, Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world and in America.  Then there is a large presence of Atheist on the board and the question arises is Atheism a religion itself and views along that line.

Then there is the questions and discussions that would be targeted to Christians alone but usually those end up being knock down drag out verbal confrontations as disagreements between conflicting Christian areas such as Catholic and non-Catholic or Mormon, or Jehovah's Witness although there are many  Christians who argue that Mormons or Jehovah's Witnesses are not Christians, at all, but a religion to themselves such as Islam, Buddhism, and Judaism. 

So can there be rational discussions even with Bill gone?  Time will tell.   Bill's main problem with relating to others and playing nicely, my own opinion mind you, was that there was a lack of respect, on his part, for others of differing opinion.  Bill was very dogmatic in his beliefs and usually had a justification for those beliefs even though at times that justification was solely relying upon his own narrow version of Scripture or his own narrow interpretation. 

With any dialog where there are conflicts of opinion there should be respect of another's opinion and while disagreements are common and expected when you argue or debate there should be mutual respect and civility among those participating such that the argument doesn't get personal and degrade into insults rather than disagreements.  Sadly there are people that you cannot debate against due more to personalities rather than intelligence or opinion.

So as I said before, time will tell.  One thing I am quite certain of though.  Given Bills absence and banning and based solely upon past experiences I will most likely inherit the reputation of posting the most lengthy and wordy responses.  So if I do continue to post I will try and make a conscience effort to remain focused on the topic, at hand, and not diverge into too many off topic conversations and at least stay on the topic of the discussion.  Then again I don't come by and check the Religion board near as much as I used to either so mayby I'll just relinquish it to other, more capable, debaters or pontificators.

Hi forum friends!.....( <---just in case any of y'all miss seeing that)

So anyway, I haven't seen a discussion in a while about eternal security through God's grace.  Bill argued to the extreme of OSAS doctrine going as far as to believe that no matter what a person who is truly saved does or how they decide to live that they are still saved and that those who don't continue to live what met his criteria of a Christian lifestyle were never actually saved to start with. I saw others that went so far to the other extreme as to believe that one could become a Christian, live a PERFECT life and then seconds before death do something like utter the words "oh crap" and they would bust hell wide open cause they said "crap" and didn't ask for forgiveness before they died.

Neither extreme is correct and Bill was actually closer to having this right than most folks. There are many beliefs on how God's grace is imparted and the truth is that His grace is there for the asking and not through any works or sacraments. Becoming a Christian doesn't mean that we have to walk on eggshells to hold on to our salvation. In John chapter 10, Jesus himself says in reference to believers that "no one will snatch them out of My hand" in verse 28 and then in verse 29 he says that "No one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand". 

A lot of the extreme OSAS crowd will use those verses as a claim that once a believer is saved then they are always saved no matter what. To an extent that is true BUT even after being saved, God won't make you stay around. Even though no one can snatch from his hand, you can still make a willful decision to walk away or ask that he let you go and if you ask him to let you go then that's what he'll do. 

To sum it up, Christians aren't perfect, we still sin. Some of us have even backslid at one time or another and I can tell you from past experience that even those who are in a state of what seems a perpetual state of living a lifestyle that is deviating from Biblical principals that if you are still feeling convicted of what you know is wrong and are searching for answers about the possibility of needing to find your way back to being an asset to God's kingdom then you are still saved. 

Kate Colombo posted:

You don't have to miss Bill. Friend him on FB and get on his e-mail list. I enjoy most of what he writes there.I

I'm certainly not into Masochism so I believe I'll pass on that invitation.  If I wish to be falsely accused, taken out of context, or belittled I can do that on here, at most any times, without having to befriend anyone.  While Bill and I share many similar beliefs, with respect to religion or doctrinal teachings, I have already served enough of my time as target of his judgmental (falsely I might ad) post and writings. 

It's never, at least in my mind, a Christian attribute, to be found writing about someone behind their back when one cannot defend themselves and I found out that was going on regarding myself and frankly I don't have much to say to someone who participates in doing such. 

I do hate that the moderators decided to implement a permanent ban on Bill and on some of the others however I'm sure they had/have their reasons so I will not second guess them either.  I neither disliked Bill nor do I miss Bill but I think each of our resident characters added to the forum, from time to time, and some in not so positive ways.  Bill and I agreed on many doctrines but also disagreed on some as well and unfortunately disagreement with some folks turns into judgment for not seeing things a certain way and usually that judgment was uniformed and incorrect which doesn't do much for civil discourse and debate and likely one contributing factor to the moderator's decisions.

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