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I realize that all the liberals here probably don't care about this. But I would be nicer to Israel if I wanted their help in controlling Iran.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/t...s/article7076431.ece

From The Times
March 26, 2010
Binyamin Netanyahu humiliated after Barack Obama 'dumped him for dinner'


For a head of government to visit the White House and not pose for photographers is rare. For a key ally to be left to his own devices while the President withdraws to have dinner in private was, until this week, unheard of. Yet that is how Binyamin Netanyahu was treated by President Obama on Tuesday night, according to Israeli reports on a trip viewed in Jerusalem as a humiliation.

After failing to extract a written promise of concessions on settlements, Mr Obama walked out of his meeting with Mr Netanyahu but invited him to stay at the White House, consult with advisers and “let me know if there is anything new”, a US congressman, who spoke to the Prime Minister, said.

“It was awful,” the congressman said. One Israeli newspaper called the meeting “a hazing in stages”, poisoned by such mistrust that the Israeli delegation eventually left rather than risk being eavesdropped on a White House telephone line. Another said that the Prime Minister had received “the treatment reserved for the President of Equatorial Guinea”.
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If you are indebted to Arab sheiks and the Chinese treasury, you don't saddle up to those who are fighting for their survival from the very same. HildaBeast and Obama cannot be friendly with the Isrealis and continue to spend us into indebtedness. The Arabs and the Chinese might stop loaning us money and then the libs would not have any more to spend in their "redistribution of wealth" plan.
The Isrealis are screwed as long as this administration is in office, and they know it.
Bibi got what Joe Biden got from him before the ambassador or the Secretary of State. Major no-no in diplomatic circles. You do not surprise the second in command of an ally with a shocker.

It was not a state dinner. Had the President really wanted to dis him all he needed to have done is ask him if he were staying at the embassy or at the Mayfair. Now that is a dis.
I'm not sure how we could actually be much nicer to Israel. They're already by far the biggest recipient of US foreign aid at more than $2 billion a year, and our military aid is basically the entire reason they're able to defend themselves in a volatile region. They're our strongest ally in the region and always one of our main considerations when dealing with Middle East policy.

However, they're still a foreign country, and their interests are not always our own. Netanyahu and his government obviously want to continue to construct Jewish settlements in the West Bank and East Jerusalem. This has no benefit to US interests and a significant downside, because every new settlement is a provocation that enrages the Muslim world against Israel and by extension the US at a time when we have troops fighting in two Muslim countries. So the goal we'd like to see is a settlement freeze and a good faith attempt by Netanyahu's government to negotiate a two-state solution with Abbas and the Palestinian Authority. It's clear that just being super-nice to our Israeli ally isn't going to accomplish anything like that or even slow down the settlements, so if we want to them to cooperate for something that we want, we may have to do a little arm twisting.
quote:
Originally posted by TheMeInTeam:
I'm not sure how we could actually be much nicer to Israel. They're already by far the biggest recipient of US foreign aid at more than $2 billion a year, and our military aid is basically the entire reason they're able to defend themselves in a volatile region. They're our strongest ally in the region and always one of our main considerations when dealing with Middle East policy.

However, they're still a foreign country, and their interests are not always our own. Netanyahu and his government obviously want to continue to construct Jewish settlements in the West Bank and East Jerusalem. This has no benefit to US interests and a significant downside, because every new settlement is a provocation that enrages the Muslim world against Israel and by extension the US at a time when we have troops fighting in two Muslim countries. So the goal we'd like to see is a settlement freeze and a good faith attempt by Netanyahu's government to negotiate a two-state solution with Abbas and the Palestinian Authority. It's clear that just being super-nice to our Israeli ally isn't going to accomplish anything like that or even slow down the settlements, so if we want to them to cooperate for something that we want, we may have to do a little arm twisting.


Maybe if the people who live across the road from, and on both sides of you want to kill you, you might realize how Israel feels. Wouldn't THAT be funny? Roll Eyes
quote:
Originally posted by Caduceus:
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:

Roll Eyes Next.


