After watching the penguins on TV last night, looking for food, because the fish they normally eat isn't around that area anymore because of all the melting and the waters filled with gazillion clumps of ice makes me wonder why anyone questions global warming at all.
The nay sayers are'nt questioning that there is global warming. We are questioning the causes of global warming. To say that CO2 is the cause and we are basing this on computer models that have huge errors and bad assumptions is wrong.
The Bush administration indicted by Scientists for trying to supress scientific evidence on global climate change.
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines07/0130-10.htm
WASHINGTON - U.S. scientists felt pressured to tailor their writings on global warming to fit the Bush administration's skepticism, in some cases at the behest of an ex-oil industry lobbyist, a congressional committee heard on Tuesday.
Discuss This Article
click here...
"Our investigations found high-quality science struggling to get out," Francesca Grifo of the watchdog group Union of Concerned Scientists told members of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee."
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines07/0130-10.htm
WASHINGTON - U.S. scientists felt pressured to tailor their writings on global warming to fit the Bush administration's skepticism, in some cases at the behest of an ex-oil industry lobbyist, a congressional committee heard on Tuesday.
Discuss This Article
click here...
"Our investigations found high-quality science struggling to get out," Francesca Grifo of the watchdog group Union of Concerned Scientists told members of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee."
quote:Originally posted by Mott The Hoople:
http://www.medialens.org/alerts/06/060116_the_point_of.php
Mott, I had to re read that article more than once to realize the SKY IS FALLING nature of its viewpoint. I must be getting Old, "this century," meant the 20th centrury so long, 58 years, that reading it I was thinking the DISASTER IS COMING IN A FEW YEARS. It is not, it's coming, but not untill 2100. That is 93 years away. I got nothing to worry about, I would be a hundred and thirty eight. My youngest grandchild will be 94. He is two, he needs something to worry about so he doesn't hassle his mom so much.
I'll let him. I have other things to do, like maybe finding a few bucks to gas up my SUV pickup...or perhaps I could just take off in the car, and drive aimlessly to say Punta del fuego. Or I could get a big power yacht and do a world circuit solo. After all, when the world gets as hot as the days of the Diansaurs, in about 2050, I will most likely be dead from heat exhaustion, I do live in Arizona afterall, and Alabama...well regular days of 115 for a few months a year are likely good for alligators. Do alligators live in or around Alabama? Well maybe if things warm up, and sea level rises, they will. GOOD LUCK...
I am waiting for nash to come in and call the WORLDS TOP scientists liars .The new report is relesed now,,,showing evidence of human link to global warming
Right wingers offer bribes to dispute global warming
An ultra-conservative Washington think tank with direct ties to the Bush Administration is offering a $10,000 bribe to any scientist or economist who will dispute a global warming report released today by the United Nation’s top scientific panel.
http://www.capitolhillblue.com/wp/2007/02/02/1974
An ultra-conservative Washington think tank with direct ties to the Bush Administration is offering a $10,000 bribe to any scientist or economist who will dispute a global warming report released today by the United Nation’s top scientific panel.
http://www.capitolhillblue.com/wp/2007/02/02/1974
I have a hard time believing that since there are already plenty of scientists disputing it. They have been for a while now.
Here's a blog from James Spann, meteorologist from B'ham.
http://www.jamesspann.com/wordpress/?p=650
Here's a blog from James Spann, meteorologist from B'ham.
http://www.jamesspann.com/wordpress/?p=650
And here's Neal Boortz's take on it...he makes some good points:
http://boortz.com/nuze/index.html
WHY AM I SKEPTICAL ABOUT MAN-MADE GLOBAL WARMING?
A 21-page report from something called the "Intergovernmental Panel On Climate Change" has been released today...in Paris, no less...and as expected, it's predictions are dire. According to the report: "Warming of the climate system is unequivocal, as is now evident from observations of increases in global average air and ocean temperatures, widespread melting of snow and ice, and rising global mean sea level." Yeah right...we've heard all this before.
But the biggest bombshell here is this one: no matter what we do, global warming will not be reversed. It will go on for centuries, according to this report. The sea levels will continue to rise as polar ice caps melt. So I guess if Al Gore wins his Nobel Peace Prize, we'll still experience global warming. So much for riding to work everyday in your hybrid car...it's not doing a thing. The situation is futile, according to this report.
