and yet.. the rt. wingnuts support the freeloader.. directly contrary to their entire political platform of 'hate for the gimmethats'.. nope, no hypocrites in the rt. wingnuts.. you just can't make this stuff up.
Originally Posted by direstraits:
Originally Posted by jtdavis:
Dire, you are better than that
____________________________________
JT, Review what Contendah called Bundy. Even Oceania's ruling party only had a two minute hate against its enemies.
Nowhere in the left's harangues against Bundy have I read of sympathy for the hundreds of people's livelihood destroyed by the BLM for a specious environmental goal. BTW, check on the desert tortoises diet -- much of it is animal dung. Removing cows reduced their food supply. Yet, no problem placing a solar power plant in the same area .
--------------------------------------------------
I saw an article like that, and I think I'll see if I can find it again. The report was actually about how the cattle helped the tortoise. The cattle, each, produce about 12 "cow patties" a day. It's a source of food and water for the tortoise.
Originally Posted by direstraits:
Originally Posted by jtdavis:
Dire, you are better than that
____________________________________
JT, Review what Contendah called Bundy. Even Oceania's ruling party only had a two minute hate against its enemies.
Nowhere in the left's harangues against Bundy have I read of sympathy for the hundreds of people's livelihood destroyed by the BLM for a specious environmental goal. BTW, check on the desert tortoises diet -- much of it is animal dung. Removing cows reduced their food supply. Yet, no problem placing a solar power plant in the same area .
____
I called him a SQUATTER, which e is.
I also call him a WELFARE COWBOY, since by his refusal to pay for grazing rights and his continued trespass by grazing his cattle on Public Land without paying the required fees, he is--at public expense--garnering an economic benefit that he is not paying for.
The bureau said Cliven Bundy still owes taxpayers more than $1 million, which includes both grazing fees and penalties, and that it would work to resolve the matter administratively and through the court system.
-------------------------------
Over a million, and they are still going to go after that. He had paid, and didn't refuse to pay, he offered to pay the state. Now, if he comes up with the money, which I hope he does, and pays, what will be their next excuse for going after him? I don't think for one second they have stopped planning to go against him. Are they going after the billions the illegals and real welfare cheats have cost us? He can't graze 900 cows on 600,000 acres of miserable land, owes a little over a million, but the government will hand over 3 million to a woman to study african grandmothers, and spend millions to toss his cattle off land his family has used for over a hundred years, on the pretense of protecting a freaking tortoise that is of no use to anyone. Talk about a shameful waste of taxpayer's money.
Originally Posted by Contendah:
Originally Posted by direstraits:
Originally Posted by jtdavis:
Dire, you are better than that
____________________________________
JT, Review what Contendah called Bundy. Even Oceania's ruling party only had a two minute hate against its enemies.
Nowhere in the left's harangues against Bundy have I read of sympathy for the hundreds of people's livelihood destroyed by the BLM for a specious environmental goal. BTW, check on the desert tortoises diet -- much of it is animal dung. Removing cows reduced their food supply. Yet, no problem placing a solar power plant in the same area .
____
I called him a SQUATTER, which e is.
I also call him a WELFARE COWBOY, since by his refusal to pay for grazing rights and his continued trespass by grazing his cattle on Public Land without paying the required fees, he is--at public expense--garnering an economic benefit that he is not paying for.
_______________________________________________
He is not a squatter, as he owns about 160 acres which the ranch buildings are locate on. Bunday paid the grazing fees for years, until the courts ordered his herd off the land. He attempted to pay the county, but his efforts were refused.
What you have not addressed is the specious reasons for ordering him and 51 ranchers off the grazing land. Nor, have any of the left shown one iota of regret for destroying a century old way of life for those ranchers and the loss of their livelihood. Just intense hatred for one family who decided to not play the game.
I really would like to read all the email within BLM and Forestry that culminated in efforts to remove Bundy's cattle. Despite claiming insufficient funds to continue the tortoise breeding program the BLM managed to mount a program costing in the millions The removal contract alone was reported at about $925,000. Add all the vehicles and upwards of 200 armed rangers and its easily over the reported $3 million. Perhaps, BLM could have approached Bundy and offered to dismiss his old bills and fork over one million to clear his cattle out and keep them out, It would have been much cheaper and less embarrassing.
The lengths that the left and the federal gov't they love will go to hurt and in some cases destroy business owners is disgusting.
