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Opec head sees oil price hitting $200 a barrel
By Russell Hotten, Industry Editor
Last Updated: 1:20am BST 30/04/2008



The president of Opec has warned that the price of oil could hit $200 (£100) a barrel, spelling more pain for the major crude-consuming economies.

Chakib Khelil said there was nothing that the oil producers' cartel could do to bring down the high price, which he blamed on geopolitical tensions and market speculators.

His comments, coming as oil touched a record $120 a barrel on Nymex at one stage yesterday, are seen as rejecting pleas from America and Europe for Opec to turn on the taps and help rein in the price. Mr Khelil, Algeria's energy minister, said there is no evidence of a shortage of oil on world markets.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtml?xml=/money/.../04/29/cnopec129.xml
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The response is FLEX ENGINES... Engines that can run on methonol, alcohol, ethonol and gasoline...
All Congress has to do is get the auto industry to produce flex engines instead of just gasoline only...
We have enough coal, and surplus down trees, brush, etc to produce enough fuel to go completely away from gasoline in 20 years if they would do so...
Have you noticed...not one candidate has proposed that solution...?
Something has to be done with the fuel price, and we need to keep using what we have now. Flex fuels actually pollute the atmosphere more than petroleum fuels do. They are not as efficient, and if you think grocery's cost a lot now, just wait until we have to use the corn for fuel and not food. No one would be planting anything but corn, so all other foods would go up. There would be so much ammonium nitrate being used in the world that we would be killing all the fish in the rivers with the run off. Maybe there is something else out there, cause this is really starting to suck.
totally agree with viper, ethanol is NOT the way to go. Im still hoping for Hydrogen, but that makes the most sense and one thing ive learned is that if something makes too much sense, they wont do it. i stumbled across a show on discovery channel last night called "futurecar", very interesting. there was a car company developing a car that could go 1000 miles on 7 gallons of gas, and other companies using hydrogen fuel cells that were extremely effecient. the sad part of all this is the fact that all the suits up there in washington have their hands in the cookie jar, and until oil does indeed run out, which is not gonna be in our lifetime, its always gonna be this way. i bought a fuel efficient corolla, thats about all you can do really, that and drive less, adjust your budgets accordingly, its worked for me. sometimes it seems as if the government doesnt care about the american people who make this nation what it is, and that truly is sad
Last edited by thomaswayne0907
Once we get out of Iraq, after a short while while those people kill one another in record numbers, the geopolitical tensions mentioned above should ease, and Iraq will again start producing oil which should ease the situation some.
On the other hand, we should NOT become complacent if we get reasonable priced gasoline again like we did after the 70's. We need to proceed with high mileage cars and attempt to get off of oil.
GM is working on a plug-in hybrid http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/4257460.html?series=19
and the best thing all of us can do is to NOT buy those gas-guzzling SUV's and Hummers.
Apparently tho, there are a lot of people who are not affected by the current price of gas as I still see the Hummers and big SUV's driving around.
quote:
Originally posted by traderconnections:
The response is FLEX ENGINES... Engines that can run on methonol, alcohol, ethonol and gasoline...
All Congress has to do is get the auto industry to produce flex engines instead of just gasoline only...
We have enough coal, and surplus down trees, brush, etc to produce enough fuel to go completely away from gasoline in 20 years if they would do so...
Have you noticed...not one candidate has proposed that solution...?


Just playing devil's advocate here, but why do you think that it should be something Congress should mandate? Isn't that a market decision that, if it makes fiscal sense, the auto manufacturers should be racing toward on their own?

I dunno... just seems to me like we want every little thing dictated to us by the crooks we keep sending and resending to DC. These very same crooks are the ones whose campaign coffers are kept full by the people who stand to make lot$ and lot$ of money if gas prices continue to rise. The automotive industry should be doing this on their own, as a way to boost slumping sales.
why would Toyota, GM, or Ford sell us the cure? the money isn't in electric cars, or fuel cells, ethanol. the money right now is in gas, and will be until its gone. people are wishing for $2.00 a gallon ethanol, and sure thats a possibility, but what good is that if your spending 200 extra dollars a month on groceries. all this talk about fuel got me remembering a certain film called "the road warrior". one day thats how its gonna be here.
quote:
Originally posted by thomaswayne0907:
why would Toyota, GM, or Ford sell us the cure? the money isn't in electric cars, or fuel cells, ethanol. the money right now is in gas, and will be until its gone.