Wow, what a well thought out and well rounded response. I am honestly dumbfounded by the level of logic and reasoning that you used to support your viewpoint. Oh... Wait...


Oh so you want me to embarrass you? Well, okay. A welfare bill that helps "our" people. Are you that stupid to think that bill helps ANYONE except the laziest people in this country? Are you brain-dead?
Now let's see....
The Israelis are building those settlements for their national security against people who want to wipe them from the face of the Earth. If your neighbor wanted to see you in hell more than anything else, wouldn't you do whatever you could to protect you and your family? I guess that's a bad question to ask of a limp-wristed lib.

There! Are you happy now? Big Grin
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:
quote:
Originally posted by Caduceus:
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:

Roll Eyes Next.


Wow, what a well thought out and well rounded response. I am honestly dumbfounded by the level of logic and reasoning that you used to support your viewpoint. Oh... Wait...


Oh so you want me to embarrass you? Well, okay. A welfare bill that helps "our" people. Are you that stupid to think that bill helps ANYONE except the laziest people in this country? Are you brain-dead?
Now let's see....
The Israelis are building those settlements for their national security against people who want to wipe them from the face of the Earth. If your neighbor wanted to see you in hell more than anything else, wouldn't you do whatever you could to protect you and your family? I guess that's a bad question to ask of a limp-wristed lib.

There! Are you happy now? Big Grin


Have you ever even been around any doctors enough to know that there are people out there that legitimately need help? Yes there are lazy people out there that would benefit from it, but there are also legitimate, dirt poor people out there as well that need help. That's like saying that since a few people that have mental issues can get guns and kill people, we should therefor ban guns. It makes no sense. (I hope I put it in terms you can understand) And please elaborate to me how apartments bolster Israeli national security? How exactly does it help their cause for peace when they antagonize all of their neighbors. You can't talk peace on one hand and try to annex territory at the same time. That isn't how it works. And the Palestinians share just as much blame, but even still, it's like South Korea trying to take over land in North Korea.
quote:
Originally posted by Caduceus:

Have you ever even been around any doctors enough to know that there are people out there that legitimately need help? Yes there are lazy people out there that would benefit from it, but there are also legitimate, dirt poor people out there as well that need help. That's like saying that since a few people that have mental issues can get guns and kill people, we should therefor ban guns. It makes no sense. (I hope I put it in terms you can understand) And please elaborate to me how apartments bolster Israeli national security? How exactly does it help their cause for peace when they antagonize all of their neighbors. You can't talk peace on one hand and try to annex territory at the same time. That isn't how it works. And the Palestinians share just as much blame, but even still, it's like South Korea trying to take over land in North Korea.


And are you so stupid to think that everybody out there on all these welfare programs are anything but lazy. There's no one in the country who is against helping the people who truly cannot help themselves. Heck I've seen blind people working, I've seen people in wheelchairs working, I've seen people paralyzed from the neck down, working. And then there are ignorant people like you that think we should put able bodied people on our backs and carry them through life. THAT is why this country is going down!

As for your views on Israel? I hope the Manson family moves in next door to you. Unlike me, some people need a real life example.
The city has a history that goes back to the 4th millennium BCE, making it one of the oldest cities in the world.[5] Jerusalem is the holiest city in Judaism and Christianity and has been the spiritual center of the Jewish people since c. 1000 BCE, when David the King of Israel first established it as the capital of the Jewish Nation, and his son Solomon commissioned the building of the First Temple in the city.

It would seem that Palestines have no claim to the land as I see it, being that there is not a state of Palestine. There is territory they claim belongs to them that is part of Israel, but I do not see a solid self governing non- terrorist state.
quote:
Originally posted by btchpls50m:
The city has a history that goes back to the 4th millennium BCE, making it one of the oldest cities in the world.[5] Jerusalem is the holiest city in Judaism and Christianity and has been the spiritual center of the Jewish people since c. 1000 BCE, when David the King of Israel first established it as the capital of the Jewish Nation, and his son Solomon commissioned the building of the First Temple in the city.

