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Originally posted by LAWGRL:
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Originally posted by excelman:
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Originally posted by LAWGRL:
What if I said that I knew of a group of very wealthy out-of-state investors who think Florence, particularly downtown, is a goldmine and who would consider coming in and paying more than the property is worth to do a complete renovation? A group with enough money to get some of our ridiculous ordinances changed? Like it or not, money talks.

Seriously though, how fast do you think the TD would write an article casting the idea in a horribly negative light and riling up the town elders into action to try and prevent it? I'd really like your thoughts.


If one of these investors was our lord David Bronner, the TD would support it with all they could.


Lord Bronner. Ha!! Big Grin

In all seriousness, I am having dinner tonight with one of these investors. His son is here for Space Camp, and he heavily researched the area and decided to stay in the Shoals rather than in Huntsville because he thought this area was so wonderful. He was shocked to get here and see downtown in the poor shape it's in, not to mention our complete lack of waterfront businesses above the dam. I told him that he was (to use a southern phrase) "preaching to the choir". Anyway, I'm going to go and hear him out tonight. If I have to move to Florence and run for city council next year to help facilitate changes, I'll ****ed well do it.


Let us know what he says, especilly what he is looking for in a city to invest in.
quote:
Originally posted by LAWGRL:
quote:
Originally posted by excelman:
quote:
Originally posted by LAWGRL:
What if I said that I knew of a group of very wealthy out-of-state investors who think Florence, particularly downtown, is a goldmine and who would consider coming in and paying more than the property is worth to do a complete renovation? A group with enough money to get some of our ridiculous ordinances changed? Like it or not, money talks.

Seriously though, how fast do you think the TD would write an article casting the idea in a horribly negative light and riling up the town elders into action to try and prevent it? I'd really like your thoughts.


If one of these investors was our lord David Bronner, the TD would support it with all they could.


Lord Bronner. Ha!! Big Grin

In all seriousness, I am having dinner tonight with one of these investors. His son is here for Space Camp, and he heavily researched the area and decided to stay in the Shoals rather than in Huntsville because he thought this area was so wonderful. He was shocked to get here and see downtown in the poor shape it's in, not to mention our complete lack of waterfront businesses above the dam. I told him that he was (to use a southern phrase) "preaching to the choir". Anyway, I'm going to go and hear him out tonight. If I have to move to Florence and run for city council next year to help facilitate changes, I'll ****ed well do it.


I'll ****ed well back you up too!
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Originally posted by FoshaBen:
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Originally posted by noblessf:
I love this topic and have nothing new to add but to simply re-instate what's already been said. I also was born and raised in Florence; I went away to college but finally settled at UNA. Finally a year after graduating and still working at my 'college job' I had to move. I'm in Atlanta now and my husband and I are relocating to start our business. Florence was a consideration but everything that's been said is reason enough. After living in a huge city for the last 7 years I really miss the Shoals but it would just be too big of an adjustment for the lifestyle I've grown accustomed to in a larger city. It is a great place to raise a family but what happens when that family gets too big for Florence??? Good luck residents! I'll stick to my visits on Holidays.


I can't emphasize how much we need people to come back home, and bring their businesses with them.

There needs to be a re-awakening in the area.. a revitalization. The motto of every city council, the Chamber of Commerce, and our representatives in Montgomery ought to be "Come Back Home". There needs to be some sort of marketing campaign geared toward getting people back, coupled with a strong and genuine effort to bring and attract businesses that will not only employ many workers, but will provide more professional jobs. They more higher paying white collar jobs you have in the area, the more the economy will be boosted. You've got to have that so that the other levels of the economic tier can thrive as well. We need to find our economic niche and expertise that will generate revenue and jobs, and match that with specialized studies at UNA to feed back into the local labor market.


I read through all the posts before putting my two cents worth in but I felt I had to reply specifically to this post from FoshaBen. I can tell you, as someone who attempted the very thing you suggest, the predominant mentality in the Shoals area doesn't allow for it. Let me give you a reality check about natives "bringing your business back to the Shoals".

