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It has often been asserted--and sometimes in this forum--that the U.S. Supreme Court building is adorned with one or more copies of the Ten Commandments.  That is simply not true.  The following link explains the nature of displays in that building and addresses a number of other misconceptions within the larger realm of church and state:

 

http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/capital.asp

 

Other errors and some deceptions are discussed in the link below, which examines the work of the shifty phony historian, David Barton:

 

http://candst.tripod.com/bjcpa1.htm

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So, Head,

 

What do YOU BELIEVE IN?  So far, we have seen that you do not like God in America!  So far, to the best of my knowledge -- you believe God has abandoned Israel, so, therefore America should abandon Israel.

 

And, you will not tell us your church affiliation or connection.  Why?

 

I am not ashamed to publicly state that I worship in a Baptist church.  I am not ashamed to share the Gospel as written in the Bible (Romans 1:16).  Head, why are you so hesitant?

 

And, why are you so against having Christian influence in our local, state, and federal leadership?

 

Who, or what, do you serve?

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Originally Posted by Bill Gray:

So, Head,

 

What do YOU BELIEVE IN?  So far, we have seen that you do not like God in America!  So far, to the best of my knowledge -- you believe God has abandoned Israel, so, therefore America should abandon Israel.

 

And, you will not tell us your church affiliation or connection.  Why?

 

I am not ashamed to publicly state that I worship in a Baptist church.  I am not ashamed to share the Gospel as written in the Bible (Romans 1:16).  Head, why are you so hesitant?

 

And, why are you so against having Christian influence in our local, state, and federal leadership?

 

Who, or what, do you serve?

 

Bill wonderful

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

Why would any of that be any of your business?

 

.


 

Hi Vic,

 

Two points.  First, if you are going to repeat my post -- please DO NOT add your words to my post -- or change anything I have written.   Anything above your little line is what I have written; anything below your line is your own personal ramblings.

 

Repeating another member's post is one thing.   But, to modify it, add to it, or change it in ANY way is deceitful and dishonest.  And, that little trick has gotten several members booted off in the past.  So, a word to the wise -- and, I realize I am being generous.

 

Second, are you trying to compete with Jimi to see who can post the most inane comments?

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Certain of the discussion above seems to me to represent a very deep misunderstanding of the U.S. Constitution and its relationship to the role of religion in American life. The initial post  included a great deal of information concerning the interpretation of these matters by those who consider the U.S.A. to be a "Christian nation" and who then reason that God and the Christian religion therefore should be granted certain prominence and recognition in the public life of the nation.  Those holding this view argue strongly that prayers and Bible reading in the public schools are constitutionally permissible activities and that the display of the 10 Commandments on public property, even in the absence of any displays of the tenets of other beliefs, is also constitutional.  The contrary view, in the initial post, is to the effect that religious matters do not belong under the control of secular government and that therefore government, including local public school boards, have no constitutional authority to selectively promote the Christian religion by means of instituting prayers in public school classrooms or other points of assembly.

 

"Bill" above, takes to task "upsidedehead" for "being so against having Christian influence in our local, state and federal leadership," for not liking "God in America," and for (perhaps in some other post, since I find none of that here) believing that "God has abandoned Israel."

 

Leaving aside the matter of Israel for now, since it is not apparent what the details of that argument might be, I submit that the post from "Bill" following the initial post by "upsidedehead" seems not to have addressed any of the numerous facts and arguments within the two rather informative and well-argued attachments that "upsidedehead" submitted to support his post. "Bill" submitted nothing that disputes the description of the displays in the Supreme Court building or that defends David Barton against the charges that he plays free and loose--and possibly dishonestly--with his use of alleged statements from the founding fathers.    Rather than meet these issues head-on, "Bill" chooses to  interrogate "upsidedehead" about his personal beliefs and religious affiliation, which seems rather peripheral to the topic in the post.

 

There are many,  many people who are devoutly religious Christians but who do not want anyone in their local, state, or federal governments directing religious exercises in public schools or selectively promoting  Judeo-Christian concepts through such measures as the placement of 10 Commandments displays on public property.  These people are not against "God in America."

They simply want government to take its proper role, a role that does not extend to becoming an arm for the promotion of Judeo-Christian precepts or other systems of religious belief.

 

I have recently heard a great deal of comment from conservative politicians who are in favor of government being "limited" and avoiding intrusions into the personal business of the citizens.  It is hard for me to understand how someone can hold to that view and at the same time argue  that  government may legitimately use its authority to influence matters that are as deeply personal as religion! 

