If the unions are suppose to be for the common man, so to speak, how come they have $1 Billion dollars in assets and are crying poor mouth because the VW workers voted not to join them? So they sued and will probably find a Liberal Judge who will agree and order another vote. And if they still vote not to join, when will the name calling start that southerners are too stupid to know what is good for them, or the union.
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UAW has shrunk by two-thirds as workers saw little value. VW workers simply had to view a gravestone labeled American Motors and cities like Detroit, Saginaw and Flint which could serve in the Walking Dead series with little changes to recognize that NO was reasonable.
ok, now time for some facts..
vw wants the plant to go union.
the polls show, the month before, the union vote was almost a guaranteed success.
that was BEFORE republican lawmakers , in TN, threatened to pull the 'tax incentives' to vw, if they went union.
there was a LARGE influx of anti-union money into TN, 30 days before the vote.
when was our economy at its highest peak? well, it just happens to be when we had great union jobs and a strong middle class. the collective bargaining power of a 'union' helps keep the middle class strong and intact. wanna know how voting NO will effect your job, ask those guys in smyrna about 'job security'.
Now Crash fully supports corporate welfare as long as it benefits his cause. Imagine that.
It's not the 1960's anymore. Global competition will erode the union base. It's happening and will continue to happen as a fact of life.
I believe that VW said they did not oppose the union not that they supported it. Is that the same as being innocent is not the same as being not guilty? They are not opposed so they must be for it. Round and round it goes. New meaning for words already defined but need to be changed to make their way of doing things seem logical. The Liberal way of doing things.
Unions were useful when industries were command and control organizations like the military. However, its no longer the 19th or early 20th century. Most unions are on their way to extinction. Plumbers, electricians, and operative engineers (heavy equipment) are exceptions. The members can act as individuals, small businesses or employees. Their unions learned to change with their needs. The same unions test and license their members so an employer knows he's getting a worker of a certain expertise and skill.
right, because the republican lawmakers wanting to 'pull the tax incentives' was all about punishing vw?
Reuters reports this morning that Volkswagen’s “top labor representative” has threatened to block any future expansion plans in the South, citing conservative interference in the United Auto Workers vote in Chattanooga.
Quoting an interview with a German newspaper, the news service reports Bernd Osterloh, head of VW’s works council, as saying he can imagine further expansion in the United States, but it probably won’t be in the South unless some sort of labor representation is established in the Chattanooga plant. Workers in Germany have representation on corporate boards, giving them a say in citing decisions.
why is it so hard for you guys to understand. vw WANTS the workers representation. they keep saying it and the republicans, in TN, don't have any ears.
Now Crash fully supports corporate welfare as long as it benefits his cause. Imagine that.
It's not the 1960's anymore. Global competition will erode the union base. It's happening and will continue to happen as a fact of life.
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and there you have it.. i must be wrong.. or.. well, hoob can't read. funny how there are at least a half dozen articles stating 'vw wants the workers to go union.' the tn republican lawmakers would rather lose the plant than have it go union. so much so that they wished to punish vw if the plant went union.. and the rt. wingnuts support the idea. against a company's wishes. just wow!
Now Crash fully supports corporate welfare as long as it benefits his cause. Imagine that.
It's not the 1960's anymore. Global competition will erode the union base. It's happening and will continue to happen as a fact of life.
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and there you have it.. i must be wrong.. or.. well, hoob can't read. funny how there are at least a half dozen articles stating 'vw wants the workers to go union.' the tn republican lawmakers would rather lose the plant than have it go union. so much so that they wished to punish vw if the plant went union.. and the rt. wingnuts support the idea. against a company's wishes. just wow!
You can't read, my statement had nothing to do with the unionization of VW. It had to do with the fact that the mean ol' corporations YOU like to rail against are using what YOU refer to as "corporate welfare". Now all of a sudden, "corporate welfare" is ok only because Republicans are threating to do away it. Liberal hypocrisy at it's worst.
hoob, you can't have it both ways.. you either want the plant and the jobs, or you don't.. and how easily you nuts forget.. TN has that 'lottery'.. remember how much money it generates for the state? they can AFFORD the incentives.. unlike poor, backwards bama. you just don't really have a clue, do you?
and just for more information.. which you seem to be in short supply of.. 'corporate welfare' most people refer to is the FEDERAL corporate tax system. you know.. that system that allows for multimillion dollar tax refunds? how many states do that? really hoob, you have got to get informed. you show your 'low information voter' status, with every post.
hoob, you can't have it both ways.. you either want the plant and the jobs, or you don't.. and how easily you nuts forget.. TN has that 'lottery'.. remember how much money it generates for the state? they can AFFORD the incentives.. unlike poor, backwards bama. you just don't really have a clue, do you?