My husband and I love the Shoals area. I'm a native, born and bred, moved away to Atlanta the first time at 22 when I got married to my now ex-husband and we both needed jobs. Moved back after my divorce to re-group. Met my second husband, who is a military brat and doesn't really have anywhere he calls "home", but adopted the Shoals after living with me in Florence for a while. We both lost our jobs when the Advanced Solid Rocket Motor Plant in Iuka was defunded by Congress and we and another 700 people were suddenly unemployed. Hubby is an aerospace engineer who couldn't buy a job because that industry, even in Huntsville, was pretty dead at that time. So, I found myself leaving the Shoals for a second time, again in search of employment. Fast forward seven years, we're back in the Shoals area and trying to start our own consulting business. My husband still had lots of contacts in the industry and Boeing had just opened in Decatur. He was told by many of those contacts that Boeing desperately wanted and needed to subcontract with some of the small manufacturing firms in the Shoals (a requirement of their contract with the gov't was to partner with local businesses). Unfortunately, these local businesses were not qualified to be suppliers because they had no quality (i.e ISO9000,etc.) plans or procedures in place; a requirement for any sub-contractor, again, per the gov't contracts. Enter me and my hubby, who is a black belt in Kaizen, Lean Manufacturing, ISO-9000, you name it. We did everything we were told would make our new little business a success. We attended Chamber of Commerce meetings on both sides of the river and small business information lunches. We went to the small business assistance office at UNA and worked really hard putting together a presentation about what we could do for these local small business manufacturing guys that would enable them to become qualified sub-contractors to Boeing, the biggest game in town, and would guarantee these little shoestring companies an income flow they could only dream of....can you guess what happened??????? NOT A **** THING, THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED! We went to visit as many of them as would actually agree to meet with us but got the same stupid, backwards, myopic answer from each one of them. "Well, uh, I don't know....you see, we've been operating this way since my granddaddy opened this shop yadda, yadda...and we've been getting by okay"....WHAT????? We could not convince a single small business owner we spoke to that allowing us to come into their shop, observing the way they did whatever it was they did, and then customizing a quality plan for them was worth paying for, even when it would guarantee them an opportunity to sub-contract to Boeing and start literally raking in the cash. I really shouldn't have been surprised since I was born and raised around these stupid people, but I was....I mean, who in their right mind would turn down a sure thing opportunity like that? You guessed it, Shoals business owners!

We finally faced reality and gave up in total disgust. I was lucky and managed to get a dinky little office job paying the grand sum of $8.50 an hour (big money for that area) and my husband went on unemployment. For a third time in my life, I was looking at leaving the Shoals...not because we wanted to, believe me, but because we had no other choice -- we needed JOBS!

All my immediate family are still in the Shoals, stubbornly hanging on by their fingernails, some working two jobs just to make ends meet. We've now been in California four years, make a really NICE living ($200k+), live 1/4 mile from the ocean, own our own home, and are never at a loss for entertainment opportunities of every variety and at any time of the day or night.

We've been back to the Shoals to visit only once during the past four years and I don't know when we'll make it back again. Other than seeing my family face-to-face and the opportunity for my husband to gorge himself on fried catfish, there, sadly, isn't anything that draws up back.

As far as retirement goes, despite all the hype of the RSA, we won't even consider the Shoals for that when my hubby gives up the rat race in about 10 years. We'll be selling our house here in So Cal and looking to buy somewhere along the Florida/Alabama Gulf Coast. We know, as much as we love the Shoals area, there isn't nearly enough to do around there for active retirees. You can only play so much golf and we'd rather swim in the warm ocean than a chilly, dirty river.

I wish LAWGRL and any others all the luck in the world on their mission to change the status quo, but I wonder if they aren't just flogging a dead horse? As is the case in most small towns where you have old money, the children of said old money crowd that are currently running things have been raised in "the moneyed bubble", are just as out of touch and short-sighted as their elders, and will perpetuate the cycle when they come to power.
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Originally posted by Mr. Hooberbloob:
PBA - You left out Occidental, they are shutting down in 2008. However, it's not because of the economic condition of this area, but because of ever increasing environmental regulations. I suspect that is the driver for many plants being shut down in the US as it is too expensive to operate when competing against countries that don't have an EPA. Reynolds has shut down plants everywhere, not just the Shoals. They have lost their share of the market years ago. Ford is the same way.

