A mans philosophy exposed!

Just google "Archbishop of Canterbury" and "Lambeth Palace, London."

You ought to be able to find Rowan Williams' office's numbers there.

We are not biblical literalists, we believe in the inspiration of the holy scriptures, not their dictation, faith, and tradition along with logic to guide us.

We are not legalistic, nor are we exclusivists. We claim to have no monopoly on faith, truth, or anything else in the world.

We are free to believe whatever dogma we personally wish, so long as we follow the Book of Common Prayer and subscribe to the Creeds.

The Church teaches that the Bible contains all that is necessary for salvation, but not that it is divine in and of itself, or that it is the literal reading is the sine non qua for "True Belef."

The Anglican Communion is not a fundamentalist church. We are the reformed branch of ancient Roman Catholicism, officially rejecting the powers of the Bishop of Rome in being the single arbiter of doctrine, of novel dogma and doctrine (such as advanced Mariology, the doctrine of Papal Infallability, etc.) and in former times, the monopoly of the Latin language in official church proceedings. We reject a definition of transubstantiation or constanstubiation, instead, relying upon the Holy Spirit to do whatever it is He or She does in the transmutation of the bread and wine into the Body and Blood of Our Lord Jesus Christ.

We believe in one God, the Father Almighty,
Maker of Heaven and Earth,
and in Jesus Christ, Our Lord and Saviour,
God from God, Light from Light,
Begotten not made, of the same substance as the Father, who for us men and for our salvation was made incarnate by the Virgin Mary, and made flesh. We believe in the Holy Spirit, who with the Father and Son is worshipped and glorified.
We believe that Jesus Christ was crucified for our sins and rose on the third day and who shall come again in glory to judge both the quick and the dead. We believe in one holy, catholic, and apostolic church. We acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins, the communion of saints and the life of the world to come.

If you have been baptized with water in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, then you are welcome in any Episcopal or Anglican Church in the world to attend divine services, to confess your sins in public, to seek God's forgiveness and be assured that it is granted in the eating of Our Lord's blessed Body and the drinking of His Blessed Blood.

You can believe in Adam and Eve as literal or not, you can tribulate and rapturate all you want, but expect a ****ed eyebrow or a smirk, and don't bring it up in coffee hour. You will not hear this stuff in a pulpit. We preach the Gospel! We read portions of the Old Testament, the Psalms, and the Epistles along with the Gospel every day, and especially on Sunday, as not all churches are open every day of the week.

We have no eschatology, trusting in Our Lord's own words and not men's interpretation of apocolyptic literature. We find it necessary to practice what we preach, however, and that includes turning the other cheek and feeding the hungry and outreach to the downtrodden.

We do not teach the novel doctrine of "spontaneous salvation" that so many contemporary Protestants do. We do not for the simple reason that it is not part of the apostolic faith.

We believe "what has always been believed in all places and at all times," as one description of orthodoxy claims.

You are really a sad person, Braylan. Sad, hubris filled and obsessed with how many angels can dance on the head of a pin or whatever it is you occupy your time with.

Sad, and offensive, I might add.

You can take your prophecy interpretations and add them to the long, long, tired list of prior now gratefully forgotten (for the most part) predecessors.

Eh gads Neal,

When all the words are removed from your sentences, there is nothing left.

Neal, who wrote the Book of Common Prayer?

braylan, i believe you're going to have to get up earlier to expose anyone but yourself.

you go, neal.

My daughter is a cradle Episcopalian and I wouldn't have it any other way.

I don't want Braylan exposing himself in front of me.


DF

quote:

Originally posted by DeepFat:
I don't want Braylan exposing himself in front of me.


DF

Me neither, DeepF...LOL

I just checked. I am not exposed, even when I showered, I wore my bathing trunks to avoid temptation, then wrapped a towel about my center portions to avoid my dog's stare at my shameful male parts!

Do you fundamentalists know how small your population actually is in the world of Christendom? You actually seem surprised that major mainline and the Roman Churches do not take a literalist view on the Bible.