The Islamis "10 Commandments" are

 

“And your Lord has ordained that you should not worship anyone except Him and shun unclean idols”

 

And do not make Allah a target for your oaths for doing good or avoiding evil or reconciling people

 

And We said to them, “Do not violate Sabbath, and We took from them a solemn Covenant”

 

And your Lord ordains that you do not worship anyone but only Him, and do good to your parents. If they reach old age before your eyes, any one of them or both, then do not say a word of criticism to them and do not scold them, rather speak kindly to them. And lean your wing of humility towards them and pray, ”O Lord, have mercy on them as they had brought me up since my childhood





And do not kill anybody that Allah has prohibited except when you have a right to kill”

 

And do not even go near adultery. It is open vice and bad way

 

As to the thief (man or woman) let their hands be cut off, a retaliation for what they did, a punishment from Allah.

 

And They (Servants of God) do not testify falsely.

 

And do not covet what Allah has favored some of you over others.

Originally Posted by Mohammad Suket Rashid:

The Islamis "10 Commandments" are

 

“And your Lord has ordained that you should not worship anyone except Him and shun unclean idols”

 

And do not make Allah a target for your oaths for doing good or avoiding evil or reconciling people

 

And We said to them, “Do not violate Sabbath, and We took from them a solemn Covenant”

 

And your Lord ordains that you do not worship anyone but only Him, and do good to your parents. If they reach old age before your eyes, any one of them or both, then do not say a word of criticism to them and do not scold them, rather speak kindly to them. And lean your wing of humility towards them and pray, ”O Lord, have mercy on them as they had brought me up since my childhood



And do not kill anybody that Allah has prohibited except when you have a right to kill”

 

And do not even go near adultery. It is open vice and bad way

 

As to the thief (man or woman) let their hands be cut off, a retaliation for what they did, a punishment from Allah.

 

And They (Servants of God) do not testify falsely.

 

And do not covet what Allah has favored some of you over others.

____

Mo,

 

You say that one of these Muslim commandments is, "And do not kill anybody that Allah has prohibited except when you have a right to kill.”

 

Then tell us this:  Are those Muslim suicide bombers in Iraq and Afghanistan killing people that they "have a right to kill"?   Or are they just a radical fringe of Islam and failing to honor this Islamic commandment?

 

It has to be one way or the other, Mo.

 

Tell us which it is.
 

Then tell us this:  Are those Muslim suicide bombers in Iraq and Afghanistan killing people that they "have a right to kill"?   Or are they just a radical fringe of Islam and failing to honor this Islamic commandment?

 

It has to be one way or the other, Mo.

 

Tell us which it is.
 

 --------

We believe that anyone who does not follow the Quran or AL Sahree'a is a sinner, "Kafer" in arabic, Christians are the infidels according to Muslims and any Muslim helping or assisting and working with infidels is considered Sinner and according to these fanatics, our Holly book of Quran does justify the death and killing of such perosn(s).

And, why are you so against having Christian influence in our local, state, and federal leadership?

 

 

Gawd, I hate this format.

 

Vic, I am against Christian influence in government because insanity has no place in government.  Our Constitution expresses flatly that no establishment of religion shall be emplaced in government.

 

Christianity depends on faith in revealed suggestions.  Government should depend on reason and reality.

 

Government should embrace justice and morality.  Christianity is the antithesis of both.  OK, not so much as Islam, but a solid second.

 

I am against Christian influences in government because America is a land of religious freedom.  Muslim, Jain, atheist, Catholic, FSM.... no one gets political power because of one's religion.  Recent Republican trends make me reconsider my party affiliation.

 

This country was not founded on Christian values.  It was founded on Enlightenment values of liberty, democracy, secularism, and capitalism.  Christianity cherishes few of those.  OK, capitalism, since it funds so many churches.

 

Vic, your thirst for an American theocracy frightens me, and stiffens my backbone to resist you and your kind.  Bring it on.  We'll be here.  Expect us.

 

 

DF

Originally Posted by Not Shallow Not Slim:

And, why are you so against having Christian influence in our local, state, and federal leadership?

 

 

Gawd, I hate this format.

 

Vic, I am against Christian influence in government because insanity has no place in government.  Our Constitution expresses flatly that no establishment of religion shall be emplaced in government.