All of these federal bureaucrats have never produced or built anything in their working lives. They are nothing but leaches living off of the productive taxpaying members of society. No matter how much we produce or pay in taxes it is never enough to pay for their cocaine like addiction to spending and wasting our dollars.
the regressives are going to great lengths to defend a freeloader.. i find this hilarious.. considering their platform of 'hate for the gimmethats'.
He quit paying grazing fees. We can argue til the cows come home (pun, ha ha) and will never solve it. I am really more disturbed that a $1,000 per cow contract was issued. How did that number come to be?
Originally Posted by jtdavis:
He quit paying grazing fees. We can argue til the cows come home (pun, ha ha) and will never solve it. I am really more disturbed that a $1,000 per cow contract was issued. How did that number come to be?
________________________________________________
BLM contracting is thru the Department of Agriculture.
Originally Posted by Crash.Override:
the regressives are going to great lengths to defend a freeloader.. i find this hilarious.. considering their platform of 'hate for the gimmethats'.
The slight difference is that this guy has a job and pays taxes.
Originally Posted by direstraits:
And still no comments on the deliberate destruction of the livelihood of 51 ranchers, their families and hired hands to accommodate specious environmental interests. When the objectives of the all knowing state clash with the interests of someone just trying to make a living, one can expect as much of the milk of human kindness as one would expect milk from a boar hog.
Originally Posted by Kenny Powers:
Originally Posted by Crash.Override:
the regressives are going to great lengths to defend a freeloader.. i find this hilarious.. considering their platform of 'hate for the gimmethats'.
The slight difference is that this guy has a job and pays taxes.
______________
the difference being .. most immigrants have jobs and pay taxes.. and this guy was freeloading off the system for a number of years.. the same thing you regressives complain about the immigrants doing.. yet, it's perfectly fine for him.. and oh the horrors of the immigrants... nope.. not the slightest bit hypocritical.. bahahahahahaha!
Originally Posted by Crash.Override:
Originally Posted by Kenny Powers:
Originally Posted by Crash.Override:
the regressives are going to great lengths to defend a freeloader.. i find this hilarious.. considering their platform of 'hate for the gimmethats'.
The slight difference is that this guy has a job and pays taxes.
______________
the difference being .. most immigrants have jobs and pay taxes.. and this guy was freeloading off the system for a number of years.. the same thing you regressives complain about the immigrants doing.. yet, it's perfectly fine for him.. and oh the horrors of the immigrants... nope.. not the slightest bit hypocritical.. bahahahahahaha!
I support immigration reform.. However, I fail to see what that has to do with this.
The "gimmethats"(your term not mine) that I don't like and that you support are the ones that live on gov't land, receive our tax dollars, do not work, and never contribute to society.
This guy may have used gov't land but at least he has a job and pays taxes so he isn't a freeloader to the extent of the welfare lifers that you love.
All the lefties are carefully avoiding the matter of the 51 ranchers whose lives were destroyed by a ukase of the BLM.
Originally Posted by direstraits:
All the lefties are carefully avoiding the matter of the 51 ranchers whose lives were destroyed by a ukase of the BLM.
=========================
They avoid a lot of things. Oh the horrors!! He's grazing cattle on federal land!!! He's gonna squash a tortoise!!!(The BS excuse they're giving) Meanwhile, thousands of illegals, of all sorts, are pouring over the border, yee and his gang are running guns and helping fund the M.I.L.F. Not to mention why he's called shark fin yee. Old "dirty harry" reid is making his shady deals, the community organizer and his gang are ruining the country. but get that "freeloader" 
off public land!!! And I still want to know how many millions we've spent on old mooching mamma and other relatives of the obamas.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gr...rms-to-north-africa/
But none of that matters. This guy is doing something he and others, and ranchers before them, have done for over a hundred years without harming anything or anyone, but by golly he has to be stopped! Not only stopped, but ruined if possible, because for some reason, no matter the offense, if the democrits are against the person, they have to be ruined. Oh, but he stopped paying!!! Yes he did. He had a reason. What about the other thousands that don't pay? I wonder if al sharpton has paid that almost three million, or more, he owes/owed in back taxes?
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For some reason, on the above post, it posted added information in tiny print. It's a report from 2002, but very interesting.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/OPINIO...on.hatriots.militia/
New York (CNN) -- At least 10 death threats have been leveled against members of Congress since the health care vote. Windows at four district offices or county party headquarters have been shattered with bricks.
A gas line was severed at the home of the brother of one Democratic congressman from Virginia, and a man was arrested for making death threats against Republican Minority Whip Eric Cantor and his family.
And Monday, nine members of a Michigan-based anti-government militia group called the Hutaree were charged with conspiring to kill law enforcement officers.
