They have actually convinced the general uneducated population that if someone is wealthy it means that someone else is poor. People in this country actually believe that the "pie" is static in size and there are only so many slices to go around. My mind is blown.
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Still enjoying those sour grapes, Kenny?
I voted for Gary Johnson. Do you think the pie is static, betern? Or are you one of the many economically uneducated that populate this forum?
Kenny: A vote for Gary Johnson is the same as a vote for O'Bama.
Don't you think you're smarter than all those Northeast, Rust Belt and West Coast liberals, minority and union thug voters? I guess not.
I voted for Gary Johnson. Do you think the pie is static, betern? Or are you one of the many economically uneducated that populate this forum?
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What I think of the pie is that the ecomomic system has become distorted so that too few get too many of the very large pieces.
I voted for Gary Johnson. Do you think the pie is static, betern? Or are you one of the many economically uneducated that populate this forum?
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What I think of the pie is that the ecomomic system has become distorted so that too few get too many of the very large pieces.
So you actually think that if someone is rich it means someone is poor?
Kenny: A vote for Gary Johnson is the same as a vote for O'Bama.
Don't you think you're smarter than all those Northeast, Rust Belt and West Coast liberals, minority and union thug voters? I guess not.
I am for less govt in our financial and personal lives. It is why I voted for Gary Johnson.
I doubt that your vote would have made any differance in Alabiblebelt anyway !!
Democrats have buying votes mastered. This is the end of America as we know it.
Woe is me, woe is me. the sky is falling, the sky is falling.
Look at the bright side, Rush Lardbutt will have plenty to rave about for the next four years .
They have actually convinced the general uneducated population that if someone is wealthy it means that someone else is poor. People in this country actually believe that the "pie" is static in size and there are only so many slices to go around. My mind is blown.
Here's your pie:
Here's 15 Mind-Blowing Charts About Wealth And Inequality In America >
http://www.businessinsider.com...-america-2010-4?op=1
I'm a bit confused. We've been told how obama has created all these millions of new high paying jobs and we're just swimming in "good times", but someone else being "rich" still bothers them? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
I'm a bit confused. We've been told how obama has created all these millions of new high paying jobs and we're just swimming in "good times", but someone else being "rich" still bothers them? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
"... new high paying jobs .."
Your words; it's up to you to prove it.
These are the jobs:
This is what the "job creators" are paying:
A new study by the National Employment Law Project (NELP) called The Low-Wage Recovery And Growing Inequality(pdf) confirms what I've repeatedly said on this blog about jobs and income. The constant focus on "jobs, jobs, jobs" is misplaced, if not an outright fraud. If those jobs are not good-paying jobs, if those jobs are not "breadwinner" jobs as David Stockton put it, jobs which can serve as a solid foundation for a functioning household, then all that's been accomplished is to further divide this country into serfs (wage-slaves) and overlords (the monied elites).
This sorry trend has been called the "good jobs" deficit.
...
[Statistics]
...
These findings speak for themselves, so I don't want to belabor points I've made over and over again in the past. But if you are a man, and you hear a politician talking about how his policies will create lots and lots of new jobs, the most appropriate response to that politician might be blow me.
The slaveowners who have a stranglehold on this vast plantation called the United States will always deploy various methods by which they consolidate and expand their power. Even if there is no overarching conspiratorial plan which has been put in place to accomplish these goals, common interests expressed and attained through our corrupt political system always guarantee that our elites will get the results they want. For example, read One Man Against The Wall Street Lobby by Simon Johnson of baselinescenario.com.
In this video from the Daily Ticker's Lost Middle-Class Jobs Being Replaced by Burger-Flipping and Retail Gigs: NELP Study, Henry Blodget says the United States doesn't work if the country is divided up into a few autocrats and 300 million serfs. That's right, it doesn't work and it's not going to work.
http://www.declineoftheempire....69e2017d3bde64ed970c
The truth:
Even more confused, so now you're claiming that it's a lie?