Auto manufacturers don't set the price of gas, nor do they profit from it. So why should they care about the price of gas? If the consumers want (and will pay more for) something, I fail to see why they aren't scrambling to provide it.
Corn fetish for ethanol is currently helping to fuel the current huge increase in current world food prices. Having to pass anything through a still by definition is a "waste" of energy to atmosphere. One could save two or more steps of energy conversion by simply making battery technology better and cheaper and increase electrical generation output.
Hydro, for example, in our present grandiose scheme can be replaced by low head high flow cascading turbines. In India, a village put in a simple series of flues on a river, increased flow rate by decreasing diameter of the flow area, and by the simple hydraulics and taking old surplus AC/DC damage control pumps made them flow backwards from design and turned the motors into generators. They then cascaded them. Only a small portion of the total stream was diverted and the majority was totally unaffected by the diversion to the cascade.
Here we seem to love the high head hydro projects -- they are indeed, awe inspiring, but not so great for anything save impounding/flood control vice merely energy conversion. A bunch of little gets you a lot.
was listening to C-Span they were talking about gas, the oil companys want to drill off the coast of Florida and California so there was one Senator really pushing it, then the Florida Senator come on and said that Germany had cars that got 40 mpg and Japan has them that would get 50 mpg and our industry is saying that they might be able to get one that gets 38 by 2015 it's all BS, you know if they have them that gets that kind of mileage already we could have them too, these congressmen and Senators are not going to cut off their Money, If we only had sense to bring all them home things would change but it will never happen
The part that pisses me off is that we are forced to buy 10% ethanol right now at the pumps in town. All the gas stations are selling up to 10% ethanol in all grades of their fuel. Some of them are posting it on the pump but a lot are not. We are still being charged the high price for gas but are getting the ethanol filler that is making it about 5% less efficient. Start looking at the pumps when you fill up, or ask the cashier. If you want some examples, the Texaco that is on 72 west in Tuscumbia, right before the old 4-way stop, have finally posted it on their pumps.
quote:
Originally posted by prince albert:
was listening to C-Span they were talking about gas, the oil companys want to drill off the coast of Florida and California so there was one Senator really pushing it, then the Florida Senator come on and said that Germany had cars that got 40 mpg and Japan has them that would get 50 mpg and our industry is saying that they might be able to get one that gets 38 by 2015 it's all BS, you know if they have them that gets that kind of mileage already we could have them too, these congressmen and Senators are not going to cut off their Money, If we only had sense to bring all them home things would change but it will never happen


Actually, the in Europe , cars are already getting 75MPG.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/4237945.html?series=19
VW, Ford, and a host of others are already there. I do understand that these cars may not have all the safety stuff required here, but would the added weight make that much difference.
These mileages are on diesel autos, and are NOT hybrids, but just think of the possibilities of something like this running on biodiesel tied to a plug-in hybrid.
We could have them too, just gotta stop buying the big ego machines and start asking the car dealers for them. If they don't have them, walk out the door. They will start showing up.
quote:
Originally posted by kontan:
quote:
Originally posted by dosvse3:
Better get use to it 5 to 7 years from now your going to be paying 8 to 10 dollars per gallon at the pump. Mark it down its going to happen.

Already that high in England.



You are correct, but just imagine what they will be paying in England. Mad
quote:
Originally posted by dosvse3:
quote:
Originally posted by kontan:
quote:
Originally posted by dosvse3:
Better get use to it 5 to 7 years from now your going to be paying 8 to 10 dollars per gallon at the pump. Mark it down its going to happen.

Already that high in England.


You are correct, but just imagine what they will be paying in England. Mad

I'm currently in denial.