 

Christianity depends on faith in revealed suggestions.  Government should depend on reason and reality.

 

Government should embrace justice and morality.  Christianity is the antithesis of both.  OK, not so much as Islam, but a solid second.

 

I am against Christian influences in government because America is a land of religious freedom.  Muslim, Jain, atheist, Catholic, FSM.... no one gets political power because of one's religion.  Recent Republican trends make me reconsider my party affiliation.

 

This country was not founded on Christian values.  It was founded on Enlightenment values of liberty, democracy, secularism, and capitalism.  Christianity cherishes few of those.  OK, capitalism, since it funds so many churches.

 

Vic, your thirst for an American theocracy frightens me, and stiffens my backbone to resist you and your kind.  Bring it on.  We'll be here.  Expect us.

 

 

DF

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

 

NS---Not sure why you named me in this post, not sure why I should "Bring it on"

I know you'll be here, not sure what you're going to do about a six thousand

year old Judeo Christian religion thats growing stronger every day.

 

But you have got your pseudo intellect, phony speech delivery and counterfeit

videos. The reason I stopped posting you, you're insane with hate, too much

hate. This Country was founded for, Right To Religion, without the nut jobs

like yourself. So, rant the good rant, but if you would please nauseate

someone else.

 

Iv

Originally Posted by Mohammad Suket Rashid:
Then tell us this:  Are those Muslim suicide bombers in Iraq and Afghanistan killing people that they "have a right to kill"?   Or are they just a radical fringe of Islam and failing to honor this Islamic commandment?

 

It has to be one way or the other, Mo.

 

Tell us which it is.
 

 --------

We believe that anyone who does not follow the Quran or AL Sahree'a is a sinner, "Kafer" in arabic, Christians are the infidels according to Muslims and any Muslim helping or assisting and working with infidels is considered Sinner and according to these fanatics, our Holly book of Quran does justify the death and killing of such perosn(s).

Well, then, Mo, how about THIS situation?

 

An Islamist suicide bomber, loaded up with plastic explosive, enters a public marketplace full of people, including men, women, and children.  Among these people are other Muslims, including those who are minding their own business and who have not done anything to help or assist or work with "infidels." Certainly the tiny Muslim infants and children in this mixed assemblage are not lending any aid or comfort to the "infidels."   And it is almost certain that among the adults there are those who are not implicated in any such anti-Islamic activities.  But never mind that.The bomber--perhaps envisioning his rapid disembarking to a 72-woman harem--positions himself within a densely-packed area of the marketplace and proceeds to blow up himself and several dozen others. 

 

Under such a scenario, Mo, is Allah pleased that totally innocent persons are blown to bits along with any "infidels" who also happened to be within killing distance? 

The 10 Commandments shown in and on the Supreme court building (actually just roman numerals 1 to 10 (I to X) are similar to those depicted in and on synagogues.  In Sheffield, there is a small brick church used by several denominations over the years. The Methodists used it at one time. It was a synnagogue, also. If, you look carefully, behind and above the front portico, you may see a depiction of two white tablets with the same roman numerals.

 

The 10 commandments were Hebrew in origin, and were meant for obediance for those under the mosaic code.  In pre-Christian times, jews did not insist thal all who worshipped God do so as Jews. Gentiles could do so and obey the seven Noahaic commandments.  In the old Temple, there was a seperate Court of the Gentiles for their worship.

Originally Posted by Contendah:
 

Under such a scenario, Mo, is Allah pleased that totally innocent persons are blown to bits along with any "infidels" who also happened to be within killing distance?

 

----

Contendah my friend.  There is no such thing as "innocents." There are those who accept Islam and the holy words of Mohammed (peace be upon him) and those that do not.  The innocents that serve with the infidels know what is coming to them.
  I beleive this to be no different from what your religion demands of you according to your holy book of testaments.  

 

Originally Posted by Mohammad Suket Rashid:
Originally Posted by Contendah:
 

Under such a scenario, Mo, is Allah pleased that totally innocent persons are blown to bits along with any "infidels" who also happened to be within killing distance?

 

----

Contendah my friend.  There is no such thing as "innocents." There are those who accept Islam and the holy words of Mohammed (peace be upon him) and those that do not.  The innocents that serve with the infidels know what is coming to them.
  I beleive this to be no different from what your religion demands of you according to your holy book of testaments.  

 

If you are going to be "Cage", you need to do a little better job of research and deliverance.

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