It would seem that Palestines have no claim to the land as I see it, being that there is not a state of Palestine. There is territory they claim belongs to them that is part of Israel, but I do not see a solid self governing non- terrorist state.


You got that right! When the murderous yasser arafat-slob was their idea of a leader, they should be treated like Spalding Smails: They'll get nothing and like it!
You get what you pay for...

NO ONE in that area - save for Jordan and Egypt - even talks to the Israeli's. And they learned in '48 and '56 that any problems they had were going to have to be dealt with by them and them only. So when Egypt cut off their fresh water in 1967 where was the USA? Britain? France? Germany? No one cared and next thing we know - we have the six day war. Israel does not need us. They never have.
Just our money.

The six day war proved - hard - that Israel would not give a sh*t and take out anyone/anything that messed with her sovereignity. Being a superpower with tons of planes and tanks it's easy to influence things. And we did in '56. We got the whole war to stop the way we wanted it to stop. But in '67 when we tried to pull the same shennigans we were informed that nuclear armed Israel wanted us to "f*ck off."

As a side issue - USS Liberty happened because we were not the ally to Israel that we are now. They treated us with contempt cuz we treated them with contempt. At the time of the gig, we had still - legally - not thrown our hat in the ring with anybody. So from an Israeli standpoint, who's side were we on during the six day war? Note that little of their mil-hardware was American. Mainly French. And the American hardware they had was stuff purchased in garage sales throughout Europe.

Only after the Cold War started heating up and the Soviets offered the Jews unlimited mil-toys in exchange for sub basing rights - ONLY THEN - did the kind and generous, loving Americans suddenly embrace Israel as an ally. This is why the Liberty investigation suddenly died.

Israel is quite capable of buying oil for itself. Water. Food. Everything else. Cut Israel off and you will surely die. This is why we pay them and clothe them, and fuel them, and feed them. Because should Saudi mess with their oil, Saudi could easily get nuked. Then NO ONE would be able to drink Saudi oil. They treat us like their b*tch because sadly, we are their b*tch. Best thing we could do is go back to 1948, leave the area, drink our own oil and let the chips fall where they may. We're too weak to do that tho.
I don't think Obama's "blow off" was uncalled for.
quote:
Originally posted by elinterventer01:
FYI, Egypt gets an amount of foreign aid equal to what we give Israel.

The Saudis work with the Israelis to thwart the Iranians. It isn't as simple as it seems. Iranians used to be chess masters, before the ayatollah banned chess as un-islamic.

And why?

Because Israel has handed Egypt their "azz on a plate" every time they (Egypt) tried any sh*t.
The Saudis only work with ANYONE who can keep their corrupt...un-popular Saud family in power.
And Amerika keeps sucking their oil...at whatever price.
American dollars...or American blood.
It's very simple...Amerikan politics (politicians) are pronounced P*SSY
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:

And are you so stupid to think that everybody out there on all these welfare programs are anything but lazy. There's no one in the country who is against helping the people who truly cannot help themselves. Heck I've seen blind people working, I've seen people in wheelchairs working, I've seen people paralyzed from the neck down, working. And then there are ignorant people like you that think we should put able bodied people on our backs and carry them through life. THAT is why this country is going down!

As for your views on Israel? I hope the Manson family moves in next door to you. Unlike me, some people need a real life example.


