I'm back. Did you miss me?

Whole-heartedly.

quote:

Originally posted by themax:
However, while I think Bill has at times, has thought a bit to highly of himself, really like all the time. I think he believes, in his own mind, what he preaches to us about.

Hi Max,

Unfortunately, Bill Gray continually falls far short of God's desires for me -- and even of my own goals. However, I do thank God that He overlooks all my shortcomings and still has given me a writing ministry. And, I pray that, through His guidance, my writings may reach even one soul for Christ.

Do I believe all that I write? Yes. Why? Because it is based upon the Written Word of God, the Bible -- and I KNOW the Bible to be Holy Spirit inspired, Holy Spirit inerrant, and God's "literal" message to bring salvation through Jesus Christ to all who will, by grace, through faith -- believe and receive it.

And, I KNOW that the Bible is God's only and full revelation to mankind for salvation and to guide our daily Christian walk.

Bill Gray is very fallible -- but, God and His Bible are not.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

Jank's superficial charm is merely a prelude to her deeper, more profound charm.

She's charming in every way. Not least among them in her intellect. I stand impressed.

nsns

quote:

Originally posted by semiannualchick:

quote:

Originally posted by themax:
I think he believes, in his own mind, what he preaches to us about.

That's what's so sad...he believes it.

I'm not so sure, my dear.

Only a madman could truly believe the lies Gray spouts.

6000 year old Earth comes to mind.

No normally intelligent American can believe this. They might pretend to believe it, but in their hearts of hearts, they have serious doubts.

They pretend to believe this nonsense because they have religious obligations to preachers who insist on this hypocrisy. Even the preachers don't believe it, but sell it because it creates identity within the flock.

It's sort of like those who think the Moon landing was faked in a Hollywood studio. It gives them identity. A club to which they belong. And they don't have the capacity to understand that the preacher is only after their money for belonging.

We've entered a New Day. More and more of us are laughing at the preachers of lies. Fewer and fewer of us are tithing, thank god.

Revel in the New Day. It's the logical and inevitable conclusion of the Enlightenment. We're seeing it now. Historians will speak of us!

It's a glorious day to be alive.


nsns

quote:

They pretend to believe this nonsense because they have religious obligations to preachers who insist on this hypocrisy. Even the preachers don't believe it, but sell it because it creates identity within the flock.

Hmmm....
Do you believe that any faithful person is just pretending to believe?
Do you believe that anyone can have Faith in God, without requiring scientific evidence?
I'm curious- you think it's all a scam, right?
Fair enough. But how can you know that people do not REALLY believe?
Cheers...

quote:

Originally posted by Not Shallow Not Slim:
We've entered a New Day. More and more of us are laughing at the preachers of lies. Fewer and fewer of us are tithing, thank god.

HEY, DEEP, HAPPY TO SEE YOU ARE BEGINNING TO PRAY - THANKSGIVING IS ALWAYS THE FIRST PRAYER - EXCITED TO SEE YOUR FUTURE PROGRESS!

quote:

And, I KNOW that the Bible is God's only and full revelation to mankind for salvation and to guide our daily Christian walk.

quote:

and I KNOW the Bible to be Holy Spirit inspired, Holy Spirit inerrant, and God's "literal" message

You better hope not Billy G. That adultery thing will get you toasted as surely as the atheists.

Exodus 20:14 "You shall not commit adultery."

Deuteronomy 22:22 "If a man is found sleeping with another man's wife, both the man who slept with her and the woman must die."

Leviticus 20:10 "If a man commits adultery with another man's wife--with the wife of his neighbor--both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death."

Proverbs 6:32 "But a man who commits adultery lacks judgment; whoever does so destroys himself."

Billy, you destroyed yourself long ago according to your own admission. I'm as sorry for you as I am for the atheists who have also committed the unforgivable sin of denying God. So it is written . . .

quote:

Fair enough. But how can you know that people do not REALLY believe?

I can't answer for most, of course, but the fact that people like Bill Gray and GB actually lie through teeth when feebly attempting to religiously justify their inconsistencies leads me to one of two conclusions:

They are lying and know it.

They are lying to themselves but have not admitted it.

My faith is one of truth and honesty and reason and open to scrutiny. Inconsistencies are signs that closely held beliefs may not actually be as truthful as we may wish them to be.

Theologian James Luther Adams said, "An unexamined faith is not worth having, for it can be true only by accident. A faith worth having is a faith worth discussing and testing."