These incidents may be following the drumbeat of incitement offered by a new breed of anti-government paramilitary organizations that have proliferated during the Obama presidency. Their members are self-styled patriots, armed and ready for a new American Revolution. They warn of martial law, seizure of guns, and imposition of global government, complete with forced internment camps and mass executions.
When love of country is mixed with fear of the government and hate for the president, that's when you become a Hatriot. We've confronted these forces before as a country. The record shows that the Hatriots are not part of a benign movement of patriots, but a dangerous strain of extremism with both a rap sheet and a body count.
In 2009, the Southern Poverty Law Center tracked a 300 percent increase in the number of militia groups operating in the United States -- from 42 to 127 such groups at the year's end.
One of these, the 3 Percenters, was co-founded by Mike Vanderboegh, who explicitly encouraged supporters to throw bricks as part of a post-health care vote protest: "If we break the windows of hundreds, thousands, of Democrat party headquarters across this country," he wrote on his blog, "we might just wake up enough of them to make defending ourselves at the muzzle of a rifle unnecessary." As a quote on the homepage of Vanderboegh's Web site warns, "All politics in this country now is just dress rehearsal for civil war."
Another new Hatriot group is the Oath Keepers, who claim to have some 3,000 dues-paying members, including current and former law enforcement officers, members of the military, and others who meet to reaffirm their oath to defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic. "The whole point of the Oath Keepers is to stop a dictatorship from ever happening here," its founder, Stewart Rhodes, told the Las Vegas Review-Journal.
Rhodes, a graduate of Yale Law School, former army paratrooper and former staff member for Congressman Ron Paul, says, "My focus is on the guys with the guns, because they can't do it without them. ... We say if the American people decide it's time for a revolution, we'll fight with you." Rhodes says his group is not a militia.
America has seen militarized radical groups in the past, playing off the same fears. Survivalist groups like the Minutemen began developing a "patriotic resistance" movement patterned after colonial militias in the early 1960s, doing wilderness military drills and hoarding weapons and ammunition in advance of what they said was a plan to "confiscate all private fire-arms by the end of 1965." This prompted President Kennedy to warn of "armed bands of civilian guerillas that are more likely to supply local vigilantes than national vigilance."
Radical and violent anti-government groups do not, of course, just reside on the far right. During the late 1960s, there were more than 1,000 shootings, arsons and bombings from left-wing radical groups. But the recession of the late 1970s saw the rise of Posse Comitatus groups which claimed there was a "criminal conspiracy to obstruct justice, disfranchise citizens and liquidate the Constitutional Republic of these United States."
<cite class="expCaption">Video: The threat of the militia movement</cite>
<cite class="expCaption">Video: All militias created equal?</cite>By the 1990s, America experienced the rise of the anti-government patriot militia movement, paramilitary groups fueled by anger at the Bill Clinton-led federal government after deaths at Ruby Ridge, Idaho, and Waco, Texas.
The destruction of the Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, was the culmination of years of escalation. In total, there were 845 acts of domestic terrorism from far-right and white supremacist groups between 1954 and 2004, including shootings, bombing and arson.
Today's Hatriots are potentially even more dangerous because of their ability to recruit and radicalize people via the Internet. They have proliferated in an environment where fear and hate are used to pump up hyperpartisanship -- including elected officials raising the specter of secession and talk radio hosts blurring the line between losing an election and living under tyranny.
There is an understandable impulse to dismiss the danger of the lone wingnut whose posts dot Hatriot Web sites. But in the last year, we have seen a half-dozen murders committed by unhinged individuals who drank deeply from Hatriot and anti-government conspiracy theory sites, including those implicated in the deaths of three Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, police officers and two Florida sheriff's deputies.
History shows us that it is most often the unhinged lone gunman who takes the hate as a call to misguided heroism -- the small but decisive step from being ready to die for a cause to being willing to kill for it.
Originally Posted by Bestworking:
Originally Posted by direstraits:
All the lefties are carefully avoiding the matter of the 51 ranchers whose lives were destroyed by a ukase of the BLM.