Really, well as for the person paralyzed from the neck down and working; how exactly is that person able to get insurance, what with a preexisting condition like paralysis? What stops an insurance company from dropping their coverage, or raising their rates to an unfeasible rate?
And also, why should we support Israel in all of their endeavors, even the things they do that serve only to exacerbate the problems in the region. Need I remind you of the atrocities of the Israel-Lebanon war? How do you support a country that deliberately attacks, schools, hospitals, civilians, and uses white phosphorous on civilians. Don't fight the people of lebanon, fight hezbullah. Precision attacks are much more effective than large scale bombing runs, artillery strikes, and cluster bombs. When you kill someone's wife, husband, daughter, grandmother, or son, what exactly does that do to champion the cause of hearts and minds?
When the citizens of the country that are being attacked see their own sons and daughters enduring white phosphorus burns, where are they going to direct their hate?
quote:
Originally posted by Caduceus:
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:

And are you so stupid to think that everybody out there on all these welfare programs are anything but lazy. There's no one in the country who is against helping the people who truly cannot help themselves. Heck I've seen blind people working, I've seen people in wheelchairs working, I've seen people paralyzed from the neck down, working. And then there are ignorant people like you that think we should put able bodied people on our backs and carry them through life. THAT is why this country is going down!

As for your views on Israel? I hope the Manson family moves in next door to you. Unlike me, some people need a real life example.


Really, well as for the person paralyzed from the neck down and working; how exactly is that person able to get insurance, what with a preexisting condition like paralysis? What stops an insurance company from dropping their coverage, or raising their rates to an unfeasible rate?
And also, why should we support Israel in all of their endeavors, even the things they do that serve only to exacerbate the problems in the region. Need I remind you of the atrocities of the Israel-Lebanon war? How do you support a country that deliberately attacks, schools, hospitals, civilians, and uses white phosphorous on civilians. Don't fight the people of lebanon, fight hezbullah. Precision attacks are much more effective than large scale bombing runs, artillery strikes, and cluster bombs. When you kill someone's wife, husband, daughter, grandmother, or son, what exactly does that do to champion the cause of hearts and minds?
When the citizens of the country that are being attacked see their own sons and daughters enduring white phosphorus burns, where are they going to direct their hate?


Why don't you ask that guy who's paralyzed you lazy slob of a leech.
quote:
Originally posted by Caduceus:
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:


Why don't you ask that guy who's paralyzed you lazy slob of a leech.


Ad Hominem attacks on an anonymous forum, well played. Those always win arguments Roll Eyes logical fallacies are great argument winners. You know nothing about me and don't pretend to.


Your warped views on everything says volumes about you. libs such as you have an incredible naivete about them. To think that all people who are sucking America dry are deserving is totally mindless.
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:


Your warped views on everything says volumes about you. libs such as you have an incredible naivete about them. To think that all people who are sucking America dry are deserving is totally mindless.


At what point did I say that all people that got it deserved it? I didn't,

I said that the system could and is abused by people that don't need it, but at the same time; as someone aspiring to be a doctor I think it is abhorrent that there could be the possibility of someone not getting the care that they need.

Like I said there are SOME people out there that need it, but not all people need it.
Hi all,

Let me see: The PLA want half of Jerusalem for their capital -- and they want a big chunk of Israel to be be given to them. And Obama/Hillary are upset and acting like play ground school children because Israel's Prime Minister says no. "If you won't give us what we want -- we'll take our ball and go home!"

Let's turn this around. How about if the PLA wanted half of Washington DC to be given to them as their capital. And, they want the states in Northwest America -- New York, New Jersey, Massachusetts, Connecticut, etc. -- to be given to them to be their nation. Would Obama/Hillary be so willing to play ball with them?

It is okay when the Liberals can give away someone else's land -- but, how about if it is our land the PLA wants. Who knows -- give in to them now -- and, next year they may be knocking on our front door -- asking for keys to the White House.

Just my thoughts.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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quote:
Originally posted by Caduceus:
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:


Your warped views on everything says volumes about you. libs such as you have an incredible naivete about them. To think that all people who are sucking America dry are deserving is totally mindless.


At what point did I say that all people that got it deserved it? I didn't,

I said that the system could and is abused by people that don't need it, but at the same time; as someone aspiring to be a doctor I think it is abhorrent that there could be the possibility of someone not getting the care that they need.

Like I said there are SOME people out there that need it, but not all people need it.