(straight from the horse's mouth so to speak)
During her speech at the Democratic National Convention Tuesday night, first lady Michelle Obama painted her husband as a president who has created jobs like those held by her father and his grandmother, jobs they used to give their families greater opportunities.
“He brought our economy from the brink of collapse to creating jobs again -- jobs you can raise a family on, good jobs right here in the United States of America,” Obama said Tuesday night.
Even more confused, so now you're claiming that it's a lie?
Is that your default condition?
Have another look -- I have given you more information to work with.
Why don't YOU have a look. I already know the claim is a lie.
Why don't YOU have a look. I already know the claim is a lie.
I guess that means I have made my point ... and you haven't.
Q.E.D. Checkmate. Game, point, match.
Have a nice day!
Your point? What was your point? To deny what obama said? I think I was the one that pointed out to you that he lied. You're like the other one, the only "point" you have is on the top of your head. Yeah, run. LOL!!!
They have actually convinced the general uneducated population that if someone is wealthy it means that someone else is poor. People in this country actually believe that the "pie" is static in size and there are only so many slices to go around. My mind is blown.
Here's your pie:
Here's 15 Mind-Blowing Charts About Wealth And Inequality In America >
http://www.businessinsider.com...-america-2010-4?op=1
That still doesn't prove that the pie is static. The entire pie can grow in size. Just because someone succeeds doesn't mean someone else fails.
However, this goes back to my original point about how dems have mastered politics. They are telling the 40+% of the population that is on some form of entitlement that the reason they have so little is because someone else has so much. That is completely and totally false but it is great political talk.
What you fail to surmise from your point however Propie is that these jobs are the types of jobs that will be created under an administration who continues to punish small business and the self employed with continued high taxes and regulations. Why would I hire someone for a 40 hour position and have to provide benefits or pay a penalty, when I could just as easily hire two, or underemploy, and provide two 20 hour work week jobs, and not have to provide these beneffts? Most of the small companies like restaurants will simply do this. There is no way that the business owners are going to be able to support a higher work wage in this stagnant economy, and no way to provide additional benefits to make it better.
This administration has been totally unfriendly to small businesses and has been on the take to large corporations and unions, neither of which will affect the small business owner who employs a large majority of people. Up to 130K jobs will be lost in the next few months thanks to regulations from this administration. There is no way the Republican House is going to support raising the debt ceiling so that his plans can go unimpeded. He has no desire to work with them in compromise, only to raise taxes on a segment of the population to redistribute wealth.
You won nothing. This election more than anything shows how divided this country is, and how a small portion of the more populated areas control the destiny of the rest. This is about envy and class warfare, something that your ilk has become quite astute in promoting.
When you put 74 people on welfare for every job you create in your four years, you pretty much assure that you are going to get their vote. As long as someone is handing me a check I would do the same BUT the checks are going to run out soon, they can't last forever. As I have seen almost 25% of my income diminish in the past year and more proposed on the way I feel like there is no incentive to work harder.
It is a wasted effort, but you won the battle, and we all lost the war. Perhaps the Mayans were right, they just missed it by a month.
I voted for Gary Johnson. Do you think the pie is static, betern? Or are you one of the many economically uneducated that populate this forum?
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What I think of the pie is that the ecomomic system has become distorted so that too few get too many of the very large pieces.
The thing you left out is you should have to make good life decisions i.e. going to school and applying yourself, learning a good trade or going to college and staying out of trouble. Do this and in America you stand a good chance of getting a bigger piece of the pie.
Sit on your ars@ smoke dope, do not apply yourself in school, get in trouble with the law, get a lot of tattoos or get a college degree that does not pay well and you much lower your chances of succeeding.
Your point? What was your point? To deny what obama said?
You are a good right winger and made that up, right? Does this look like "denying?"
I think I was the one that pointed that out to you.
You created a fictional "fact" of me denying the jobs created under Obama, just like the Republicans had to create a fictional Obama to run against, making up all sorts of fantasies that didn't square with the facts.
