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Ascension Earth

 

10 Mysterious Biblical Figures No One Can Explain

 

10  Melchizedek

 

Probably the single most mysterious figure in the Bible, Melchizedek was a priest-king of Salem (later known as Jerusalem) in the time of Abram  (Abraham), suggesting a religious organization, complete with ritual and hierarchy, that predated the Jewish nation and their priestly lineage  from the tribe of Levi. He is only portrayed as active in one passage,  although he is alluded to once in Psalms, and several times in the New  Testament’s Epistle to the Hebrews. Some Jewish  disciplines insist that Melchizedek was Shem, Noah’s son.

 

He is thought of, in Christian circles, as a proto-messiah, embodying certain traits later given to Christ. New Testament writings  assert that Christ was “a priest forever in the order of Melchizedek,”  indicating an older and deeper covenant with God than the  Abrahamic-Levite lineage. Hebrews 7, though presents him in a more unusual light. In verses 3 and 4: “Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither  beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God;  abideth a priest continually. Now consider how great this man was, unto  whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.” Not only do these verses grant Melchizedek a hierarchical level above the most important Jewish patriarch, they assign him mystical  qualities. Some take this to mean an earlier incarnation of Christ. 

 

Others see it as an ancient manifestation of the Holy Spirit. His  identity, role, and theological function have long been debated. The paucity of scriptural references have added to the mystery,  making him a somewhat spectral figure. As such, newer spiritual  traditions, as well as New Age quacks, have taken liberties with his  persona. Gnostics insisted he became Jesus, and he is cited as a high-level priest in Masonic and Rosicrucian lore. Joseph Smith wrote that he was the greatest of all prophets, and Mormons still trace their priesthood back to him. The Urantia, a 20th-century pseudo-Bible  that claims to merge religion, philosophy, and science, insists he’s the first in an evolutionary succession of deification manifestations, with Abraham being his first convert. There is even a school of thought that Melchizedek is a title or assumed character name, sort  of a theological 007, played by a series of Judeo-Christian James  Bonds. 

 

The lore of  Melchizedek is confusing but deep and fascinating.  Apocryphal books give us more details, some cryptic, some relatively  mundane. The Second Book of Enoch is particularly informative, insisting Melchizedek was born of a Virgin. When his mother Sophonim (the wife of Noah’s brother Nir) died in childbirth, he sat up, clothed himself, and sat beside her corpse, praying and preaching. After 40 days, he was  taken by an archangel to the Garden of Eden, protected by angels and  avoiding the Great Flood without passage on Uncle Noah’s ark.

9  Cain’s Wife

02   Cain was, according to Genesis, the first human ever born. He later  killed his younger brother Abel in a hissy fit over his sacrifice of  meat being more favored than Cain’s sacrificial fruit basket. God put a  mark on Cain and cursed the ground he farmed, forcing him into a life as a wandering fugitive. 
That part of the story is fairly well known. Later, though, we read that he settled in the  Land of Nod, and, all of a sudden, he has a wife. Absolutely nothing else is mentioned about her. We don’t even know  where she came from. In fact, the question of where Cain got his wife,  when his immediate family were apparently the only people in the world,  has sent many a perceptive young Sunday schooler down the road of  skepticism. 

 

Some have posited a mysterious other tribe of people, maybe created  after Adam and Eve, maybe even another race or species. But the standard response is that Adam and Eve had many other sons and daughters to  populate the Earth. The only way to keep the human race going would be  to mate with siblings, nieces, nephews, and cousins. 

 

In fact, though the  Holy Bible is silent on her identity, the apocryphal Book of Jubilees  tells us exactly who was Cain’s wife: his sister Awan, who bore his son  Enoch.

 

Read the rest of this Bible study

 

 

http://www.ascensionearth2012....-figures-no-one.html

 

 

 

Original Post

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Originally Posted by HIFLYER2:

Who was Cain afraid of when he was banished?

_______

According to creation, the only people alive at the time were Adam, Eve, Cain and the dead Abel. If he was banished & sent out away from his parents, who was around for him to fear? The ghost of Abel? His Father, Adam? The Bible doesn't say.

That's the problem with the Bible & one of the reason's I stopped believing. There are too many unanswered questions, contradictions, discrepancies & things that just don't add up.

