http://money.cnn.com/2010/07/0...ne_forever/index.htm

From the article:

quote:
"The job losses during the Great Recession were so off the chart, that even though we've gained about 600,000 private sector jobs back, we've got nearly 8 million jobs to go," said Lakshman Achuthan, managing director of Economic Cycle Research Institute.

Excluding temporary Census workers, the economy has added fewer than 100,000 jobs a month this year -- a much faster and stronger jobs recovery than occurred following the last two recessions in 2001 and 1991.

But even if that pace of hiring were to double immediately, it would take until 2013 to recapture the lost jobs. And the labor market very likely doesn't have years before it gets hit with the shock of the inevitable next economic downturn.



quote:
It would take the creation of 10.6 million jobs immediately for the same percentage of the population to be working as was the case three years ago.

Of course, it will take time to create jobs. If it takes three years, more than 3.5 million additional jobs will be needed because of continued population growth.



Now...

14.6 million people are now out of work (8 million of those jobs were lost during the Great Recession) and the unemployment rate is 9.5%.

So how do we fix this?

Many of you will say the government needs to move out of the way and allow the free market to create all the jobs. Okay, but in what sector and why aren't jobs being created now?

Let me guess: Businesses need tax breaks to create more jobs, right? Well my answer to that is business owners and potential entrepreneurs can't predict with 100% accuracy what kind of taxes they'll pay in the long term no matter what (administrations change, you know).

And...

Existing companies came into this recession with huge cash balances. Translation: They've got the money to expand and hire now, so why aren't they? The fact is they are still hoarding their cash and giving pink slips and/or cutting hours and benefits to save more cash. They can't be waiting on tax breaks to expand.

More to think about...

Many educated professionals lost good-paying jobs in this recession. They have been left with no choice at this point but to apply for jobs they are overqualified for and are being turned down due to lack of hiring or fear the overqualified applicant will walk when the economy turns around.

Those who have accepted lower paying jobs are struggling. As an example, let's say Mr. Johnson used to make $40/hr before the recession. Now the only jobs he's being offered are for $8.00/hr. How does he pay bills on that? Who on earth can live on such a paltry wage in 2010? And this is happening; it's a story that's playing out over and over across the country.

(I'm not saying that anything LESS than $40/hr. is a paltry wage. I'm talking about someone whose education and experience is commensurate with that salary, as an example.)

So, please, enlighten me with your answers/suggestions to this crisis.
Original Post
I have one suggestion from talking with our CEO. Business is good but there isn't a lot of confidence. Say for example one of our main buyers goes under. Even if our business is well run we are relying on other companies.

There are also unknown costs down the road. Our utility bill for example is 300,000 on a normal month. A commercial rate hike or a energy tax would probably put us under. They are in a game of pennies.

They also don't know how Obamacare will effect them. A big hit there could also make it more profitable to produce our product in another country.

So it's the business atmosphere that is the problem. No one is willing to take a chance. They don't feel like this is a business friendly situation with the uncertainty and the possibility of skyrocketing energy and health costs.
I know how we could help it in Alabama. Big Grin

Build Casinos all along Mcfarland Bottoms.
Just think of the work that would generate here, construction workers, Hotel managers, waitress, bartenders, dealers, houskeeping, Valet parking attendants, ****tail waitress, Security Guards, cashiers, and the list goes on. Wink
A good start would be to build a fence that covered the Mexican border. Construction would last for several years and would actually be funded with the overwhelming majority of taxpayer's approval.
Lottery would help alot. I personally wouldn't play it, but there are so many people that I know that do. Why not keep money in our state?
quote:
14.6 million people are now out of work (8 million of those jobs were lost during the Great Recession) and the unemployment rate is 9.5%.


Actually, the number is a bit higher!

quote:
We can now say that the current recession has sunk to a level even worse than the horrible early 1980s recession, as measured by one indicator: The broadest measure of U.S. unemployment -- which includes unemployed and underemployed Americans, as well as discouraged workers -- rose to 17.5% in October, according to data compiled by the U.S. Labor Department. The previous high was 17.1% in December 1982, The New York Times reported.

