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quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
Jennifer,
I usually stay away from topics about religion because I feel that I may do more harm than good. I personally believe that most, if not all, Christians have troubles similar to yours from time to time. I'm not perfect in my Christian walk and I've struggled with my faith at times too.

I usually pray every night and I do randomly speak to God throughout the day. I know that I need Him and that He's with me. I have tried to walk away at times out of anger, hurt, etc...but He never allowed it. God allowed me to throw my temper tantrums, say my hateful words...but He stayed with me.

IMO, it's much easier to choose not to believe than to believe and have faith in Him.


I really enjoyed reading this, & I agree with some of what you've said. I've walked away, & I'm still angry. But I don't have the confidence that Jennifer seems to have for a fact that He doesn't exist.

I've said He doesn't exist, but I don't know that beyond a doubt. There's still this voice inside my head (heart?) that makes me wonder.

It would be nice to know instead of just saying I know.
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
Jennifer,

I usually stay away from topics about religion because I feel that I may do more harm than good. I personally believe that most, if not all, Christians have troubles similar to yours from time to time. I'm not perfect in my Christian walk and I've struggled with my faith at times too.

I usually pray every night and I do randomly speak to God throughout the day. I know that I need Him and that He's with me. I have tried to walk away at times out of anger, hurt, etc...but He never allowed it. God allowed me to throw my temper tantrums, say my hateful words...but He stayed with me.

Again, I don't have all of the answers. I won't put you down because of your beliefs. I do think it would be great if you would give Him a genuine, sincere chance again. He's waiting if you'll reach out to him. IMO, it's much easier to choose not to believe than to believe and have faith in Him.
I'm headed to bed but I had to respond. Did you not read what I posted? I gave "him" a chance for YEARS. I didn't CHOOSE to not believe. My belief LEFT. I say my common sense and logic won out. It's wrong for christians to say people choose not to believe but yet they keep saying it. I've had this "debate" with bill for days now. Believers can and do lose their belief ALL THE TIME. You no more CHOOSE to be a non-believer anymore than you choose your sex before you're born. But it's not a bad thing, I was a happy little christian, and now I'm a happy atheist.


Of course I read it. I don't believe that you're a "happy atheist" as you put it. Sorry, but your posts/replies don't back that up. You actually come across as if you resent God and you need other "atheists" to defend your actions/beliefs. Opie made the remark that Atheists aren't recruiters. Then why do you and other Atheists argue with Bill and other Christians constantly on these forums? It's as if many of you need reassurance in your CHOICE to not believe. Paint the picture however you'd like, God doesn't choose for you to turn away from him, that choice.....is entirely yours.


You can "paint your picture" anyway you want it too. Christians have a little bag of tricks they drag out, and that "you can't be happy" is one of those little tricks. Now why in your opinion would I not be happy? As far as how I "come across", I don't post anything any worse, sometimes not as bad, as others in here post. That includes the christians. I "argue" with bill because he's radical, totally wrong, and exactly the kind of "christian" that should be challenged on his statements. It's like NSNS says, we can sit back and let people like you and bill spread the lies about atheists, or we can speak up. I will speak up. You call yourself a christian, yet you continue to spread the lie that people choose or don't choose to believe.

That doesn't "wound me", that doesn't make me flinch, it just tells me that it's either ignorance on your part, or pure hatred of people that don't believe in your god. And you toss out that hatred/ignorance by making those statements. It's you that looks bad in that situation.
quote:
I really enjoyed reading this, & I agree with some of what you've said. I've walked away, & I'm still angry. But I don't have the confidence that Jennifer seems to have for a fact that He doesn't exist.

I've said He doesn't exist, but I don't know that beyond a doubt. There's still this voice inside my head (heart?) that makes me wonder.

That's normal. I've stated that I struggled when I first began to think there really wasn't a god. I came out of all that emotional turmoil with a firm belief there is no god. I can't tell you how you will "end up", no one can. It could take a while, it could happen tomorrow, but you will eventually know what you think one way or the other. No believer ever wakes up one day and decides/chooses to be an atheist, and no atheist ever wakes up one day and just decides/chooses to "believe".
quote:
Atheists aren't recruiters. Then why do you and other Atheists argue with Bill and other Christians constantly on these forums? It's as if many of you need reassurance in your CHOICE to not believe. Paint the picture however you'd like, God doesn't choose for you to turn away from him, that choice.....is entirely yours.