Don't you realize that all lotteries are just a tax on the poor--the people that can least afford to gamble? And guess where the largest sales point for the Tennessee Lottery is? In a little grocery in the poorest neighborhood in the poorest city in the U.S.--Memphis. Between The Lottery, Tunica gambling and crack cocaine, there is virtually no cash in the Memphis economy. And no cash mean high crime--as in the whole city of Memphis. The lottery is a curse on society, as is casino gambing.
hoob, you can't have it both ways.. you either want the plant and the jobs, or you don't.. and how easily you nuts forget.. TN has that 'lottery'.. remember how much money it generates for the state? they can AFFORD the incentives.. unlike poor, backwards bama. you just don't really have a clue, do you?
Don't you realize that all lotteries are just a tax on the poor--the people that can least afford to gamble? And guess where the largest sales point for the Tennessee Lottery is? In a little grocery in the poorest neighborhood in the poorest city in the U.S.--Memphis. Between The Lottery, Tunica gambling and crack cocaine, there is virtually no cash in the Memphis economy. And no cash mean high crime--as in the whole city of Memphis. The lottery is a curse on society, as is casino gambing.
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Memphis benefits not a bit from the casinos in Tunica . Tunica County (once the poorest county in the nation - News network did a thing on it) , is now one of the wealthest, and the state of Mississippi rakes in the bucks.
Due to that, a word of caution if you are driving in Miss. If you find yhourself on a 2 lane road, be cautions, because there is construction ahead 4 laining that road.
hoob, you can't have it both ways.. you either want the plant and the jobs, or you don't.. and how easily you nuts forget.. TN has that 'lottery'.. remember how much money it generates for the state? they can AFFORD the incentives.. unlike poor, backwards bama. you just don't really have a clue, do you?
Don't you realize that all lotteries are just a tax on the poor--the people that can least afford to gamble? And guess where the largest sales point for the Tennessee Lottery is? In a little grocery in the poorest neighborhood in the poorest city in the U.S.--Memphis. Between The Lottery, Tunica gambling and crack cocaine, there is virtually no cash in the Memphis economy. And no cash mean high crime--as in the whole city of Memphis. The lottery is a curse on society, as is casino gambing.
Memphis the poorest? It did not even make the top ten in these from end of 2013. Not saying my hometown is not without major problems. I also do not think something you voluntary buy could be considered a tax.
Back to the union vote. The governor came out against it, senator Corker said VW would close the plant, Grover Norquest rented billboards against it. I have no idea why an anti tax guy is anti union, but that's his right. The governor and senator needs to stay out of it.
Back to the union vote. The governor came out against it, senator Corker said VW would close the plant, Grover Norquest rented billboards against it. I have no idea why an anti tax guy is anti union, but that's his right. The governor and senator needs to stay out of it.
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So, Obama, who spoke out in favor of unionization, can speak, but no other politicians -- how liberal of you!
Tennessee is directly affected by the vote, so their politicians have a reason to speak. Obama's only reason is payoffs from the unions.
one more time.. for the slow or learning impaired.
vw wanted the plant to go union.
Crash,
From all I have read your assessment is wrong. VW said they would allow the workers to decide if they wanted a union shop. They did this because their hands were forced by the German union. You can bet they did not want to see their loss of state sponsored revenue, and like the Congressman said, the state would not have been able to support the company with incentives if they were a Union shop. No self respecting voter in TN (AL, or MS) would support tax relief for a company like that. The employees are already being paid skilled labor wages, what more could they gain from brining in the UAW and paying a percentage of their wages to these thugs?
It is the goal of the UAW to break into the southern auto manufacturing companies. They have already lost their stronghold in the north due to those businesses closing up, so if they don't get in down here, they will cease to exist. They are a parasitic infestation on the workforce. Most of the employees at these places here know how lucky they are to have a good paying job with benefits. Then there is that group that thinks they deserve more and are never going to be happy.
do you people not have google? can you not read? do you just not want to read? i've said this till i'm sick of saying it... why is it so hard to understand? all you have to do is google it and and read one of the 10 or so articles. i don't know why i expected more from the same people who hosted the scopes monkey trial.