The index, statistically known as "U-6," totaled 17.0% in September and 16.8% in August; that's up from 12.0% a year ago, in October 2008.
http://www.bloggingstocks.com/...ate-hit-17-5-in-oct/

As for what to do, I'm afraid it will take time, sweat, and patience to get out of this mess. I suspect that any quick cure will be like a fad diet and only make things worse.
Clues from the Great Depression may help. Jobs programs like WPA to build high speed rail, and even that Mexican border fence could be of benefit, but until we, in this country, decide to produce goods again, no full scale recovery is going to be possible. I therefore think we should make it economically not fesable for a company to produce products in another country and ship them here. As long as health care cost are being borne by businesses it is a lot more difficult to compete with other countries, so I think we should make available a single-payer health care .
In the end, since this is a global problem we shouldn't look at it like it is going to be over soon.
One thing that really bothers me to have to admit, but obsession with the national debt at this point in time is actually going to hurt. Happened during 39 so we know what can happen if it is too much of a worry. I hate to have to admit that fact because I hate debt so much, but we are where we are.
Taxes? , hell, we have the lowest taxes we have had since Harry Truman was president, and it would appear low taxes ain't working now.
In the meantime, while we are trying to find our way in the night, we should re-regulate the financial industry to keep them from playing the shell game they were playing before it all went south.
One thing more as it relates to manufacturing: We have a problem - we need energy more and more
There is a green solution- Solar and Wind
There is a country capitalizing on that need right now- China
NOW THE REAL QUESTION -- WHY IS IT NOT US?
In fact , we don't even lead the world in battery research for electric cars. WHY NOT ?
This socialist/racist administration has to be removed for any significant recovery to take place, short and simple.
What about investing in our infrastructure? We're in need of so many repairs to our bridges, roads and sewer systems, etc. It's an investment in our future. The Chinese understand this and are making the necessary investment; why don't we?

And it seems to me that those once employed in the construction sector would have the transferable skills needed to be retrained for rebuilding America's infrastructure.
quote:
Originally posted by Buttercup:
What about investing in our infrastructure? We're in need of so many repairs to our bridges, roads and sewer systems, etc. It's an investment in our future. The Chinese understand this and are making the necessary investment; why don't we?

And it seems to me that those once employed in the construction sector would have the transferable skills needed to be retrained for rebuilding America's infrastructure.


There is infrastructure work going on right now. It is mostly being done by Hispanics.
The construction company however is getting rich.

As long as our govt. has no requirement to be a LEGAL citizen it will continue this way.
quote:
Originally posted by Buttercup:
What about investing in our infrastructure? We're in need of so many repairs to our bridges, roads and sewer systems, etc. It's an investment in our future. The Chinese understand this and are making the necessary investment; why don't we?

And it seems to me that those once employed in the construction sector would have the transferable skills needed to be retrained for rebuilding America's infrastructure.


The original stimulus plan, $787 billion, was supposed to go for shovel ready infrastructure projects. About half of the funds are still unspent. However, little has gone for infrastructure. How about using the available funds for that?

As to China, their chief auditor reports that provincial unfunded internal debt is about $1 trillion. That's almost their entire foreign currency and bond reserve.

Japan tried massive infrastructure spending, including dozens of bridges to nowhere. Results were a decade of decay and stagnant economics. BTW, some of my Japanese friends say the construction is subpar. Wouldn't want to be near them in an earthquake.
quote:
Originally posted by seeweed:
In fact , we don't even lead the world in battery research for electric cars. WHY NOT ?


Physics.

High-quality batteries store only 1% as much energy as gasoline, pound for pound. Cheap lead-acid batteries store 1/1000 as much.
Too many are trying to solve the unemployment/economy problem without the knowledge, qualifications or full understanding of what it entails. The fuel for this fire was lit in the early 1980s, when industry decided that we should export all of our "heavy industry"/manufacturing and become a "service" economy. The result was to put the American worker out of work, make their product in a low paid foreign location and then "import" it to America to sell to their former employee who now punches the time clock a Wal Mart or draws a government check. Now the REAL problem hasn't arrived yet...when the economy is in total ruin/collapse and the "Great Depression" starts looking like better times, our government will be out of money because the tax payers will be out of money/work and China and Japan will cut off our line of credit. Total economic collapse looms for our nation.