But really, it makes sense that the global warming crowd would come to this conclusion. After all, global warming is a religion. The anti-capitalist enviro-nazis don't ever want the problem to be solved. After all, if global warming were to be solved tomorrow, what would they blame the United States for? They'd have to find some other reason.
Sorry .. I'm still a skeptic. In no particular order here are just a few of the reasons why I'm not buying this man-made global warming scare:
The United Nations is anti-American and anti-Capitalist. In short .. I don't trust them. Not a bit. The UN would eagerly engage in any enterprise that would weaken capitalist economies around the world.
Because after the fall of the Soviet Union and worldwide Communism many in the anti-capitalist movement moved to the environmental movement to continue pursuing their anti-free enterprise goals. Many of the loudest proponents of man-made global warming today are confirmed anti-capitalists.
Because the sun is warmer .. and all of these scientists don't seem to be willing to credit a warmer sun with any of the blame for global warming.
The polar ice caps on Mars are melting. How did our CO2 emissions get all the way to Mars?
It was warmer in the 1930s across the globe than it is right now.
It wasn't all that long ago that these very same scientists were warning us about "global cooling" and another approaching ice age?
How much has the earth warmed up in the last 100 years? One degree. Now that's frightening.
Because that famous "hockey stick" graph that purports to show a sudden warming of the earth in the last few decades is a fraud. It ignored previous warming periods ... left them off the graph altogether.
The infamous Kyoto accords exempt some of the world's biggest CO2 polluters, including China and India.
The Kyoto accords can easily be seen as nothing less than an attempt to hamstring the world's dominant capitalist economies.
Because many of these scientists who are sounding the global warming scare depend on grant money for their livelihood, and they know the grant money dries up when they stop preaching the global warming sermon.
Because global warming "activists" and scientists seek to punish those who have different viewpoints. If you are sure of your science you have no need to shout down or seek to punish those who disagree.
What happened to the Medieval Warm Period? In 1996 the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change issued a chart showing climatic change over a period of 1000 years. This graph showed a Medieval warming period in which global temperatures were higher than they are today. In 2001 the IPCC issued another 1000 year graph in which the Medieval warming period was missing. Why?
Why has one scientist promoting the cause of man-made global warming been quoted as saying "we have to get rid of the medieval warming period?"
Why is the ice cap on the Antarctic getting thicker if the earth is getting warmer?
In the United State, the one country with the most accurate temperature measuring and reporting records, temperatures have risen by 0.3 degrees centigrade over the past 100 years. The UN estimate is twice that.
There are about 160,000 glaciers around the world. Most have never been visited or measured by man. The great majority of these glaciers are growing, not melting.
Side-looking radar interferometry shows that the ise mass in the West Antarctic is growing at a rate of over 26 gigatons a year. This reverses a melting trend that had persisted for the previous 6,000 years.
Rising sea levels? The sea levels have been rising since the last ice age ended. That was 12,000 years ago. Estimates are that in that time the sea level has risen by over 300 feet. The rise in our sea levels has been going on long before man started creating anything but natural CO2 emissions.
Like Antarctica, the interior of Greenland is gaining ice mass.
Over the past 3,000 years there have been five different extended periods when the earth was measurably warmer than it is today.
During the last 20 years -- a period of the highest carbon dioxide levels -- global temperatures have actually decreased. That's right ... decreased.
Why did a reporter from National Public Radio refuse to interview David Deming, an associate professor at the University of Oklahoma studying global warming, after his testimony to the Senate Environment and Public Works Committee unless Deming would state that global warming was being caused by man?
Why are global warming proponents insisting that the matter is settled and that no further scientific research is needed? Why are they afraid of additional information?
On July 24, 1974 Time Magazine published an article entitled "Another Ice Age?" Here's the first paragraph:
"As they review the bizarre and unpredictable weather pattern of the past several years, a growing number of scientists are beginning to suspect that many seemingly contradictory meteorological fluctuations are actually part of a global climatic upheaval. However widely the weather varies from place to place and time to time, when meteorologists take an average of temperatures around the globe they find that the atmosphere has been growing gradually cooler for the past three decades. The trend shows no indication of reversing. Climatological Cassandras are becoming increasingly apprehensive, for the weather aberrations they are studying may be the harbinger of another ice age."