=========================
They avoid a lot of things. Oh the horrors!! He's grazing cattle on federal land!!! He's gonna squash a tortoise!!!(The BS excuse they're giving) Meanwhile, thousands of illegals, of all sorts, are pouring over the border, yee and his gang are running guns and helping fund the M.I.L.F. Not to mention why he's called shark fin yee. Old "dirty harry" reid is making his shady deals, the community organizer and his gang are ruining the country. but get that "freeloader" off public land!!! And I still want to know how many millions we've spent on old mooching mamma and other relatives of the obamas.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gr...rms-to-north-africa/
But none of that matters. This guy is doing something he and others, and ranchers before them, have done for over a hundred years without harming anything or anyone, but by golly he has to be stopped! Not only stopped, but ruined if possible, because for some reason, no matter the offense, if the democrits are against the person, they have to be ruined. Oh, but he stopped paying!!! Yes he did. He had a reason. What about the other thousands that don't pay? I wonder if al sharpton has paid that almost three million, or more, he owes/owed in back taxes?
____
More of the standard old irrelevent Worsthinking claptrap. A and B are both bad, but B is worse than A, so we should cut slack or even give a pass fot A. Here is how that "logic" unpacks:
Some guys beat their wives, but there an estimated two dozen serial killers running loose in this country. Don't worry about some wives being bruised up; go after the real nasties, those serial killers.
Jankinonya,
What you have identified is a Hatriot terrorist movement masquerading as patriots. They have been responsible for much more death, destruction, and civic unrest than any Islamist factions within this country. They prey on naive and ignorant folks in the same way that the slimy televangelist prosperity gospelers prey on the same class. People who know their Bibles would not fall for the latter and People who know American history and understand the Constitution would not fall prey to the Siren song of these "militia" vermin. In other words, they thrive on having an ignorant and under-educated public from which to recruit their own corps of jackbooted thugs.
How come a lot of you say if a group is anti rightie, they are radical jack booted thugs and if they are anti lefty, they are all american patriots?
I don't know anyone on the right that has said that jt, I must have missed it, care to show me?
Best, if it's not your post, you miss a lot
Originally Posted by Contendah:
Originally Posted by Bestworking:
Originally Posted by direstraits:
All the lefties are carefully avoiding the matter of the 51 ranchers whose lives were destroyed by a ukase of the BLM.
=========================
They avoid a lot of things. Oh the horrors!! He's grazing cattle on federal land!!! He's gonna squash a tortoise!!!(The BS excuse they're giving) Meanwhile, thousands of illegals, of all sorts, are pouring over the border, yee and his gang are running guns and helping fund the M.I.L.F. Not to mention why he's called shark fin yee. Old "dirty harry" reid is making his shady deals, the community organizer and his gang are ruining the country. but get that "freeloader" off public land!!! And I still want to know how many millions we've spent on old mooching mamma and other relatives of the obamas.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gr...rms-to-north-africa/
But none of that matters. This guy is doing something he and others, and ranchers before them, have done for over a hundred years without harming anything or anyone, but by golly he has to be stopped! Not only stopped, but ruined if possible, because for some reason, no matter the offense, if the democrits are against the person, they have to be ruined. Oh, but he stopped paying!!! Yes he did. He had a reason. What about the other thousands that don't pay? I wonder if al sharpton has paid that almost three million, or more, he owes/owed in back taxes?
____
More of the standard old irrelevent Worsthinking claptrap. A and B are both bad, but B is worse than A, so we should cut slack or even give a pass fot A. Here is how that "logic" unpacks:
Some guys beat their wives, but there an estimated two dozen serial killers running loose in this country. Don't worry about some wives being bruised up; go after the real nasties, those serial killers.
_______________________________________________________________________
Condie, I really wouldn't be alluding to Stalin, if, I were you -- "One death is a tragedy; one million is a statistic." So, destroying the livelihood of 51 ranchers, their families and their ranch hands in search of a specious environmental goal is a mere statistic. However, one family refusing to bend to the will of government ukases is an absolute abomination worth of wiping the family off the face of the earth with hundreds of armed federal agents! Good, got that!
Originally Posted by Crash.Override:
Originally Posted by Kenny Powers:
Originally Posted by Crash.Override:
the regressives are going to great lengths to defend a freeloader.. i find this hilarious.. considering their platform of 'hate for the gimmethats'.
The slight difference is that this guy has a job and pays taxes.
______________
the difference being .. most immigrants have jobs and pay taxes.. and this guy was freeloading off the system for a number of years.. the same thing you regressives complain about the immigrants doing.. yet, it's perfectly fine for him.. and oh the horrors of the immigrants... nope.. not the slightest bit hypocritical.. bahahahahahaha!
_________________________________
Actually, many illegal immigrants don't pay taxes. They work off the books.
Originally Posted by jtdavis:
Best, if it's not your post, you miss a lot
================
So, how hard is it to post proof? Oh right, I forgot, someone told you or someone emailed you. Got it.