It is difficult if not impossible to fix that which is broken and the people tasked with saving the nations economy/workers do NOT have a clue where to begin...they think they "pulled the American economy back from the brink" POTUS
* Quit giving jobs to Illegals - almost all their wages are sent back to families across the border and spent elsewhere.
* "Work For Welfare" Program - because the jobs that are out there Illegals are getting because our own people are too lazy to work when they are getting free cable, food and paying $50/month rent.
* Give better tax breaks to small business, not big business.
* Don't lend money to small businesses that have no means of capital to support tough times.
* Create more jobs within Government instead of cutting government jobs and allowing lateral moves from within, from position to position, without ever bringing in any new faces/jobs. Government creates jobs = more people work for the government = more people spending money = more people paying taxes = more government funded programs = government creating even more new jobs.
quote:
Clues from the Great Depression may help. Jobs programs like WPA to build high speed rail, and even that Mexican border fence could be of benefit, but until we, in this country, decide to produce goods again, no full scale recovery is going to be possible. I therefore think we should make it economically not fesable for a company to produce products in another country and ship them here. As long as health care cost are being borne by businesses it is a lot more difficult to compete with other countries, so I think we should make available a single-payer health care .
In the end, since this is a global problem we shouldn't look at it like it is going to be over soon.
One thing that really bothers me to have to admit, but obsession with the national debt at this point in time is actually going to hurt. Happened during 39 so we know what can happen if it is too much of a worry. I hate to have to admit that fact because I hate debt so much, but we are where we are.
Taxes? , hell, we have the lowest taxes we have had since Harry Truman was president, and it would appear low taxes ain't working now.


I doubt that we can have the same outcome if we try to redo the 1930's and 40's. There was this thing called World War Two when the Europeans and Asians decided to kill each other off. It helped get us out of the depression by employing all able Americans to produce war goods and serve in the military. The only problem is that the world now has these things called nuclear weapons and ICBM's.

As far as Truman's taxes, the USA came out of WW2 with newer, more productive, and intact factories and infrastructure while most of the world was wrecked. We had no competition like we do now for 2 to 3 decades. Any excess cost in manufacturing like a carbon tax gives the board of directors of any corporation another reason to move a factory to another country.
Lots of reasons we're in this mess, but we will never get out of it with the mindset of this current administration.
This is the most inexperienced prez in most of our lifetimes and to compound the situation, he's surrounded himself w/ inexperienced, incompetent, left wing (Marxist, Socialist) clueless idealogues. Most every bill they pass and decision they make goes against the wishes of most Americans.
Uncertainty, the promise of higher taxes and higher energy cost is scaring businesses and potential employers.
quote:
Originally posted by Chuck Norris:
quote:
Originally posted by seeweed:
In fact , we don't even lead the world in battery research for electric cars. WHY NOT ?


Physics.

High-quality batteries store only 1% as much energy as gasoline, pound for pound. Cheap lead-acid batteries store 1/1000 as much.


Seems like an opportunity for a great deal of improvement battery research and development.
We should be doing this here and not in the Orient.
quote:
Originally posted by gracies old man:
Lots of reasons we're in this mess, but we will never get out of it with the mindset of this current administration.
This is the most inexperienced prez in most of our lifetimes and to compound the situation, he's surrounded himself w/ inexperienced, incompetent, left wing (Marxist, Socialist) clueless idealogues. Most every bill they pass and decision they make goes against the wishes of most Americans.
Uncertainty, the promise of higher taxes and higher energy cost is scaring businesses and potential employers.

Why not criticize the administration that led us into this mess instead of the one who inherited it.
Because they took a bad mess and compounded it 1000 fold.
A mess that was caused by overspending by both parties, Barney Frank and Chris Dodd, specifically, screwing w/ mortgage and banking. I disagreed w/ Bush on spending and immigration policy, fervently.
quote:
Originally posted by seeweed:
Why not criticize the administration that led us into this mess instead of the one who inherited it.


The one that inherited it isn't helping, he's making it much worse.
I dread what's it's going to be like before he's finished.
Most of what I am reading here has to do with government jobs and money the government can spend to help but that's not the answer.
One thing that is helping a little is that at the moment there are some tax breaks for hiring from the ranks of the unemployed but for the most part the part our government can do is lighten up some of the burden they put on business and get out of the way.
I know several employers who are afraid to add full time help right now but could often use short term help. The problem with hiring short term help is that employers will get raped on their experiance ratings (experiance ratings are what is used to determine the percentage of an employees pay that an employer must pay in unemployment tax). If employers could get a little break on that point alone, a lot of temp jobs would immediatly be created that would also help employers get to a point where they can comfortably hire more permanent help.
Want to know whay jobs go overseas? In my case, I started operating in Mexico and importing from China not only because of the lower wages but also because of there is a lot less paperwork, a lot fewer regulations,and last but not least...a lot more skilled labor for our industry than what is available here. When I talk about regulations I am not talking about commen sense stuff, I am talking about the little things such as the $1000.00 fine I once got from OSHA for not having exit signs above all the doors. I guess they think that in a small company that the people working there everyday don't know how to get out the doors without a sign, if they think such a thing perhaps they should have shown up around quitting time to see just how fast everyone really could get out of there. No corner guards on a desk in the office? I think that fine was around 500. I could see that if it were a kindergarten class but I have never heard of an employee getting hurt by their desk.
If the government wants to help bring jobs back from other countries and encourage more hiring then they should spend more on education and training and spend less on nitpicking and nickel & diming employers to death.
quote:
Originally posted by Fighting Illini:
A good start would be to build a fence that covered the Mexican border. Construction would last for several years and would actually be funded with the overwhelming majority of taxpayer's approval.


I think we should build big a huge moat patrolled by a motion sensored missile carrying submarine. Let's see them try to out swim that lock and load.
quote:
Originally posted by seeweed:
Clues from the Great Depression may help. Jobs programs like WPA to build high speed rail, and even that Mexican border fence could be of benefit, but until we, in this country, decide to produce goods again, no full scale recovery is going to be possible. I therefore think we should make it economically not fesable for a company to produce products in another country and ship them here. As long as health care cost are being borne by businesses it is a lot more difficult to compete with other countries, so I think we should make available a single-payer health care .
In the end, since this is a global problem we shouldn't look at it like it is going to be over soon.
One thing that really bothers me to have to admit, but obsession with the national debt at this point in time is actually going to hurt. Happened during 39 so we know what can happen if it is too much of a worry. I hate to have to admit that fact because I hate debt so much, but we are where we are.
Taxes? , hell, we have the lowest taxes we have had since Harry Truman was president, and it would appear low taxes ain't working now.
In the meantime, while we are trying to find our way in the night, we should re-regulate the financial industry to keep them from playing the shell game they were playing before it all went south.
One thing more as it relates to manufacturing: We have a problem - we need energy more and more
There is a green solution- Solar and Wind
There is a country capitalizing on that need right now- China
NOW THE REAL QUESTION -- WHY IS IT NOT US?
In fact , we don't even lead the world in battery research for electric cars. WHY NOT ?


You do realize that increased protectionism was one of the main causes of the Great Depression, right?
quote:
until we, in this country, decide to produce goods again, no full scale recovery is going to be possible. I therefore think we should make it economically not fesable for a company to produce products in another country and ship them here


Congratulations, you've just driven up the cost of everything. Now, the poor can't afford us much as they could before. Mercantilism fails...everytime.

quote:
As long as health care cost are being borne by businesses it is a lot more difficult to compete with other countries, so I think we should make available a single-payer health care .


So you want to give the same government that caused this mess control of your health and well being? Go right ahead, but let's not do anything stupid that requires me to use and/or help pay for that monstrosity.

quote:
obsession with the national debt at this point in time is actually going to hurt. Happened during 39 so we know what can happen if it is too much of a worry. I hate to have to admit that fact because I hate debt so much, but we are where we are.


I don't expect the debt to be paid down...ever. A default is more likely than finding a politician willing to let working people keep their money. A politician's job - by definition - is to steal working peoples' money and spend it on things designed to improve re-election chances. That said, as the debt increases, the buying power of American dollars decreases, and the poor and middle classes quality of life will go down with that drop in buying power. So, adding anything to the debt is only a further burden on those who need the most relief.

quote:
Taxes? , hell, we have the lowest taxes we have had since Harry Truman was president, and it would appear low taxes ain't working now.


We can't tax enough to satiate Washinton's spending appetite. Increased taxes will only burden people who need their paychecks. They'll have less money and Washinton will give them nothing in return.

quote:
In the meantime, while we are trying to find our way in the night, we should re-regulate the financial industry to keep them from playing the shell game they were playing before it all went south.


Really, we should just stop loaning the money. They had a bunch of money and lost it. Instead of letting that be the end of it, smart benevolent people in Washington decided to give them more of our money.

quote:
There is a green solution- Solar and Wind


If we can make those things work, great! You should invest in it in fact. Just leave me and my paycheck out of it.
quote:
When I talk about regulations I am not talking about commen sense stuff, I am talking about the little things such as the $1000.00 fine I once got from OSHA for not having exit signs above all the doors. I guess they think that in a small company that the people working there everyday don't know how to get out the doors without a sign, if they think such a thing perhaps they should have shown up around quitting time to see just how fast everyone really could get out of there. No corner guards on a desk in the office? I think that fine was around 500. I could see that if it were a kindergarten class but I have never heard of an employee getting hurt by their desk.


I doubt a lot of people have ever looked at an OSHA manual. I did about 15 years ago when working for a small office. Not only did all doors have to marked as EXIT or NOT EXIT, they also had to have a light source on them. The print had to be a certain size and color, bathrooms had to be labeled and had to be a certain distant from other areas. ETC, .........
It took weeks just to figure out what had to be done, then money spent to follow ridiculous rules.

Until common sense enters into the equation, expect more unemployment.
quote:

posted by seeweed:
until we, in this country, decide to produce goods again, no full scale recovery is going to be possible. I therefore think we should make it economically not fesable for a company to produce products in another country and ship them here

posted by dolemitejb:
Congratulations, you've just driven up the cost of everything. Now, the poor can't afford us much as they could before. Mercantilism fails...everytime.


The poor can't afford as much as they could before? No, that's not the problem. The poor - along with the middle and upper classes - are just buying a lot more stuff than they actually need. And we're importing way too much cheap, useless crap that people don't need.

Televisions, computers and washing machines are built to last a few years. There are simply too many fluffy pillows and plastic gadgets (that we all somehow did without 20+ years ago) on the shelves at big box mart.

How much more of this useless stuff do you think our landfills can take?

quote:

posted by seeweed:
obsession with the national debt at this point in time is actually going to hurt. Happened during 39 so we know what can happen if it is too much of a worry. I hate to have to admit that fact because I hate debt so much, but we are where we are.

posted by dolemitejb:
I don't expect the debt to be paid down...ever. A default is more likely than finding a politician willing to let working people keep their money. A politician's job - by definition - is to steal working peoples' money and spend it on things designed to improve re-election chances. That said, as the debt increases, the buying power of American dollars decreases, and the poor and middle classes quality of life will go down with that drop in buying power. So, adding anything to the debt is only a further burden on those who need the most relief.


Americans haven't stopped buying yet. And if we want to buy anything, chances are it's made in China, making China's economy dependent on U.S. customers. Also, because Europe is experiencing a worse fiscal crisis than the U.S., China will continue to buy our bad debt; the dollar is still a safer bet than the euro.

Debt is not good but as long as we're China's best customer they will not try to bankrupt us. If the U.S. economy collapses, so does China's.
quote:
The poor can't afford as much as they could before? No, that's not the problem. The poor - along with the middle and upper classes - are just buying a lot more stuff than they actually need. And we're importing way too much cheap, useless crap that people don't need.

Televisions, computers and washing machines are built to last a few years. There are simply too many fluffy pillows and plastic gadgets (that we all somehow did without 20+ years ago) on the shelves at big box mart.

How much more of this useless stuff do you think our landfills can take?


Seeweed was answering questions on how to solve unemployment, and I was disagreeing with Seeweed's solutions. "Buying too much" did not cause the unemployment problem and buying less won't solve it. Also, over crowded landfills did not cause unemployment, so less stuff in the landfill won't fix that problem either.

quote:
Also, because Europe is experiencing a worse fiscal crisis than the U.S., China will continue to buy our bad debt; the dollar is still a safer bet than the euro.