Christians are recruiters. So if a christian does it it is ok, but if an atheist does it it is evil, right? Why do you and other christians argue with the atheists? It's as if you need reassurance in your CHOICE to believe. You don't make that choice for me....that is MY decision.
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
Jennifer,

I usually stay away from topics about religion because I feel that I may do more harm than good. I personally believe that most, if not all, Christians have troubles similar to yours from time to time. I'm not perfect in my Christian walk and I've struggled with my faith at times too.

I usually pray every night and I do randomly speak to God throughout the day. I know that I need Him and that He's with me. I have tried to walk away at times out of anger, hurt, etc...but He never allowed it. God allowed me to throw my temper tantrums, say my hateful words...but He stayed with me.

Again, I don't have all of the answers. I won't put you down because of your beliefs. I do think it would be great if you would give Him a genuine, sincere chance again. He's waiting if you'll reach out to him. IMO, it's much easier to choose not to believe than to believe and have faith in Him.
I'm headed to bed but I had to respond. Did you not read what I posted? I gave "him" a chance for YEARS. I didn't CHOOSE to not believe. My belief LEFT. I say my common sense and logic won out. It's wrong for christians to say people choose not to believe but yet they keep saying it. I've had this "debate" with bill for days now. Believers can and do lose their belief ALL THE TIME. You no more CHOOSE to be a non-believer anymore than you choose your sex before you're born. But it's not a bad thing, I was a happy little christian, and now I'm a happy atheist.


Of course I read it. I don't believe that you're a "happy atheist" as you put it. Sorry, but your posts/replies don't back that up. You actually come across as if you resent God and you need other "atheists" to defend your actions/beliefs. Opie made the remark that Atheists aren't recruiters. Then why do you and other Atheists argue with Bill and other Christians constantly on these forums? It's as if many of you need reassurance in your CHOICE to not believe. Paint the picture however you'd like, God doesn't choose for you to turn away from him, that choice.....is entirely yours.


I can only answer for myself, but I enjoy ridiculing those who are hanging on to a belief in the unbelievable. I think they are foolish. Granted, they are free to go about their cyber witnessing, however their logic and arguments are so weak and puny that it must be addressed. It would be un American to allow Christianity and its sillyness to stand uncontested.
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by INVICTUS:
The Mysterious Eyes Of Our Lady of Guadalupe.

This 5 min. video will know your socks off.
The worlds best physicists can't explane it.


LINK



Iv
Just curious-do you ever research any of this stuff before you post it?

-----------------------------

jen, You're so far out of whats going on I can see why so much
is as new to you as most protestants

.
quote:
Originally posted by INVICTUS:
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by INVICTUS:
The Mysterious Eyes Of Our Lady of Guadalupe.

This 5 min. video will know your socks off.
The worlds best physicists can't explane it.


LINK



Iv
Just curious-do you ever research any of this stuff before you post it?

-----------------------------

jen, You're so far out of whats going on I can see why so much
is as new to you as most protestants

.
So that means no, you don't research your silly stories. You believe all these stupid urban legends and call me far out? LOL Hey, if you're at war with the Protestants what's that to me? All you guys do is yell "my cult is better than your cult".
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by INVICTUS:
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by INVICTUS:
The Mysterious Eyes Of Our Lady of Guadalupe.

This 5 min. video will know your socks off.
The worlds best physicists can't explane it.


LINK



Iv
Just curious-do you ever research any of this stuff before you post it?

-----------------------------

jen, You're so far out of whats going on I can see why so much
is as new to you as most protestants

.
So that means no, you don't research your silly stories. You believe all these stupid urban legends and call me far out? LOL Hey, if you're at war with the Protestants what's that to me? All you guys do is yell "my cult is better than your cult".