Hey ... I could go on. There's much more where that came from. But I need to get ready to go on the air. Just know that many of the strongest proponents of this "man-made" global warming stuff are dedicated opponents to capitalism and don't feel all that warm and fuzzy about the United States.
http://boortz.com/nuze/index.html
WHY AM I SKEPTICAL ABOUT MAN-MADE GLOBAL WARMING?
A 21-page report from something called the "Intergovernmental Panel On Climate Change" has been released today...in Paris, no less...and as expected, it's predictions are dire. According to the report: "Warming of the climate system is unequivocal, as is now evident from observations of increases in global average air and ocean temperatures, widespread melting of snow and ice, and rising global mean sea level." Yeah right...we've heard all this before.
But the biggest bombshell here is this one: no matter what we do, global warming will not be reversed. It will go on for centuries, according to this report. The sea levels will continue to rise as polar ice caps melt. So I guess if Al Gore wins his Nobel Peace Prize, we'll still experience global warming. So much for riding to work everyday in your hybrid car...it's not doing a thing. The situation is futile, according to this report.
But really, it makes sense that the global warming crowd would come to this conclusion. After all, global warming is a religion. The anti-capitalist enviro-nazis don't ever want the problem to be solved. After all, if global warming were to be solved tomorrow, what would they blame the United States for? They'd have to find some other reason.
Sorry .. I'm still a skeptic. In no particular order here are just a few of the reasons why I'm not buying this man-made global warming scare:
The United Nations is anti-American and anti-Capitalist. In short .. I don't trust them. Not a bit. The UN would eagerly engage in any enterprise that would weaken capitalist economies around the world.
Because after the fall of the Soviet Union and worldwide Communism many in the anti-capitalist movement moved to the environmental movement to continue pursuing their anti-free enterprise goals. Many of the loudest proponents of man-made global warming today are confirmed anti-capitalists.
Because the sun is warmer .. and all of these scientists don't seem to be willing to credit a warmer sun with any of the blame for global warming.
The polar ice caps on Mars are melting. How did our CO2 emissions get all the way to Mars?
It was warmer in the 1930s across the globe than it is right now.
It wasn't all that long ago that these very same scientists were warning us about "global cooling" and another approaching ice age?
How much has the earth warmed up in the last 100 years? One degree. Now that's frightening.
Because that famous "hockey stick" graph that purports to show a sudden warming of the earth in the last few decades is a fraud. It ignored previous warming periods ... left them off the graph altogether.
The infamous Kyoto accords exempt some of the world's biggest CO2 polluters, including China and India.
The Kyoto accords can easily be seen as nothing less than an attempt to hamstring the world's dominant capitalist economies.
Because many of these scientists who are sounding the global warming scare depend on grant money for their livelihood, and they know the grant money dries up when they stop preaching the global warming sermon.
Because global warming "activists" and scientists seek to punish those who have different viewpoints. If you are sure of your science you have no need to shout down or seek to punish those who disagree.
What happened to the Medieval Warm Period? In 1996 the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change issued a chart showing climatic change over a period of 1000 years. This graph showed a Medieval warming period in which global temperatures were higher than they are today. In 2001 the IPCC issued another 1000 year graph in which the Medieval warming period was missing. Why?
Why has one scientist promoting the cause of man-made global warming been quoted as saying "we have to get rid of the medieval warming period?"
Why is the ice cap on the Antarctic getting thicker if the earth is getting warmer?
In the United State, the one country with the most accurate temperature measuring and reporting records, temperatures have risen by 0.3 degrees centigrade over the past 100 years. The UN estimate is twice that.
There are about 160,000 glaciers around the world. Most have never been visited or measured by man. The great majority of these glaciers are growing, not melting.
Side-looking radar interferometry shows that the ise mass in the West Antarctic is growing at a rate of over 26 gigatons a year. This reverses a melting trend that had persisted for the previous 6,000 years.
Rising sea levels? The sea levels have been rising since the last ice age ended. That was 12,000 years ago. Estimates are that in that time the sea level has risen by over 300 feet. The rise in our sea levels has been going on long before man started creating anything but natural CO2 emissions.
Like Antarctica, the interior of Greenland is gaining ice mass.
Over the past 3,000 years there have been five different extended periods when the earth was measurably warmer than it is today.
During the last 20 years -- a period of the highest carbon dioxide levels -- global temperatures have actually decreased. That's right ... decreased.