People that believe in God/Jesus/Bible try to explain it, give their opinion but it's all guess work. No one really knows.

Originally Posted by CrustyMac:

Once you try to take the creation story literally, it makes no sense. 

 

Totally agree. It does not help that many are influenced by the interpretations of Christian teachers.

 

There is a progression and consistency with the way God created earth and all life. Once again Mr. Smith can explain it better than I.

-------------

Now what do science finds are the progression of plants? You start with the primitive, they can be somewhat advanced, until you finally have whole trees producing fruit. What is one of the last things in plant life that comes on the scene according to the geological table? It’s a very recent addition… flowers. Flowers are relatively new to plant life in the geological time scale.

So obviously He didn’t make one blade of grass or one piece of algae, there was a multitude. Now notice when we come over to verse 20.

Gen 1:20  And God said, let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creatures, that hath life.
 
Did He just make one male and one female fish or was there an abundance of them? Then we go on verse 21, “He made the great tanniyn.” Which I believe you know are the dinosaurs, the reptiles.

Then we have the cattle, verse 24.  Did He just make one cow and one bull, is that it? Well, it says He made cattle.

Well then when we come down to verse 26, it says “God said, Let Us make man…” But the Hebrew is ‘humanity.’ “Let us make humanity.” Did He really just make one man and one woman? That’s not what He did with all the other things, did He? Look at it.

Gen. 1:27  Let Us make humanity in Our image after Our likeness, and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle…

Remember, I pointed out it doesn’t say let them have dominion over the great tanniyn, the dinosaurs. Why? Because they were extinct for 50 million years.

“In the image of God created He him.“ That’s what it says, but that’s not in the Hebrew. It just says, “In the image of God created.” That’s all, it doesn’t say “He him.” Concordant puts “created it.” God created it, humanity, it. So it just says “in the image of God created.” He created, but to make the English more understandable, they put in “…created He him.” God created him, but the “him” is not in there. 

“Male and female created.” Now in our translation, it says “male and female He created them.” So it’s pretty difficult to say, ‘well there was one man and one woman.’ He created humanity, He created humanity male and He created humanity female. Humanity, okay. 

Now when we come to Adam and Eve, He gives them a name and we know it’s just one. Are they the first ones though? Maybe not. Because we later have Cain, that says his sentence is too great, wherever I go, they will kill me (Gen. 4:13-14). Who will kill him? Who? There was only Abel and he killed Abel. So if there’s only Adam and Eve and their two sons, Cain and Abel… well Cain killed Abel, so now there’s only one man left, and his mother and father. He says to God, wherever I go, “anyone who finds me will kill me." Who? He killed the only other man alive on earth. Well if we interpret it that way, there are problems. Then Cain took a wife… so there’d be all these other things to contend with and so on. Alright.

 

FIRST HUMANS

http://forums.bible-truths.com...hp/topic,9130.0.html

-----------------

 

Mal_3:6  For I am the LORD, I change not

 

Jas 1:17  Every generous act and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights; with Him there is no variation or shadow cast by turning.

Last edited by gdriggs

What if there were other people that existed, not just Adam and Eve? What if those that believe they were the first two human beings are wrong? The Bible says God created male & female on the 6th day……after the 7th day was complete, that’s when he created Adam. If anyone saw Cain with the "mark" that God had placed on him, they could be of a mind to kill him.

Cain wasn’t banished from the land of Nod, he was banished from Eden. It was later when he went into the land of Nod that he found his wife.  

Evidently Cain’s fear was unfounded, since he wasn’t murdered. The Bible doesn't say...................just as it doesn’t say many things. It opens the door, but never closes it.

Kinda puts a new twist on things, doesn’t it?

 

Originally Posted by semiannualchick:
Originally Posted by gdriggs:

Once again Mr. Smith can explain it better than I.

_____

One more opinion. Mr. Smith gives his opinion as have many before him & there will be many after. It's a vicious cycle.

--------------

 

No doubt semi. We should never take someones word for it. It's really up to us to study and be convinced what is true or false in our own minds.

Originally Posted by semiannualchick:

One more opinion. Mr. Smith gives his opinion as have many before him & there will be many after. It's a vicious cycle.