The increasingly claustrophobic parallel conservative universe isn't just something that lefties like myself have noted. Julian Sanchez, a CATO libertarian who moves in social circles of both liberals and conservative, coined the term "epistemic closure" to describe the alternate reality found in, as he put it, the "multimedia array of interconnected and cross promoting conservative blogs, radio programs, magazines, and of course, Fox News" where "whatever conflicts with that reality can be dismissed out of hand because it comes from the liberal media, and is therefore ipso facto not to be trusted. (How do you know they're liberal? Well, they disagree with the conservative media!)
The Right Wing Bubble:
http://veracitystew.com/2011/0...r-in-a-bubble-video/
video:
start watching at 3:45
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCsAis40x-k
That still doesn't prove that the pie is static. The entire pie can grow in size. Just because someone succeeds doesn't mean someone else fails.
"The entire pie can grow in size."
When the pie gets bigger, this is what happens. Who gets the extra part of the pie?
Between 1976 and 2007, the US real GDP per head grew 66%. But the average income for the top 1% increased by 280%, while the average income of the bottom 90% pretty much stagnated, growing just 8% over this 30-year period. From 1978–2011, compensation for corporate chief executives grew more than 725%, compared to the annual compensation of a typical private-sector worker, which grew a meagre 5.7%. The Congressional Budget Office reported that the top 1% of income earners gained 58% from 1993 to 2010 (implying a 2.7% annual growth rate), or more than half of the overall economic growth of real incomes. Professor Emmanuel Saez‘ report Striking It Richer found that the top 1% captured 93% of the income gains in the first year of recovery.
What you fail to surmise from your point however Propie is that these jobs are the types of jobs that will be created under an administration who continues to punish small business and the self employed with continued high taxes and regulations.
More made up "facts." Some may think that, but they are simply misperceptions based on their interpretation of faulty (or false) data.
The Tax Argument in a Nutshell
So, if tax cuts don't lead to more jobs, what's the purpose of tax cuts -- if not just to give those at the top a bigger portion of the pie?
Regulations aren't the problem, either.
Do Regulations Really Kill Jobs Overall? Not So Much
It’s become a mantra on Capitol Hill and a rallying cry for industry groups: Get rid of the job-killing regulations. In recent days, with nearly every one of the GOP presidential candidates repeating thatrefrain, the political echo chamber has grown even louder. Earlier this month, President Obama also asked the Environmental Protection Agency to back off more stringent ozone regulations, citing the "importance of reducing regulatory burdens" during trying economic times.
But is the claim that regulation kills jobs true?
Hopefully we will see a resurgence of Unions in America. The number of Corporations with unions have dropped almost at the same rate that income growth has stagnated. Corporations have seen huge profits in this same time. When American's wake up to the fact that big Corporations will never allow a trickle down of wealth then they will finally realize they have to demand an honest wage instead of cowtowing to the top 1% and begging for their bread crumbs.
Its time to band together again and unionize!!!!
Its time to band together again and unionize!!!!
Hahah....good luck with that. It is a different world girly than it was 40 years ago. That is why "right to work" states like Alabama are attracting more larger companies.
And Propie, your statement about regulations....pure BS....might want to talk to the 900 or so coal miners who will be laid off in the coming months because of "regulations".
You people are delusional in thinking that the light at the end of the tunnel is not the train. If it were not so pitiful it would be hilarious.
Teyates I would hate to live in the doom and gloom world you have designed in your head. Must be a very sad place.
I on the other hand have hope and happiness! I will gladly share with you if you would just open your eyes to reality and stop worrying about the boogy man in your closet. (He is not there) Times are tough no doubt, but things are looking up. With 4 more years to make the changes needed we will see progress in this country that the Republican's have fought against for 3 decades. Part of that change is finally giving up on the stupid idea that trickle down economics works. How long does it take for Republicans to learn that lesson?
If Romney had been elected we would be taking 10 steps backwards to the same old shuck and jive and failed policies of the Republican party. I am so happy that those who buy into their lies and greed are not in the majority of this great country. I don't think the Republican's will ever be able to fool the majority again. They are going to have to change their ways or go the way of the whigs. Either way is fine by me. 
I just want my free stuff I am owed.
Hopefully we will see a resurgence of Unions in America. The number of Corporations with unions have dropped almost at the same rate that income growth has stagnated. Corporations have seen huge profits in this same time. When American's wake up to the fact that big Corporations will never allow a trickle down of wealth then they will finally realize they have to demand an honest wage instead of cowtowing to the top 1% and begging for their bread crumbs.
Its time to band together again and unionize!!!!
You're not very bright, are ya'.
It is not doom and gloom, when it is reality, you might want to try it sometimes. Hope and happiness is probably like Hope and Change, as long as you are on the receiving end of that government money, and it isn't coming out of YOUR pocket like it is mine, it is easy to have Hope and Happiness. If and when however that gravy train runs out for you, you can say you finally had reality slap you upside your head, and hopefully then you can see that those who you so despise and envy were actually not your enemy. But until then, party on!
It is not doom and gloom, when it is reality, you might want to try it sometimes. Hope and happiness is probably like Hope and Change, as long as you are on the receiving end of that government money, and it isn't coming out of YOUR pocket like it is mine, it is easy to have Hope and Happiness. If and when however that gravy train runs out for you, you can say you finally had reality slap you upside your head, and hopefully then you can see that those who you so despise and envy were actually not your enemy. But until then, party on!
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Exactly teyates. And I don't know about you, but we and many others like us who are able, have discussed our "game plan" in the event obama was put back in office. We'll bow out and let the ones that so wanted to "take over" do just that, they can take over the tax paying and all the supporting of the ones that think others "owe" them something.
My oldest memory of my (widowed) mom is her working 3 jobs, at all times. We never went on welfare, had food stamps, or lived in any public housing. We never had breakfast or meat during the week. I didn’t know fully what food stamps were until my late teens, and only then because of friends. We were very, very, poor. I honestly thought people who lived in housing projects were doing better than us. I thought DHR was a place people went when they had dark, mysterious problems. I thought we would have a turnaround when she started working for the state. That one job only brought the same income as 3, so we were still very poor. I understand now that she had to be home to raise us. Education was number 1; my mother taught me to read early; I was on 3rd grade levels by the time I started kindergarten. I always made good grades, and my mother drilled into me that combined with college, travel was another vital form of education.
Six years ago I got laid off from my job, and had to work temp jobs, (until the temp agencies fizzled away), and part time. I remember opening the Courier Journal and seeing two jobs: one for a truck driver and one for an Avon rep. I was pre-licensed in real estate but guess what? The housing market crashed. In 2008 I had a full time job, but was laid off in early 2009. Summer of 2009 I went back to school and educated myself, thanks to Pell Grants, and today, I have a full time job, benefits, I go to school full time, my husband is about to complete his second degree while working full time, our kids make straight A’s. During those lean years, my kids both benefitted from the Head Start program and free lunch at school. We pay full price today and are happy to do so, thankful that we have the money. This past month I picked up a second job; not because I had to but because I want to help pay for a family vacation next year (we never had one), and put more money in the bank. By the way, I was offered FOUR jobs last month when looking for a second one; I took one, declined one, and declined 2 because they were going to turn into full time, permanent positions. (Jobs are out there, and as one community leader stated, there are jobs, but people are not passing drug tests.)Life is not excellent but I am WAY better off now. I can actually help out my mom, who after all these years, is still working because she cannot afford to fully retire. (These highlighted in red are things I temporarily benefitted from when times were rough!)
I voted for Obama in 2008, and again yesterday. Screw anyone who says I’M a taker, a gimmethat, a lazy stoner, or any other creative name you can come up with for people whose situations you know nothing about. I was born and raised with lack, but my mother never told me, “just go sign up for welfare, food stamps, etc”. She taught me, “where there’s lack, there has to be gain, you just have to empower yourself to receive it”. There are millions more like me, who are just trying to make it. White, black, brown, purple, green, there are people who have seen improvement, and believe there is more to come.
It is not doom and gloom, when it is reality, you might want to try it sometimes. Hope and happiness is probably like Hope and Change, as long as you are on the receiving end of that government money, and it isn't coming out of YOUR pocket like it is mine, it is easy to have Hope and Happiness. If and when however that gravy train runs out for you, you can say you finally had reality slap you upside your head, and hopefully then you can see that those who you so despise and envy were actually not your enemy. But until then, party on!
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I receive nothing that I don't work for. I have never had to be on any form of welfare. I am very happy about that. However, I have no problem paying a bit more for those that are in need of welfare. It doesn't bother me at all. I guess you begrudge those less fortunate than you simple things like food and shelter. That's a very sad thing. I would not want to live in that kind of society. I have been to countries where the poor and elderly are not cared for. Seeing children run around on the streets in groups, taking care of each other....some as young as 3 and 4 years old. Seeing elderly people laying on the streets starving and in need of healthcare. Seeing handicapped people left to their own devises. America should better than that. We take care of our own. I am proud of that fact, and I will not allow our safety nets to be destroyed by greed and selfishness if I can help it.
I pay more in taxes than many of my friends make in yearly income. I will pay more if needed to help those that were devastated by the Bush years to recover and get back on their feet. I think those that have even more than I do should pony up as well. Those that have ridden on the backs of the poor and middle class all the while making record breaking profits should be paying a fairer share of their incomes, regardless of where those incomes come from.
You are delusional if you think that everyone that supports Obama is on welfare of some sort. Such a narrow mind you have there teyates. Surely you have heard of William Buffett and Bill Gates. Do you think they are riding the welfare gravy train? LOL
Well said Knak-Tak. I too was raised very poorly and had a single mother who worked more than one job. We were farm kids as well and never went without food, but we wore homemade clothes and didn't get much of anything for Christmas or our birthdays. Its a very different world we live in today. Many families the parents are both working 2 jobs and still can't afford to feed their children. I don't consider them "gimmethats" What a heartless terrible thing to call someone struggling to feed their children. I would love for all these self-righteous, selfish people who call them that to survive on what welfare recipients survive on and tell me how great of a life it is. Every time I hear one of these Republicans spout off about quitting their jobs and living off the government because that is the easy life, I sincerely wish they would. It would be hilarious to watch them try and make it on the tiny amount of food stamps and welfare they would receive. Anyone that believes the majority of welfare recipients is living the high-life is completely out of touch with reality.
Most people who go on any type of welfare only use it for a short time. To believe otherwise is just refusing to believe the facts. Many successful people received government help somewhere along the way. They are now paying it back with their own taxes. Why would anyone want to kick someone when they are down instead of giving them a hand up?
I also agree about the jobs. As I have pointed out on here before, take a look to your right at the jobs ticker. You need a job? Know someone out of work? No problem, go get one. They are out there and they are growing everyday. I believe we will see welfare start to go down as the economy keeps growing. Until then we do what we can for those that are struggling to make it.
Well lets compare notes. I grew up in what was called "middle class" in the 60's and 70's. My parents did not graduate from HS, but went to work and sent my brother and I to school. They encouraged us, provided what they could for us, but never took food stamps or free lunches. Never saw them sign up at the Salvation Army for Christmas assistance or anything else. I went to college, and after my second semester got a job working 40 hours a week at night at a convenience store for minimum wage. I borrowed the rest of the money which I paid back after I got out of college. I went to graduate school again financing it myself and still paying for it today. I have two kids in college and today one semester of college costs as much as my entire four years in the early 1980's. They of course cannot borrow the money for school because the powers that be say I make too much. Again though I have not sought a handout. I am self employed, and under this administration have seen a 30% decrease in my income in the past year. Of course that might not be bad since at least I won't be taxed on it, but the fact remains that I work harder than before to make less money and all I hear is jacklegs like yourself who think that the "rich" ought to pay more so you can have yours.
I am not delsuional and tend not to take advice from Warren Buffet especially since that clown does not have a clue what he owes. in I would be hesitant to give tax advice if I were him light of the fact that it was determined that his accountants had failed to pay several million dollars in taxes on some of his assets, and then were applying for relief from it. What a ******* joke.
I too pay more in taxes than most folks make, big deal, it is a fact of life that if you make more, you pay more, but why should I be penalized for making more while not being able to take the same tax deductions are the ones who are sucking from the teat? When is 20% of $100K not more than 20% of $50K?
Please spare me the handicapped are in the street and the elderly and poor are suffering speech, it is getting old. When I hear people who work at things like the Salvation Army Christmas project tell me about folks with five kids and five last names, and women who are demanding X-boxes and bikes while driving an Escalade, it makes my blood boil. I am all for helping those who need it, i do it all the time, but this election has proved that the scales are tipped, and those who want more from the goevrnment now exceed those who are trying to hold the government accountable.
I voted for Obama in 2008, and again yesterday. Screw anyone who says I’M a taker, a gimmethat, a lazy stoner, or any other creative name you can come up with for people whose situations you know nothing about. I was born and raised with lack, but my mother never told me, “just go sign up for welfare, food stamps, etc”. She taught me, “where there’s lack, there has to be gain, you just have to empower yourself to receive it”. There are millions more like me, who are just trying to make it. White, black, brown, purple, green, there are people who have seen improvement, and believe there is more to come.
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The gimmethats are the ones that don't go to school, too busy "hanging out and hustling, and yes, doing dope and staying drunk", they're the ones that think a "job" is heading down to the gimmethat office and signing up for the new give away programs. And screw anybody that denies that. How contradictory, ALL these wonderful jobs and opportunities, and yes, there was a time they were out there, yet we still have so many on the government dole, that have been there for generations? How is that possible UNLESS the sad, true fact is, yes, there are way to many people that were willing to sit back and have it handed to them. Now that the well is running dry, the jobs are disappearing, opportunities few and far between for the ones wanting to work, they have the nerve to talk "****" to the very people that supported them while they were able, and again, screw anybody that denies that.
I voted for Obama in 2008, and again yesterday. Screw anyone who says I’M a taker, a gimmethat, a lazy stoner, or any other creative name you can come up with for people whose situations you know nothing about. I was born and raised with lack, but my mother never told me, “just go sign up for welfare, food stamps, etc”. She taught me, “where there’s lack, there has to be gain, you just have to empower yourself to receive it”. There are millions more like me, who are just trying to make it. White, black, brown, purple, green, there are people who have seen improvement, and believe there is more to come.
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The gimmethats are the ones that don't go to school, too busy "hanging out and hustling, and yes, doing dope and staying drunk", they're the ones that think a "job" is heading down to the gimmethat office and signing up for the new give away programs. And screw anybody that denies that. How contradictory, ALL these wonderful jobs and opportunities, and yes, there was a time they were out there, yet we still have so many on the government dole, that have been there for generations? How is that possible UNLESS the sad, true fact is, yes, there are way to many people that were willing to sit back and have it handed to them. Now that the well is running dry, the jobs are disappearing, opportunities few and far between for the ones wanting to work, they have the nerve to talk "****" to the very people that supported them while they were able, and again, screw anybody that denies that.
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Sounds like you chose the wrong neighborhood to live in. If I were you, I would think hard about moving out of that 1973 double wide and finding a more wholesome place to live.
Thanks for clarifying what a "gimmethat" is. Now that we both know that I am not one (My post said, screw anyone who thinks that I'M...), we are clear on that. Maybe I should have said, screw anyone who tries to group all Obama voters into one category. I agree with you about the moochers and leeches and users of the system. Nothing contridictory about that. If anything, my post should show how people in poverty can overcome something that could have easily turned into generational poverty. People should be accountable for themselves, and try to do what they can for themselves. I'm trying to build a financial foundation for my kids. I don't want to be poor or in poverty; been there, done that. But I can't forget, there are people who sincerely need assistance that can't be counted out. Unfortunately, there are people who put more time and energy into scamming, and playing the system than if they worked an honest 8hr day, 40hr week.
Yeah BW, you need to move to a better place....like your mom's basement where the Cheetos are free and the cable television plays all night long!!! Assimilate!!! We have no choice!!!