-----------------

This happened in the year 1531, its been scrutinized.

Disprove it or shut your cult mouth,

The thing is you can't disprove it.

.
quote:
Originally posted by semiannualchick:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
Jennifer,
I usually stay away from topics about religion because I feel that I may do more harm than good. I personally believe that most, if not all, Christians have troubles similar to yours from time to time. I'm not perfect in my Christian walk and I've struggled with my faith at times too.

I usually pray every night and I do randomly speak to God throughout the day. I know that I need Him and that He's with me. I have tried to walk away at times out of anger, hurt, etc...but He never allowed it. God allowed me to throw my temper tantrums, say my hateful words...but He stayed with me.

IMO, it's much easier to choose not to believe than to believe and have faith in Him.


I really enjoyed reading this, & I agree with some of what you've said. I've walked away, & I'm still angry. But I don't have the confidence that Jennifer seems to have for a fact that He doesn't exist.

I've said He doesn't exist, but I don't know that beyond a doubt. There's still this voice inside my head (heart?) that makes me wonder.

It would be nice to know instead of just saying I know.


Allow that to work in you. In the Book of Mormon in Alma 32:27 we read, But behold, if ye will awake and arouse your faculties, even to an experiment on my words, and exercise a particle of faith, yea, even if ye can no more than desire to believe, let this desire work in you, even until ye believe in a manner that ye can give place for a portion of my words. Hang in there Chick, there is hope!
quote:
Originally posted by buffalo:
quote:
[WINDSONG]As I listen to each , I grow in understanding of human nature.


WINDSONG , I’m curious. What exactly did you learn about ‘human nature’ from the atheist candidate given the axiom that ‘behavior’ is a result of heritable traits + the environment?


I learn from how others react towards them
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
Jennifer,

I usually stay away from topics about religion because I feel that I may do more harm than good. I personally believe that most, if not all, Christians have troubles similar to yours from time to time. I'm not perfect in my Christian walk and I've struggled with my faith at times too.

I usually pray every night and I do randomly speak to God throughout the day. I know that I need Him and that He's with me. I have tried to walk away at times out of anger, hurt, etc...but He never allowed it. God allowed me to throw my temper tantrums, say my hateful words...but He stayed with me.

Again, I don't have all of the answers. I won't put you down because of your beliefs. I do think it would be great if you would give Him a genuine, sincere chance again. He's waiting if you'll reach out to him. IMO, it's much easier to choose not to believe than to believe and have faith in Him.
I'm headed to bed but I had to respond. Did you not read what I posted? I gave "him" a chance for YEARS. I didn't CHOOSE to not believe. My belief LEFT. I say my common sense and logic won out. It's wrong for christians to say people choose not to believe but yet they keep saying it. I've had this "debate" with bill for days now. Believers can and do lose their belief ALL THE TIME. You no more CHOOSE to be a non-believer anymore than you choose your sex before you're born. But it's not a bad thing, I was a happy little christian, and now I'm a happy atheist.


Of course I read it. I don't believe that you're a "happy atheist" as you put it. Sorry, but your posts/replies don't back that up. You actually come across as if you resent God and you need other "atheists" to defend your actions/beliefs. Opie made the remark that Atheists aren't recruiters. Then why do you and other Atheists argue with Bill and other Christians constantly on these forums? It's as if many of you need reassurance in your CHOICE to not believe. Paint the picture however you'd like, God doesn't choose for you to turn away from him, that choice.....is entirely yours.


You can "paint your picture" anyway you want it too. Christians have a little bag of tricks they drag out, and that "you can't be happy" is one of those little tricks. Now why in your opinion would I not be happy? As far as how I "come across", I don't post anything any worse, sometimes not as bad, as others in here post. That includes the christians. I "argue" with bill because he's radical, totally wrong, and exactly the kind of "christian" that should be challenged on his statements. It's like NSNS says, we can sit back and let people like you and bill spread the lies about atheists, or we can speak up. I will speak up. You call yourself a christian, yet you continue to spread the lie that people choose or don't choose to believe.