The draw for this area is the navigable river system, highly skilled craftsmen, and cheap and reliable power system. Toyota is building a plant just down the road from us that will employ 2000 people. There will be a lot of contract work and support business that will trickle over to us. The SCA plant as well as the Lighting Plant has generated many jobs both onsite and off. A railcar company is likely to build a plant in Barton in the near future that will create hundreds of onsite jobs. I wouldn't write the Shoals area off just yet, I think we may be on the cusp of somthing big.



Thanks for this info!! Some good news to the ear! Thanks again!
quote:
Originally posted by LAWGRL:
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Originally posted by excelman:
quote:
Originally posted by LAWGRL:
What if I said that I knew of a group of very wealthy out-of-state investors who think Florence, particularly downtown, is a goldmine and who would consider coming in and paying more than the property is worth to do a complete renovation? A group with enough money to get some of our ridiculous ordinances changed? Like it or not, money talks.

Seriously though, how fast do you think the TD would write an article casting the idea in a horribly negative light and riling up the town elders into action to try and prevent it? I'd really like your thoughts.


If one of these investors was our lord David Bronner, the TD would support it with all they could.


Lord Bronner. Ha!! Big Grin

In all seriousness, I am having dinner tonight with one of these investors. His son is here for Space Camp, and he heavily researched the area and decided to stay in the Shoals rather than in Huntsville because he thought this area was so wonderful. He was shocked to get here and see downtown in the poor shape it's in, not to mention our complete lack of waterfront businesses above the dam. I told him that he was (to use a southern phrase) "preaching to the choir". Anyway, I'm going to go and hear him out tonight. If I have to move to Florence and run for city council next year to help facilitate changes, I'll ****ed well do it.




What is it like to know people with power and big $$$$$$money?
The only thing that GoFish got right was that I should have said old money. There are still the established young, stupid people here that are just happy the way it is. The rest is all garbage. He must be living in some solitary goldfish bowl. Come outside and see how the rest of us live and struggle here in Florence. Property values are at an all-time low! Where do you live?

You agree there are no jobs for young folks. How about the old folks? There are none. A college degree will get you a $7.00 an hour job here. Shameful!!!

You say we have a progressive city council who "seem" to listen to the younger voices. Seem to listen is just another way to say, deaf ears. What have they done but to stand in the way of any common sense? If you think we have a progressive city council, you have not ventured out of you bubble lately.

As far as retirement, it is not ever going to work. Anyone contemplating retirement is looking for good medical care as a priority. No one will live here without it. It is essential. No one here trusts the medical community here and travels as far as they can for treatment. I plan to retire elsewhere and I am from here!

I am sorry, I have to go back to the real estate thing again. I just can't see where you are coming from. I know of several people wanting to sell but cannot because they cannot afford to take the loss.
LAWGRL: I don't know who you are but wish I did. I would love to help anyone with a no-nonsense, common sense approach to our problems. It would be so refreshing. The Shoals area has so much going for it. It is gorgeous! We have water, trees, land. We have a lot of stupid people, but maybe they could be overheard for a while. No one will get anything done without a LOT of support. I think there are a number of people here that would love to support you if you are willing. I have never been affraid of hard work and that is what it would take. Our resources are not being used.
After reading the account of DixieGatlinSoCal (what a handle), it occurred to me that maybe what we really need to do , as voters, is elect people who are NOT from here. Think about it, a lot of polititions run on the premis that "I was born here, grew up here, left to go to school, then came back here"
They have lived here all their lives and have not been exposed to other cities or places.
No wonder we get "well, its always been done this way" mentality.
Next election, lets get some new blood, not just a different set of local yocals, but NEW blood. People who have lived elsewhere.
LawGirl, sounds like I would support you. At least you have lived in Huntsville .
Any others out there who would be interested in running for office that have lived in other more progressive places?

BTW, Lawgirl, don't forget to tell us what the guy said about what kind of place he wanted.

DixieGat, what you told us is truly sad, sad sad. Sounds like y'all actually came out in good shape, but the sad part is look what we lost here.
You know, this is exactly the problem. After reading Dixie's story, it is sad to think that the Shoals area lost such young, resourceful, talented entrepreneurs. And sadly, hers is not the only story.....

