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McCain targeted for opposing vets college aid bill.

J JJPAULOld Faithful
McCain targeted for opposing vets college aid bill. Republicans hate the GI Bill.


By Jim Kuhnhenn | Associated Press | View story in the original context
http://www.dailypress.com/news/local/virginia/dp-mccain...ay19,0,2289443.story
PUBLISHED: May 20, 2008
Hampton,Va.(HFR:WASHINGTON) - Democrats and their allies are ready to convert Sen. John McCain's stance on college aid for military veterans into a presidential campaign cause.

McCain, the all-but-nominated Republican presidential candidate, opposes a Democratic-backed bill that would significantly expand the breadth of education benefits for veterans, first adopted for those returning from World War II. Democrats want the proposal included in a war spending bill the Senate is scheduled to vote on this week.

Sen. Barack Obama, McCain's most likely general election opponent, already has raised objections to McCain's resistance. And on Tuesday, a veterans' group that has been critical of the war in Iraq is launching an ad in Washington to pressure McCain to change his mind.

By taking issue with McCain on the subject of veterans, Democrats hope to weaken one of his biggest assets--his personal biography as a former Navy pilot who became a prisoner of the North Vietnamese and endured torture at the hands of his captors.

The legislation, sponsored by Democratic Sen. Jim Webb of Virginia and Republican Sen. Chuck Hagel of Nebraska, also veterans of Vietnam, would guarantee full tuition payments to veterans at any public school in their home state. Its expected cost is $52 billion over 10 years.

McCain says the legislation is too expensive and has proposed his own version, which would increase the monthly benefit available to most veterans to $1,500 from $1,100. It would not offer the equivalent of a full scholarship.

The ad by VoteVets.org Action Fund, features Iraq and Afghanistan veterans noting that both McCain and President Bush oppose the bill.

"McCain thinks covering a fraction of our education is enough," one veteran says. Another one, pictured recovering from head wounds, adds in a voiceover: "We didn't give a fraction in Iraq. We gave 100 percent."

"Senator McCain" an announcer concludes, "we respect your service. Please respect ours."

The ad is running Tuesday and Wednesday on broadcast and cable television stations in Washington, primarily during news broadcasts. VoteVets is running a similar ad targeting Sen. John Cornyn, R-Texas, in San Antonio and Waco--two Texas markets with military bases.

Other veteran's groups--from Veterans of Foreign Wars to the American Legion--support the Democratic bill. But VoteVets, which has been aggressive in its criticism of Bush's war policies, is the first to take McCain on directly.

"He's trying to run interference for the White House with a watered down bill," said Jon Soltz, an Iraq war veteran and chairman of VoteVets.org. "How could this not be an issue in the presidential campaign if he doesn't vote for this bill? There is no way for this to go away if he votes against it."

VoteVets is a nonprofit corporation and part of a Democratic-leaning coalition of war critics that has vowed to spend millions linking McCain to Bush's war policies. Earlier this year, VoteVets ran an ad on Washington cable stations urging McCain to abandon his commitment to Iraq.

The Pentagon opposes the Webb-Hagel bill, saying the benefit could hurt retention by encouraging members of the military to leave after serving only three years.

Obama, campaigning in West Virginia last week, said the bill is necessary to make veteran's benefits match the rising costs of tuition.

"I have great respect for John McCain's service to this country and I know he loves it dearly and honors those who serve," Obama said. "But he is one of the few senators of either party who oppose this bill because he thinks it's too generous. I couldn't disagree more."
http://www.votevets.org/news?id=0139
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NashBamaNashBamaOld Faithful
Read an actual news source. That's a load of crap.

McCain's GI bill 'political games'
ASSOCIATED PRESS

http://washingtontimes.com/article/20080515/NATION/203783919/1001

Senate Democrats blocked a bill by Sen. John McCain that would have increased college aid for military veterans because they said it didn't go far enough and would serve only as political cover for the Republican presidential candidate.



Republicans offered Mr. McCain's bill as an amendment to legislation that would give police officers, firefighters and other first responders the right to unionize. The Senate voted 55-42 to kill the amendment.
J JJPAULOld Faithful
NashBama, This is from your own article.
"This vote is a message to Bush-McCain Republicans that the U.S. Senate will not stand for political games at the expense of our nation's first responders and veterans," said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada.


http://washingtontimes.com/article/20080515/NATION/203783919/1001
Mr. McCain proposed his GI bill after Democrats pitched a more ambitious plan that would essentially guarantee a full scholarship to any public, in-state university after serving in the military for three years. Democrats are pushing their proposal, introduced by Sen. Jim Webb of Virginia as part of this year's war-spending bill.



The Pentagon opposes Mr. Webb's bill because it says in part that providing such a large benefit after only three years of service would hurt retention.



Accordingly, Republican Sens. McCain, Lindsey Graham of South Carolina and Richard M. Burr of North Carolina drafted an alternative that would increase to $1,500 from $1,100 the monthly benefit available to most veterans. The stipend would increase to $2,000 a month after 12 years of service.
M MonkeysUncleByMarriage
Actually, if you want a reputable source concerning this and the outcry for McCain to sponsor this bill, look no further than that radical left wing propagandist tool (<~sarcasm: Need to clarify for Skymaster, Gracie and "TOTALTRUTH") VoteVets.org.

McCains bill was crap compared to Webb's. He is just posturing, wanting to get some bill through with his name on it. Even the Vets support Webb's (whose son is currenly in the military).
Last edited by MonkeysUncleByMarriage
cwilly65cwilly65Familiar Face
quote:
McCain says the legislation is too expensive and has proposed his own version, which would increase the monthly benefit available to most veterans to $1,500 from $1,100. It would not offer the equivalent of a full scholarship.


He is NOT trying to cut out their benefits, he just did not agree with the way that proposal was written. He proposed his own version which WOULD INCREASE THE VETERANS MONTHLY BENEFIT BY $400.00 !!!
Southern PatriotSouthern PatriotHall of Famer
quote:
Originally posted by MonkeysUncleByMarriage:
Cwilly don't be fooled. Even Votevets.org wants Webbs bill and has no desire for McCains. McCains needs to quit his ego tripping and sign Senator Webb's Bill.


Of course they want the dim bill genius, it gives folks a free ride after 3 years of service. I've been in the military for 19 years and even I believe it goes to far for only 3 years service. McCains bill make more sense and it is still an almost 50% increase over what the Soldier is getting now.
cwilly65cwilly65Familiar Face
quote:
Originally posted by Southern Patriot:
quote:
Originally posted by MonkeysUncleByMarriage:
Cwilly don't be fooled. Even Votevets.org wants Webbs bill and has no desire for McCains. McCains needs to quit his ego tripping and sign Senator Webb's Bill.


Of course they want the dim bill genius, it gives folks a free ride after 3 years of service. I've been in the military for 19 years and even I believe it goes to far for only 3 years service. McCains bill make more sense and it is still an almost 50% increase over what the Soldier is getting now.


I agree, 3 years doesn't seem like enough to get the kind of benefits they want.

How long do you currently have to enlist in the National Guard to get benefits such as college tuition, etc??
M MonkeysUncleByMarriage
quote:
Originally posted by Southern Patriot:
quote:
Originally posted by MonkeysUncleByMarriage:
Cwilly don't be fooled. Even Votevets.org wants Webbs bill and has no desire for McCains. McCains needs to quit his ego tripping and sign Senator Webb's Bill.


Of course they want the dim bill genius, it gives folks a free ride after 3 years of service. I've been in the military for 19 years and even I believe it goes to far for only 3 years service. McCains bill make more sense and it is still an almost 50% increase over what the Soldier is getting now.


Ok Southern, understand you loud and clear. You obviously don't think 3 years of service should give them anything. So three years in Iraq shouldn't give them a free ride?

Southerm turn off your Republican blinders for one second if you can. Senator Webb's Bill has gotten overwhelming NON-PARTISAN support. It has also gotten the support of numerous Veterans Organizations, including the most powerful one VoteVets.org.

Senator Webb is a former military man himself who currently has a son serving in the military. You try to break it down to a "dim bill", when it has nothing to do with party lines.


So let's recap.

Those in favor of Webb's Bill:

A large group of non-partisan members of Congress

Veterans Organizations

Those in favor of McCain's bill:

John McCain
Southern Patriot
Cwilly
Southern PatriotSouthern PatriotHall of Famer
quote:
Originally posted by MonkeysUncleByMarriage:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern Patriot:
quote:
Originally posted by MonkeysUncleByMarriage:
Cwilly don't be fooled. Even Votevets.org wants Webbs bill and has no desire for McCains. McCains needs to quit his ego tripping and sign Senator Webb's Bill.


Of course they want the dim bill genius, it gives folks a free ride after 3 years of service. I've been in the military for 19 years and even I believe it goes to far for only 3 years service. McCains bill make more sense and it is still an almost 50% increase over what the Soldier is getting now.


Ok Southern, understand you loud and clear. You obviously don't think 3 years of service should give them anything. So three years in Iraq shouldn't give them a free ride?

Southerm turn off your Republican blinders for one second if you can. Senator Webb's Bill has gotten overwhelming NON-PARTISAN support. It has also gotten the support of numerous Veterans Organizations, including the most powerful one VoteVets.org.

Senator Webb is a former military man himself who currently has a son serving in the military. You try to break it down to a "dim bill", when it has nothing to do with party lines.


So let's recap.

Those in favor of Webb's Bill:

A large group of non-partisan members of Congress

Veterans Organizations

Those in favor of McCain's bill:

John McCain
Southern Patriot
Cwilly


Let's be clear here. You are a **** liar who will spin what anybody who doesn't agree with you says to sound like something totally different that supports your point of view. You spin "it is still an almost 50% increase over what the Soldier is getting now" to "You obviously don't think 3 years of service should give them anything". The Soldier currently gets 20+ k in G.I.Bill for putting in 1200$ of his or her own money. There are also many fields where you can go to school and get your B.A or better on Uncle Sams dime.

If you want to tell your own lies that's fine; but don't you come on this forum and take what I say and spin it to an outright lie. I already knew you were a low life... I just didn't realize how low.
cwilly65cwilly65Familiar Face
quote:
Originally posted by MonkeysUncleByMarriage:
quote:
Originally posted by Southern Patriot:
quote:
Originally posted by MonkeysUncleByMarriage:
Cwilly don't be fooled. Even Votevets.org wants Webbs bill and has no desire for McCains. McCains needs to quit his ego tripping and sign Senator Webb's Bill.


Of course they want the dim bill genius, it gives folks a free ride after 3 years of service. I've been in the military for 19 years and even I believe it goes to far for only 3 years service. McCains bill make more sense and it is still an almost 50% increase over what the Soldier is getting now.


Ok Southern, understand you loud and clear. You obviously don't think 3 years of service should give them anything. So three years in Iraq shouldn't give them a free ride?

Southerm turn off your Republican blinders for one second if you can. Senator Webb's Bill has gotten overwhelming NON-PARTISAN support. It has also gotten the support of numerous Veterans Organizations, including the most powerful one VoteVets.org.

Senator Webb is a former military man himself who currently has a son serving in the military. You try to break it down to a "dim bill", when it has nothing to do with party lines.


So let's recap.

Those in favor of Webb's Bill:

A large group of non-partisan members of Congress

Veterans Organizations

Those in favor of McCain's bill:

John McCain
Southern Patriot
Cwilly


Didn't say I supported the bill. I'm not familiar enough with either one to pick and choose. I just said that 3 years seems like an awfully short time to serve and then reap all the benefits of a career soldier.

You make way too many assumptions about what people are thinking And they're usually wrong.

I'll give you a tip: keep your day job and don't open up that psychic shop just yet.
M MonkeysUncleByMarriage
I think it's a pretty broad assumption to make the statement that "three years is too short of a time." There's no telling what these young men and women experience in three years in the military, especially under this administration and their faulty military campaigns.

And Patriot, I know you're slow so follow along. If the Bill has non-Partisan support and is lauded by the Veterans Organizations whose primary goal is to ensure fair treatment and benefits for Veterans, then I have to support it. Just another Republican who walks around saying he supports the troops, but falls short when it comes time to ante up.

Thanks for your input.
Southern PatriotSouthern PatriotHall of Famer
quote:
Originally posted by MonkeysUncleByMarriage:
I think it's a pretty broad assumption to make the statement that "three years is too short of a time." There's no telling what these young men and women experience in three years in the military, especially under this administration and their faulty military campaigns.

And Patriot, I know you're slow so follow along. If the Bill has non-Partisan support and is lauded by the Veterans Organizations whose primary goal is to ensure fair treatment and benefits for Veterans, then I have to support it. Just another Republican who walks around saying he supports the troops, but falls short when it comes time to ante up.

Thanks for your input.


You can talk about your "non-partisan" support all you want to.. That's not the point. You took something I said, twisted it into what you wnated me to say, and spit it back out. That is an outright lie. PERIOD. You are an idiot, a liar and an individual who can not be reasoned with.

And further more, don't you EVER attempt to even think about saying I don't "support the troops" you jack ass. I am one of the "Troop" you are talking about. I also work with many other "Troops" every day in my civilian job. Before you open your mouth you need to know your facts. But then again, I have yet to see you bother with "facts" in any of your post.

You sir, are a useless worm who brings nothing to the debate on this forumn. This will be the last post I waste responding to your BS.
M MonkeysUncleByMarriage
Sorry pal, you dont. I don't care what you are. I see through you. You bash the democratic party every chance you get, and you'll attempt to make it seem they don't support the troops, when in actuality they've done much more for the troops in the last 8 years than the Republicans have.

I am sorry you can't pull year head out of your ass enough to see that this is a great bill, with a lot of support. You're too blinded by your love of McCain to see what is beneficial here.

I appreciate your misguided Mullet Wing anger though. Noted.

And I know I haven't posted any facts. VoteVets.org supporting the Bill is not a fact. It is just something I made up. You got me dawg! You got me!
NashBamaNashBamaOld Faithful
quote:
And Patriot, I know you're slow so follow along. If the Bill has non-Partisan support and is lauded by the Veterans Organizations whose primary goal is to ensure fair treatment and benefits for Veterans, then I have to support it. Just another Republican who walks around saying he supports the troops, but falls short when it comes time to ante up.


Yep, you picked the right picture for your avatar. That's exactly where your head is.

What an incredibly dumb thing to say.
NashBamaNashBamaOld Faithful
quote:
I know Nash. You and patriot know much better what is good for the troops. Much more so than VoteVets.org, Senator Webb and the multitude of others who agree with the bill. I apologize for thinking in rational terms.


I've never served in the military, so I would never claim to know what's best for them.

Southern Patriot on the other hand has served. I think he knows what's best for him and his fellow veterans and soldiers than you, a crack pot web site, or blow hard politician.

Why do you think you know what's best for him and other soldiers? Because you read Jane Fonda's latest blog? Maybe you're on Michael Moores e-mail newsletter list?

Leftist think they have all the answers, they really have their heads up their butts. Like I said, perfect avitar for you.
M MonkeysUncleByMarriage
I don't claim to know what's best for them either. Which is why I trust the organization whose goal it is to know that. And also the Senator who served in the military and has a son serving now.

A crack pot website? You are joking right? VoteVets.org is a very reputable organization who never leans one way or the other. This is the typical Conservative bull. Something is great until it doesnt support your ideals completely.

VoteVets.org has often went against some of the politicians I agree with and/or like.

Just like your socialist b.s. You only like socialized programs that help you, and you only support the troops when it's convenient and a Republican is telling you to do so.
NashBamaNashBamaOld Faithful
quote:
Just like your socialist b.s. You only like socialized programs that help you, and you only support the troops when it's convenient and a Republican is telling you to do so.


Easy to say on a message board. You wouldn't say that to my face.

My dad is a vet, I have friends who have served in Iraq, my wife has family who has served in Iraq. I've supported them not because a politician told me to, but because they're doing their duty so I'll do mine and help them as best as I can.

There aren't any socialized programs helping me. The government giving money to help with school isn't socialism.

JJ, what branch did you serve in? Where were you stationed? How do I know you're not lying? For someone to post the crap you do, I find it hard to believe you're military.
Southern PatriotSouthern PatriotHall of Famer
quote:
Originally posted by geddon97:
I`m in the military and he speaks for me JJ.So I guess were even.Hey SP maybe were just a couple of cold blooded killers like Olberdouche said we were. Wink


Maybe.

I've never said that the military doesn't deserve everything we get and more. All I saying is we shouldn't do something that is obviously going to hurt retainment and will bust the budget just because it "feels good". I would be more for something along the lines of saying the gov't will pay for you to go to school, in your desired field, and once you finish school you will have a 6 year service commitment. If you flunk out of school you will have to immediately fulfill your 6 yeear obligation. That way you know you got your moneys worth from the school funding and you get a crop of well schooled Soldiers who will most likely be Officers because of their degree. Would be very similar to the current ROTC program, just expanded.

I'm all for doing good things for the Soldier, just think it out before you do it, no knee jerk reactions.

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