That doesn't "wound me", that doesn't make me flinch, it just tells me that it's either ignorance on your part, or pure hatred of people that don't believe in your god. And you toss out that hatred/ignorance by making those statements. It's you that looks bad in that situation.


You argue with Bill because you're frustrated with the events that led you away from Christ.

You haven't seen me spreading any lies about anyone on this forum...including atheists. Hopefully you've put more thought in your choice to be a non believer than you did the statement about me.
quote:
Originally posted by bluetick:
quote:
Atheists aren't recruiters. Then why do you and other Atheists argue with Bill and other Christians constantly on these forums? It's as if many of you need reassurance in your CHOICE to not believe. Paint the picture however you'd like, God doesn't choose for you to turn away from him, that choice.....is entirely yours.


Christians are recruiters. So if a christian does it it is ok, but if an atheist does it it is evil, right? Why do you and other christians argue with the atheists? It's as if you need reassurance in your CHOICE to believe. You don't make that choice for me....that is MY decision.




Let me ask you this. Why are you so defensive about YOUR choice? I'm not telling you to believe a certain way. It's your own uncertainty that cause's your hostility and anger. I didn't say that atheists don't recruit, Opie did. It doesn't make any sense to say "hey, we don't do it.", but they you turn around and defend why you do it.
quote:
You argue with Bill because you're frustrated with the events that led you away from Christ.

You haven't seen me spreading any lies about anyone on this forum...including atheists. Hopefully you've put more thought in your choice to be a non believer than you did the statement about me.

Oh please-get over it. Sheesh Oh and if you bothered to read my posts you'd know there were no "events" that "led me away from christ". Unless you call common sense and logic events.
Last edited by Jennifer
quote:
Originally posted by Opie Cunningham:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
Jennifer,

I usually stay away from topics about religion because I feel that I may do more harm than good. I personally believe that most, if not all, Christians have troubles similar to yours from time to time. I'm not perfect in my Christian walk and I've struggled with my faith at times too.

I usually pray every night and I do randomly speak to God throughout the day. I know that I need Him and that He's with me. I have tried to walk away at times out of anger, hurt, etc...but He never allowed it. God allowed me to throw my temper tantrums, say my hateful words...but He stayed with me.

Again, I don't have all of the answers. I won't put you down because of your beliefs. I do think it would be great if you would give Him a genuine, sincere chance again. He's waiting if you'll reach out to him. IMO, it's much easier to choose not to believe than to believe and have faith in Him.
I'm headed to bed but I had to respond. Did you not read what I posted? I gave "him" a chance for YEARS. I didn't CHOOSE to not believe. My belief LEFT. I say my common sense and logic won out. It's wrong for christians to say people choose not to believe but yet they keep saying it. I've had this "debate" with bill for days now. Believers can and do lose their belief ALL THE TIME. You no more CHOOSE to be a non-believer anymore than you choose your sex before you're born. But it's not a bad thing, I was a happy little christian, and now I'm a happy atheist.


Of course I read it. I don't believe that you're a "happy atheist" as you put it. Sorry, but your posts/replies don't back that up. You actually come across as if you resent God and you need other "atheists" to defend your actions/beliefs. Opie made the remark that Atheists aren't recruiters. Then why do you and other Atheists argue with Bill and other Christians constantly on these forums? It's as if many of you need reassurance in your CHOICE to not believe. Paint the picture however you'd like, God doesn't choose for you to turn away from him, that choice.....is entirely yours.


I can only answer for myself, but I enjoy ridiculing those who are hanging on to a belief in the unbelievable. I think they are foolish. Granted, they are free to go about their cyber witnessing, however their logic and arguments are so weak and puny that it must be addressed. It would be un American to allow Christianity and its sillyness to stand uncontested.


It's unbelievable because you won't allow yourself to believe. That's your choice. You mention Christians being weak...weak is having a "me" mentality and the control that it implies. It takes strength to put your faith in someone other than yourself.
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
...weak is having a "me" mentality and the control that it implies. It takes strength to put your faith in someone other than yourself.


