Skip to main content

Replies sorted oldest to newest

I seriously wonder about both of you and david (that's assuming david is not an extra persona for someone who wants the freedom to be 'really' nasty about the subject - lol). If you are <not> believers, God and Christians cannot be your enemy and yet that appears to be your intention here (by here I mean in the Religion section of TD - thank God they made one as it was in every section).

Surely this obsession is unhealthy. If I obsessed over Atheism or Islam or Wicca like y'all do over God and Christianity, I'd question my sanity. Whatever, I just felt perfectly justified in being blunt after that pathetic excuse of a cartoon.

JMHO Smiler
quote:
Originally posted by _Joy_:
I seriously wonder about both of you and david (that's assuming david is not an extra persona for someone who wants the freedom to be 'really' nasty about the subject - lol). If you are <not> believers, God and Christians cannot be your enemy and yet that appears to be your intention here (by here I mean in the Religion section of TD - thank God they made one as it was in every section).

Surely this obsession is unhealthy. If I obsessed over Atheism or Islam or Wicca like y'all do over God and Christianity, I'd question my sanity. Whatever, I just felt perfectly justified in being blunt after that pathetic excuse of a cartoon.

JMHO Smiler

Attachments

Images (1)
  • Amen_Animated
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
It was STUPID and in poor taste, skep.

Obsessions can be treated by qualified psychiatrists, you could even find one that is an atheist.


Exactly what was "stupid" or "offensive" about it?

I'll admit there is a thin line between passion and obsession. The 30 minutes per day I spend on this forum do not an "obsession" make, IMO.

I spend more time enjoying a single (or two) glass of wine every day. Does that make me a drunk, too?
I agree with Joy and Ron, it just shows a lack of understanding of Christianity. The video Deep posted was funny, this was just dumb.

As for God making atheists, He didn't make atheists any more than He made Christians. He made us all and we're free to make our own choices. To say that God hates atheists also shows a lack of understanding of Christianity.
quote:
Originally posted by Skeptik:
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
It was STUPID and in poor taste, skep.

Obsessions can be treated by qualified psychiatrists, you could even find one that is an atheist.


Exactly what was "stupid" or "offensive" about it?

I'll admit there is a thin line between passion and obsession. The 30 minutes per day I spend on this forum do not an "obsession" make, IMO.

I spend more time enjoying a single (or two) glass of wine every day. Does that make me a drunk, too?


You knew it was offensive to Christians the moment you put it up. Now you're playing dumb and I know better than that. I could put up dozens of pictures showing atheists burning in Hell, would you find that offensive?
Blaming fires in California on gays and atheists?

All that is offensive and stupid.
Mutual respect.
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
I could put up dozens of pictures showing atheists burning in Hell, would you find that offensive?


Since there is no such thing as hell for atheists to burn in, it would seem to be silly to be offended by that.

Now, if you posted a pic of my or my family burning in hell, that might cross the line. Post a pic and let's see what you gots!

This mock offensiveness is just silly when you really think about it. Y'all know the game here. I'm not stating anything I haven't stated before. Every single panel in that comic is a representation of debates we have day in and out here.

The comments by the "Christian" up there are stated verbatim with great regularity here.

Why the sudden accusations of obsession and offensiveness? I think I know but I'm curious what y'all think.
quote:
Originally posted by Skeptik:
Interesting that I'm being accused of being obsessive by people who spend at least as much time as I do "obsessing" over the exact same thing.

It's like attending an Alcoholics Anonymous keg party. Wink


It's different. I'm usually correcting misconceptions, proving internet theories false, and discussing something that has a huge impact on my life. You're discussing something you consider on the same level as Santa Claus.

Why spend so much time on something that you don't believe is real? Who spends 30 minutes a day discussing Santa?
quote:
Originally posted by NashBama:
Why spend so much time on something that you don't believe is real? Who spends 30 minutes a day discussing Santa?


Well, evidently I do. Wink

Would any of you care to cite exactly what is offensive (or even incorrect) about the comic? Seriously, I'm really, really not seeing it.

I really do exercise when I think I should. I really do NOT do evil just because it's the right thing to do.

Why would god NOT like someone like me who does "good" for the sake of goodness and not out of some hope that I'll gather enough golden stars to get to heaven?

What's "offensive" about that?
quote:
Originally posted by SHELDIVR:
I BELIEVE GOD will, for ETERNITY, deliver to atheist what he promised for non-believers.


I had no idea god had a delivery service. And what, exactly, is that, Shel? Pizza with anchovies? I HATE anchovies.

Perhaps warm, flat beer? Drank it in college all the time from dead kegs but no mo'.
quote:
Originally posted by Skeptik:
Har har.


No Christian prays for God to reduce their weight. They might pray for the strength of will to eat better and exercise, but not a 'magical' intervention.

No Christian behaves morally just because they may go to Hell if they don't. They do it for the same reason you do, because it's what is right and what their conscience tells them to do.

Wars have been waged in the names of gods, cultures, land , or for a single megalomaniac.