You seem to think the welfare system doesn't need to be totally destroyed. That's the ONLY way to get rid of the fraud and corruption. If someone needs treatment, let THEM pay for it. If that means they need to make health care a priority in life instead of dope, booze, cellphones, spinners, HDTV etc; GOOD!
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:


You seem to think the welfare system doesn't need to be totally destroyed. That's the ONLY way to get rid of the fraud and corruption. If someone needs treatment, let THEM pay for it. If that means they need to make health care a priority in life instead of dope, booze, cellphones, spinners, HDTV etc; GOOD!


What about the people that legitimately cannot provide for themselves? People that can barely keep food on the table, that are unemployed, that would happily take any job given to them, but get turned down at every interview.

What if that person gets cancer, a disease that can cost millions to treat, or even a simple broken leg that can cost up into the tens of thousands of dollars to treat without insurance.

Or people that have been denied insurance coverage due to something out of their control. You honestly believe that there is no one out there that is deserving of help? Do I think people that choose to pay for unnecessary luxuries instead of health care or other necessities need that help? No.
quote:
Originally posted by Caduceus:
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:


You seem to think the welfare system doesn't need to be totally destroyed. That's the ONLY way to get rid of the fraud and corruption. If someone needs treatment, let THEM pay for it. If that means they need to make health care a priority in life instead of dope, booze, cellphones, spinners, HDTV etc; GOOD!


What about the people that legitimately cannot provide for themselves? People that can barely keep food on the table, that are unemployed, that would happily take any job given to them, but get turned down at every interview.

What if that person gets cancer, a disease that can cost millions to treat, or even a simple broken leg that can cost up into the tens of thousands of dollars to treat without insurance.

Or people that have been denied insurance coverage due to something out of their control. You honestly believe that there is no one out there that is deserving of help? Do I think people that choose to pay for unnecessary luxuries instead of health care or other necessities need that help? No.


We DON'T NEED the welfare agency for that. It's the crushing load of welfare spending over the years that has helped curb the job market in this country. The trillions of dollars sucked away from businesses and industries to pay for the welfare nation has caused has caused employment reductions to hold down costs of doing business. I know because I was in retail management.

We would have to come up with some other way of caring for the TRULY unfortunate rather than flushing even many more trillions down this stink hole we have now that STILL will not solve the problem.
quote:
Originally posted by Caduceus:
quote:
Originally posted by kperk014:


You seem to think the welfare system doesn't need to be totally destroyed. That's the ONLY way to get rid of the fraud and corruption. If someone needs treatment, let THEM pay for it. If that means they need to make health care a priority in life instead of dope, booze, cellphones, spinners, HDTV etc; GOOD!


What about the people that legitimately cannot provide for themselves? People that can barely keep food on the table, that are unemployed, that would happily take any job given to them, but get turned down at every interview.

What if that person gets cancer, a disease that can cost millions to treat, or even a simple broken leg that can cost up into the tens of thousands of dollars to treat without insurance.

Or people that have been denied insurance coverage due to something out of their control. You honestly believe that there is no one out there that is deserving of help? Do I think people that choose to pay for unnecessary luxuries instead of health care or other necessities need that help? No.


Let's see......so they can buy milk with their WIC money, bread with their food stamps and beer and cigarettes with the change they get back from the card or their cash from the min wage job they work so they can keep their welfare who drive off in their hoopty mobile with the woofers and spinner and their bling.......? Yes, there are some people that deserve it, but not many that are bilking the system for money while they are drinking and smoking and doing drugs.

As far as healthcare is concerned -- most of the people that need it do get it -- they are on Medicaid and Medicare as it is.

As far as the "broken leg" excuse -- AFLAC is dirt cheap and it will cover much of the expenses that come with a broken bone and you can have it even if you don't have health insurance and it pays you more if you don't have health insurance. There are also cancer policies through AFLAC as well that will help with the cost.

There are options for help. But people want the help for FREE without having to work or pay in or earn that privilege -- they think it should be handed to them. I work for my job and I work to pay for my own health insurance and it is a minimal plan, but I pay for AFLAC to cover what it doesn't and I do just fine.

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