LOL. Weak is thinking that you're born owing a sin debt and that you can't manage to deal with the everyday facts of your life without the mystical support of the sky daddy who knowingly created you weak and in need of His help to get by.
quote:
Originally posted by A. Robustus:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
...weak is having a "me" mentality and the control that it implies. It takes strength to put your faith in someone other than yourself.


LOL. Weak is thinking that you're born owing a sin debt and that you can't manage to deal with the everyday facts of your life without the mystical support of the sky daddy who knowingly created you weak and in need of His help to get by.


Weak is denying that we all may actually be held accountable for our actions by someone/something other than ourselves.
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
quote:
Originally posted by A. Robustus:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
...weak is having a "me" mentality and the control that it implies. It takes strength to put your faith in someone other than yourself.


LOL. Weak is thinking that you're born owing a sin debt and that you can't manage to deal with the everyday facts of your life without the mystical support of the sky daddy who knowingly created you weak and in need of His help to get by.


Weak is denying that we all may actually be held accountable for our actions by someone/something other than ourselves.


I don't know about anyone else, but I am accountable for my actions to a lot of people, besides myself. My family, friends, law enforcement, government. What I don't have is a sky fairy that I can say I am sorry to and all is forgiven. That is a luxury that religious people have afforded themselves. It is a lie, but they feel that no one and nothing else matters as long as they are right with the make believe deity. Sound pretty weak to me.
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
quote:
Originally posted by A. Robustus:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
...weak is having a "me" mentality and the control that it implies. It takes strength to put your faith in someone other than yourself.


LOL. Weak is thinking that you're born owing a sin debt and that you can't manage to deal with the everyday facts of your life without the mystical support of the sky daddy who knowingly created you weak and in need of His help to get by.


Weak is denying that we all may actually be held accountable for our actions by someone/something other than ourselves.


Strawman arguments are weak. No one is denying accountability for one's actions. I guess when and by what entity is the issue.

Weak though, is the belief that we're beholden and accountable to a purportedly all-loving, all-knowing, all-powerful, all-perfect creator that is somehow also jealous, angry, a mass murderer and offended by what his creations do with each other while naked. A creator who would incarnate a son on earth to be a tortured human sacrifice to help resolve the inherited sin debt passed on to us from two distant ancestors. All of which the creator knew would happen just as it did and could have easily prevented from happening anywhere along the way or could have fixed out of compassion for needless and pointless suffering.

It's weak to put your faith in something that would create and allow all these things and more to happen and then shamelessly places the blame entirely on it's creation for following his programming and design.
quote:
Originally posted by buffalo:
wind song,

Take it on faith from good authority that God is the Creator.

There are of course other options:

Take it on faith that God does not exist based on no authority; since science is not an ‘authority’ that leaves the loud mouth’s rhetoric that claim themselves to be well employed as atheist candidates by choice.

They can never discover by what knowledge they are atheist candidates or who told them they were.

Ignorance of facts is in more cases than not the reason the forum atheist here just as an example.

There are those who live the lie of claiming there is no God;

Then there are those like myself who have studied the proposition for many years and have arrived at the conclusion that there is no other choice but God as the creator.

Since science has never claimed to have any proof that God does not exist why imagine on it’s behalf that there is no God. Well, there are authors of confusion like slim& and Co. who seem to dazzle the minds of supposedly believers with their ignorance. Strangely enough it’s the Catholics among us that give quarter to these blasphemers.

What it biles down to is, the candidates are not smart enough to reach the level of understand as myself to know the difference in fact and fiction.

Jennifer is simply a loud mouth lunatic.

Slim has abandoned all reason.

Uno is obsessed that he cannot buy wine on Sunday.

Crust…….well….he is just sitting perched on a limb, never makes much-of-a-fuss and other than a small puff of dust following an indistinct thud from the occasional falling off the limb when suddenly aroused, goes virtually un-noticed.


What Buffalo said
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
Jennifer,

I usually stay away from topics about religion because I feel that I may do more harm than good. I personally believe that most, if not all, Christians have troubles similar to yours from time to time. I'm not perfect in my Christian walk and I've struggled with my faith at times too.