The main point of this is not a battle between "young and old", "rich or poor", but the fact that there is nothing, nothing, nothing to keep people like Dixie and her husband in the area. The status quo is not working anymore, and if there are more and more Dixie's out there, the Shoals area will become a retirement ghost town. You can all just sit on your porch swings and watch the young, talented ones move off to cities that actually give a **** about their future, and the future of their citizens.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if there aren't any jobs the Shoals will not become a retirment community. It will become a welfare state and a ghetto. As stated by other posters in other threads, many people in the Shoals cannot afford to move elsewhere. There are others who are very strongly tied to the area by family commitments. If those people have no job prospects then they will have no choice but to jump on the welfare wagon. Is that what the area leaders want? It is already happening people. Have you driven around the neighborhoods off of Huntsville Road, Wood Ave, and Pine Street? Sure there are pockets of nice homes, but there are a lot more Section 8 rentals and a lot more shady areas (and I don't mean large trees) then there was just 5 years ago. The area is in a dangerous downward spiral and quite frankly - the more I read this thread and think about it, the less I miss the Shoals.
I know what TSC is saying, and it is absolutly true in a lot of neighborhoods.
what I can't figger out is, here in Muscle Shoals, they are building new nice houses. probably in the $200,000 range. Just go behind the school, back on Houston Plantation, and down 6th street across from the country club.
Where in the world is the money coming from to buy these houses? What's going on?
I do believe the rich are getting richer, and the poor are getting poorer.
quote:
Originally posted by excelman:
I know what TSC is saying, and it is absolutly true in a lot of neighborhoods.
what I can't figger out is, here in Muscle Shoals, they are building new nice houses. probably in the $200,000 range. Just go behind the school, back on Houston Plantation, and down 6th street across from the country club.
Where in the world is the money coming from to buy these houses? What's going on?
I do believe the rich are getting richer, and the poor are getting poorer.


A lot of those houses are owned by people who drive to Huntsville/Decatur every day to work.

It amazes me as well. I see people everyday who say they cannot afford basic medical care, but they can afford to drive a Denali and live in the exclusive section of town. Priorities all messed up.
Sorry for not posting yesterday. Crazy day. The Manhattan investor has a great vision for downtown (crazy huh; he's been here only once and has more vision than our local leaders). He had heavily research the Shoals (he sees the area as a whole -- go figure) before coming down, and I am embarrassed to admit he knew more about the history of the Shoals than I do. To put it in his words, we have an absolute goldmine here with so many natural resources that are going to waste. He wants to put a business plan together and take it to an investment group in NY.

He envisions downtown Florence being a quaint, yet prosperous Southern tourist attraction where the locals hangout and where tourists will want to come and spend tons of money. Great little cafes, pubs, spas, bookstores (he was stunned that Books a Million was born here yet Anderson's closed on Court Street), ice cream shops (he loved Trowbridges), barber shops, etc.

He also recognizes that we need industry here to support the locals. He is a corporate laywer and deals with big businesses everyday. Granted, we don't have an interstate system coming through the Shoals; but we do have a federal waterway. We have the resources to support big business now, and the interstate can come later. God knows we have a great workforce here. It's sad when my 50-something uncle who put in 30 years at Delphi can't even find a decent job now. If my dad, who has been with the same plant since he was 19, lost his job, it would be virtually impossible for him to find anything where he could make more than $8/hour. It makes me nauseuous to think about it.

We talked about the overall sad attitude of the "older" generation. We are, after all, the buckle of the Bible belt. And please don't misunderstand me. I am a Christian and have a very strong faith in God. However, I also like to socialize, listen to great music, and have a good drink. I, unlike the older generation, believe that my faith is not compromised by an occasional Sapphire and tonic.

Anyway, he is definitely in the brainstorming phase, but I assured him that there are PLENTY of smart, progressive people here who would vocally and actively support positive growth and change. We are going to communicate regularly, and I pray that others will share his vision. He is so eager and optimistic about what this area could be. Why does it take someone from up north to take action? It doesn't. We can start the change right now.

Let's start brainstorming. What would you like to see, specifically, happen?
quote:
Originally posted by excelman:
I know what TSC is saying, and it is absolutly true in a lot of neighborhoods.
what I can't figger out is, here in Muscle Shoals, they are building new nice houses. probably in the $200,000 range. Just go behind the school, back on Houston Plantation, and down 6th street across from the country club.
Where in the world is the money coming from to buy these houses? What's going on?
I do believe the rich are getting richer, and the poor are getting poorer.