Why did a reporter from National Public Radio refuse to interview David Deming, an associate professor at the University of Oklahoma studying global warming, after his testimony to the Senate Environment and Public Works Committee unless Deming would state that global warming was being caused by man?
Why are global warming proponents insisting that the matter is settled and that no further scientific research is needed? Why are they afraid of additional information?
On July 24, 1974 Time Magazine published an article entitled "Another Ice Age?" Here's the first paragraph:
"As they review the bizarre and unpredictable weather pattern of the past several years, a growing number of scientists are beginning to suspect that many seemingly contradictory meteorological fluctuations are actually part of a global climatic upheaval. However widely the weather varies from place to place and time to time, when meteorologists take an average of temperatures around the globe they find that the atmosphere has been growing gradually cooler for the past three decades. The trend shows no indication of reversing. Climatological Cassandras are becoming increasingly apprehensive, for the weather aberrations they are studying may be the harbinger of another ice age."
Hey ... I could go on. There's much more where that came from. But I need to get ready to go on the air. Just know that many of the strongest proponents of this "man-made" global warming stuff are dedicated opponents to capitalism and don't feel all that warm and fuzzy about the United States.
I was hoping that someone would post that. This proves that there is are two sides to every argument. It is arogant on behalf of the U.N. and Al Gore and others to claim there is a consensus about the cause of global warming.
I think everyone agrees that we all have a responsibility to our future generations to make this world cleaner and conserve our resources, but this country is much more environmentally responsible that it gets credit for. The main perpetrators are China and India, yet they do not have to follow our strict regulations. Why does the U.N. overlook this and go after us as the root of global warming.
Think about it. If the U.N. would pursue other countries and make them conform to ours and western European standards, that might make us a little more competitive and maybe regain some of the manufacturing jobs lost.
The U.N. and several countries are anti-American and anti-capitalist and would like to see our economy fail.
I think everyone agrees that we all have a responsibility to our future generations to make this world cleaner and conserve our resources, but this country is much more environmentally responsible that it gets credit for. The main perpetrators are China and India, yet they do not have to follow our strict regulations. Why does the U.N. overlook this and go after us as the root of global warming.
Think about it. If the U.N. would pursue other countries and make them conform to ours and western European standards, that might make us a little more competitive and maybe regain some of the manufacturing jobs lost.
The U.N. and several countries are anti-American and anti-capitalist and would like to see our economy fail.
quote:Originally posted by Fighting Illini:
I was hoping that someone would post that. This proves that there is are two sides to every argument. It is arogant on behalf of the U.N. and Al Gore and others to claim there is a consensus about the cause of global warming.
I think everyone agrees that we all have a responsibility to our future generations to make this world cleaner and conserve our resources, but this country is much more environmentally responsible that it gets credit for. The main perpetrators are China and India, yet they do not have to follow our strict regulations. Why does the U.N. overlook this and go after us as the root of global warming.
Think about it. If the U.N. would pursue other countries and make them conform to ours and western European standards, that might make us a little more competitive and maybe regain some of the manufacturing jobs lost.
The U.N. and several countries are anti-American and anti-capitalist and would like to see our economy fail.
There is a consensus. DENYING there is will not change that. THERE ARE ALSO DISPUTES, if I already knew for sure, I would just go off and do something else while I have time. But I might get a little more time if I can contribute to solving the problem. TELLING ME THERE IS NOTING I CAN DO, AS THE NAY SAYERS DO, is telling me all hope is lost.
Accepting that says do nothing, because noting you do will change things.
quote:Originally posted by pba:
Right wingers offer bribes to dispute global warming
An ultra-conservative Washington think tank with direct ties to the Bush Administration is offering a $10,000 bribe to any scientist or economist who will dispute a global warming report released today by the United Nation’s top scientific panel.
An additional comment on Global Climate Change, this time from within the Evangelical Christian Community.
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/03/02/cpac/...ml?source=newsletter
"The truth, which almost everyone except them acknowledges, is there is little reasonable doubt left about the threat posed to the earth by climate change. There is an international consensus among scientists, religious leaders, business leaders, and economists that we must act, and act now, to preserve a world for our children." Jim Wallis, in God's Politics" On Beliefnet & Sojourners present.
The Great Global Warming Swindle.
This is an interesting take. I watched some of it earlier. I'll have to drill down when time allows.
This is an interesting take. I watched some of it earlier. I'll have to drill down when time allows.