Gangs kill other gangs, drug dealers kill other drug dealers, one army kills another, etc.
War continues with or without religious influence.

Satan is pushing as hard as he can for more residents of Hell. The more Christianity and other religious views are attacked, the more he gets.
quote:
Originally posted by Skeptik:
quote:
Originally posted by NashBama:
Why spend so much time on something that you don't believe is real? Who spends 30 minutes a day discussing Santa?


Well, evidently I do. Wink

Would any of you care to cite exactly what is offensive (or even incorrect) about the comic? Seriously, I'm really, really not seeing it.

I really do exercise when I think I should. I really do NOT do evil just because it's the right thing to do.

Why would god NOT like someone like me who does "good" for the sake of goodness and not out of some hope that I'll gather enough golden stars to get to heaven?

What's "offensive" about that?


I never said it was offensive, I said it was dumb.

Have you ever seen Kirk Cameron try to disprove evolution by holding up photoshoped pictures of a "crocoduck" and a "bullfrog"? Your cartoon is the same kind of dumb. Not really funny, not offensive, just dumb because the cartoonist doesn't get it.
Good Afternoon All!

Silly Cartoon Skep. I’m glad you posted it.

Posting this cartoon allowed both the religionists and the non-religionists here to take a good look at the way they view the world, their idea of the universe, and ultimately, themselves.

One thing that it pointed out is that too many religionists take their religion seriously, TOO seriously. The one thing we all need to be able to do is to laugh at ourselves. After all, in the final analysis, we are all rather small and insignificant beings. Individual lives, no more than brief flashes played out upon the panorama of eternity. And yet all so self important, and all so seemingly profound! I am definitely one of the worst offenders here, by the way…

Too many religionists do use prayer as a device for material ends. How often do we forget to pray for values, and not for things? So we are such easy targets for the non-religionists.

However someone raised up a good point, asking the non-religionists why they fixate so on religion. This seems to be an uncomfortable point for the non-religionists. However, give Skep credit for his tongue in cheek response. The fact is, that there must be something drawing these folks to this site, other than a mean spirited urge to poke fun at the religionists.

I suspect it is a deep seated, unconscious even, uncertainty.

As to the dire “punishments” warned against these unbelievers…

There are none. We all are free to believe as we wish. This is our ultimate freedom, and our ultimate responsibility.

Hell amounts to no more than a return to nothingness for those who choose not to participate in the great adventure of eternity. It appears to be the expected and apparently welcomed outcome for many who participate here.

And Heaven is no more than the beginning of an eternal adventure of service and eventually finding and knowing God.
quote:
Satan is pushing as hard as he can for more residents of Hell. The more Christianity and other religious views are attacked, the more he gets.


Ahh, I get it. I'm Satan. Muh-wah-ha-ha-ha-haaah! Warm beer for you for eternity, LMM!

Ya see, that's the REALLY good thing about atheism. Yeah, we are pretty sure that no godds exist but are just as sure of the non-existence of fallen angels ruling over lakes of fire. That hot oozy stuff that comes out of volcanoes that was the genesis of "underground hell"? That's lava. A geologic process common in worlds the size of earth.

Demons? In the Bronze Age, what the heck would you call a giant fossil skull of a T-Rex sticking out of the ground?

Really, bud, there's no boogie man under the bed that will get you after you sleep. Promise. Wink
God favors atheists, which from his point of view is totally illogical.

For whatever reason, God gave a disproportionate amount of wisdom and understanding to those who do not believe in Him, e.g., scientists. I can only conclude that because God has a disdain for wisdom and understanding, he believed he was inflicting punishment on non-believers by afflicting them with a high IQ. The warped mind of God must have been responsible for the old saw, "Ignorance is bliss."
quote:
Originally posted by davidnmiles:
God favors atheists, which from his point of view is totally illogical.

For whatever reason, God gave a disproportionate amount of wisdom and understanding to those who do not believe in Him, e.g., scientists. I can only conclude that because God has a disdain for wisdom and understanding, he believed he was inflicting punishment on non-believers by afflicting them with a high IQ. The warped mind of God must have been responsible for the old saw, "Ignorance is bliss."


So you're saying God made atheists smarter so they wouldn't believe in Him and He could punish them? Not only is that completely illogical, it goes directly against scripture.

Here is a theory. Maybe when people are told how intelligent they are, when they have official titles and PhD after their names, they develop an inflated ego. Maybe it is their ego, believing they are too smart to believe in God and that belief is for stupid people is a major factor in their decision. I've worked with several pro athletes, ego is not related to intelligence.

There are plenty of accomplished, educated, and intelligent people who believe in a higher power than ourselves. To assume that a belief in God is limited to stupid people and that atheism is directly related to higher intelligence is to believe something without proof.
quote:
Originally posted by msmcneil:
"God gave a disproportionate amount of reason and underst anding to those that don't believe in him, scientists...."

1) All scientists are atheists? Rumor has it even in the National Academy of Sciences there are Christians. Stupid scientists, maybe?