I know some of those people. Some are doctors, some are business owners, some are engineers who love living here (schools) but commute to work elsewhere; some have a joint income and a 40-year mortgage who are living above their means. I choose to live in an affordable garden home and put money into my business in the hopes that I can one day afford to live on the water. I was raised by parents who didn't believe in buying anything other than a house that they couldn't pay for with cash. I use credit cards, but I don't want to make them a lifestyle.
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Originally posted by johnhaeger:
The problem is NOT a State or Federal matter. The problems begin at the Local level. (Common Sense). And who do we look to when we think Local? The Mayor and the City Council. All fingers need to be pointed towards them. They are in charge of the community, not the state and federal officials.

Give me a break.....


I see. So our local city council has the power to entice the next Google Data Center or Lockheed Martin rocket plant? Where to they get their hundreds of millions of dollars in incentives?

THAT'S the kind of industry we need here but we will never get it until we put people in office who represent our needs. Bud Cramer, Jeff Sessions and Richard Shelby keep overlooking this forgotten corner of the state and we igints keep ptting them back in office.

As long as that doesn't change, this area will continue to experience snails-pace growth.

All our local councils can do is get this place ready for the 21st century by expiring antique blue laws, enacting progressive ordinances, developing the waterfront for commerce and generally putting out best foot forward. Beyond that, our local leaders are nearly impotent for attracting "real" growth to this area.
quote:
Originally posted by LAWGRL:
Anyway, he is definitely in the brainstorming phase, but I assured him that there are PLENTY of smart, progressive people here who would vocally and actively support positive growth and change.

Let's start brainstorming. What would you like to see, specifically, happen?


Count me in. I will write letters, visit councils, conduct grass-roots meetings and plant signs in my downtown businesses' windows to help this thing (assuming you are serious)

I suggest you start this topic in a new thread. It's too important for this forgotten corner of the forum.

For starters, though, I want a retail-friendly waterfront. The old folks council here wants a nice walking trail with a small amphetheater. That is nice but it won't do it. We need . . . Well, I have a really well-developed plan modeled on the "slave market" of Charleston, South Carolina.

Start a new thread and let's talk!
quote:
Originally posted by LAWGRL:
I choose to live in an affordable garden home and put money into my business in the hopes that I can one day afford to live on the water. I was raised by parents who didn't believe in buying anything other than a house that they couldn't pay for


You are a very smart person. I wish someone would have taught me that long ago. Good for you, girl.
quote:
Next election, lets get some new blood, not just a different set of local yocals, but NEW blood. People who have lived elsewhere.
LawGirl, sounds like I would support you. At least you have lived in Huntsville .


Actually it was Birmingham. Twice. But I do have some very good friends who have left here to live in Huntsville (among other places) and who would love to be able to afford to come back here.
quote:
Originally posted by GoFish:Count me in. I will write letters, visit councils, conduct grass-roots meetings and plant signs in my downtown businesses' windows to help this thing (assuming you are serious)

I suggest you start this topic in a new thread. It's too important for this forgotten corner of the forum.

For starters, though, I want a retail-friendly waterfront. The old folks council here wants a nice walking trail with a small amphetheater. That is nice but it won't do it. We need . . . Well, I have a really well-developed plan modeled on the "slave market" of Charleston, South Carolina.

Start a new thread and let's talk!


I am dead serious. I have made a commitment to this area by leaving a great firm in Birmingham to open a private practice here. If I am going to be a lifelong resident, I have to see some changes. Otherwise I will find myself wanting to get the heck out again in three years.

And I can't agree with you more about the waterfront. It is mind-boggling that I can't drive up to a waterfront establishment above the dam and buy a burger or a beer without locking through to Wheeler and making the long haul to Hard Dock in Decatur. I would love nothing more than to see a really great restaurant that's available by land or by lake. What a money maker!
"He envisions downtown Florence being a quaint, yet prosperous Southern tourist attraction where the locals hangout and where tourists will want to come and spend tons of money. Great little cafes, pubs, spas, bookstores (he was stunned that Books a Million was born here yet Anderson's closed on Court Street), ice cream shops (he loved Trowbridges), barber shops, etc."

