From Catholic Study Fellowship

Hi Nathan,

 

You write, "Bill erroneously states that sinless = no need for a Redeemer. Mary was sinless, but still needed a redeemer."

 

When Christ was nailed to the cross and died, the sin debt for all people was nailed to the cross with Him (Colossians 2:14).  Christ died to pay our sin debt and to make salvation available to all who, by grace, through faith (Ephesians 2:8), will believe and receive His "paid in full" pardon from sin.  That is why He is called our Redeemer; He came to redeem us from sin.

 

If Mary had no sin, if she were born sinless and remained sinless -- she would have no need for a Redeemer.   And, being sinless, she could have died for our sins instead of having Christ incarnated as the Man/God. 

 

If ANY human was born sinless -- that person could have done what Christ did -- die for our sins.

 

However, since the ONLY sinless person ever born, or who will ever be born, is Jesus Christ -- ONLY He could die for our sins.

 

How can you expect anyone to take the Roman Catholic church seriously -- when, from the Vatican down -- you teach such unBiblical doctrines?

 

If it not in the 66 -- it is not of God!

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

WhatIs unbiblical about Mary being sinless? It in no way contradicts anything in the Bible, particularly the new testament! How could it? A catholic dogma from the same folks who wrote the new testament! It all flows seamlessly together! Bill places great faith in the bible, and it was the authority of the catholic church that declared what went in it, and what didn't. Same authority that acknowledged Mary's sinlessness! Easy stuff! Praised be Jesus forever!

 

Hi Nathan,

 

Simple solution!  Show us the verse or passage in any of the 66 books of the Bible which tell us that Mary, John the Baptist, or anyone other than Jesus Christ was born sinless and remained sinless.

 

Since you claim that the Roman Catholic church gave us the Bible (I still believe God did, but, howsomeever) -- that must certainly be hidden somewhere in the Big 66.  So, where is it?

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Romans 3:23---For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God

 

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You just can't please some imaginary people.

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An irrelevant comment if every there was one, Best. It has nothing to do with what I posted.

Sure it does, it just went over your head is all.

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Doesn't matter if it was for factual correctness, & not meant to criticize. Why would it matter to you if Vplee, or any Catholic, does kiss a statue? Does it hurt you in any way? There's been many times on this forum when you have criticized & been rude to the Catholics.

 

It's not a mis-perception that the COC teach that they're the only people going to Heaven. I've been in them, I've heard the message. I have friends that attend them regularly & tell me this all the time. If your COC doesn't teach this, then they are one in hundred's. I just can't believe that they don't teach/preach this.

 

 

I have two "sets" of coc in my family, They think they are the only ones who have it right, and gasp, they have religious pictures/items in their houses. I guess they worship those.

Hi Chick,

 

You ask Contendah, "Doesn't matter if it was for factual correctness and not meant to criticize.  Why would it matter to you if Vplee, or any Catholic, does kiss a statue?"

 

Because that, bowing to and kissing the statues, is a form of worship -- idol worship.   Why do you think the Roman Catholic church deleted the Second Commandment from Exodus 20?

 

First Commandment:  Exodus 20:2-3, "I am the LORD your God, . . . You shall have no other gods before Me."

Second Commandment:  Exodus 20:4,"You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth."

 

But, because this was in conflict with all the Saints, statues, and icons which are worshiped in the Roman Catholic church -- they deleted the Second Commanment.  Then, they split the Tenth Commandment into two sub-commandments -- so that they would still have Ten Commandments.

 

This is why we are bothered by the kissing, bowing, and worshiping of Saints, statues, and idols in the Roman Catholic church.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

billie jez said

 

Why do you think the Roman Catholic church deleted the Second Commandment from Exodus 20?

 

First Commandment:  Exodus 20:2-3, "I am the LORD your God, . . . You shall have no other gods before Me."
Second Commandment:  Exodus 20:4,"You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth."

 

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billie so stupid he can't tell a believable lie.

 

1st. Commandment, Catholic

 

 

You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all   your soul and with all your strength" (Deut 6:5).

   2134 The first commandment summons man to believe in God, to hope in him, and to love him above all else.

   2135 "You shall worship the Lord your God" (Mt 4:10). Adoring God, praying   to him, offering him the worship that belongs to him, fulfilling the promises and vows made to him are acts of the virtue of religion which   fall under obedience to the first commandment.

   2136 The duty to offer God authentic worship concerns man both as an individual and as a social being.

   2137 "Men of the present day want to profess their religion freely in private and in public" (DH 15).

   2138 Superstition is a departure from the worship that we give to the true God. It is manifested in idolatry, as well as in various forms of   divination and magic.

   2139 Tempting God in words or deeds, sacrilege, and simony are sins of irreligion forbidden by the first commandment.

   2140 Since it rejects or denies the existence of God, atheism is a sin against the first commandment.

   2141 The veneration of sacred images is based on the mystery of the Incarnation of the Word of God. It is not contrary to the first commandment

 

 

I guess if we are to take the Bible literally, we need to destroy all pictures, sculptures, photos, and any other medium which may depict an actual person, place or thing here, or underwater, and any imagined thing in heaven.

 

You got anything like that in your house, Bill?  I believe you posted a picture of yourself on facebook, and have done so here.  Is that not a likeness of something here on earth?  Will you be destroying pictures of your family and friends? 

 

Is there a cross hanging somewhere in your church?  Isn't that a likeness of something here on earth?