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Your not the only ones that have doubts, there are a lot of Christians that have had doubts, even at Jesus crucifixion the only disciple that was there was John and a lot of those that believed that he was the Savior turned away. But you might want to look at this  http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/answers.html

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Hi Slice,

 

Our atheist Friends get upset when anyone challenges their religion -- even if that someone is a fellow atheist.   I offer this new article as proof:

 

‘What Has Gotten Into Thomas Nagel?’: Leading Atheist Branded A ‘Heretic’ For Daring to Question Darwinism

http://life.nationalpost.com/2...-question-darwinism/


Prof. Nagel’s thesis is provocative, no doubt. In just 128 pages, "Mind & Cosmos" argues the modern scientific story of the origin of life through evolution is “ripe for displacement” and it represents “a heroic triumph of ideological theory over common sense,” which will be seen as “laughable” in a couple of generations.

Its main failing, he argues, is it fails to account for how consciousness fits into the natural order. Instead, it regards it as an afterthought, an accidental quirk, a trinket on the tree of life, less important to life’s story than the random physical mutations of genes.

By putting physics at the top of a scientific hierarchy, he argues, modern Darwinism offers a dogmatic system of thought that is intoxicating precisely because it offers the illusion of freeing us from religion.

For a long time I have found the materialist account of how we and our fellow organisms came to exist hard to believe, including the standard version of how the evolutionary process works,” he writes in the book, which is subtitled “Why the Materialist Neo-Darwinian Conception of Nature is Almost Certainly False.”

“I realize that such doubts will strike many people as outrageous, but that is because almost everyone in our secular culture has been browbeaten into regarding the reductive research program [about the origin of life] as sacrosanct, on the ground that anything else would not be science.”

 

He calls it “reductive materialism” and argues the more we learn about life, the less believable it gets, and the more central mind and consciousness seem to the true picture.

"Believing, as Darwinists do, life arose first from accidental chemical reactions in the primordial ooze, and, once established, progressed via the mechanism of natural selection to create all the wonders of human consciousness, 'flies in the face of common sense,' ”
Prof. Nagel writes.

 

By George, I do believe the troops are starting to leave the ranks.  At least, those who are honest enough to admit that they are just locked into a dogmatic system of atheism only because it gives them some wiggle room for denying God.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Be Still - Know I Am God - 1

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Originally Posted by Quaildog:

This quote below for possibly one person on the forum of whom might understand it.

 

"Though mind remains a major topic in philosophy, it has been traditionally shunted to the edges of the physical sciences, in favour of a quantitative, math-based understanding of physical laws" http://life.nationalpost.com/2...-question-darwinism/

___

For some, that  "math-based understanding of physical laws" has engendered a notion that since mind is a purely function of the brain and the brain is a physico-chemical mechanism, there is therefore no "mind" that is in any way separate from the the electrochemical reactions that occur in the brain.  From that premise, or so goes the theory (if indeed it can be dignified by that label), that there can be no such thing as free will.  This is to biology/psychology what orthodox Calvinism is to soteriology.  Both concepts rest on unsound premises and both are deeply flawed.

Certainly quantitative math is at home in Newtonian physical laws but things like conscience   and intuition are off limits even to quantum laws as we barely understand some of them. I say that believing in Conway’s mathematical proof of freewill. http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~...reewill-theorem.html  and of course there’s his famous lecture series on freewill at Princeton beginning here:  http://www.princeton.edu/WebMe...nway_free_will.shtml

I don't judge the atheists, you got to remember not only our sins are the ones that cause the death of Christ, it was the religious leaders of the some of the Jewish faith that caused it, they are the ones that shouted, crucify Him, crucify Him. There are a lot of good athiest that does more good than those who believe.

Originally Posted by Quaildog:

Semi the do good, what will be your offering for the day?

________

I am in no way the "do good" & I resent your implying that I'm in some way bragging on myself. Whatever my "offering" is, no one will know but myself.

 

I am in no way relating this to me but to you & some of the "Christians" out there. Matthew says when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret.

 

Was one of your former ID's on this forum Buffalo?

says semi the do good " Whatever my "offering" is, no one will know but myself."

-----------------------------------------------------------

I can only guess since 'no one will know' but you; the affect or effects are for your own personal satisfaction since others by omission are excluded. I have suspected this all along and now you have confirmed my suspicion. Your usual caper is running down Bill Gray. I don't know if your are jealous of his attention to posts of other females or what but I think you are funny.

     I hereby petition Bro. Bill to lay it on thick concerning your obvious sins. Crust could use another layer or two.

   BTW semi the do good, what's with this Buffaloe question? I remember him being treated rudely by you& Co. Eventually being banned and charged falsely by those who were short-changed in intellect.

Originally Posted by Quaildog:
I can only guess since 'no one will know' but you; the affect or effects are for your own personal satisfaction since others by omission are excluded. I have suspected this all along and now you have confirmed my suspicion. Your usual caper is running down Bill Gray. I don't know if your are jealous of his attention to posts of other females or what but I think you are funny.

     I hereby petition Bro. Bill to lay it on thick concerning your obvious sins. Crust could use another layer or two.