--------------

Originally Posted by gdriggs:

No doubt semi. We should never take someones word for it. It's really up to us to study and be convinced what is true or false in our own minds.

_____

Thank you! It's refreshing to see someone not go into that, "I'm right & you're stupid" theory.

Originally Posted by CrustyMac:

Once you try to take the creation story literally, it makes no sense.

 

+++

 

Many things, no, not literally.

 

But I wonder how we'll be evaluated a couple of thousand years from now, literally.

 

Maybe it'll all fall down to a matter of interpretation by folks who think they're smarter than we are.

Last edited by budsfarm

Laughable. They will stand and make fun of the "big bang", which they either don't understand or willfully lie about, and with a straight face claim man was made from dirt and woman from his rib, by a being and his helpers that had always been here. No explanation of where they came from, oh no, but that makes sense to them, and they claim the big bang is ridiculous and should be dismissed, but you are closed minded if you don't give their story a 'chance'. Now, if god was so powerful, why did he have to use dirt for adam and a bone from adam for eve? Where did adam's first wife lilith come from? Which bone?

Originally Posted by Bestworking:

Laughable. They will stand and make fun of the "big bang", which they either don't understand or willfully lie about, and with a straight face claim man was made from dirt and woman from his rib, by a being and his helpers that had always been here. No explanation of where they came from, oh no, but that makes sense to them, and they claim the big bang is ridiculous and should be dismissed, but you are closed minded if you don't give their story a 'chance'. Now, if god was so powerful, why did he have to use dirt for adam and a bone from adam for eve? Where did adam's first wife lilith come from? Which bone?

____

Wherever "Lilith" (Adam's alleged first wife) came from, it is not the Bible, which never mentions any such person.  Lilith is a creature of Jewish mythology.  MYTHOLOGY, Best, is not history.

 

Wherever "Lilith" (Adam's alleged first wife) came from, it is not the Bible, which never mentions any such person.  Lilith is a creature of Jewish mythology.  MYTHOLOGY, Best, is not history.

 

==================

LOL! Like the bible is history! So she's not mentioned in your bible. So what? She's mentioned other places.

 

 

According to midrashic literature, Adam's first wife was not Eve but a woman named Lilith, who was created in the first Genesis account. Only when Lilith rebelled and abandoned Adam did God create Eve, in the second account, as a replacement. In an important 13th century Kabbalah text, the Sefer ha-Zohar ("The Book of Splendour") written by the Spaniard Moses de Leon (c. 1240-1305), it is explained that:

 

At the same time Jehovah created Adam, he created a woman, Lilith, who like Adam was taken from the earth. She was given to Adam as his wife. But there was a dispute between them about a matter that when it came before the judges had to be discussed behind closed doors. She spoke the unspeakable name of Jehovah and vanished.

 

Last edited by Bestworking
Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:

Luv the new avatar "Jack."

-----

Since we know the former forum troll is reading the forum, I can imagine how really pizzed off he is that Jack Flash is using that avatar. Probably almost as much as he is that someone else is using his Pulpit & he can't do anything about it. 

That avatar has bad vibes!!

Originally Posted by Bestworking:

Who was going to harm cain? His baby brothers and sisters he and his brother fathered with his own mother/sisters or his father fathered with his daughters? Huh? Makes sense doesn't it? Bed your mom and dad, brothers and sisters, but don't be a homosexual.

When God told Cain he had to leave, Cain said, you throw me out the people

will kill me for what I've done to Abel. God said I'll not let that happen and

God also marked Cain so people will know it's Cain, so don't touch.

Short version.    

Originally Posted by Bestworking:

Yes, I know the story, but his own kids/brothers and sisters/nieces nephews were going to kill him? Was he his own grandfather too?

I think not, just my thought, Cain and Abel were adults when this happened.

There very well could have been many more people on earth by that time.

We don't know enough facts because the Bible doesn't have every answer.

 

I think that people forget that the earliest parts of the Old Testament were oral traditions for more than a few centuries. Even if there were actual events and people remembered in the oral traditions, several generations of tall tale experts would twist any story out of proportion. I believe that some of the Old Testament stories have parallels in other nearby cultures like the Epic of Gilgamesh.