[quoteSOFER]My faith is one of truth and honesty and reason and open to scrutiny. Inconsistencies are signs that closely held beliefs may not actually be as truthful as we may wish them to be.[/quote]


Sofa, I’m curious as hell; what is your religion.

Why have you suddenly jumped in here on GBRK?

quote:

Originally posted by Sofa King:

quote:

Fair enough. But how can you know that people do not REALLY believe?

I can't answer for most, of course, but the fact that people like Bill Gray and GB actually lie through teeth when feebly attempting to religiously justify their inconsistencies leads me to one of two conclusions:

They are lying and know it.

They are lying to themselves but have not admitted it.

My faith is one of truth and honesty and reason and open to scrutiny. Inconsistencies are signs that closely held beliefs may not actually be as truthful as we may wish them to be.

Theologian James Luther Adams said, "An unexamined faith is not worth having, for it can be true only by accident. A faith worth having is a faith worth discussing and testing."

Hi Sofa,

What faith? You do not even attend church or in any other way acknowledge God. And, you attack everyone who does try to share the Gospel.

You say we are lying. No, we are only sharing the Word of God from the Bible. Yet, there is no way for you to know if we are telling the truth or not -- for, if you ever had a Bible -- it is probably buried somewhere in your garage or closet.

You always scream, "It's a lie!" whenever any of us share the Word of God. Don't tell us we are wrong if you cannot show us honest Biblical proof. And, no, copy/pasting from a Richard Dawkins book is not showing proof of anything except Dawkins' own poor knowledge of God's Word.

So, before you accuse -- stop screaming like a school yard girl -- and let's talk turkey; but, in a civil manner. If you are going to continue to bray and scream; there is no way to have a civil discussion. Care to give it a try?

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

Bill,

To be honest , I thought he was a deacon by the way he was testifying.lol

quote:

Originally posted by Sofa King:

quote:

Fair enough. But how can you know that people do not REALLY believe?

I can't answer for most, of course, but the fact that people like Bill Gray and GB actually lie through teeth when feebly attempting to religiously justify their inconsistencies leads me to one of two conclusions:

They are lying and know it.

They are lying to themselves but have not admitted it.

My faith is one of truth and honesty and reason and open to scrutiny. Inconsistencies are signs that closely held beliefs may not actually be as truthful as we may wish them to be.

Theologian James Luther Adams said, "An unexamined faith is not worth having, for it can be true only by accident. A faith worth having is a faith worth discussing and testing."

What if the discussions and tests lead to the conclusion that faith is contrary to reality? What if they lead to the conclusion that faith is dishonest, or a juvenile excuse for not having the courage to admit that there are things we just don't know yet?

nsns

Bill, try not to be so hard on people you don't know. It seems that when someone calls you on something, you automatically ask them if they have a Bible and if they do is it covered in dust.

Some of the folks here, I am sure have several Bibles in their homes. And, just guessing here, but they read them.

So when someone jumps on you for whatever, don't all of a sudden call them someone that don't own a Bible or if they do it has never been opened.
Just don't be so hasty to judge.

quote:

What if the discussions and tests lead to the conclusion that faith is contrary to reality? What if they lead to the conclusion that faith is dishonest, or a juvenile excuse for not having the courage to admit that there are things we just don't know yet?

Ah, but NSNS, this is the beauty of Faith- there is a LOT I don't know. Much of it is a mystery.
In fact, faith itself is a mystery.
I am content to live my life not having the answers to everything. I don't need to understand the how/when/why of every facet of the universe to accept that God had a Hand in Creation, and is quite real.
Just my 2cents.

Max,

Compadre. Bud. Amigo.

Judge Bill exists to foist his narrow and erroneous dogma onto others.

He believes that the Earth is 6000 years old, and that a Great Flood happened about 4800 years ago. He's a nut.

I've seen him here for almost four years. He's beyond compassion, reason, evidence, friendship, and any other influence that might endear him to the intelligent, moral, and affectionate community of greater mankind. He likes it that way.

You and I can disagree, but I won't send you to Hell. I can't. Neither can Gray, but he doesn't see it that way.

nsns

quote:

Originally posted by Not Shallow Not Slim:
Jank's superficial charm is merely a prelude to her deeper, more profound charm.

She's charming in every way. Not least among them in her intellect. I stand impressed.

nsns

NSNS,

You were not supposed to talk about my deeper charms here in a public forum.

You should be careful. I have been told that I am a hot ended woman.

quote:

Originally posted by vplee123:

quote:

What if the discussions and tests lead to the conclusion that faith is contrary to reality? What if they lead to the conclusion that faith is dishonest, or a juvenile excuse for not having the courage to admit that there are things we just don't know yet?