Originally Posted by direstraits:
Originally Posted by Crash.Override:
Originally Posted by Kenny Powers:
Originally Posted by Crash.Override:
the regressives are going to great lengths to defend a freeloader.. i find this hilarious.. considering their platform of 'hate for the gimmethats'.
The slight difference is that this guy has a job and pays taxes.
______________
the difference being .. most immigrants have jobs and pay taxes.. and this guy was freeloading off the system for a number of years.. the same thing you regressives complain about the immigrants doing.. yet, it's perfectly fine for him.. and oh the horrors of the immigrants... nope.. not the slightest bit hypocritical.. bahahahahahaha!
_________________________________
Actually, many illegal immigrants don't pay taxes. They work off the books.
___________________
and many pay taxes and work within the system... why give the freeloader a break? why this particular freeloader? because 'his great granddaddy did it'.. i'm sorry.. times have changed.
More of the standard old irrelevent Worsthinking claptrap. A and B are both bad, but B is worse than A, so we should cut slack or even give a pass fot A. Here is how that "logic" unpacks:
Some guys beat their wives, but there an estimated two dozen serial killers running loose in this country. Don't worry about some wives being bruised up; go after the real nasties, those serial killers.
-----------------------------------------
More of that old contendah drama queen claptrap. Your attempt to compare this to wife beaters and serial killers is almost too silly and very bill like. It's more like, one man beats his wife to death, one slaps his wife. Condie doesn't worry about the one that was beaten to death, he's too busy screaming for the guy that slapped his wife to be thrown in jail for life. For a man that tries to come across as so intelligent, you sure post some stupid things.
Actually, many illegal immigrants don't pay taxes. They work off the books.
The reason they work off the books is because the person who hires them doesn't withhold taxes.
One reason they work off the books is because they are ILLEGAL. Think about that when someone is whining that illegals "work for less". Who couldn't work for less, if they didn't have to pay taxes, lived two families or more in one house, all working off the books, and was on the government dole, again, without contributing? They certainly aren't paying any fees for the use of federal lands.
Why don't anybody point a finger at the ones hiring them?
Originally Posted by jtdavis:
Why don't anybody point a finger at the ones hiring them?
________________________________________
Why can't both parties enforce use of Everify!
Plenty have pointed a finger at the ones hiring them. When we built our house we asked the contractor who would be doing all the work. We turned down a company that wanted to give us an estimate to repair tornado damage because it's no secret he uses illegals. We told him, nicely, why we didn't want his estimate, he said no hard feelings, he heard that sometimes. Even if there were "hard feelings" he would just have to get over it. As I said, that was not the first time, and won't be the last, that we turn them down. I will not knowingly use a company that hires them, and I will ask. It's not that hard to check, and it's not true that we can't find anybody to do the work, it's not true that it costs us more, and it's not true that the work is not excellent. So, you tell me, do you "point the finger" at the ones using illegals?
Best, in this case, you backed up what you say. Good job.
Originally Posted by Bestworking:
More of the standard old irrelevent Worsthinking claptrap. A and B are both bad, but B is worse than A, so we should cut slack or even give a pass fot A. Here is how that "logic" unpacks:
Some guys beat their wives, but there an estimated two dozen serial killers running loose in this country. Don't worry about some wives being bruised up; go after the real nasties, those serial killers.
-----------------------------------------
More of that old contendah drama queen claptrap. Your attempt to compare this to wife beaters and serial killers is almost too silly and very bill like. It's more like, one man beats his wife to death, one slaps his wife. Condie doesn't worry about the one that was beaten to death, he's too busy screaming for the guy that slapped his wife to be thrown in jail for life. For a man that tries to come across as so intelligent, you sure post some stupid things.
__________________________________________
By Harry, you're right. Condie could play one of those old harridans on "As the Worm Turns" -- have I got the name right.
On TV, I heard Harry Reid, on another TV show, state that Cliven Bundy did not pay his taxes. Bundy states he does pay his taxes. Harry accused Mitt Romney of this from the well of the Senate and was proven a liar. As the statement was made from the well of the Senate, Harry may not be sued for libel. However, making the statement on a TV show provides him no such protection. In addition, its a felony for an member of the IRS to provide anyone with such information, outside a federal investigation. DoJ should investigate if Harry participated in a felony and prosecute all parties. However, I will not hold my breath awaiting Eric Holder to uphold the law. Perhaps. Bundy could sue for libel, with the proceeds going to BLM to pay off his grazing fees. Dirty Harry has the bucks.