LAWGRL,
That is exactly what I was trying to convey in an earlier post. Unfortunately, I did a very poor job. KS took this as trying to make downtown "pretty", which I never said. I have been to cities where their downtown is very similar to your description. They are booming!! As I said, it is so much fun to visit these cities. It would be so nice to be able to stay home and enjoy the benefits of the renovation of our downtown as well.

As someone mentioned, we need to take advantage of some of the students at UNA who might have some fresh and innovative ideas to offer. Getting them involved could be good for everyone.
quote:
Originally posted by pepelp:
As I said, it is so much fun to visit these cities. It would be so nice to be able to stay home and enjoy the benefits of the renovation of our downtown as well.

As someone mentioned, we need to take advantage of some of the students at UNA who might have some fresh and innovative ideas to offer. Getting them involved could be good for everyone.


Agreed! And we would need the support of UNA students also in the way of VOTES to get progressive people into office.
Since moving here many years ago, I have always thought that a combined effort by all in this area would have greater impact than the divided smaller communities. That fight has been fought and there are no takers. Unfortunate! It just makes sense to me, but common sense has never been a strong point here.
quote:
Originally posted by LAWGRL:
Sorry for not posting yesterday. Crazy day. The Manhattan investor has a great vision for downtown (crazy huh; he's been here only once and has more vision than our local leaders). He had heavily research the Shoals (he sees the area as a whole -- go figure) before coming down, and I am embarrassed to admit he knew more about the history of the Shoals than I do. To put it in his words, we have an absolute goldmine here with so many natural resources that are going to waste. He wants to put a business plan together and take it to an investment group in NY.

He envisions downtown Florence being a quaint, yet prosperous Southern tourist attraction where the locals hangout and where tourists will want to come and spend tons of money. Great little cafes, pubs, spas, bookstores (he was stunned that Books a Million was born here yet Anderson's closed on Court Street), ice cream shops (he loved Trowbridges), barber shops, etc.

He also recognizes that we need industry here to support the locals. He is a corporate laywer and deals with big businesses everyday. Granted, we don't have an interstate system coming through the Shoals; but we do have a federal waterway. We have the resources to support big business now, and the interstate can come later. God knows we have a great workforce here. It's sad when my 50-something uncle who put in 30 years at Delphi can't even find a decent job now. If my dad, who has been with the same plant since he was 19, lost his job, it would be virtually impossible for him to find anything where he could make more than $8/hour. It makes me nauseuous to think about it.

We talked about the overall sad attitude of the "older" generation. We are, after all, the buckle of the Bible belt. And please don't misunderstand me. I am a Christian and have a very strong faith in God. However, I also like to socialize, listen to great music, and have a good drink. I, unlike the older generation, believe that my faith is not compromised by an occasional Sapphire and tonic.

Anyway, he is definitely in the brainstorming phase, but I assured him that there are PLENTY of smart, progressive people here who would vocally and actively support positive growth and change. We are going to communicate regularly, and I pray that others will share his vision. He is so eager and optimistic about what this area could be. Why does it take someone from up north to take action? It doesn't. We can start the change right now.

Let's start brainstorming. What would you like to see, specifically, happen?



This is absolutely GREAT news to hear... We've been needing someone to come in and stir the pot for a long time over there. If this investor is meeting with you, its obvious that your input and opinions matter to him. We NEED this. Please don't let this die. I want to help. Even though I'm young, I have this fire within me to make a difference. I seemed to have inherited my father's entrepreneurial spirit, and when I dream, I dream big.

Now, I think to make this discussion more effective, it needs to move from this forum to a more realistic setting where ideas can be discussed and excitement can be created for what we can achieve. It seems to me that this would be best achieved through a some sort of community meeting. If our elected officials are not going to lead the way for us, then we should be willing to step up and lead the way.