Originally Posted by Jack Flash:
Originally Posted by Bestworking:

Yes, I know the story, but his own kids/brothers and sisters/nieces nephews were going to kill him? Was he his own grandfather too?

I think not, just my thought, Cain and Abel were adults when this happened.

There very well could have been many more people on earth by that time.

We don't know enough facts because the Bible doesn't have every answer.

 

-------

 

It has many more answers then you give it credit for. Careful study of the Hebrew will show you this.

 

In Gen 1:26 the King James Version has "Let us make manH120 in our image" as if it was just one individual that God created. The Concordant Literal Version translates manH120 correctly.

 

Gen 1:26 And saying is the Elohim, "Make will We HUMANITYH120 in Our image, and according to Our likeness, and sway shall they over the fish of the sea, and over the flyer of the heavens, and over the beast, and over all land life, and over every moving animal moving on the land.

 

H120
אדם
'âdâm
aw-dawm'
From H119; ruddy, that is, a human being (an individual orthe species, mankind, etc.): - X another, + hypocrite, + common sort, X low, man (mean, of low degree), person.

 

God never just creates one of something during the creation period, He creates a bunch of them time and time again all throughout the creation period. No reason to change that pattern all of a sudden when it comes to humans.

 

This is just my beliefs based on what I have studied, but I believe there were a lot more humans during that time. Otherwise it just does not make sense that Cain found a city and got married had kids etc.

Originally Posted by Jack Flash:

Ascension Earth

 

10 Mysterious Biblical Figures No One Can Explain

 

10  Melchizedek

 

Probably the single most mysterious figure in the Bible, Melchizedek was a priest-king of Salem (later known as Jerusalem) in the time of Abram  (Abraham), suggesting a religious organization, complete with ritual and hierarchy, that predated the Jewish nation and their priestly lineage  from the tribe of Levi. He is only portrayed as active in one passage,  although he is alluded to once in Psalms, and several times in the New  Testament’s Epistle to the Hebrews. Some Jewish  disciplines insist that Melchizedek was Shem, Noah’s son.

 

He is thought of, in Christian circles, as a proto-messiah, embodying certain traits later given to Christ. New Testament writings  assert that Christ was “a priest forever in the order of Melchizedek,”  indicating an older and deeper covenant with God than the  Abrahamic-Levite lineage. Hebrews 7, though presents him in a more unusual light. In verses 3 and 4: “Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither  beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God;  abideth a priest continually. Now consider how great this man was, unto  whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.” Not only do these verses grant Melchizedek a hierarchical level above the most important Jewish patriarch, they assign him mystical  qualities. Some take this to mean an earlier incarnation of Christ. 

 

Others see it as an ancient manifestation of the Holy Spirit. His  identity, role, and theological function have long been debated. The paucity of scriptural references have added to the mystery,  making him a somewhat spectral figure. As such, newer spiritual  traditions, as well as New Age quacks, have taken liberties with his  persona. Gnostics insisted he became Jesus, and he is cited as a high-level priest in Masonic and Rosicrucian lore. Joseph Smith wrote that he was the greatest of all prophets, and Mormons still trace their priesthood back to him. The Urantia, a 20th-century pseudo-Bible  that claims to merge religion, philosophy, and science, insists he’s the first in an evolutionary succession of deification manifestations, with Abraham being his first convert. There is even a school of thought that Melchizedek is a title or assumed character name, sort  of a theological 007, played by a series of Judeo-Christian James  Bonds. 

 

The lore of  Melchizedek is confusing but deep and fascinating.  Apocryphal books give us more details, some cryptic, some relatively  mundane. The Second Book of Enoch is particularly informative, insisting Melchizedek was born of a Virgin. When his mother Sophonim (the wife of Noah’s brother Nir) died in childbirth, he sat up, clothed himself, and sat beside her corpse, praying and preaching. After 40 days, he was  taken by an archangel to the Garden of Eden, protected by angels and  avoiding the Great Flood without passage on Uncle Noah’s ark.

