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quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Helped it? Hardly. It's causing it. If I got $200 a week to sit on my butt with all medical covered, why would I want to negotiate anything?

The same place that lost the RV trade. With attitudes like this, should I feel sorry that this place has a 19% unemployment?



detroit, Michigan, a symbol of the fruits of liberal policies! RIP
quote:
Originally posted by zippadeedoodah:
Link

This union has been on strike for three years in a town with 19% unemployment. Apparently management has decided to play hardball, and we see that union solidarity is not all it's cracked up to be.
would you like to have your $40,000 yearly salary reduced by 40% ? the union was willing to extend the current contract as it was..... THEY WERE NOT ASKING FOR ANYTHING. was management going to take 40% pay cuts?
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Helped it? Hardly. It's causing it. If I got $200 a week to sit on my butt with all medical covered, why would I want to negotiate anything?

The same place that lost the RV trade. With attitudes like this, should I feel sorry that this place has a 19% unemployment?
WOOOOOHOOOOOO !!!......a whole 200 dollars a week !!! french riviera , here we come ! PLEASE TELL ME YOU ARE KIDDING!
quote:
Originally posted by mackadoo:
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Helped it? Hardly. It's causing it. If I got $200 a week to sit on my butt with all medical covered, why would I want to negotiate anything?

The same place that lost the RV trade. With attitudes like this, should I feel sorry that this place has a 19% unemployment?
WOOOOOHOOOOOO !!!......a whole 200 dollars a week !!! french riviera , here we come ! PLEASE TELL ME YOU ARE KIDDING!



LOL i was thinking the exact same
No, I'm not kidding. Who said anything about the French riviera? Two people sitting on their butts would have $400 A WEEK, no medical expenses and since they get together to celebrate their stupidity at the coffee shop, they seem to be enjoying it.
Would I take a 40% reduction in pay, if there were no other jobs, which there is not, yes.
Their jobs were filled by other people so why would the company hire them back?
LMM the vast majority of Americans if they took a 40 percent pay reduction could not meet their financial obligations,of course 40 percent less is better than nothing,but when they are making the case they are hoping and expecting to prevail,the less or nothing claim is just a ld big business gimmick....Can you imagine the outrage if union workers slacked off and worked at a 40 percent slower pace and told management "you can take slower production or no production" or if Americans who were having budget problems decided to tell their credit card companies "As head of the Smith household we are having some hard times due to economic conditions and from now on we are going to just pay 10 percent so it is either the 10 or nothing"...the less or nothing in honesty is just STUPID,when parties make an agreement it is just that am agreement
quote:
Originally posted by Roger Waters:
Can you imagine the outrage if union workers slacked off and worked at a 40 percent slower pace and told management "you can take slower production or no production"...


The last time I managed both a union- and a non-union shop, doing the same tasks, at different locations, the union shop, BY ACTUAL MEASUREMENT, was 90% less productive than the non-union shop. And they got paid more.

So I closed them up, and sent their work to the non-union shop. But first, I gave them the opportunity to improve, and they filed a grievance on me for asking.

It seemed the hardest they worked was when they protested my action. Tough luck.
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Stupid is losing the only job you have.
As for agreements, Obama proved that no one has to abide by agreements any more. I once worked at Champion and was given the option of 'less or nothing'. I took less.


You deserve to have your wages sliced if you no more **** brains than to be working class and vote Republican like a imbecile harming you and your family's on interests
There is blame enough for everyone, as I see it. Unions are necessary when you have unbridled greed and more concern for profits than you do safety of your workers. Unions though have put themselves in a position, by ever increasing dues, of having to come from the table with ever increasing wages and benefits and many companies give in due to the treat of strikes that would cripple their ability to stay in business. Politicians (Democrats and Republicans) have created or allowed a situation whereby most of our products are now imported rather than made in the USA. If someone went into a coma in the early 60's and woke up today they would swear that we went to war with China and lost given all the "Made in China" things there are today. Unions can't continue to achieve greater pay and benefits and expect us to compete with labor and products from out of the country where they aren't playing on a level field. When you have that then yes unions can cripple or kill an industry, such as the steel industry and then you have the situation like the Democrats saddled us with during Clinton's years called NAFTA that took most of our textile manufacturing and sent it south of the border.

Before you blame the owners for taking their plants and businesses overseas or out of the country think about the homes you live in? If you built a new home did you build it with Union Carpenters? Union Plumbers? Union Roofers? etc, etc. If not then you are doing the same thing .. being conscience of the money you are spending or trying to save. If you used non-union people to save money on your home then you haven't the right to criticize a business owner for doing essentially the same thing. For this we have our Politicians (Democrat & Republican) to blame.

Unions are necessary in some cases, because you do have ruthless owners and people but in other cases Unions are not needed and cause more harm than good.
quote:
Originally posted by Roger Waters:
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Stupid is losing the only job you have.
As for agreements, Obama proved that no one has to abide by agreements any more. I once worked at Champion and was given the option of 'less or nothing'. I took less.


You deserve to have your wages sliced if you no more **** brains than to be working class and vote Republican like a imbecile harming you and your family's on interests


The working class in Detroit voted democrat and look at the trouble their in. The democrats
are not a friend of the working class.
quote:
Originally posted by skymaster:
quote:
Originally posted by Roger Waters:
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Stupid is losing the only job you have.
As for agreements, Obama proved that no one has to abide by agreements any more. I once worked at Champion and was given the option of 'less or nothing'. I took less.


You deserve to have your wages sliced if you no more **** brains than to be working class and vote Republican like a imbecile harming you and your family's on interests


The working class in Detroit voted democrat and look at the trouble their in. The democrats
are not a friend of the working class.