Debt is not good but as long as we're China's best customer they will not try to bankrupt us. If the U.S. economy collapses, so does China's.


That's not what I was talking about. I don't think our currency is headed the way of Zimbabwe's, but it's definitely losing value. Additional debt will only further that decline. That happenes independent of how other currencies perform. This type of currency decline is naturally going to affect those who's only real assets are cash and cash equivalents - the poor and middle class.
quote:
Originally posted by dolemitejb:
quote:
The poor can't afford as much as they could before? No, that's not the problem. The poor - along with the middle and upper classes - are just buying a lot more stuff than they actually need. And we're importing way too much cheap, useless crap that people don't need.

Televisions, computers and washing machines are built to last a few years. There are simply too many fluffy pillows and plastic gadgets (that we all somehow did without 20+ years ago) on the shelves at big box mart.

How much more of this useless stuff do you think our landfills can take?


Seeweed was answering questions on how to solve unemployment, and I was disagreeing with Seeweed's solutions. "Buying too much" did not cause the unemployment problem and buying less won't solve it. Also, over crowded landfills did not cause unemployment, so less stuff in the landfill won't fix that problem either.

quote:
Also, because Europe is experiencing a worse fiscal crisis than the U.S., China will continue to buy our bad debt; the dollar is still a safer bet than the euro.

Debt is not good but as long as we're China's best customer they will not try to bankrupt us. If the U.S. economy collapses, so does China's.


That's not what I was talking about. I don't think our currency is headed the way of Zimbabwe's, but it's definitely losing value. Additional debt will only further that decline. That happenes independent of how other currencies perform. This type of currency decline is naturally going to affect those who's only real assets are cash and cash equivalents - the poor and middle class.


You're the one who said the poor wouldn't be able to buy as much as they did before if we started producing goods again. My argument is not only did the bank's problems get us into trouble, so did our personal debt.

My bet is, in the long run, our economy won't be fueled by consumer spending like it once was. People can't pull the equity out of their homes like an ATM anymore because many homeowners are underwater; property values are still declining; the unemployed aren't finding jobs. Most people are just broke and my hope is they will learn a lesson from this economic crisis.

The bigger point is if people had not bought so much crap in the first place and instead saved more, the financial crisis and massive unemployment wouldn't have had such a horrible impact on us.

I don't necessarily disagree with you about the debt issue, but my point (as is seeweed's) is we can't concentrate on that right now. The ability to borrow is still there and we still need to borrow. Having said that, I don't like it; it is just a necessary thing to do right now.
quote:
You're the one who said the poor wouldn't be able to buy as much as they did before if we started producing goods again.


No. If you look back, you will see that Seeweed was arguing that we should make imports economically non-viable. My response to that was that it would drive up the cost of everything, leaving the poor unable to purchase as much.

quote:
The bigger point is if people had not bought so much crap in the first place and instead saved more, the financial crisis and massive unemployment wouldn't have had such a horrible impact on us.


I guess that's not completely off. However, to blame "people," is to miss the mark. All this credit came from somewhere. That somewhere is Washington DC. Sure, you can make the argument that people should have some restraint (and I would agree), but you also have to look to the source of the credit that never should have existed in the first place.

quote:
my point (as is seeweed's) is we can't concentrate on that right now. The ability to borrow is still there and we still need to borrow. Having said that, I don't like it; it is just a necessary thing to do right now.


I'm not going to say you're wrong, but that's a highly debatable point. Borrowing your way to proserity is impossible, and throwing money at a problem doesn't make it go away. That's what our government is attempting right now. Not once have they addressed the systemic problems. Instead, they call for more stimulus, more unemployment, etc... They're trying to put a band-aid on a gunshot wound.
quote:
Originally posted by Flatus the Ancient:
quote:
Clues from the Great Depression may help. Jobs programs like WPA to build high speed rail, and even that Mexican border fence could be of benefit, but until we, in this country, decide to produce goods again, no full scale recovery is going to be possible. I therefore think we should make it economically not fesable for a company to produce products in another country and ship them here. As long as health care cost are being borne by businesses it is a lot more difficult to compete with other countries, so I think we should make available a single-payer health care .
In the end, since this is a global problem we shouldn't look at it like it is going to be over soon.
One thing that really bothers me to have to admit, but obsession with the national debt at this point in time is actually going to hurt. Happened during 39 so we know what can happen if it is too much of a worry. I hate to have to admit that fact because I hate debt so much, but we are where we are.
Taxes? , hell, we have the lowest taxes we have had since Harry Truman was president, and it would appear low taxes ain't working now.