I usually pray every night and I do randomly speak to God throughout the day. I know that I need Him and that He's with me. I have tried to walk away at times out of anger, hurt, etc...but He never allowed it. God allowed me to throw my temper tantrums, say my hateful words...but He stayed with me.

Again, I don't have all of the answers. I won't put you down because of your beliefs. I do think it would be great if you would give Him a genuine, sincere chance again. He's waiting if you'll reach out to him. IMO, it's much easier to choose not to believe than to believe and have faith in Him.
I'm headed to bed but I had to respond. Did you not read what I posted? I gave "him" a chance for YEARS. I didn't CHOOSE to not believe. My belief LEFT. I say my common sense and logic won out. It's wrong for christians to say people choose not to believe but yet they keep saying it. I've had this "debate" with bill for days now. Believers can and do lose their belief ALL THE TIME. You no more CHOOSE to be a non-believer anymore than you choose your sex before you're born. But it's not a bad thing, I was a happy little christian, and now I'm a happy atheist.


Of course I read it. I don't believe that you're a "happy atheist" as you put it. Sorry, but your posts/replies don't back that up. You actually come across as if you resent God and you need other "atheists" to defend your actions/beliefs. Opie made the remark that Atheists aren't recruiters. Then why do you and other Atheists argue with Bill and other Christians constantly on these forums? It's as if many of you need reassurance in your CHOICE to not believe. Paint the picture however you'd like, God doesn't choose for you to turn away from him, that choice.....is entirely yours.


I love your response Southern
quote:
Originally posted by I am the Fireman:
quote:
Originally posted by buffalo:
wind song,

Take it on faith from good authority that God is the Creator.

There are of course other options:

Take it on faith that God does not exist based on no authority; since science is not an ‘authority’ that leaves the loud mouth’s rhetoric that claim themselves to be well employed as atheist candidates by choice.

They can never discover by what knowledge they are atheist candidates or who told them they were.

Ignorance of facts is in more cases than not the reason the forum atheist here just as an example.

There are those who live the lie of claiming there is no God;

Then there are those like myself who have studied the proposition for many years and have arrived at the conclusion that there is no other choice but God as the creator.

Since science has never claimed to have any proof that God does not exist why imagine on it’s behalf that there is no God. Well, there are authors of confusion like slim& and Co. who seem to dazzle the minds of supposedly believers with their ignorance. Strangely enough it’s the Catholics among us that give quarter to these blasphemers.

What it biles down to is, the candidates are not smart enough to reach the level of understand as myself to know the difference in fact and fiction.

Jennifer is simply a loud mouth lunatic.

Slim has abandoned all reason.

Uno is obsessed that he cannot buy wine on Sunday.

Crust…….well….he is just sitting perched on a limb, never makes much-of-a-fuss and other than a small puff of dust following an indistinct thud from the occasional falling off the limb when suddenly aroused, goes virtually un-noticed.


What Buffalo said


That is your answer? You want the words of what appears to be a complete lunatic to be your own?

You would rather believe in something completely unproven with no evidence at all than to believe in reality? This Buffalo character seems to think he has all the answers, but instead he just picked the answer before the questions were ever ask. That is a perfect example of how weak religion is.

Someone who really cares about truth would not exclude the real evidence for a convenient lie.
quote:
Originally posted by I am the Fireman:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern_Guy:
Jennifer, I usually stay away from topics about religion because I feel that I may do more harm than good. I personally believe that most, if not all, Christians have troubles similar to yours from time to time. I'm not perfect in my Christian walk and I've struggled with my faith at times too.

I usually pray every night and I do randomly speak to God throughout the day. I know that I need Him and that He's with me. I have tried to walk away at times out of anger, hurt, etc...but He never allowed it. God allowed me to throw my temper tantrums, say my hateful words...but He stayed with me.

Again, I don't have all of the answers. I won't put you down because of your beliefs. I do think it would be great if you would give Him a genuine, sincere chance again. He's waiting if you'll reach out to him. IMO, it's much easier to choose not to believe than to believe and have faith in Him.

