Hi GB,
You tell me, "Well, Bill, the facts are that there are documented cases annually where people are resuscitated after they have met the definition of physical death. There have been cases this year and the difference in most is the time the person had been without breathing or signs of life."
Yes, there have been cases where the medical doctors declared a person dead -- and later the person appeared to have been brought back from the dead. All this tells me is that the medical doctors were wrong. Given a choice of believing medical doctors or believing God; I will choose to believe God and His Written Word.
But, GB, are you telling us that you do not believe what the Bible teaches? If you will look more closely at my first post, you will find Scripture passages which tell us that a person cannot die -- and then come back.
Then, you write, "As for these people who have not yet died but, as they say, came back and have a story to tell or an experience to relate -- who are we to tell them what they saw and experienced was not real? Frankly we just don't know for it didn't happen to us."
True, we see folks eager to hear and believe the people who have "seen heaven" and returned to tell us about it. That is very similar to folks who visit seers and fortune tellers in an attempt to know the future. If God wants us to know the future; He will disclose it to us. Well, actually, He has already. It is in the Bible. And, as far as us knowing what heaven will be like -- that, too, is in the Bible. At least, as much as God wants us to know at this time.
God does not tell us all details about the trip -- only what we need for tomorrow. The same is true about heaven. What God feels we need to know about heaven is in the Bible. So, why should we look to psychics, seers, or NDEs to tell us about the future and about heaven? God has already told us all we need to know.
You tell me, "As for the statement that, not in the Bible being proof that NDE does not have any validity -- that also is not a rational statement for you. (You) know that the Bible is silent on many things and issues in life. Just because you do not find it printed in the Scriptures does not make it potentially (not) a viable event or happening."
Yet, the Bible is NOT silent on this issue. Take a look at Hebrews 9:27.
Then, you tell me, "As for your statement about there not being any NDE event recorded in Scripture, while I know how you will spin it -- How to you reconcile your statement with John 11:38-43 and John 12:9&10. Yes this is a Miracle of Jesus but by definition Lazarus was dead and then he was raised. The dead returned to life.
Although in Lazarus' situation it was a miracle of our Lord, there are still those today that have been declared and perceived as dead and yet have returned to life. So many would say that Lazarus was a recorded NDE in the Bible we just don't have the experiences that Lazarus related after he was returned to the physical body."
First, Lazarus was NOT a recorded NDE. Lazarus was dead for four days. Jesus Christ raised Lazarus from the dead -- not a NDE.
Yes, in the days of Jesus earthly ministry, there were incidents where people were raised from the dead -- by Jesus Christ, or by the power of Jesus Christ. Lazarus, as you mentioned is a prime example of Jesus raising the dead. However, as I said -- there are NO cases of Near Death Experiences, where folks who were near-dead and then rose again.
How do we account for the folks raised from the dead during Jesus' ministry -- and not now? The same way we can say that there are no prophets today. In the Old Testament, God used prophets to declare His messages to the people. Now, with all people having access to His Written Word, the Bible -- there is no need for prophets. We basically get it straight from God, i.e, His Bible.
By the same token, in the days of Jesus' ministry and shortly thereafter, we see many miracles such as raising the dead, healing the blind, healing the lepers, etc. These were meant to show testimony of Jesus Christ as the promised Messiah.
As we are told in John 20:30-31, "Therefore many other signs Jesus also performed in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; but these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name."
1 John 5:13, "These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life."
B. B. Warfield, in Counterfeit Miracles, Banner of Truth Trust, 1918, reprinted 1976, pp. 27,28 -- wrote:
Had any miracles perchance occurred beyond the Apostolic age they would be without significance; mere occurrences with no universal meaning. What is important is that the Holy Scriptures teach clearly that the complete revelation of God is given in Christ, and that the Holy Spirit who is poured out on the people of God has come solely in order to glorify Christ and to take the things of Christ.
Because Christ is all in all, and all revelation and redemption alike are summed up in him, it would be inconceivable that either revelation or accompanying signs should continue after the completion of that great revelation with its accrediting works.
From the GodQuestions.Org web site:
http://www.gotquestions.org/miracles-Bible.html
Question: "Does God still perform miracles?"
Answer: The purpose of miracles was to authenticate the performer of the miracles. Acts 2:22 declares, “Men of Israel, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through Him, as you yourselves know.” The same is said of the apostles, “The things that mark an apostle -- signs, wonders and miracles -- were done among you with great perseverance” (2 Corinthians 12:12).
Speaking of the Gospel, Hebrews 2:4 proclaims, “God also testified to it by signs, wonders and various miracles, and gifts of the Holy Spirit distributed according to His will.” We now have the truth of Jesus recorded in Scripture. We now have the writings of the apostles recorded in Scripture.
Jesus and His apostles, as recorded in Scripture, are the cornerstone and foundation of our faith (Ephesians 2:20). In this sense, miracles are no longer necessary, as the message of Jesus and His apostles has already been attested to and accurately recorded in the Scriptures. Yes, God still performs miracles. At the same time, we should not necessarily expect miracles to occur today just as they did in Bible times.
So, GB, if you and Vic insist upon believing in "near death experiences" -- not a problem. What is believed about such things does not affect a person's salvation. However, no one can ever claim this to be Biblical; for it is not -- at all. The Bible clearly teaches against this kind of "future seeing."
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill