Do You Know Your Father in Heaven?

Our parents gave us life. I'm astonished at just how many people have yet to figure that process out and still blame it on a supernatural deity. Yes, The Stork has also been disproved.

Yes, you are correct in stating that there is-every day a new authority claiming to know it all which is why I cannot stress enough the fact that if YOU don't use your head-SOMEONE ELSE is always more than  willing to do so for you.

Hmm... Here's a thought:

How about doing right just because it's the right thing to do?  We all know the difference between right and wrong.

  I think doing right for right's sake is reward enough, and the reward is immediate.

If you could somehow suddenly know beyond a shadow of a doubt that there in fact was no god-what would then be your incentive to 'do the right things' since the goal of obtaining your 'eternal reward' would no longer exist?

Would you still do the right things?   Why (or why not?)

Personally speaking, I do the "right thing" because it is who I am. I can't fathom not doing the "right thing" because my belief in God changes. It is a flawed argument to believe someone would just run amok because they learn God doesn't exist. We are products of our raising with the influence of our life experiences molding us I think. I don't know that it would be like flipping a switch. Just my two little measly cents.

Youre absolutely right, wright. (GAAAH! )

You have ethics.  You do what is right because it's the right thing to do.

It may be a flawed argument, but in light of some recent posts by certain uber-religious nutbags fundies and other churchgoing 'taggers' who do in fact suggest that without god and his word, people actually WOULD just run amok and turn to evil.

  It has been suggested many times by believers (who apparently don't have any other reference points to go by other than the religion they've been spoon-fed since birth) that atheists such as myself are evil and unethical because we don't believe in any god.

It's what a lotta them are taught.

It's understandable and it keeps the pews and the collection plates full.

/shrug

I don't think Atheists are evil. You just have a different view of things. That is no reason we can't get along. Some people just take themselves a little too seriously (on both sides I may add).

If by 'different view' you mean pretty much the same as you.

I asked that question of ol' Skip not because *I* believe it, but because I wanna know if HE believes it.

I know better and I can and do get along with just about everybody.

Until they start knocking themselves out trying to prove to me how 'educated' they are or how righteous they are and start telling me what a joke I am or that I'm surely hellbound for not joining their particular club.

  I'm a reasonable guy.

I usually don't turn the big guns around their way without provocation.

They always draw first blood.

Always.

Hi Skippy,

Let me ask you just a couple of questions:

1.  You talk about God in heaven.  Was this god you speak of ever a man?  Is he an exalted man?

2.  Do you believe that God the Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit -- are one God manifested in three distinct persons:   Father, Son, and Holy Spirit?

Skippy, if you cannot, or will not, answer these questions -- then, all you have written is for naught.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

Another forum rerun. I need to figure out a way to make some money off of this. I can pretty much bet on what will be said, and by whom.

Bill, why do you keep asking those same questions? Seriously, I would like to know. What difference does it make? Skippy believes one way, you believe another.

Everything you write on here is naught to most of us....same old stuff, day after day,

after day.

======================================================

Then it might behoove ya to go read another one, huh?

Hi Chick,

On the other hand -- why not ask?   He has never answered the questions; so, why not keep asking?

Any thoughts on this, Skippy?  Or, are you waiting for Dwight to answer for you?

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

He has answered those questions. Many, many post back. But if he hadn't, why keep on? Maybe he knows if he did, you still wouldn't accept it. Get the beam out of your own eye before worrying about someone else.

LOL.. this from the grand master of ignoreing questions.

bill is such a massive hypocrit that he can't even see how hypocritical he is.

Sure Road Pup,

I do feel the reward of being good and kind immediately. I also believe that most people

that care for one another would be the same person. I like Wright, do not think Atheists

are evil just for being an Atheist. I look at everyone exactly the same regardless of who

or what they are, unless their an idiot of course. When I was young I didn't believe in

much of anything. As I've gone thru life I have seen many things that I would describe

as a Miracle. But I understand that some might see something as a Miracle were someone

else might not. Just because someone believes in God, doesn’t make that person better

than someone who doesn’t. It's the person who cares for others who I respect. Those who

don't give a crap, well their life isn't as meaningful if their just focused on themselves.

Skippy

Bill as Chick has stated, you have asked these and many questions of me. And as you

asked them, I have answered them. Here we go again.

You ask,"1. You talk about God in heaven. Was this god you speak of ever a man? Is he an exalted man?"

He is an eternal God. He was here before time as we know it. He created everything

we know. I don't know if he was ever a man. He has a Glorified Body of Flesh and Bones.

How and where would you find it, do you know that this is not true?

You then ask,"2. Do you believe that God the Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit -- are one God manifested in three distinct persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit?

I know they are three distinct individuals. The Son (Jesus Christ) although separate

from the Father, is of one purpose with His and our Father in Heaven.

Luke 22: 42

Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.

    This scripture brings the question. Why would Jesus pray to The Father, if he is the Father?

Why would God have to play these silly games? Why would God want things so complicated.

The Holy Spirit is also a separate Spirit. His work is to bless us with the knowledge of what's

is good and what is Bad.

Again Bill Asked and Answered. Please also tell me where you say it says they are not

Separate, but one manifested in three. I don’t see it. Please give specific Scripture.

Scripture that is plain and not interpreted by yourself.

Skippy

Skip...

I'm honestly curious.

Would you still do the same good things even if there was no god? Even if there was no reward at the end? Would you do bad things, knowing their was no judgement?  Or would you be inclined to-as Nagel says, eat a revolver in despair?

Just speculate. That's good enough for me.

YO SKIP!

Don't fall asleep now....

Pup,

  I've been away from the computer.

I answered a few posts up above. And again yes I would.

Skippy

Skippy and other Mormons continue to make a case that God and Jesus are, and have always been, beings of "flesh and bones."  That   belief is hugely at odds with the Bible, as anyone can determine for himself from the Bible itself.  Consider Hebrews  5:7, which refers to Jesus in this manner:

⁵So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee.

 ⁶As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

 ⁷Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;"

There would have been no purpose in citing "in the days of His flesh" if Jesus, as an eternal being were from the beginning always a person of flesh and bones.  The writer of Hebrews is making a purposeful distinction in citing "the days of his flesh," an obvious reference to the incarnation of Jesus during the time of his walk on earth in human form.

Similarly, at John 1:14, the writer tells us that "The Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory as of the only begotten of the Father), full of grace and truth."

The Word, Skippy, "was made flesh."  Jesus was given a body of flesh for His sojourn on earth, but in His eternal and heavenly form, He no longer is in that state.

If this is not enough to convince you (and it probably is not, since you are so thoroughly brainwashed with the corrupted Mormon concepts of deity), then consider THIS, from Philippians 2:5-8:

⁵Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

 ⁶Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

 ⁷But made himself of no rep u t ation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

 ⁸And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

No rational conclusion can be drawn from this passage other than that Jesus was in one form ("in the form of God"), but willingly took on another form when he "took upon Him the form of a servant and was made in the likeness of men."  He was in one form, but "took upon Himself" another form in keeping with God's plan for redemption of man through the sacrifice and death of Jesus Christ.  The passage would make no sense at all if Jesus had never been incarnated in human form.  There would have been no need to make the distinction the inspired writer is describing.  Mormons want to define the incarnate form of Jesus as the eternal and exclusive form in which Jesus existed, but it takes a wild distortion of the Biblical concept of the incarnation to get to that very wrong conclusion.

Skippy, you say, above, concerning the birth of Jesus: "He is the only begotten son of our Father in Heaven, meaning the only person(God) born in the flesh of Our Father in Heaven.

(And NO to what some are thinking.) It was a Virgin Birth. "

So that readers on this forum will understand more fully the deep-dyed heresy that Mormonism teaches concerning the conception and birth of Christ, I have provided below some quotations from several of the con men and poseurs who have asserted themselves falsely as "prophets, seers, and revelators" and/or "apostles" of your corrupt cult:

• Brigham Young taught:The birth of the Savior was as natural as are the births of our children; it was the result of natural action. He partook of flesh and blood---was begotten of his Father as we were of our fathers" (Journal of Discourses vol.8, p.115); and "when the Virgin Mary conceived the child Jesus, the Father had begotten him in his own likeness [flesh and blood]. He was not begotten by the Holy Ghost" (Journal of Discourses, vol.1, p.50).
• Brigham Young insisted: "I will say that I was naturally begotten; so was my father, and also my Savior Jesus Christ...he is the first begotten of his father in the flesh, and there was nothing unnatural about it" (Journal of Discourses vol.8, p.211); "Now remember from this time forth, and for ever, that Jesus Christ was not begotten by the Holy Ghost" (Journal of Discourses, vol.1, p.51).
• Orson Pratt (LDS apostle) taught: "the Father and Mother of Jesus, according to the flesh, must have been associated together in the capacity of Husband and Wife…as God was the first husband to her, it may be that He only gave her to be the wife of Joseph while in this mortal state, and that He intended after the resurrection to again take her as one of his own wives to raise up immortal spirits in eternity" (The Seer. p.158, 1853).
• Joseph Fielding Smith wrote: "The birth of the Savior was a natural ccurrence unattended by any degree of mysticism, and the Father God was the literal parent of Jesus in the flesh as well as in the spirit" (Religious Truths Defined, p.44).

Skippy,  your apostate church very obviously  teaches that the birth of Christ was a not a "virgin birth."  No birth can be a "virgin birth" with all the cohabiting--the  "natural" goings-on, with "nothing unnatural about it"--as described above by the so-called "prophets, seers and revelators" of your apostate church. Had those snake oil peddlers paid attention to the teachings of scripture, they would have never reached such heights of fantasy and delusion.  Read it here, Skippy, from Matthew 1: 18-23:

¹⁸Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost  ¹⁹Then Joseph her husband, being a just man, and not willing to make her a public example, was minded to put her away privily.

 ²⁰But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost.

 ²¹And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

 ²²Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,

 ²³Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Mormons claim to follow both the Bible and their own false scriptures and the apostate doctrines of their false prophets, but it is simply not possible to reconcile the clear teachings of the New Testament with the corrupt and fanciful notions of the conception and birth of Jesus Christ as propagated by the wildly-blithering false prophets of Mormonism!

My father lived in Alabama.  He had the advantage over god in that he was real.

nsns