George Carlin said it best, and I'll have to paraphrase or it will just be "**** ******** ********* ****** ****** ***** **** ***** ****".
The planet isn't going anywhere, we are. Pack your bags! The planet does not need to be saved! It's been taking care of itself for a long time, WE are the ones who are leaving!
The planet isn't going anywhere, we are. Pack your bags! The planet does not need to be saved! It's been taking care of itself for a long time, WE are the ones who are leaving!
Its foolish to suggest that man has no effect on the planet. I think many are simply willing to take the gamble that there is no such thing as global warming because in 50 yrs we will all be dead. It really does not matter what happens-in death no one is right or wrong. The only fly in the ointment is that those who are saying there is no global warming are losing the argument. Every single candidate running for president with the exception of Mitt Romney beleave in global warming.
Plutonic Warming
By Fred Thompson
Some people think that our planet is suffering from a fever. Now scientists are telling us that Mars is experiencing its own planetary warming: Martian warming. It seems scientists have noticed recently that quite a few planets in our solar system seem to be heating up a bit, including Pluto.
NASA says the Martian South Pole’s “ice cap” has been shrinking for three summers in a row. Maybe Mars got its fever from earth. If so, I guess Jupiter’s caught the same cold, because it’s warming up too, like Pluto.
This has led some people, not necessarily scientists, to wonder if Mars and Jupiter, non signatories to the Kyoto Treaty, are actually inhabited by alien SUV-driving industrialists who run their air-conditioning at 60 degrees and refuse to recycle.
Silly, I know, but I wonder what all those planets, dwarf planets and moons in our SOLAR system have in common. Hmmmm. SOLAR system. Hmmmm. Solar? I wonder. Nah, I guess we shouldn’t even be talking about this. The science is absolutely decided. There’s a consensus.
Ask Galileo.
— Fred Thompson is an actor and former United States senator from Tennessee.
By Fred Thompson
Some people think that our planet is suffering from a fever. Now scientists are telling us that Mars is experiencing its own planetary warming: Martian warming. It seems scientists have noticed recently that quite a few planets in our solar system seem to be heating up a bit, including Pluto.
NASA says the Martian South Pole’s “ice cap” has been shrinking for three summers in a row. Maybe Mars got its fever from earth. If so, I guess Jupiter’s caught the same cold, because it’s warming up too, like Pluto.
This has led some people, not necessarily scientists, to wonder if Mars and Jupiter, non signatories to the Kyoto Treaty, are actually inhabited by alien SUV-driving industrialists who run their air-conditioning at 60 degrees and refuse to recycle.
Silly, I know, but I wonder what all those planets, dwarf planets and moons in our SOLAR system have in common. Hmmmm. SOLAR system. Hmmmm. Solar? I wonder. Nah, I guess we shouldn’t even be talking about this. The science is absolutely decided. There’s a consensus.
Ask Galileo.
— Fred Thompson is an actor and former United States senator from Tennessee.
Perhaps I should have said "declared" presidential candidates. Oh and an ACTOR as well.
I vow to only use one square of tissue - most of the time.
Hey, if I don't even use one most of the time, can I save those unused ones up for when I need more than one?
Hey, if I don't even use one most of the time, can I save those unused ones up for when I need more than one?
quote:Originally posted by meanasasnake:
Perhaps I should have said "declared" presidential candidates. Oh and an ACTOR as well.
I hadn't seen your post on presidential candidates before posting Thompson's statement...I had done a search on global warming and found it...other than liking the post and respecting Thompson, I didn't give it a thought about his possibly running for president.
quote:Originally posted by FatNoMo:
I vow to only use one square of tissue - most of the time.
Hey, if I don't even use one most of the time, can I save those unused ones up for when I need more than one?
Why not use roves suit?
Found the following facts from TVA today, although it is not yet on their web page.
> "The three-month period-- January to March 2007-- was the driest in 118 years of record for that time of year, with only 6.4" of rainfall, or 46 percent of normal for the area above Chattanooga."
>" Runoff was the seventh lowest in 133 years, with only 4.7" of water reaching the resevoirs above Chattanooga."
Maybe we need to ask Fred Thompson (quoted above as the expert) what's going on.
> "The three-month period-- January to March 2007-- was the driest in 118 years of record for that time of year, with only 6.4" of rainfall, or 46 percent of normal for the area above Chattanooga."