I blogged about this tonight. Seems that there is some guy pushing for water powered engines and swears that the tech is effective. Not sure that it is a ton better than oil, but it is interesting.
quote:
Originally posted by kontan:
quote:
Originally posted by dosvse3:
quote:
Originally posted by kontan:
quote:
Originally posted by dosvse3:
Better get use to it 5 to 7 years from now your going to be paying 8 to 10 dollars per gallon at the pump. Mark it down its going to happen.

Already that high in England.


You are correct, but just imagine what they will be paying in England. Mad

I'm currently in denial.

I blogged about this tonight. Seems that there is some guy pushing for water powered engines and swears that the tech is effective. Not sure that it is a ton better than oil, but it is interesting.


Water? Yea right. Perhaps a fission reactor in a car… oh forget that hasn’t been invented yet. Law of supply and demand with China, India and all those other third world folks finally getting into the uhh the 20th century, a barrel of oil will be 200 to 250 dollars in the next 5 to 7 years. Break out the old horse and buggy.
quote:
Originally posted by Viper:
Something has to be done with the fuel price, and we need to keep using what we have now. Flex fuels actually pollute the atmosphere more than petroleum fuels do. They are not as efficient, and if you think grocery's cost a lot now, just wait until we have to use the corn for fuel and not food. No one would be planting anything but corn, so all other foods would go up. There would be so much ammonium nitrate being used in the world that we would be killing all the fish in the rivers with the run off. Maybe there is something else out there, cause this is really starting to suck.
I also agree with you viper. Biodeisel is the way to go. It doesnt pollute our environment and all you need is used vegetable oil and some other additives. We currently own the following deisel vehicles: jetta TDI, VW new bug and a ford f-250. We have been running all of them on BIO for going on 2 years. No mechanical problems what so ever and didnt have to buy any conversion kits for the autos. I would say we are paying between .60 to .70 cents a gallon.
quote:
Originally posted by prince albert:
was listening to C-Span they were talking about gas, the oil companys want to drill off the coast of Florida and California so there was one Senator really pushing it, then the Florida Senator come on and said that Germany had cars that got 40 mpg and Japan has them that would get 50 mpg and our industry is saying that they might be able to get one that gets 38 by 2015 it's all BS, you know if they have them that gets that kind of mileage already we could have them too, these congressmen and Senators are not going to cut off their Money, If we only had sense to bring all them home things would change but it will never happen
I have a 2002 VW new bug and a 2002 vw jetta TDI, they run on biodeisel and they both get 40 miles to the gallon. We have the cars, people just want trucks, hummers, SUV's, etc....
quote:
Originally posted by thomaswayne0907:
why would Toyota, GM, or Ford sell us the cure? the money isn't in electric cars, or fuel cells, ethanol. the money right now is in gas, and will be until its gone. people are wishing for $2.00 a gallon ethanol, and sure thats a possibility, but what good is that if your spending 200 extra dollars a month on groceries. all this talk about fuel got me remembering a certain film called "the road warrior". one day thats how its gonna be here.


Well, let's see.... if gas goes up so much that GM's best selling SUV's aren't being purchased, then they might have some incentive. Actually it is the car companies (namely Honda and Toyota, that have to deal with this in Japan) that pioneered hybrids. GM and Ford have been late-comers since before the first oil crisis. It is in fact the auto industry that is working on the fuel-cell alternative.

Follow the money, the auto industry stands to gain nothing if gas prices keep people from buying new cars.
Zip, for once I agree with you. I have been a proponent for a long time for a plug-in electric car, however, I do think that unless there is some battery developed that can take a quick charge, and a distribution network for acquiring such, an all electric vehicle may be for a niche market such as commuters, but that would be ok with me.
Another problem tho with an all electric vehicle which may be more problematic, is how would cities, and counties replace the tax money they now get from gasoline taxes ?
Oil prices are not going down, there is no minus figures in the "Sett" section, it closed at $116.32 today.


What is sad about this is the people are ok with it. They're buying it. I see the big trucks and cars that drink the gas like we drink water. People have not made any cut backs and still driving at high speeds.
quote:
Originally posted by JJPAUL:
Oil prices are not going down, there is no minus figures in the "Sett" section, it closed at $116.32 today.