Ah, but NSNS, this is the beauty of Faith- there is a LOT I don't know. Much of it is a mystery.
In fact, faith itself is a mystery.
I am content to live my life not having the answers to everything. I don't need to understand the how/when/why of every facet of the universe to accept that God had a Hand in Creation, and is quite real.
Just my 2cents.

And this is why I love VP! None of us know the how/when/why of every facet of the universe. You recognize that what you have is faith and it is a personal thing. To each his own, should be your motto.

Thanks for being you.

aww..thanks, Jank.
Right back at ya!

I saw someone on another thread say something like "Faith is a crutch for the weak minded".

Maybe so. But I am the first to admit that I am broken, and need all the "crutches" I can get.

My motto is "What ever gets ya through the day..."

quote:

You should be careful. I have been told that I am a hot ended woman.

LMAO!
How come you get to be hot ended, and I am merely "contentious"??!?!? lol.

Jank,

Being hot ended is not a character flaw.

One simply must be aware that the trait is sometimes so obvious to the outside observer that it can cause unrealistic assumptions on their part.

With that caution in mind being hot ended and used as a tool can result in productive and healthy relationships .

Sometimes the trait is viewed by other females as a threat when not understood.

Being the most used property in advertisement; no wonder why we buy so much.

The world is not in any immediate danger. Yet.

quote:

Max,

Compadre. Bud. Amigo.

Judge Bill exists to foist his narrow and erroneous dogma onto others.

He believes that the Earth is 6000 years old, and that a Great Flood happened about 4800 years ago. He's a nut.

I've seen him here for almost four years. He's beyond compassion, reason, evidence, friendship, and any other influence that might endear him to the intelligent, moral, and affectionate community of greater mankind. He likes it that way.

You and I can disagree, but I won't send you to Hell. I can't. Neither can Gray, but he doesn't see it that way.

nsns

Yea, I know deep, and I know that no matter when anyone proves Billy wrong, he'll never admit it.

I recall years ago you and I went at it tooth and nail at times, but I don't recall any name calling or cartoons.

quote:

Originally posted by themax:
Yea, I know deep, and I know that no matter when anyone proves Billy wrong, he'll never admit it.

I recall years ago you and I went at it tooth and nail at times, but I don't recall any name calling or cartoons.

Hi Max,

You may often prove Bill Gray wrong; I have done this myself. However, you have never proven the Bible wrong. And, that is where I try to always hang my hat.

You say you debated for years with Deep -- and never saw any insults and derogatory names? Then, you must have been on a different forum dialoguing with a different Deep. For the Deep we have grown to love, cherish, and disagree consistently with on the TimesDaily Religion Forum -- lived only to parrot the insults of his gods, Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens.

From Deep, his connected at the hip buddy, Fish, and a few others -- we have consistently heard "stupid" - "ignorant" - various versions of the "F" word and "S" word weakly disguised -- and any other denigrating words Dawkins and Hitchens could think of to write in their "money making" books.

I will agree that Deep, et al, could not come up with all of these on their own -- but, they have been good parrots for years.

So, Max, I seriously wonder which forum and which other Deep you have been reading all these years.

And, I also have to wonder about a Christian believer who would rather hold hands with an avowed atheist -- than support a Christian brother or sister in attempts to share His Gospel.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

quote:

And, I also have to wonder about a Christian believer who would rather hold hands with an avowed atheist -- than support a Christian brother or sister in attempts to share His Gospel.

I'd gladly hold the hand of an atheist and stand up with them against the likes of your hateful, despicable, outright dishonest attempts at winning souls.

me too!

Back in those days I stayed mostly in the news. as a matter of fact, we may not even had a religion section.

quote:

I recall years ago you and I went at it tooth and nail at times, but I don't recall any name calling or cartoons.

LMAO!

Darn. I wish I had thought of cartoons then.

JK!

Good to see you again, bud. No doubt we'll spar again, but I'm sure we are mature adults who can disagree academically. Unlike some here.


nsns

quote:

Originally posted by Sofa King:

quote:

And, I also have to wonder about a Christian believer who would rather hold hands with an avowed atheist -- than support a Christian brother or sister in attempts to share His Gospel.

I'd gladly hold the hand of an atheist and stand up with them against the likes of your hateful, despicable, outright dishonest attempts at winning souls.

SO, WHAT'S NEW? - YOU HAVE BEEN DOING THIS FOR A LONG TIME ALREADY - "PEAS IS A POD?"