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Today is the 10th anniversary of the Bush Tax Cuts, so lets look at what they have wrought.

  1. Dismal Economic Growth
  2. A Decade of Budget Deficits
  3. Red Ink as Far as the Eye Can See
  4. Disastrous Job Creation
  5. Declining Incomes
  6. Increasing Poverty
  7. A Massive Windfall for the Wealthy
  8. Record Income Inequality
  9. A Sagging Stock Market
  10. Jeopardizing Future Economic Growth
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Originally Posted by Mr.Dittohead:

Today is the 10th anniversary of the Bush Tax Cuts, so lets look at what they have wrought.

  1. Dismal Economic Growth
  2. A Decade of Budget Deficits
  3. Red Ink as Far as the Eye Can See
  4. Disastrous Job Creation
  5. Declining Incomes
  6. Increasing Poverty
  7. A Massive Windfall for the Wealthy
  8. Record Income Inequality
  9. A Sagging Stock Market
  10. Jeopardizing Future Economic Growth

 

 

 

And ALL brought to you by a Democratic Party controlled Government.

Isn't it time for a REAL change?

2012

Originally Posted by Mr.Dittohead:

Today is the 10th anniversary of the Bush Tax Cuts, so lets look at what they have wrought.

  1. Dismal Economic Growth
  2. A Decade of Budget Deficits
  3. Red Ink as Far as the Eye Can See
  4. Disastrous Job Creation
  5. Declining Incomes
  6. Increasing Poverty
  7. A Massive Windfall for the Wealthy
  8. Record Income Inequality
  9. A Sagging Stock Market
  10. Jeopardizing Future Economic Growth

The tax decrease resulted in increased revenue.  As to how the tax cut resulted in any of the ten mentioned items defies logic.  Logic and reason are foreign to the left wing mind, such as it is.

"The tax decrease resulted in increased revenue.  As to how the tax cut resulted in any of the ten mentioned items defies logic.  Logic and reason are foreign to the left wing mind, such as it is."

 

I'm not going to agree with Dittohead and declare his list of problems all a result of the Bush tax cuts.  However, your logic in crediting the cuts with increased revenue is as logically flawed as his argument that they cause all the problems.  Just because B follows A doesn't mean A caused B.  Income tax revenue as a percentage of GDP was actually much less under Bush than under Clinton.  Revenue increases are most likely attributable to GDP growth from the housing bubble - the same bubble than can take credit for most of the things Ditto listed.

Originally Posted by interventor1212:
Originally Posted by Mr.Dittohead:

Today is the 10th anniversary of the Bush Tax Cuts, so lets look at what they have wrought.

  1. Dismal Economic Growth
  2. A Decade of Budget Deficits
  3. Red Ink as Far as the Eye Can See
  4. Disastrous Job Creation
  5. Declining Incomes
  6. Increasing Poverty
  7. A Massive Windfall for the Wealthy
  8. Record Income Inequality
  9. A Sagging Stock Market
  10. Jeopardizing Future Economic Growth

The tax decrease resulted in increased revenue.  As to how the tax cut resulted in any of the ten mentioned items defies logic.  Logic and reason are foreign to the left wing mind, such as it is.

 

Liar.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org...yafact.cfm?Docid=200

 

Tax revenues decreased YoY from 200 to 2005. While spending increased. 

 

Originally Posted by Mr.Dittohead:
Originally Posted by interventor1212:
Originally Posted by Mr.Dittohead:

Today is the 10th anniversary of the Bush Tax Cuts, so lets look at what they have wrought.

  1. Dismal Economic Growth
  2. A Decade of Budget Deficits
  3. Red Ink as Far as the Eye Can See
  4. Disastrous Job Creation
  5. Declining Incomes
  6. Increasing Poverty
  7. A Massive Windfall for the Wealthy
  8. Record Income Inequality
  9. A Sagging Stock Market
  10. Jeopardizing Future Economic Growth

The tax decrease resulted in increased revenue.  As to how the tax cut resulted in any of the ten mentioned items defies logic.  Logic and reason are foreign to the left wing mind, such as it is.

 

Liar.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org...yafact.cfm?Docid=200

 

Tax revenues decreased YoY from 200 to 2005. While spending increased. 

 

 

 

Are you running the BS train full time now??? You can run these number anyway you care to and the results will be the same...unless you are just plain stupid.

 

February 19, 2009

Who Are the Big Spenders?

 

Myth.  Our national debt doubled in the last eight years.

 

Fact.  Nope, no matter how you measure it.  In fact, if adjusted for inflation, real economic growth and population growth, it didn't budge at all.

 

Here are the national debt figures in 2000 (President Clinton's last full year) and as currently estimated for 2008 (President Bush's last full year), as provided by our government.



         2000         2008         % Increase

 

Total Debt (dollars)          $5,628.7B        $9,654.4B        72%

 

Held by Public ($)          $3,409.8B        $5,428.6B        59%

 

Total Debt (%GDP)          58.0%          67.5%          16%

 

Held by Public (%GDP)          35.1%          37.9%            8%



By no measure did the debt "double" (increase 100%) in the last eight years.  By using total debt in nominal dollars, you get to only a 72% increase, not a doubling.  But that is nominal dollars, which includes both inflation and real economic growth in a country growing in population.  Plus, the "total" debt includes what the government owes itself; it is a figment of government accounting.

 

The most meaningful number, which is the amount of government debt held by the public (you, me and China) as a fraction of GDP, went up by only 8%.  If you also take population growth into account, the amount of debt per capita remained virtually flat the last eight years.  (The CIA World Factbook says our current population growth rate is 0.883%.  Over eight years, that would lead to an increase of 7.3%, or just about what the debt grew by.)

 

Was President Obama lying?  Of course not.  He just sees a glass that is 99% empty as 100% full. He visited 57 states, remember ?

 

Myth.  President Bush increased spending dramatically.  Specifically, he spent more than President Clinton did, dramatically increasing our national debt.

 

Fact.  Only if measured in nominal dollars.  But by that measure, or even in inflation-adjusted dollars, Clinton spent more than Bush 41, who spent more than Reagan, who spent more than Carter, on down the line.  Measured in a meaningful way, namely as a fraction of GDP, Bush spent less than the pre-Bush average, including that of President Clinton.  Similarly, he kept national debt below the pre-Bush average.
Originally Posted by Blind Melon Chit'lin:
Originally Posted by Mr.Dittohead:
Originally Posted by interventor1212:

The tax decrease resulted in increased revenue.  As to how the tax cut resulted in any of the ten mentioned items defies logic.  Logic and reason are foreign to the left wing mind, such as it is.

 

Liar.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org...yafact.cfm?Docid=200

 

Tax revenues decreased YoY from 200 to 2005. While spending increased. 

 

Are you running the BS train full time now??? You can run these number anyway you care to and the results will be the same...unless you are just plain stupid.

 

February 19, 2009

Who Are the Big Spenders?

 

Myth.  Our national debt doubled in the last eight years.

 

Fact.  Nope, no matter how you measure it.  In fact, if adjusted for inflation, real economic growth and population growth, it didn't budge at all.

 

Here are the national debt figures in 2000 (President Clinton's last full year) and as currently estimated for 2008 (President Bush's last full year), as provided by our government.



         2000         2008         % Increase

 

Total Debt (dollars)          $5,628.7B        $9,654.4B        72%

 

Held by Public ($)          $3,409.8B        $5,428.6B        59%

 

Total Debt (%GDP)          58.0%          67.5%          16%

 

Held by Public (%GDP)          35.1%          37.9%            8%



By no measure did the debt "double" (increase 100%) in the last eight years.  By using total debt in nominal dollars, you get to only a 72% increase, not a doubling.  But that is nominal dollars, which includes both inflation and real economic growth in a country growing in population.  Plus, the "total" debt includes what the government owes itself; it is a figment of government accounting.

 

The most meaningful number, which is the amount of government debt held by the public (you, me and China) as a fraction of GDP, went up by only 8%.  If you also take population growth into account, the amount of debt per capita remained virtually flat the last eight years.  (The CIA World Factbook says our current population growth rate is 0.883%.  Over eight years, that would lead to an increase of 7.3%, or just about what the debt grew by.)

 

Was President Obama lying?  Of course not.  He just sees a glass that is 99% empty as 100% full. He visited 57 states, remember ?

 

Myth.  President Bush increased spending dramatically.  Specifically, he spent more than President Clinton did, dramatically increasing our national debt.

 

Fact.  Only if measured in nominal dollars.  But by that measure, or even in inflation-adjusted dollars, Clinton spent more than Bush 41, who spent more than Reagan, who spent more than Carter, on down the line.  Measured in a meaningful way, namely as a fraction of GDP, Bush spent less than the pre-Bush average, including that of President Clinton.  Similarly, he kept national debt below the pre-Bush average.

"Are you running the BS train full time now??? "

I believe this shows Mr. Ditto to be exactly the creature he accused Interventor to be.

Federal spending increased every year, despite revenue declines, resulting in $300billion deficits. That is a fact. 

 

In 2005, when federal revs increased back to the 2000 year level, it was mostly due to increased corp tax revs, not individual income tax. 

 

Reagan invented deficit spending, so BushIIe cant be blamed for following the Repub God, and everyone knows BushIIe never had an original idea of his own. 

 

Originally Posted by Mr.Dittohead:

Federal spending increased every year, despite revenue declines, resulting in $300billion deficits. That is a fact. 