What is sad about this is the people are ok with it. They're buying it. I see the big trucks and cars that drink the gas like we drink water. People have not made any cut backs and still driving at high speeds.


That does NOT include my family. I have no choice but buy 140 bucks worth a week right now, I am on nightshift. But once I go back on dayshift in a couple of weeks, I will be on a van. No more running errands to pay bills - everything will go in the mailbox, went and bought a new book of stamps today. We are cutting back on all trips not absolutely necessary and going to cleaners, grocery store, dollar store etc that are close to home. The cost of everything is outrageous.
quote:
Originally posted by SO TIRED OF IGNORANCE:
No more running errands to pay bills - everything will go in the mailbox, went and bought a new book of stamps today.


There's this newfangled thing called the Internet - you may have heard of it - and you can pay almost every bill online, these days. With 128-bit encryption, which is standard, it's more secure than sending documents containing your account information through the USPS.

The more you know... Smiler
the first thing that needs to be done is start drilling ANWR! when the OPEC countries realize that we won't need them in about 10 years, they will start kissing our butts, rather than raping us.

bio-diesel and SVO (straight vegetable oil) systems are looking good to me. this months issue of "grassroots motorsports" has a story about pro racer randy pobst, and his SVO VW jetta TDI. when he gets low on "fuel" he stops at costco, gets a few jugs of wesson, and continues on for about half of what diesel costs at the pump.

I don't want to see food prices go up, as using food products for fuel will do, but we should use that to our advantage. its hard to grow corn/rice/wheat in the desert. what ever happened to the food for oil program. lets starve them out, until they realize that they need us as bad as we need them. and once ANWR is up and going, they can all burn in their own oil.
quote:
Originally posted by Howard Roark:
Probably a plug-in hybrid will be the next step after the hybrid. Technology still has quite aways to go before pure quick charge electrics.

modern gear heads are taking gas/electric hybrids, and modifying them to be plug-in hybrids. they are getting the toyota prius and honda insight, and the gas engines never crank. they are seeing 300+ miles per charge. if folks can do this stuff in their garages, the auto makers must be able to.

quick charging is coming. I've seen them for cell phones, so that technology is close.

honda now has a hydrogen fuel cell civic for lease in california (purchasing isn't an option, so they can keep them out of the hands of the competition). the technology is there, its just not catching on yet. hopefully it will happen soon.
there are some interesting tidbits in this article.http://money.cnn.com/2008/04/25/autos/SUV_AP.ap/index.htm?iref=werecommend

this one is hilarious to me: "Now owners of SUVs and other gas guzzlers who've seen the price of a fill-up climb sharply are getting a second shock when they try to trade in their behemoths. Used car dealers don't want the big vehicles on their lots anymore because hardly anyone is buying them. Some won't take them at any price."

thats what they get for buying that beast to boost their ego!
quote:
Originally posted by Ed@Bama:
quote:
Originally posted by SO TIRED OF IGNORANCE:
No more running errands to pay bills - everything will go in the mailbox, went and bought a new book of stamps today.


There's this newfangled thing called the Internet - you may have heard of it - and you can pay almost every bill online, these days. With 128-bit encryption, which is standard, it's more secure than sending documents containing your account information through the USPS.

The more you know... Smiler


Ok smart a**. I have a computer science degree ......LOL. Both of my kids - BRACES - Dr. Griggs doesnt take online payments. I also have to pay Dr. Gillespie in MSC and two other doctors offices in Killen when I find out what BC/BS didnt pay - they only take checks or cash - no internet. Chill out- I use the internet for Credit cards, cell bill and house note etc. Usually I would have taken a day of "running around" to give them a check. Now its the old fashioned post office. It really doesnt strain anything to put a check in the mail...............Smiler

Plus, the internet is not foolproof on identity theft. My dads info got stolen paying a credit card bill online - they enjoyed their trip to some tropical island and he had a headache trying to clear it up. Razzer

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