As for who wrote the BCP, no one person wrote the BCP. Archbishop Cramner compiled the first version, using an English translation of the old Sarum missal. The 39 articles are in there, too, along with canticles, psalms set out in meter, and various miscellaneous prayers. It has been revised several times, most recently in 1979, replacing the 28 book in the USA. This gave us Rite I and Rite II, basically, a choice between the thees and thous of I and modern English for II along with two new approved Eucharistic Prayers, largely based on ancient Eastern Rite liturgies.
We can be freeform, also in our celebrations, as long as certain "has to be done" rubrics are carried out, like the officiant actually saying "This is My Body" and "This is My Blood" when consecrating the elements of the Eucharist.
Probably 2/5 of the BCP is straight out of the Bible.
We translated that for you to usurp, you know, old King Jimmy I/VI, that is. The BCP in England is under the jurisdiction of the British Parliament. In the Churches of Ireland, Episcopal Church of Scotland, the PECUSA, the Canadian Anglican Church, etc. the General Assembly would and do approve any changes.
I am not giving Braylan any of our clergy's numbers, as one priest does not speak for the Communion, only the Bishops can. I assume he can use a phone book after that.
We are not directed by priests, we elect our clergy who are then appointed in office by the bishop and can only be removed when the contract is mutually severed, for cause with the vestry's vote and for cause by the bishop. Our clergy are not considered any different from fellow members save for their ordinations and only for sacerdotal events that require a priest. We do not even need on if there is no Communion! As a rule, we seem to distrust the clergy to a certain degree and tend to let the vestry and the bishop and local parish tradition dictate what goes on at the pulpit and behind the altar.
But I can guarantee you that the homily will not be a boring hour long snoozer on some begats and smites and tribularpture -- it will be on the Gospel! On man's duty to God and his brothers and sisters, not on how special we are in our faith in hideous modern innovations such as "instant salvation" and "Bema Seat Judgments" or "Prosperity Gospel." The Bishop would have them under observation at the state nervous hospital very rapidly were they to break out in a bunch of such doings. We squat and we stand and we grovel at the foot of the Cross and are not ashamed to do it, either!
I am actually quite appalled at the obvious lack of any basic church history that so many show on these forums.
All that "Dearly beloved we are gathered together this day to join this man and this woman" and "Ashes to ashes, dust to dust, in sure and certain hope of the resurrection, etc." is straight out of the Book of Common Prayer. In turn, no one can say who "wrote" them, they have been in use from time immemorial.
By the way, the ECLA and UMC liturgies are almost exactly like the BCP services. The modern English Mass following the Vatican II Council is largely "informed" by the BCP.
Why don't you just go to church Sunday? There is St. Barts on Darby Drive, Trinity on Pine, and Grace in Sheffield also on Darby there. I shall be at St. Timothy's in Athens, right on the Square on Washington ST. Poll the people there and ask them about tribulation, rapture, and a literal Bible reading. You can also do the same in most ECLA and UMC and Roman Churches. You will be shocked, shocked, I say! They don't toe your line! Nope, why toe your line when we invented the game?

I'm just too tired to read what I know I will enjoy reading tomorrow, Neal, but I did read enough to give you two thumbs up for giving a much more thorough answer than was deserved.

You write very well, Neal. Many of your posts require pause to digest, but well worth the effort.

Hi to all,

Neal tells us that Archbishop Cranmer wrote their prayer book. Just so everyone knows -- in 1534, when King Henry declared himself the "Supreme Head of the Church" -- Cranmer was his archbishop.

So, Neal is right -- their prayer book has been around longer than our KJV Bible.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

quote:

Originally posted by UnderContract:
My daughter is a cradle Episcopalian and I wouldn't have it any other way.

Good Morning,

I hope you understand that this was not directed towards all Episopalians, in my understanding of John 3:16 according to God's Holy Word; if we have chose that path of righteousness we are all one in Christ. This was intended to shed light on why Neal is the way he is and his writings have done so, to an extent.

Neal has a way of making himself stand out as a non-Christian in his writings. When a person does not respect the writings of a Gods' word, then it bring sorrow to my heart. My passion is for Gods Holy word and I take it as it is...(From Genesis - Revelation)

Neal is a very intelligent person and in all his intelligence he has forgot one thing and that is there is nothing more important on this earth than Jesus Christ and his teachings (The Holy Bible).

Thank you & Good day.

Bray - Neal was quoting the Book of Common Prayer and he's pretty right on with what I understand the tenets of the Anglican church to be.

You'll find more professors locally in the Episcopal church than any other. Wonder why?

quote:

Originally posted by Neal Hughes:
Just google "Archbishop of Canterbury" and "Lambeth Palace, London."

You ought to be able to find Rowan Williams' office's numbers there.

