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In the small but cohesive Mormon community where he grew up, Hans Mattsson was a solid believer and a pillar of the church. He followed his father and grandfather into church leadership and finally became an “area authority” overseeing the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints throughout Europe.

 

When fellow believers in Sweden first began coming to him with information from the Internet that contradicted the church’s history and teachings, he dismissed it as “anti-Mormon propaganda,” the whisperings of Lucifer. He asked his superiors for help in responding to the members’ doubts, and when they seemed to only sidestep the questions, Mr. Mattsson began his own investigation.       

 

But when he discovered credible evidence that the church’s founder, Joseph Smith, was a polygamist and that the Book of Mormon and other scriptures were rife with historical anomalies, Mr. Mattsson said he felt that the foundation on which he had built his life began to crumble.       

 

Around the world and in the United States, where the faith was founded, the Mormon Church is grappling with a wave of doubt and disillusionment among members who encountered information on the Internet that sabotaged what they were taught about their faith, according to interviews with dozens of Mormons and those who study the church.

 

authority. “Everything I’d been taught, everything I’d been proud to preach about and witness about just crumbled under my feet. It was such a terrible psychological and nearly physical disturbance.”       

 

Mr. Mattsson’s decision to go public with his disaffection, in a church whose top leaders commonly deliberate in private, is a sign that the church faces serious challenges not just from outside but also from skeptics inside.       

 

Greg Prince, a Mormon historian and businessman in Washington who has held local leadership positions in the church, shares Mr. Mattsson’s doubts. “Consider a Catholic cardinal suddenly going to the media and saying about his own church, ‘I don’t buy a lot of this stuff,’ ” Mr. Prince said. “That’s the level we’re talking about here.”       

 

He said of Mr. Mattsson, “He is, as far as I know, the highest-ranking church official who has gone public with deep concerns, who has had a faith crisis and come forward to say he’s going to talk about it because maybe that will help us all to resolve it.”       

 

Every faith has its skeptics and detractors, but the Mormon Church’s history creates special challenges. The church was born in America only 183 years ago, and its founder and prophet, Joseph Smith, and his disciples left behind reams of papers that still exist, documenting their work, exposing their warts and sometimes contradicting one another.       

 

“The Roman Catholic Church has had 2,000 years to work through the hiccups in its history,” said Terryl L. Givens, a professor of English, literature and religion at the University of Richmond and a Mormon believer. “Mormonism is still an adolescent religion.”       

 

Mr. Givens and his wife, Fiona, recently presented what they called “Crucible of Doubt” sessions for questioning Mormons in England, Scotland and Ireland. Hundreds attended each event.

 

“Sometimes they are just this side of leaving, and sometimes they are simply faithful members who are looking for clarity and understanding to add to their faith,” said Mr. Givens, who hosted a similar discussion in July in Provo, Utah, and has others planned in the United States. The church is not sponsoring the sessions, Mr. Givens said, but local bishops give their permission.

 

Read more.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/21/us/some-mormons-search-the-web-and-find-doubt.html?hp&_r=0

 

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Hi Quail,

 

Chick might be a wee bit more comfortable in a good conservative Baptist church -- where we are more relaxed.  But, like you, I do encourage her to find some Christian church, i.e., Baptist, or any of the Churches of Christ, Nazarene, non-denominational, etc. -- and get involved in their fellowship and Bible studies.

 

And, to Chick, I do not intend to "clatter" or clutter up Vic's 100% copy/paste post.  For that would not be cluttering Vic's writings -- only the work of the real writer, whose work Vic has brought to the Religion Forum -- in the sincere hope that he, Vic, can start an argument. 

 

The only argument, as such, I might have is that not one single word in that post belongs to Vic.  I suppose one might say that Vic is "word challenged" -- for he cannot come up with even one original word from his own mind. 

 

But, I will say this:  Mormonism is not Christian, so what is there to say?   And, Vic's Roman Catholicism is a religion built upon a mountain of erroneous traditions and teachings.  Not a cult, but very borderline in the Christian world.

 

So, Chick, my Friend -- "Clatter on!"   But, please do consider finding a good Christian fellowship and become involved -- for I sincerely do want to meet you in heaven one day.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

A Friend is - Slightly Cracked_Animated

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Originally Posted by Bill Gray:

Hi Quail,

 

 

 

But, I will say this:  Mormonism is not Christian, so what is there to say?   And, Vic's Roman Catholicism is a religion built upon a mountain of erroneous traditions and teachings.  Not a cult, but very borderline in the Christian world.

 

-----------------------------------------------

As the world knows, Catholic is Biblical and you Are Not. Jesus built

Catholic and he didn't wait 1500 years on you.