I doubt that we can have the same outcome if we try to redo the 1930's and 40's. There was this thing called World War Two when the Europeans and Asians decided to kill each other off. It helped get us out of the depression by employing all able Americans to produce war goods and serve in the military. The only problem is that the world now has these things called nuclear weapons and ICBM's.

As far as Truman's taxes, the USA came out of WW2 with newer, more productive, and intact factories and infrastructure while most of the world was wrecked. We had no competition like we do now for 2 to 3 decades. Any excess cost in manufacturing like a carbon tax gives the board of directors of any corporation another reason to move a factory to another country.


Only two nations have single payer healthcare systems -- Canada and North Korea. Canada is seeking ways to lower their costs, even private insurance is being considered.
quote:
Originally posted by bama in chi-town:
quote:
Originally posted by seeweed:
Clues from the Great Depression may help. Jobs programs like WPA to build high speed rail, and even that Mexican border fence could be of benefit, but until we, in this country, decide to produce goods again, no full scale recovery is going to be possible. I therefore think we should make it economically not fesable for a company to produce products in another country and ship them here. As long as health care cost are being borne by businesses it is a lot more difficult to compete with other countries, so I think we should make available a single-payer health care .
In the end, since this is a global problem we shouldn't look at it like it is going to be over soon.
One thing that really bothers me to have to admit, but obsession with the national debt at this point in time is actually going to hurt. Happened during 39 so we know what can happen if it is too much of a worry. I hate to have to admit that fact because I hate debt so much, but we are where we are.
Taxes? , hell, we have the lowest taxes we have had since Harry Truman was president, and it would appear low taxes ain't working now.
In the meantime, while we are trying to find our way in the night, we should re-regulate the financial industry to keep them from playing the shell game they were playing before it all went south.
One thing more as it relates to manufacturing: We have a problem - we need energy more and more
There is a green solution- Solar and Wind
There is a country capitalizing on that need right now- China
NOW THE REAL QUESTION -- WHY IS IT NOT US?
In fact , we don't even lead the world in battery research for electric cars. WHY NOT ?


You do realize that increased protectionism was one of the main causes of the Great Depression, right?


Yes, despite letters from hundred of economists, Hoover signed the bill. The rest of the world followed suit.
quote:
Originally posted by Buttercup:
What about investing in our infrastructure? We're in need of so many repairs to our bridges, roads and sewer systems, etc. It's an investment in our future. The Chinese understand this and are making the necessary investment; why don't we?

And it seems to me that those once employed in the construction sector would have the transferable skills needed to be retrained for rebuilding America's infrastructure.


I love it, I knew I liked you for a reason ;O)
quote:
Originally posted by dntblnk:
* Quit giving jobs to Illegals - almost all their wages are sent back to families across the border and spent elsewhere.
* "Work For Welfare" Program - because the jobs that are out there Illegals are getting because our own people are too lazy to work when they are getting free cable, food and paying $50/month rent.
* Give better tax breaks to small business, not big business.
* Don't lend money to small businesses that have no means of capital to support tough times.
* Create more jobs within Government instead of cutting government jobs and allowing lateral moves from within, from position to position, without ever bringing in any new faces/jobs. Government creates jobs = more people work for the government = more people spending money = more people paying taxes = more government funded programs = government creating even more new jobs.


YES YES AND YES, although the more govt jobs equation looks like fuzzy math to me. I think that sounds alot like a 'pyramid scheme' to me ;o) But I do agree with you and buttercup, we need to put some folks on the payroll and get some work done (as well as put some of the welfare folks to work). Heck, we can give the auto and banking industry BILLIONS and we cant pay to fix our roads. Someone tell me why the gov't didnt just BUY a couple hundred thousand Hummers instead of just throwing the money at GM ;O) Hey, as a taxpayer, I'm still an owner in GM. I wonder if I can get a discount on a new car like the employee plan. Its worth a try.

Jeepin'

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