Wow! We are making progress. An acknowledgement that the majority, in fact a vast majority, of leading scientists are atheists.

I have stated all along that 7% of the members of the national Academy of Sciences beleive in a personal God. Why such a low percentage?
Again this fixation of high intellect. Ah, if only the stupid could realize they are stupid, or realize we priveleged few are so smart, what a wonderful world this would be.

"Science" is nothing more than a method. Not a complex one at that. It doesn't give you "wisdom". It might give you data, and if you're lucky accurate data.

It's obvious to me we need to teach the scientific method at greater length to persons who will never become scientists. Two things will be revealed---

1) There's no competition between science and Christianity and any apparent contradiction just that-an apparent one.

2) Atheists will not longer be able to hide behind scientific mysticism.
"I have stated all along that only 7% of members of the National Academy of Sciences beleive ina personal God...."

1) Up to this point I've taken your word for that, being a wee bit lazy.

2) "Personal God" is fudging. Frankly, that's more Dawkins crap. What you're implying is that many of these scientists beleive in God but just have a different theology from me.

3) When I wasn't lazy, my own research determined that about half of all scientists believed in God.

That would be a more accurate figure based on non-skewed sampling, to be scientific.
"Science" is nothing more than a method. Not a complex one at that. It doesn't give you "wisdom". It might give you data, and if you're lucky accurate data.

If it doesn't take wisdom to understand quantum mechanics and cure diseases, then you would be right. But clearly it does.

It is people of wisdom that embrace the scientific method and use it as a tool to unlock the mysteries of the universe. What mysteries of the universe have been unlocked by religion without using science and intellect? If you are going to tell me that Christianity tells us why we are here (and science doesn't), then please tell me "why we are here" and what eveidence we have from Christian dogma for why wer are here.

"my own research determined that about half of all scientists believed in God."

Please tells about this research.

Even if 50% of scientists believe in God (not true), it is still evidence that the more intelligent tend to be atheists. Fifty percent atheists among scientists is far greater for the number of atheists in the general population.
Last edited by davidnmiles
The number is actually around 40%. About 45% said they do not believe in God, the rest are unsure.

Link

That figure has changed very little since 1918 which is a very important fact. If scientific advancements disprove God, then the number should be lower. Reality is that even though we advance in our knowledge, the number of scientists who believe in a higher authority remains the same. Why?

If people who believe in God are irrational and unintelligent, then how can science advance if 40% of the scientific community are irrational and unintelligent?
There are both stupid and brilliant atheists, and stupid and brilliant Christians. Some of the brilliant ones become scientists, engineers, doctors, whatever. Some will apply the scientific method to the question of God's existence and nature. Some may question God; others may confirm God. It's all with the individual.

Just because someone is an "atheist", doesn't necessarily impart any intellectual quality in either direction. Same with Christians.

Many of the Christians who turn to question, I would imagine, are those who were inundated with dogma that, frankly, makes little sense when viewed scientifically. One-hundred-and-forty-four hours does not a thriving planet make. A rock the size of a house takes longer than that to cool to a temperature that would not injure or kill a human.

If the universe were a made thing, I would suppose the "maker or makers" may have constructed it to provide intellectual stimulation. Do we stare in awe and wonder, and reach for the stars; or do we cower in caves whenever the lightning flashes? Like it or not, it was science, not religion, that opened up the road to the future. But it's religion, or it's cousin, "morality" that puts the speed limit signs and traffic lights on that road.

I took a lot of hard science in college and graduate school; I suffered through philosophy and the softer courses. At this stage in my life, however, it's the philosophy that asks all the really interesting questions. I believe I'm more content and a much better scientist (when I'm doing science and not business crap) because, at least for myself, I've integrated science and religion internally. They are not mutually exclusive, as some would believe; they are two sides of a bright, golden coin. Of course, the hazard here is the threat of my being thrown, for eternity, into the lake of fire because I believe differently than certain bloviating people, but at least I'm honest about it.
quote:
"Personal God" is fudging. Frankly, that's more Dawkins crap. What you're implying is that many of these scientists beleive in God but just have a different theology from me.


Actually, it's Einstein crap, and before that, it was Spinoza crap.

A personal god is simply one who knows you, cares about you, listens to you, speaks to you. As opposed to a deistic god who is indifferent to humankind and who might not even know we are here.

Assigning "crap" status to those things you don't understand or with which you disagree is... amusing.


DF
Comparison of survey answers among "greater" scientists (National Academy of Sciences)

Belief in personal God
1914 1933 1998
Personal belief
27.7 15.0 7.0
Personal disbelief
52.7 68.0 72.2
Doubt or agnosticism
20.9 17.0 20.8
--
Belief in human immortality
1914 1933 1998
Personal belief
35.2 18.0 7.9
Personal disbelief
25.4 53.0 76.7
Doubt or agnosticism
43.7 29.0 23.3
Figures are percentages.

Add Reply

Post

Untitled Document
×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×