Thanks again for sharing this bit of news. I hope that this all will come to fruition. I'll be thinking of ideas to share with you all in the meantime.
Look, I left "The Shoals" as soon as humanly possible with a worthless degree from what was then known as "Harvard on the Hill" aka UNA (my freshman year it was still Florence State College, showing my age) I had to return there in 1995 due to my fathers death and only meant to stay until his estate was settled. Well 12 years later, after all the dead end low paying jobs, putting up with the rip off's by the city government of Florence and all that went with it, found a way to get out and move to Birmingham. The prettiest sight in my life was seeing "The Shoals" in my rear view mirror. People are CRAZY to stay there, although I am glad there is another "rumor" floating of a large railroad car manufacturing plant (I wonder if RSA has became the equivalent of Mercedes yet?) The MYTHS that the cost of living in "the Shoals" are JUST THAT! Designed by the few families that own the major employers and designed to keep the citizens like the mushrooms they are, landed in **** and in the dark. No, sorry, when I go to Five Points and can have a nice meal or DRINK and enjoy all the opportunities of the city, I don't miss things like "Big Ed's" and all those chain restaurants and the small town cronism that IS THE SHOALS! MOON DOGGIE
quote:
Originally posted by Moon Over Homewood:
I don't miss things like "Big Ed's" and all those chain restaurants and the small town cronism that IS THE SHOALS! MOON DOGGIE


See ya. Dang sure wouldn't wanna be ya.

I'm glad you don't live here. The Shoals is a wonderful place to raise a family and the less people like you here, the better.
quote:
Originally posted by pepelp:
"He envisions downtown Florence being a quaint, yet prosperous Southern tourist attraction where the locals hangout and where tourists will want to come and spend tons of money. Great little cafes, pubs, spas, bookstores (he was stunned that Books a Million was born here yet Anderson's closed on Court Street), ice cream shops (he loved Trowbridges), barber shops, etc."

LAWGRL,
That is exactly what I was trying to convey in an earlier post. Unfortunately, I did a very poor job. KS took this as trying to make downtown "pretty", which I never said. I have been to cities where their downtown is very similar to your description. They are booming!! As I said, it is so much fun to visit these cities. It would be so nice to be able to stay home and enjoy the benefits of the renovation of our downtown as well.

As someone mentioned, we need to take advantage of some of the students at UNA who might have some fresh and innovative ideas to offer. Getting them involved could be good for everyone.


Sorry, pepelp, I was basically trying to point out that downtown Florence IS a very pretty downtown area... I didn't mean to infer anything that you didn't WANT inferred.
quote:
Originally posted by Moon Over Homewood:
Look, I left "The Shoals" as soon as humanly possible with a worthless degree from what was then known as "Harvard on the Hill" aka UNA (my freshman year it was still Florence State College, showing my age) I had to return there in 1995 due to my fathers death and only meant to stay until his estate was settled. Well 12 years later, after all the dead end low paying jobs, putting up with the rip off's by the city government of Florence and all that went with it, found a way to get out and move to Birmingham. The prettiest sight in my life was seeing "The Shoals" in my rear view mirror. People are CRAZY to stay there, although I am glad there is another "rumor" floating of a large railroad car manufacturing plant (I wonder if RSA has became the equivalent of Mercedes yet?) The MYTHS that the cost of living in "the Shoals" are JUST THAT! Designed by the few families that own the major employers and designed to keep the citizens like the mushrooms they are, landed in **** and in the dark. No, sorry, when I go to Five Points and can have a nice meal or DRINK and enjoy all the opportunities of the city, I don't miss things like "Big Ed's" and all those chain restaurants and the small town cronism that IS THE SHOALS! MOON DOGGIE



Dog, you just said a mouthful!!! I think that your comment here should be made into a LETTER TO THE EDITOR so that all the city governments can SEE what they are creating...

Great reply!!!! It may step on some toes, but it could make a world of difference if the right sets of "eyes" see it, ya know?
quote:
Originally posted by GoFish:
quote:
Originally posted by Moon Over Homewood:
I don't miss things like "Big Ed's" and all those chain restaurants and the small town cronism that IS THE SHOALS! MOON DOGGIE


See ya. Dang sure wouldn't wanna be ya.

I'm glad you don't live here. The Shoals is a wonderful place to raise a family and the less people like you here, the better.



How sweet... Roll Eyes ..

That is also one less family to BUY things here, pay taxes here, and help OUR economy here... I wish he could have found a way to stay, myself... I hate to see anyone (almost, lol) leave!!!

Besides, Dog has the RIGHT to boast about uplifting himself... there is quite a few people on this forum who does not live in this area, and you don't talk to them like that... I don't understand the mindset...

EVERY family we can get here who is productive, we NEED.
Thats a no brainer. The shoals is infested with low wage temp jobs that constantly shift workers. snobish self righteous southern baptist mega churches and a gossip ridden mentality that makes me puke . if it wasnt for moving to birmingham where the cost of living is higher but soooo worth it id leave alabama for good . truth is the shoals has to grow up and let those who have money (yes Im talking to you whitsells ,****burns, andersons and other greedy pigs). the librarys are lacking the schools are second rate and to have a bachelors degree means you still make 8 dollars a hour.. Good ridance to the shoals
Oh, yeah, the loveliness that is Birmingham. The smog, the haze, the nastiness. Ensley, 5 Points West, 1st Avenue North, the gunshots that ring out in the night, crackheads on the corners, crack dealers in the church parking lots, how many homicides since January (I think we're at 59 now, which is actually down some since last year), and how many shootings? The traffic is just a wonder, too. Locking every door you can find to lock. Being AFRAID to go to Walmart after 11pm. $80,000 houses going for $250,000. Neighbors in your lap. Hookers at every gas station on Arkadelphia road. And panhandlers. Having to practically give blood to cash a check at your own bank.

Big city living is a wonder.
I for one do NOT want the Shoals to become a "big city", per se. What I do want is for us to utilizes the resources we have, and to bring a few large employers to the area. I think it may be easier to think of cities we have visited that we loved most everything about, and then work towards bringing some of those ideas that work elsewhere here.
vick13
Hall of Famer
Posted 16 July 2007 02:04 PM Hide Post
Oh, yeah, the loveliness that is Birmingham. The smog, the haze, the nastiness. Ensley, 5 Points West, 1st Avenue North, the gunshots that ring out in the night, crackheads on the corners, crack dealers in the church parking lots, how many homicides since January (I think we're at 59 now, which is actually down some since last year), and how many shootings? The traffic is just a wonder, too. Locking every door you can find to lock. Being AFRAID to go to Walmart after 11pm. $80,000 houses going for $250,000. Neighbors in your lap. Hookers at every gas station on Arkadelphia road. And panhandlers. Having to practically give blood to cash a check at your own bank.

Big city living is a wonder.
Posts: 1757 | Registered: 16 May 2007

As Randy Newman sang in the song: "Birmingham, Birmingham, Greatest City in Alabam, you can travel cross this entire land, there ain't no place like Birmingham." I am sorry you hate "the Magic City" , Vick. Personally, after 12 grueling years in "The Shoals" trying to make ends meet on $8.00 an hour jobs, the non-sense that is public policy (no bars) I can put up with traffic (people from the Shoals would get killed on 280 if they drove here anyway) and I don't go to Arkadelphia Road or to Walmart after 11 p.m. (As a matter of fact, on principle, I don't shop at Walmart period) As for housing prices, check out the way they have jumped in the Shoals, and compare it to the prices in say Vestavia. Overall, houses may be a little higher but as I have stated in a previous post, this is your biggest investment and in the Shoals you are actually LOSEING money when you sell to relocate. As for rental prices, the Shoals complexes are run down and shabby, yet only a little lower than what you can get on the Southside or Homewood. No sorry Vick, I feel like I got paroled from prison when I left the "Shoals" and LOVE Birmingham, warts and all (chill out, go to the Southside and have a drink!) Moondoggie
quote:
Originally posted by unclegus:
Maddog, it is apparent you don't miss this wonderful place called the Shoals. I think you are posting on the wrong thread, maybe you should start a new thread labeled I don't miss the Shoals.
We do enjoy a good quality of life here I think you are unable to get in Birmingham.


unclegus, I'm interested in hearing what you describe as the "quality of life" in the Shoals. And, I'm not asking you to compare to big cities such as Birmingham, Nashville, etc, and tell me that you love the "small town atmosphere, no traffic, etc.", but what it is EXACTLY that keeps you in the Shoals area. Because I for one, did not have a "quality of life" in the Shoals (after being born and raised there and from many generations of Shoals residents) while making only $6.00 - $8.00 an hour with a college degree.....interested in hearing that....
If you have been here and didn't see it, I doubt you would ever understand what qualities of life I'm talking about.
I live way out in the county, but work in the city every day. It is such a relief to drive home each day and get out of the race of the city. Once I get home, I can relax how I chose without having to think about money or the things I don't have, I have nature at my back door, as well as the front. I am at peace here, it would take a whole lot of resources to achieve what I have here any other place on the planet.
Everyone has their own standard to what is quality of life is, this is mine.

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