I'm headed to bed but I had to respond. Did you not read what I posted? I gave "him" a chance for YEARS. I didn't CHOOSE to not believe. My belief LEFT. I say my common sense and logic won out. It's wrong for christians to say people choose not to believe but yet they keep saying it. I've had this "debate" with bill for days now. Believers can and do lose their belief ALL THE TIME. You no more CHOOSE to be a non-believer anymore than you choose your sex before you're born. But it's not a bad thing, I was a happy little christian, and now I'm a happy atheist.

Of course I read it. I don't believe that you're a "happy atheist" as you put it. Sorry, but your posts/replies don't back that up. You actually come across as if you resent God and you need other "atheists" to defend your actions/beliefs. Opie made the remark that Atheists aren't recruiters. Then why do you and other Atheists argue with Bill and other Christians constantly on these forums? It's as if many of you need reassurance in your CHOICE to not believe. Paint the picture however you'd like, God doesn't choose for you to turn away from him, that choice.....is entirely yours.

I love your response Southern

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Here's a thought:
I've never met any of you on this forum. I don't know your names, your address, your phone number, what color hair you have if any, so do you really exist?
I've never been to China. Does it really exist? How do I know it exist? Just because some person took a few pictures and said so? I can choose not to believe any thing I want to. Every new adventure we take we do it by faith. If you fly in an airplane you are trusting in someone (pilot) to keep that plane in the air. You've had faith in that person. You've never met the pilot but yet you trust him.
Similar to God. I've never met God face to face but I have faith that what he say's in his Word (Bible) is true.
Let's say the Bible is not true but I've followed the teachings of His Word my whole life. What good has it done me? I've lived a loving, caring, humbled life caring about others more than myself.
Now, let's say that the Bible and it's teachings are entirely true but I've chosen to ignore it's teachings my whole life. What then?
Eternity in Hell. Bad choice all around. There are no do overs, mulligans, re-starts.
Understand this all unbelievers. When you breath your last breath on this earth your life is over and that's when eternity starts. I know that some of you don't believe there is life after death BUT what if there is. Just take a minute to think about it. WHAT IF IT'S ALL TRUE?????
quote:
Originally posted by I am the Fireman:
Here's a thought:
I've never met any of you on this forum. I don't know your names, your address, your phone number, what color hair you have if any, so do you really exist?
I've never been to China. Does it really exist? How do I know it exist? Just because some person took a few pictures and said so? I can choose not to believe any thing I want to. Every new adventure we take we do it by faith. If you fly in an airplane you are trusting in someone (pilot) to keep that plane in the air. You've had faith in that person. You've never met the pilot but yet you trust him.
Similar to God. I've never met God face to face but I have faith that what he say's in his Word (Bible) is true.
Let's say the Bible is not true but I've followed the teachings of His Word my whole life. What good has it done me? I've lived a loving, caring, humbled life caring about others more than myself.
Now, let's say that the Bible and it's teachings are entirely true but I've chosen to ignore it's teachings my whole life. What then?
Eternity in Hell. Bad choice all around. There are no do overs, mulligans, re-starts.
Understand this all unbelievers. When you breath your last breath on this earth your life is over and that's when eternity starts. I know that some of you don't believe there is life after death BUT what if there is. Just take a minute to think about it. WHAT IF IT'S ALL TRUE?????


It isn't true, think about it. You die and are soon whisked away to a fluffy, white place, handed rock candy by butterflies and reunited with your lost pets and loved ones? Kind of a stretch even for the most unbalanced among us, don't you think?


I'd be embarrassed to admit I believed in this line of crap.
It isn't true, think about it. You die and are soon whisked away to a fluffy, white place, handed rock candy by butterflies and reunited with your lost pets and loved ones? Kind of a stretch even for the most unbalanced among us, don't you think?


I'd be embarrassed to admit I believed in this line of crap.[/QUOTE]

Fluffy white place, rock candy, butterflies? I've never seen any of that in my Bible. But if it was all that it beats burning in Hell where the worm never dies.
Pay day some day I'm sorry to say.
quote:
Originally posted by A. Robustus:
IatF,
You present a very false choice. Please take a minute to think about not only being wrong but some other religion with eternal consequences being right. It's possible the both atheists and Christians could be wrong, then what?