 

In 2005, when federal revs increased back to the 2000 year level, it was mostly due to increased corp tax revs, not individual income tax. 

 

Reagan invented deficit spending, so BushIIe cant be blamed for following the Repub God, and everyone knows BushIIe never had an original idea of his own. 

 

 

 

So, if you can't provide proof...just "spin"?

I thought so.

Originally Posted by dolemitejb:

"The tax decrease resulted in increased revenue.  As to how the tax cut resulted in any of the ten mentioned items defies logic.  Logic and reason are foreign to the left wing mind, such as it is."

 

I'm not going to agree with Dittohead and declare his list of problems all a result of the Bush tax cuts.  However, your logic in crediting the cuts with increased revenue is as logically flawed as his argument that they cause all the problems.  Just because B follows A doesn't mean A caused B.  Income tax revenue as a percentage of GDP was actually much less under Bush than under Clinton.  Revenue increases are most likely attributable to GDP growth from the housing bubble - the same bubble than can take credit for most of the things Ditto listed.

Please correlate income tax revenue increase to housing bubble (inflated cost of housing).  I understand how the dotcom bomb bubble caused false economic boom.  The housing bubble existed for several decades.

Originally Posted by Mr.Dittohead:
Originally Posted by interventor1212:
Originally Posted by Mr.Dittohead:

Today is the 10th anniversary of the Bush Tax Cuts, so lets look at what they have wrought.

  1. Dismal Economic Growth
  2. A Decade of Budget Deficits
  3. Red Ink as Far as the Eye Can See
  4. Disastrous Job Creation
  5. Declining Incomes
  6. Increasing Poverty
  7. A Massive Windfall for the Wealthy
  8. Record Income Inequality
  9. A Sagging Stock Market
  10. Jeopardizing Future Economic Growth

The tax decrease resulted in increased revenue.  As to how the tax cut resulted in any of the ten mentioned items defies logic.  Logic and reason are foreign to the left wing mind, such as it is.

 

Liar.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org...yafact.cfm?Docid=200

 

Tax revenues decreased YoY from 200 to 2005. While spending increased. 

 

From your source, with income in billions:

2001   1991.1
2002   1853.1
2003   1782.3
2004   1880.1
2005   2153.6
2006   2406.9
2007   2568.0
2008   2524.0
2009   2105.0

Bush signed his major tax cut in May 2003.  Then, the revenue shot up.  The decrease over the first three years was from recovery from the dotcom bubble under Clinton.

 

A man with a shred of decency would remove the claim of liar.  A man of honor would not have used it.  I expect, neither from this source.

Originally Posted by interventor1212:

Bush signed his major tax cut in May 2003.  Then, the revenue shot up.  The decrease over the first three years was from recovery from the dotcom bubble under Clinton.

 

A man with a shred of decency would remove the claim of liar.  A man of honor would not have used it.  I expect, neither from this source.

I give as I get. 

Your rationalization fails.  You can keep repeating it, but no one believes you.

The increase in revs in 2006-2008 was mostly corporate income tax collections increases, as I pointed out already.

"Please correlate income tax revenue increase to housing bubble (inflated cost of housing).  I understand how the dotcom bomb bubble caused false economic boom.  The housing bubble existed for several decades."

 

Well, this requires addressing a few issues.

 

1)  The housing bubble didn't last for decades.  Inflation adjusted housing prices remained pretty constant throughout the 1990's and skyrocketed through the 2000's before becoming unglued. 

 

2)  The housing bubble itself produced jobs and profitable opportunities.  GDP grew strongly and steadily throughout that period.

 

3)  As GDP grows, so too does income tax revenue, even if the cuts resulted in less revenue as a percentage of GDP than in prior years.

Originally Posted by Mr.Dittohead:
Originally Posted by interventor1212:

Bush signed his major tax cut in May 2003.  Then, the revenue shot up.  The decrease over the first three years was from recovery from the dotcom bubble under Clinton.

 

A man with a shred of decency would remove the claim of liar.  A man of honor would not have used it.  I expect, neither from this source.

I give as I get. 

Your rationalization fails.  You can keep repeating it, but no one believes you.

The increase in revs in 2006-2008 was mostly corporate income tax collections increases, as I pointed out already.

yes, I keep repeating the facts, just the facts.  Sorry things, facts, to the left, that is! 

 

The left fails to recognize cause and effect. For about the tenth time, as to corporate income tax collections, raising, of course, they rose.  That's the other half of the equation, when individual income taxes are cut.

 

When people perceive they have more income for the foreseeable future, they spend more -- more on goods and services.  Corporations produce goods and provide services.  Having sold more, the corporations pay more taxes.  What part of that don't you understand!

 

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