***

Neal thank you for your response. However in your answers you seemed a little more like a politician than a Christian.

I asked specific questions and you answered some of them but not all. If you could answer them all without your schooling and "statement of Faith" writings then I/we could better understand who you are in the world of Christianity.

I could not say that you are or are not a Christian for only God knows your heart, but many of your Christian peers see your writings about the Bible to be a little off centered.

It is so obvious that when the Bible is read from Genesis to Malachi that it was viewed by Jesus & the Apostles as beging an edict of God. For they quoted from it many times in their own writings & teachings.

Neil you forget to see one other thing by your answers, according to John the Revelator, Jesus himself appeared to John and spoke directly to him in Revelation about the end times.

So in your own words you have said...
[quote] Hooey! Anathema! Balderdash, and rubbish!
Almost as stupid as the Tribulation and Rapture and a 6000 year old earth, demonic possession, and an ark full of animals with even Mt. Ararat being covered with flood waters. Maybe even more, actually, because each is a separate species of contagion. [quote]...

You are calling God himself a liar, You are calling Jesus a liar for he spoke of all these things.

Good day and I will keep praying for you.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Gray:
Hi to all,

Neal tells us that Archbishop Cranmer wrote their prayer book. Just so everyone knows -- in 1534, when King Henry declared himself the "Supreme Head of the Church" -- Cranmer was his archbishop.

So, Neal is right -- their prayer book has been around longer than our KJV Bible.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

An interesting note about Cranmer - He was appointed archbishop so he would grant Henry VIII his divorce from Katharine of Aragon. He performed the marriage ceremony between Henry and Anne Boleyn and christened Elizabeth, also acting as her god parent.

In the melee that ensued after Henry's death and the subsequent death of his son, Edward, Lady Jane Grey assumed the throne and was queen for 9 days before she was beheaded on the Tower Green.

Mary, the daughter of Katharine (A devout Catholic) and Henry was named queen and she had Thomas Cranmer burned at the stake as a heretic before she restored Catholicism as the official religion of England.

Elizabeth I came to the throne after Mary's death and she restored the Anglican church.

So now you know the rest of the story.

quote:

Originally posted by hoss gal:
braylan, i believe you're going to have to get up earlier to expose anyone but yourself.

you go, neal.

Hoss thank you for you 2 cents, all input is appreciated. Keep up the negative contributions, for any contribution is still participation in spreading God's Holy Word.

Thank you & good day.

quote:

Originally posted by DeepFat:
I don't want Braylan exposing himself in front of me. DF

Sir, you do not have to worry about this issue. I am quite fond of my wife and am not into males.

Many thanks for thinking about me though.

quote:

Originally posted by _Joy_:
I'm just too tired to read what I know I will enjoy reading tomorrow, Neal, but I did read enough to give you two thumbs up for giving a much more thorough answer than was deserved.

You write very well, Neal. Many of your posts require pause to digest, but well worth the effort.

Joy, I am not sure if you read my questions to Neal but in my view; he answered many of the question the same way a politician would do. He gave long round-about answers to some and to others he side stepped all together.

I did not want to know all of what his Doctrinal beliefs were according to his church.... I wanted a yes or no answer with maybe a hint of why according to him, but not answers according to his Episcopalian Church!

I wanted Him to come out and say YES or NO to the questions so I could better understand Neal and he could not even do that.

Good day.

I am not going to play games with you Braylan, you are too silly to even reply for the most part. You begged for a sermon and you got one.

You and Bill need to get out more often and not stay up late waiting for your amputated limbs to grow back of whatever it is you do in your chapels after the snake handling.

Don't all Fundamentalists handle snakes? I heard they did once. . .

quote:

Originally posted by Neal Hughes:
I am not going to play games with you Braylan, you are too silly to even reply for the most part. You begged for a sermon and you got one.

You and Bill need to get out more often and not stay up late waiting for your amputated limbs to grow back of whatever it is you do in your chapels after the snake handling.

Don't all Fundamentalists handle snakes? I heard they did once. . .

I am not sure if they do or not. I can tell you that I have had a pet snake but it was way before I became a follower of Christ. Maybe Bill or someone else could answer this for you. Good luck with your search for that answer.

quote:

Originally posted by Neal Hughes:
I am not going to play games with you Braylan, you are too silly to even reply for the most part. You begged for a sermon and you got one.