The article says this:

 

<<<But when he discovered credible evidence that the church’s founder, Joseph Smith, was a polygamist and that the Book of Mormon and other scriptures were rife with historical anomalies, Mr. Mattsson said he felt that the foundation on which he had built his life began to crumble. >>>

 

Well, imagine that!  A man who ascended to the rank of "area authority" overseeing  the Mormon churches in Europe, but who has only recently discovered that Joseph Smith was a polygamist!  And he has only belatedly discovered at least some of the glaringly obvious historical errors in the Book of Mormon,   a screed that is contaminated from cover to cover with absurd, ludicrous anachronisms!  All this information  is, and long has been, available to anyone who cared to carry out  a little basic basic research on Mormonism.  I suspect that Mr. Mattsson has been discouraged by his superiors from reading such information from sources outside the Mormon cult, but that for some reason his curiosity got the better of him, and that once he started finding out the truth, he was loathe to stop seeking more of it.

 

Mr. Mattesson, alas , is apparently just one more spoon-fed Mormon, but one among the very few in that cult who has begun to discover for himself the fatuous and fantastic false claims of the cult's founder, the false prophet, Joseph Smith, Jr. con man extraordinary!

 

The article includes this little bit of analysis:

 

<<<Every faith has its skeptics and detractors, but the Mormon Church’s history creates special challenges. The church was born in America only 183 years ago, and its founder and prophet, Joseph Smith, and his disciples left behind reams of papers that still exist, documenting their work, exposing their warts and sometimes contradicting one another.>>>

 

I have consistently, on this and other forums, pointed out the extensive, and embarrassing paper trail left behind by Mormon "prophets, " "apostles", and historians, most of it contained within official Mormon publications. Loyal Mormons, responding to this, have tried to wiggle away from the obvious implications of this large and ludicrous body of work , either by claiming that "It is not official Mormon doctrine" or by invoking  that old emotional  Mormon fall-back answer to the effect that, "I prayed to God to tell me whether Joseph Smith is a true prophet and whether the Book of Mormon is the true word of God, and God told me that all of that was true and I felt it in my heart."  Mr. Mattsson is to be commended for allowing his God-given intellect to trump this kind of flimsy, emotional appeal for allegedly divine confirmation of Mormon mythology and fabrication.

 

Originally Posted by semiannualchick:

Even if I had a desire to go to church, it wouldn't be a COC. I like music to much.

----------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Bestworking:

You mean you don't want to dive into crazy??

________

Heck, no! Everyone one of them is crazy, JMHO. I got out of crazy years ago & have no desire to go back.

Interesting there contendah. The COC had some inkling this would happen. When I inquired of mine own brethren in the COC as to how they were justifying their support of the Mormon Romney they just stood there and done this. They see Blacks as fodder for the mission cow, not presidential material.

     P.S. Semi , what the ever is your great sin, the C0C, after all these years would take you back and not pick at  the albatross that is worse from wear about your neck.

Originally Posted by Quaildog:

covetous lust more than likely.

yes I know what is an Albatross.

______

Why would you say that? The Sin of Covetousness covers many things. Thy neighbor’s house, thy neighbor’s wife, his manservant, his maidservant, his ox, his a*s*s, or any thing that is your neighbor’s.

BTW, I do lust……for my husband. Can you say you never lust? If you say no, you're a liar.

 

Tell us what an Albatross is.

Originally Posted by Quaildog:

well semi I've just got this feeling that you have shot one. why do you ask me trick questions that have answers in superposition? pick one. it is somewhere between the first and last. it is any of them and at the same time all of them

Why didn't you just tell semi you didn't know??

Why would semi have a big bird around her neck??

 

Albatrosses, of the biological family Diomedeidae, are large seabirds allied to the procellariids, storm-petrels and diving-petrels in the order Procellariiformes (the tubenoses). They range widely in the Southern Ocean and the North Pacific. They are absent from the North Atlantic, although fossil remains show they once occurred there too and occasional vagrants are found.

For those wondering about all this albatross stuff, please note that the "albatross around the neck" concept originated with the great English poet, Samuel Taylor Coleridge, in his "The Rime of the Ancient Mariner."

 

The mariner shot an albatross with his crossbow.  The albatross was considered by mariners to bring good luck to ships at sail on the open seas.  After the albatross was shot, the wind subsided and fog and mist formed, creating the worst conditions for sailing--all assumed to be punishment for the killing of that lucky bird..  As punishment for his crime, the mariner was compelled to wear the decaying carcass of the albatross around his neck.

 

Here is Coleridge's masterpiece:

http://www.poetryfoundation.org/poem/173253

 

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