9  Cain’s Wife

02   Cain was, according to Genesis, the first human ever born. He later  killed his younger brother Abel in a hissy fit over his sacrifice of  meat being more favored than Cain’s sacrificial fruit basket. God put a  mark on Cain and cursed the ground he farmed, forcing him into a life as a wandering fugitive. 
That part of the story is fairly well known. Later, though, we read that he settled in the  Land of Nod, and, all of a sudden, he has a wife. Absolutely nothing else is mentioned about her. We don’t even know  where she came from. In fact, the question of where Cain got his wife,  when his immediate family were apparently the only people in the world,  has sent many a perceptive young Sunday schooler down the road of  skepticism. 

 

Some have posited a mysterious other tribe of people, maybe created  after Adam and Eve, maybe even another race or species. But the standard response is that Adam and Eve had many other sons and daughters to  populate the Earth. The only way to keep the human race going would be  to mate with siblings, nieces, nephews, and cousins. 

 

In fact, though the  Holy Bible is silent on her identity, the apocryphal Book of Jubilees  tells us exactly who was Cain’s wife: his sister Awan, who bore his son  Enoch.

 

Read the rest of this Bible study

 

 

http://www.ascensionearth2012....-figures-no-one.html

 

 

 

Fascinating post Jack. 

Originally Posted by gdriggs:
Originally Posted by Jack Flash:
Originally Posted by Bestworking:

Yes, I know the story, but his own kids/brothers and sisters/nieces nephews were going to kill him? Was he his own grandfather too?

I think not, just my thought, Cain and Abel were adults when this happened.

There very well could have been many more people on earth by that time.

We don't know enough facts because the Bible doesn't have every answer.

 

-------

 

It has many more answers then you give it credit for. Careful study of the Hebrew will show you this.

 

In Gen 1:26 the King James Version has "Let us make manH120 in our image" as if it was just one individual that God created. The Concordant Literal Version translates manH120 correctly.

 

Gen 1:26 And saying is the Elohim, "Make will We HUMANITYH120 in Our image, and according to Our likeness, and sway shall they over the fish of the sea, and over the flyer of the heavens, and over the beast, and over all land life, and over every moving animal moving on the land.

 

H120
אדם
'âdâm
aw-dawm'
From H119; ruddy, that is, a human being (an individual orthe species, mankind, etc.): - X another, + hypocrite, + common sort, X low, man (mean, of low degree), person.

 

God never just creates one of something during the creation period, He creates a bunch of them time and time again all throughout the creation period. No reason to change that pattern all of a sudden when it comes to humans.

 

This is just my beliefs based on what I have studied, but I believe there were a lot more humans during that time. Otherwise it just does not make sense that Cain found a city and got married had kids etc.

=====================

When I was a child, and believed in a god, there were always questions, but never answers. After I grew up and finally realized I just didn't believe it anymore I told one preacher that I would go back to church and give it another shot if he could answer some questions for me. The first, where did god come from? End of that discussion. Now today, as an adult, when anyone asks the preacher wannabes on this forum they don't have any answers either. They just attack and call a questioner "bitter and a god hater". You can't hate what doesn't exist, and they just can't get it through their heads that it's them, their lies, and their willing deception, their hatred and bitterness that people dislike. I know the story of cain is bull, just like the story of the ark and all the other things in the bible. But it would be interesting to hear someone give an honest answer to the question. You are the only one that has ever given another answer besides, incest was OK then but it's not now, and you can't question god. BTW, what is your take on the story of the ark?

Last edited by Bestworking

Hi Best,

 

My take on the ark and the flood is that it was a local or regional flood, not a worldwide one. The two of each type of animal that were put into the ark were local animals, not all the dang animals in the world. There is a evidence in the Hebrew Scriptures that support this. It's just much get's lost in translation from ancient Hebrew to English.

 

I also believe the ark is a type or a shadow of a higher spiritual reality where Jesus is the Ark Who covered and saved Noah and his family.

 

As for your question about where God came from I haven't a clue. Surprise! Maybe someday we will find out.

 

I do not believe the Christian version (or most other versions) of god exist either. Kinda like you I never got any answers and when they tried to give answers it usually only contradicted was was written and what others have said.  My biggest question at the time was "how could a god that was supposedly all powerful and all knowing burn the majority of humanity in fire for ever and ever?" So I started studying for myself and realized it was a lie. Maybe if it wasn't for the people God put in my life like my grandmother and L. Ray Smith I'd be an atheist too.