You and Bill need to get out more often and not stay up late waiting for your amputated limbs to grow back of whatever it is you do in your chapels after the snake handling.

Don't all Fundamentalists handle snakes? I heard they did once. . .

***

One more thing while I am thinking of it. I asked you easy questions with simple yes or no answers and have even allowed for a hint of your reasoning.

I did not beg for a sermon, for I have read up on your Episcopalian statement of Faith and I hear preaching of some sort everyday that I am able.

I am requesting you to answer these question provided for you in a simplistic manner, even a child with less intelligence than you could answer these.

Are you up to the challenge or are you afraid that people might see you for who you really are, or maybe it is because you are afraid that you might see you for who you really are?

You have been weighed, you have been measured and you have been found wanting!

Good day.

To Neal from Marva Munson: "You don't wanna be tried and found wantin'!"

By the way, will someone PLEASE change the title of this thread?

Come to think of it, I don't want to see Neal exposed either.


DF

quote:

Originally posted by UnderContract:
Bray - Neal was quoting the Book of Common Prayer and he's pretty right on with what I understand the tenets of the Anglican church to be.

You'll find more professors locally in the Episcopal church than any other. Wonder why?

Because one of the Episcopalians missions is teaching.

At there wuz that there Arabamic out of Daniel, wasn't it, Braylan? "Minny Minny Tickle?" That there Arabamic wuz what Daniel and Jesus talked, right?

This cheer is a video you will like by Sister Betty Butterfield on the Episcopals:

Link

p.s. The nights are getting cool, yall better get them there snakes rounded up on the sunny days right quick like!

LOL Neal! I thought that was Shirley Q Liquor.

quote:

Originally posted by Braylan:
You have been weighed, you have been measured and you have been found wanting!

You have been kneaded; you have been floured and rolled. You have been found to be a wonton.

Chuck Kipp is both Shirley Q. and Sister Betty!
He reminds me of my former co-worker who came to NY as a bearded ponytailed biker and left as a BBW, Mark-Melissa, who came out at a sushi fest birthday party on Long Island dressed in a caftan and holding a martini glass and a cigarette holder like Auntie Mame. His wife divorced him as the transformation progressed. I sublet my apt. to him when we scattered to the four winds and (s)he decided to stay in NY for . . . well, personal and sense of community . . . various reasons. My landlord called me in Omaha and dogcussed me for renting to him! I asked if he wasn't smart enough to meet his future tenant, then it wasn't my fault! They ended up being great friends because Mark-Melissa did the lifting for the landlord's mother upstairs when she housecleaned daily!
Such memories of those sunny days on the Island . . . almost like a Warhol film at times. . . and then the human stomach washed up on Fire Island our week in the sun had to be transferred to Montreal. I believe we were having lobster bisque and shrimp linguini (both home made) and a couple of bottles of Vinho Verde from Portugal when the shreiks began at lunch and we were on the ferry to Patchogue before one knew what had happened. I had swam that night in the ocean and got a terrible ear infection that took weeks of antibiotics to shake, the sewage plant in Brooklyn had also released 2 million gallons of raw sewage the same night. C'est la vie. Montreal was fun. You say "un grand mac avec pomme frites" or else, just "Numero Un." The subway has rubber wheels and the stations are airconditioned! Mark-Melissa wasn't there: (s)he was in San Juan for a family reunion prior to breaking the news of the forthcoming blossoming.

Aah, what memories just a simple little girl in a dress and makeup can bring up, like Proust with his cookie and tea!

quote:

Originally posted by UnderContract:
Bray - Neal was quoting the Book of Common Prayer and he's pretty right on with what I understand the tenets of the Anglican church to be.

You'll find more professors locally in the Episcopal church than any other. Wonder why?

Hi Under,

I suspect that would be because most professors, even those leaning toward Christianity, lean more toward Liberal Theology. While we will find some professors who are of the Conservative Theology group -- most tend to be extremely Liberal.

So, what we have in our higher education system will be a small handful of Conservative Christians -- and a great majority of Secular and Liberal Theology Christians.

This is why there are organizations springing up whose goal is to restore Conservative Christianity back into our higher education.

We need to pray for those groups.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Gray:



This is why there are organizations springing up whose goal is to restore Conservative Christianity back into our higher education.

We need to pray for those groups.

If by "conservative" you mean people who believe the earth is only 6000 years old, I'm praying for those groups.... to go away.


Have a blissed day, Bill.