Don't blame 8 years of Bush and the republicans mess on democrats. You wanted war and Bush gave you one and everybody is paying for it. The rich get rich from war.
quote:
Originally posted by Roger Waters:
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Stupid is losing the only job you have.
As for agreements, Obama proved that no one has to abide by agreements any more. I once worked at Champion and was given the option of 'less or nothing'. I took less.


You deserve to have your wages sliced if you no more **** brains than to be working class and vote Republican like a imbecile harming you and your family's on interests

So those guys on strike who have been getting $200 a week for the last three years could be working at the 40% cut and getting $550 a week. I think I know who the imbeciles are. Now they won't get their jobs back at all.
quote:
Originally posted by Nobluedog:
quote:
Originally posted by skymaster:
quote:
Originally posted by Roger Waters:
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Stupid is losing the only job you have.
As for agreements, Obama proved that no one has to abide by agreements any more. I once worked at Champion and was given the option of 'less or nothing'. I took less.


You deserve to have your wages sliced if you no more **** brains than to be working class and vote Republican like a imbecile harming you and your family's on interests


The working class in Detroit voted democrat and look at the trouble their in. The democrats
are not a friend of the working class.




Don't blame 8 years of Bush and the republicans mess on democrats. You wanted war and Bush gave you one and everybody is paying for it. The rich get rich from war.


I believe this is zeb or whatever you’re calling yourself now. You make absolutely no sense.
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
quote:
Originally posted by Roger Waters:
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Stupid is losing the only job you have.
As for agreements, Obama proved that no one has to abide by agreements any more. I once worked at Champion and was given the option of 'less or nothing'. I took less.


You deserve to have your wages sliced if you no more **** brains than to be working class and vote Republican like a imbecile harming you and your family's on interests

So those guys on strike who have been getting $200 a week for the last three years could be working at the 40% cut and getting $550 a week. I think I know who the imbeciles are. Now they won't get their jobs back at all.



Why are they on strike? This may answer the question you asked.
quote:
Originally posted by skymaster:
quote:
Originally posted by Nobluedog:
quote:
Originally posted by skymaster:
quote:
Originally posted by Roger Waters:
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Stupid is losing the only job you have.
As for agreements, Obama proved that no one has to abide by agreements any more. I once worked at Champion and was given the option of 'less or nothing'. I took less.


You deserve to have your wages sliced if you no more **** brains than to be working class and vote Republican like a imbecile harming you and your family's on interests


The working class in Detroit voted democrat and look at the trouble their in. The democrats
are not a friend of the working class.




Don't blame 8 years of Bush and the republicans mess on democrats. You wanted war and Bush gave you one and everybody is paying for it. The rich get rich from war.


I believe this is zeb or whatever you’re calling yourself now. You make absolutely no sense.



Ok, read my lips, Don't blame 8 years of Bush and the republicans mess on democrats. That should make good sense. No, I'm not Zeb. But if it turns you on to think I am, it is ok by me.
quote:
Originally posted by Nobluedog:
The unions don't have any power to do anything yet. Obama may undo what Reagan did to the unions.


Reagan did nothing to the Unions, all he did was uphold the agreement they signed. I, like the air traffic controllers, and those that worked in certain government jobs signed an agreement that we would never strike. We had unions and representations but we knew going in that we could not strike because we agreed to it and put our signatures to it that we wouldn't. PATCO or the Air Traffic Controllers Union felt they were above that agreement and that there would be no way they could be fired for they were needed too badly. Reagan gave them notice of what he would do then did just what he said. I have no sympathy for any of them for I signed the same agreement and I knew what it said. Reagan was within his rights and did what he had to.

As far as Obama and the unions. I am never for creating a situation where people voting for or against a union have to vote in front of people and let people know how they voted. Management shouldn't know who is for the union and the union shouldn't know who is against the union. The vote should be private and what Obama wants to do is give the unions and unfair advantage for I've been in a union that was controlled by the mob and I've been among workers threatened by our own union before and I wouldn't want them to know how I voted.

My last position was a management position, in a company, but I still paid my Union Dues in the IBEW as well. I could see both sides of it.
quote:
Originally posted by Nobluedog:
quote:
Originally posted by skymaster:
quote:
Originally posted by Nobluedog:
quote:
Originally posted by skymaster:
quote:
Originally posted by Roger Waters:
quote:
Originally posted by LMM:
Stupid is losing the only job you have.
As for agreements, Obama proved that no one has to abide by agreements any more. I once worked at Champion and was given the option of 'less or nothing'. I took less.


You deserve to have your wages sliced if you no more **** brains than to be working class and vote Republican like a imbecile harming you and your family's on interests


The working class in Detroit voted democrat and look at the trouble their in. The democrats
are not a friend of the working class.




Don't blame 8 years of Bush and the republicans mess on democrats. You wanted war and Bush gave you one and everybody is paying for it. The rich get rich from war.


I believe this is zeb or whatever you’re calling yourself now. You make absolutely no sense.



Ok, read my lips, Don't blame 8 years of Bush and the republicans mess on democrats. That should make good sense. No, I'm not Zeb. But if it turns you on to think I am, it is ok by me.


The only Bush years that were a mess were the last 2. Yes I blame the defacrats for that. That should make good sense. Cool
In the LA teacher's layoff thing, our former gangster mayor told them if they took a 3% paycut they could reduce the number of layoffs by about 3500. Bets, anyone? Union solidarity...protection of each other's interests? Will the union members give up-what?- $2000 per year so that 3500 teachers won't be laid off?

I'm thinking the odds are NOT good...

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