   BTW semi the do good, what's with this Buffaloe question? I remember him being treated rudely by you& Co. Eventually being banned and charged falsely by those who were short-changed in intellect.

_______

Jealous of Bill Gray??!!? OMG! Thank you, I needed that laugh.

I'll leave bragging to people like you & Bill that want people to know of the good you so surely do.

I have a problem with anyone that claims to be something they are not. I have a problem with anyone that calls him/herself a Christian & then makes fun of, & is a bully to others. You've seen how he treats others, & if you think he's a Christian, you're no better than he is.

I was asking abut your other ID, Buffalo, because several people on here have mentioned you being he. I remember him as a mean spirited man that wasn't much different than Bill. Maybe that's why you admire Billy Bob so much.

Slice,

 

I believe that your intentions with this post were sincere, and for that I thank you.

 

However, I would like to say that as an atheist I have more than doubts. I have flat out disbelief. I can't speak for every person who says that are atheist, but for me, I was a Christian who went through the stage of doubt a long time ago. Doubt to me is when there is still some degree of belief. I used to fear my doubt. I believed that my doubt was a sign of weakness. Now I realize it was a strength. 

 

Once again thanks for the sentiment. I have come to see real concern from Christians as a compliment. I want you to know that I am fine and happy in my disbelief and there is no need for you to be concerned.

Why semi, I’m surprised you say that a buffalo was ‘mean’. He may have been a bit rough around a  edge or two but he did come from somewhere out among the rest. He always insisted on the truth. You may have held that against him. Perhaps it was a glance rather than knowing him intimately that has caused your concern.  I’ve noticed your greeting of any new arrival is always been less than delightful and is soon followed by farewells. I just wrote it off as a bad decision on your part. Your heavily charged dislike for Bro. Bill is also puzzling. Your daily bleeding of Bill must be of some comfort to you but after a while it has the effect of someone extracting teeth.  Too much ‘flat pine’ in your boiler will surely be your undoing someday semi the do good.

Originally Posted by Quaildog:

Why semi, I’m surprised you say that a buffalo was ‘mean’. He may have been a bit rough around a  edge or two but he did come from somewhere out among the rest. He always insisted on the truth. You may have held that against him. Perhaps it was a glance rather than knowing him intimately that has caused your concern.  I’ve noticed your greeting of any new arrival is always been less than delightful and is soon followed by farewells. I just wrote it off as a bad decision on your part. Your heavily charged dislike for Bro. Bill is also puzzling. Your daily bleeding of Bill must be of some comfort to you but after a while it has the effect of someone extracting teeth.  Too much ‘flat pine’ in your boiler will surely be your undoing someday semi the do good.

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Aha! We have here a "friend of Bill"; another Bill like Christian, complete with unwarranted ego, unChristian like name calling, and attack on character - ironically, much as Bill, opting to concentrate on picking members of the female persuasion... Congratulations Billie boy, you've found a convert... Are you proud? Yes? Shame on you... Excessive "unwarranted" pride is a sin... Well QD... We'll see how long it takes to join you idol Billie on "blocked" status...

If Semi's dislike of "Bro. Bill" puzzles you, you are indeed blinded by your attraction to him...

.

 

Certainly semi the do good. I think Bill is a good egg. He is much smarter than his critics; most of whom are no smarter than a 5th grader. I guess I could find some fault in him if I was as infatuated with him as many on here are.  For the record I respect Bill as a religious spokesman even though he does not speak the same dogma in exact as do I.  Contenda for instance is a C0C as myself and he gets beside himself with Bill because his mission in life is to battle denominations to the last one. Catholics and OSAS’ers his favorites. You on the other hand seem to think bill is out to get you and expose you for what-t-hell-ever-it-is-you-have-done. I for one, however, would like to see, out of curiosity what it is myself.  I might consider joining in if it met certain criteria. Jank on another hand despises Bill because he represents the very thing that denied her the opportunity to run wild growing up; Religion. The rest of his haters are just asswholes with frontal lobe damage.

For the record if someone asks, I like Bill.

Hi Quail,

 

While I would have worded much of that differently -- I DO agree with the thought.  Especially when you say, "For the record I respect Bill as a religious spokesman even though he does not speak the same dogma in exact as do I."

 

That is the same thought I have expressed numerous times on the Religion Forum -- that, we may disagree on theology, or even whether or not God exists -- but, that is no reason for us to become nasty, calling names, and throwing out insults.

 

I am a firm believer that Christian believers may agree, or agree to disagree -- but should never allow it to divide the body.  And, the same consideration should be given to our non-believing Friends and those in churches with erroneous doctrines -- agree to disagree, but continue discussing the issue in a civil manner.   NO ONE benefits when name calling, cursing, and derogatory words are thrown out.

 

By the way, you say that I am a "religious spokesman"  -- I prefer to just say that I am a Christian believer with a "relationship" with my Lord Jesus Christ -- and that I feel that all Christians were given marching orders in the Great Commission (Matt 28:19-20, Acts 1:8, Mark 16:15) to share His Gospel with all the world.          

 

Thank you, my Friend, for expressing those thoughts.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

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