I'll have to go with what the Bible say's Robustus. Both atheist and Christians could be wrong but I don't think so. I don't believe that Believers in Jesus Christ and His teachings are wrong. I believer God is real, I believe, Heaven is a real place, I also believe that Hell is a literal place where unbelievers will spend eternity when they die.
If you want to throw out another belief that those unbelievers in Christ might follow I'm sure they will give whatever you throw at them a look see and may even follow you.
quote:
Originally posted by I am the Fireman:
It isn't true, think about it. You die and are soon whisked away to a fluffy, white place, handed rock candy by butterflies and reunited with your lost pets and loved ones? Kind of a stretch even for the most unbalanced among us, don't you think?


I'd be embarrassed to admit I believed in this line of crap.


Fluffy white place, rock candy, butterflies? I've never seen any of that in my Bible. But if it was all that it beats burning in Hell where the worm never dies.
Pay day some day I'm sorry to say.[/QUOTE]

How is Heaven described in your bible, or as I call it, the "Ancient Goatherd Detective Manual".
quote:
Originally posted by A. Robustus:
IatF, You present a very false choice. Please take a minute to think about not only being wrong but some other religion with eternal consequences being right. It's possible the both atheists and Christians could be wrong, then what?

Hi Robust,

No, it is not possible that atheism or some other world religion is true -- and Christianity is wrong. Why? Very simply -- the Bible. The Bible contains over 1800 prophecies -- all written under the inspired authorship of God -- all written hundreds or thousands of years before they were fulfilled -- and all, except those pertaining to the End Times, have been fulfilled as attested by secular, Christian, and Biblical sources.

No world religion, including atheism and secularism, include any prophecies. Why? Because these religions do not include God and do not have His divine knowledge and inspiration in their writings. If any of those books were to have included prophecies -- those prophecies, being much less that 100% accurate -- would have proven the falsity of that religion. Thus, to avoid this pitfall -- the writers wisely chose to not include prophecies in their sacred books.

This is how we know Christianity, and our Christian faith, to be the only path to eternal life with God -- it is proven and validated by our Bible, the inspired, inerrant, literal Written Word of God.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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quote:
Originally posted by Bill Gray:

Hi Robust,

No, it is not possible that atheism or some other world religion is true -- and Christianity is wrong. Why? Very simply -- the Bible. The Bible contains over 1800 prophecies -- all written under the inspired authorship of God -- all written hundreds or thousands of years before they were fulfilled -- and all, except those pertaining to the End Times, have been fulfilled as attested by secular, Christian, and Biblical sources.


It is very convenient that all the "fulfilled" prophesies were fulfilled in the same book in which they were prophesied. Revelation is just a drug induced dream. Did any of your drug induced dreams come true, Bill?

I'm no Qur'an scholar - never read it - but I'll bet there are fulfilled prophesies in it also.

Which prophesies have come true since the writing of the NT, Bill?
quote:
Originally posted by CrustyMac:
quote:
Originally posted by Bill Gray:

Hi Robust,

No, it is not possible that atheism or some other world religion is true -- and Christianity is wrong. Why? Very simply -- the Bible. The Bible contains over 1800 prophecies -- all written under the inspired authorship of God -- all written hundreds or thousands of years before they were fulfilled -- and all, except those pertaining to the End Times, have been fulfilled as attested by secular, Christian, and Biblical sources.


It is very convenient that all the "fulfilled" prophesies were fulfilled in the same book in which they were prophesied. Revelation is just a drug induced dream. Did any of your drug induced dreams come true, Bill?

I'm no Qur'an scholar - never read it - but I'll bet there are fulfilled prophesies in it also.

Which prophesies have come true since the writing of the NT, Bill?

Hi Crusty,

Notice the phrase I highlighted in bold above -- includes secular, non-biblical Christian and religious writers, and archeology.

No, neither the Qur'an nor any other world religion sacred book contains prophecies.

Yes, one such prophecy which has been fulfilled in OUR time -- is the return of Israel to its own homeland.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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