Reuters reports this morning that Volkswagen’s “top labor representative” has threatened to block any future expansion plans in the South, citing conservative interference in the United Auto Workers vote in Chattanooga.
Quoting an interview with a German newspaper, the news service reports Bernd Osterloh, head of VW’s works council, as saying he can imagine further expansion in the United States, but it probably won’t be in the South unless some sort of labor representation is established in the Chattanooga plant. Workers in Germany have representation on corporate boards, giving them a say in citing decisions.
The mindset of anti union people overrides any amount of facts that you can put in front of them. Unions are what created the middle class. Every time union membership goes down, the middle class goes down.
So, if you are working in the plant and vote against the union, you are interfering?
Unions are great, especially the UAW, just ask anyone from Detroit.
It could be that the people that voted against the UAW did not think they would get anything for their money. The electrician's union provides good training for it's members, I don't know about the other crafts but IBEW members are highly trained and it shows in the work that they do.
I have no problem with workers organizing. However, there should be no laws forcing someone to be a part of a union.
hoob, you can't have it both ways.. you either want the plant and the jobs, or you don't.. and how easily you nuts forget.. TN has that 'lottery'.. remember how much money it generates for the state? they can AFFORD the incentives.. unlike poor, backwards bama. you just don't really have a clue, do you?
You're deflecting crash. I have no horse in that race regarding whether or not they go union. I also have no problem with giving corporations tax breaks to bring jobs in. YOU are the one who has stated many, many times that what you call "corporate welfare" should be stopped. Now YOU are for it simply because it benefits your cause. Can I be any more clear than that?
As for a lotto, a fool and his money shall soon be parted. You may want to research exactly what percentage of the lotto money generated actually returns to the public. Obviously, you will be surprised.
The mindset of anti union people overrides any amount of facts that you can put in front of them. Unions are what created the middle class. Every time union membership goes down, the middle class goes down.
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The middle class existed well before the unions. Its expansion begin when the US was formed. Unions are a late 19th and early 20th century solution, now outdated. Given a choice, teachers abandoned their union in droves, same as done in the unions involved with private enterprise.
It could be that the people that voted against the UAW did not think they would get anything for their money. The electrician's union provides good training for it's members, I don't know about the other crafts but IBEW members are highly trained and it shows in the work that they do.
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I would include operating engineers and plumbers.
hoob, you can't have it both ways.. you either want the plant and the jobs, or you don't.. and how easily you nuts forget.. TN has that 'lottery'.. remember how much money it generates for the state? they can AFFORD the incentives.. unlike poor, backwards bama. you just don't really have a clue, do you?
You're deflecting crash. I have no horse in that race regarding whether or not they go union. I also have no problem with giving corporations tax breaks to bring jobs in. YOU are the one who has stated many, many times that what you call "corporate welfare" should be stopped. Now YOU are for it simply because it benefits your cause. Can I be any more clear than that?
As for a lotto, a fool and his money shall soon be parted. You may want to research exactly what percentage of the lotto money generated actually returns to the public. Obviously, you will be surprised.
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hoob, can you show where i was 'for the tax incentives'?.. the lawmakers in tn gave them the incentives.. now, to stop the plant from going union and against the VW management's wishes, the regressives of TN made the threat. how is that 'i supported the incentives?" i understand them, and that's a far cry from 'approval'. i can see how the regressives hate the lottery.. it provides for the education of the people and costs the regressives some of those 'low information voters'. now, stop deflecting from the topic with your ignorant dribble. you obviously lack the mental capacity to understand.
Corker did not threaten them, he just told them that it would be extremely hard for the legislature to support a factory with union representation, and he is correct. If the mainstream voters are not supporting this endeavor what makes them think that the voters are going to allow the legislature to throw tax incentives to a company who has brought in the UAW? The UAW contributed to the destruction of Detroit. It bred the corruption that bankrupted that state. Now the Union plans to pour another #300M in the next election to make sure they can get rid of anyone in office who opposes them. They know they cannot continue to suck a dry teat in the north where the manufacturing industry is sying because of the unions, and that to survive they must get in the south. i hope the southern folks continue to hold fast and not let them ruin what has become our only saving grace of late. Finally some good paying jobs with benefits are coming to the southern states. Why screw that up with union dues?
The unions are showing their "poor loser" mentality that they have accused the Republicans of for so many years. The majority spoke and said they did not want them there, but the UAM will not let up. The Reuters article says that this has been the goal of the UAW for many years, and the german Unions know that if they can increase the costs of doing business in the south, they will retain some of the manufacturing in the Germany. The enemy of my enemy is my friend mentality.
i give up.. common sense is in short supply among regressives.