 

This might sound crazy to some, but maybe God does not want the majority of humanity to know He exists in the form that He does. At least not yet.

 

We all either do or do not believe based on circumstances or causes in our life. Weather those causes are caused by God is not for me to convince you or anyone. I don't worry about the other peoples salvation anymore as I have total faith in Jesus that He really is the Savior of the whole world and that He will actually save it. The Hell with the Christian Hell!

 

Personally I like atheists more then Christians. They always have the best questions and bring out the stupidity of some of Christianities beliefs. I'm sure my beliefs are stupid to atheist as well, but then again most Christians believe that also. Poor me lol.

 

Peace

Last edited by gdriggs
Originally Posted by gdriggs:
Personally I like atheists more then Christians. They always have the best questions and bring out the stupidity of some of Christianities beliefs. I'm sure my beliefs are stupid to atheist as well, but then again most Christians believe that also. Poor me lol.

Peace

______

Thank you for that refreshing post. It's nice to see an opinion given w/o all the preaching, judging, mocking, etc. 

I know your post was to Best but I enjoyed your take on things, & I didn't read anything that I thought was stupid. I'm always open to learning, & possibly having a mind change, even after 20 years. It's doubtful but my mind is not closed to the possibility.

I don't like the majority of Christians at all. The Atheist & non-believers are so less judgmental & more accepting than most Christians. Not all, but most.

I hope you keep posting, I enjoy reading your opinion.

As for your question about where God came from I haven't a clue. Surprise! Maybe someday we will find out.

 

============================

You may be the only one besides my parents that said they had no idea. All others say he was always here and you can't question it, you just have to believe it. My parents, my mom especially, would be open about things. Make no mistake, she believed, but she would say the same, she had no idea where he came from, and wouldn't give the standard 'brush off' of "it's not your place to question". I've posted it many times, I listen to/read about all kinds of theories and some I discard, such as all the god, jesus, bible stuff, some theories I find interesting and put in the 'wait and see' category. The truth of it is, I will never know. I don't really think anyone will ever know for sure. 

 

Religion is fascinating. People who stand and say god does this and god does that fascinate me. People from all walks of life believe, people from all walks of life don't believe. believers attack believers. It's wild. I see the so called christians whine about non-believers and some of the things they say about religion, but they don't see how ridiculous it all seems to us, and can't understand why we do not want it pushed on us, or our kids/grandkids. It's like nothing is ever enough for them. They have tax exemption, huge churches, private schools, bible schools and all sorts of religious programs, but they cry when asked to please leave it out of politics and schools where it was never meant to be. And while they attack atheists for asking them to please leave it out of politics and schools, public school systems are asking muslims how they can make those school systems more muslim friendly.

Originally Posted by Bestworking:

As for your question about where God came from I haven't a clue. Surprise! Maybe someday we will find out.

 

============================

You may be the only one besides my parents that said they had no idea. All others say he was always here and you can't question it, you just have to believe it. My parents, my mom especially, would be open about things. Make no mistake, she believed, but she would say the same, she had no idea where he came from, and wouldn't give the standard 'brush off' of "it's not your place to question". I've posted it many times, I listen to/read about all kinds of theories and some I discard, such as all the god, jesus, bible stuff, some theories I find interesting and put in the 'wait and see' category. The truth of it is, I will never know. I don't really think anyone will ever know for sure. 

 

Religion is fascinating. People who stand and say god does this and god does that fascinate me. People from all walks of life believe, people from all walks of life don't believe. believers attack believers. It's wild. Some of the most hateful people I have ever seen claim to be christians while they run down other christians . I see the so called christians whine about non-believers and some of the things they say about religion, but they don't see how ridiculous it all seems to us, and can't understand why we do not want it pushed on us, or our kids/grandkids. It's like nothing is ever enough for them. They have tax exemption, huge churches, private schools, bible schools and all sorts of religious programs, but they cry when asked to please leave it out of politics and schools where it was never meant to be. And while they attack atheists for asking them to please leave it out of politics and schools, public school systems are asking muslims how they can make those school systems more muslim friendly.

 

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