Corker did not threaten them, he just told them that it would be extremely hard for the legislature to support a factory with union representation, and he is correct. If the mainstream voters are not supporting this endeavor what makes them think that the voters are going to allow the legislature to throw tax incentives to a company who has brought in the UAW? The UAW contributed to the destruction of Detroit. It bred the corruption that bankrupted that state. Now the Union plans to pour another #300M in the next election to make sure they can get rid of anyone in office who opposes them. They know they cannot continue to suck a dry teat in the north where the manufacturing industry is sying because of the unions, and that to survive they must get in the south. i hope the southern folks continue to hold fast and not let them ruin what has become our only saving grace of late. Finally some good paying jobs with benefits are coming to the southern states. Why screw that up with union dues?
If you really believe the unions are what killed Detroit then I have a bridge to sell you . News flash unions are already in Tennessee and why should a plant get support of the legislature based on if they have a union or not. Its management 101; for a union to exist there has to be a reason "bad management" and then for a company to fail the same has to exist. Yep, the union made the decision to design and build crappy cars. "remember planed obsolescence" or not to hire workers resulting in existing workers to have to work overtime. I really have no dog in this fight as I am a member of ALPA and do not always agree with them but they are necessary at my job.
Sorry HF, but I disagree. The corruption and wasted opportunites of the major autoplants during the last part of the 20th century contributed to the decline of Detroit and the reason for its ultimate demise. Obviously the workers at this plant are satisfied, at least the majority, and therefore no union is needed.
No one wants to blame brain dead management. Unfunded perks and benefits for the uaw workers, fully funded and excessive salary and perks for managers. No one wants to touch that. Why not?
Corruption was the main contributor to the demise of Detroit. It started back in prohibition and it never let go of that town.
To blame the union for the demise of Detroit makes as much sense as blaming Ronald McDonald for a bad hamburger.
I don't know Jank, but I think the business world might disagree with your assessment. Of course if Ronald McDonald had been running Detroit, it might still be solvent.
hoob, you can't have it both ways.. you either want the plant and the jobs, or you don't.. and how easily you nuts forget.. TN has that 'lottery'.. remember how much money it generates for the state? they can AFFORD the incentives.. unlike poor, backwards bama. you just don't really have a clue, do you?
You're deflecting crash. I have no horse in that race regarding whether or not they go union. I also have no problem with giving corporations tax breaks to bring jobs in. YOU are the one who has stated many, many times that what you call "corporate welfare" should be stopped. Now YOU are for it simply because it benefits your cause. Can I be any more clear than that?
As for a lotto, a fool and his money shall soon be parted. You may want to research exactly what percentage of the lotto money generated actually returns to the public. Obviously, you will be surprised.
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hoob, can you show where i was 'for the tax incentives'?.. the lawmakers in tn gave them the incentives.. now, to stop the plant from going union and against the VW management's wishes, the regressives of TN made the threat. how is that 'i supported the incentives?" i understand them, and that's a far cry from 'approval'. i can see how the regressives hate the lottery.. it provides for the education of the people and costs the regressives some of those 'low information voters'. now, stop deflecting from the topic with your ignorant dribble. you obviously lack the mental capacity to understand.
LOL, crash you poor critter, you still don't get it. Before this situation, you consider corporate tax breaks to be evil, now all of a sudden they are ok. You can't have it both ways. I've already stated my opionion regarding tax breaks for businesses and it still hasn't changed.
Concerning Tennessee's lotto, to get $1 for state education programs, people have to buy $4 worth of lotto tickets. I guess only a progressive is dumb enough to make that kind of investment. I'll be happy to take your 100 dollar bill and return you $25 anytime.
I'm surprised that the small government folks on here seem to be turning a blind eye at the BIG government interference in the UAW VW union vote. Am I to understand that many of you support the Gov. and Senators of that state in threatening VW employees and even the company if they went against their wishes of a none union plant?
Corruption was the main contributor to the demise of Detroit. It started back in prohibition and it never let go of that town.
To blame the union for the demise of Detroit makes as much sense as blaming Ronald McDonald for a bad hamburger.
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The demise of Detroit, along with Saginaw and Flint are hydra headed -- decades of Democrat administrations, bone headed decisions by auto companies and, yes, UAW..