>" Runoff was the seventh lowest in 133 years, with only 4.7" of water reaching the resevoirs above Chattanooga."
Maybe we need to ask Fred Thompson (quoted above as the expert) what's going on.
quote:Originally posted by excelman:
Found the following facts from TVA today, although it is not yet on their web page.
> "The three-month period-- January to March 2007-- was the driest in 118 years of record for that time of year, with only 6.4" of rainfall, or 46 percent of normal for the area above Chattanooga."
>" Runoff was the seventh lowest in 133 years, with only 4.7" of water reaching the resevoirs above Chattanooga."
Maybe we need to ask Fred Thompson (quoted above as the expert) what's going on.
Neither I nor Fred Thompson called Fred Thompson an "expert". He was acting in the role of a commentator on an issue...I found it interesting and posted it.
For every expert and every statistic you quote saying it's a reality, I can quote one that says it's junk science. For every "driest in 118 years" I can come up with a "coldest in 110". It would be a urination contest of the highest magnitude, and neither you nor I could prove anything.
How did Greenland get its name? Alabama has cooled in the last 150 years. Go figure.quote:Reply
Posted 02 January 2007 11:41 PM Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by NashBama:
quote:
Greenland and Antartica, and Iceland, and the Alps, and Mt Killamanjaro, and The Andes and the Rocky Mountains, ALL HAVE ICE FLOATING ON THEM TOO.
Those aren't polar ice caps. Those snows have melted and returned, it's part of the natural cycle of the Earth. You mentioned the snows in the Rockies are disappearing, have you watched the news lately? Denver has been covered in record snow fall. Even if the snows were disappearing and the ocean level was rising, there is still no evidence that we are responsible as opposed to the Earth simply changing on it's own.
Posted by Ed:
Whoa here fella, you apparently don't recognize that the GREENLAND ICECAP HAS BEEN THERE FOR ABOUT 50 THOUSAND YEARS OR MORE. You don't seem to know about Glacier National Park in Washington State. You don't seem to know that the Snows of Killamajaro fall on GLACIERS. You seem to think that Iceland is Ice Free in the summer. WELL IT JUST AIN'T SO.
What you are FAILING
I couldn't get back in to edit previous post, But that is basically what I was trying to say.
quote:
Originally posted by NashBama:
quote:
Greenland and Antartica, and Iceland, and the Alps, and Mt Killamanjaro, and The Andes and the Rocky Mountains, ALL HAVE ICE FLOATING ON THEM TOO.
Those aren't polar ice caps. Those snows have melted and returned, it's part of the natural cycle of the Earth. You mentioned the snows in the Rockies are disappearing, have you watched the news lately? Denver has been covered in record snow fall. Even if the snows were disappearing and the ocean level was rising, there is still no evidence that we are responsible as opposed to the Earth simply changing on it's own.
Posted by Ed:
Whoa here fella, you apparently don't recognize that the GREENLAND ICECAP HAS BEEN THERE FOR ABOUT 50 THOUSAND YEARS OR MORE. You don't seem to know about Glacier National Park in Washington State. You don't seem to know that the Snows of Killamajaro fall on GLACIERS. You seem to think that Iceland is Ice Free in the summer. WELL IT JUST AIN'T SO.
What you are FAILING
I couldn't get back in to edit previous post, But that is basically what I was trying to say.
quote:Originally posted by that smart chick:
George Carlin said it best, and I'll have to paraphrase or it will just be "**** ******** ********* ****** ****** ***** **** ***** ****".
The planet isn't going anywhere, we are. Pack your bags! The planet does not need to be saved! It's been taking care of itself for a long time, WE are the ones who are leaving!
lol, that is so true. mother earth was here before us and will be here long after we're gone, a blip on her grand timeline. ;^)
Like I said earlier - those of you who dont beleave in the possibility of global warming will lose this one. The tide is not going in your favor. Beleave in it or not, those who do beleave in it are winning the battle for public opinion.
quote:Originally posted by meanasasnake:
Its foolish to suggest that man has no effect on the planet. I think many are simply willing to take the gamble that there is no such thing as global warming because in 50 yrs we will all be dead. It really does not matter what happens-in death no one is right or wrong. The only fly in the ointment is that those who are saying there is no global warming are losing the argument. Every single candidate running for president with the exception of Mitt Romney beleave in global warming.
We humans are a living paradox. We're totally dependent on nature, yet we're destroying it at an alarming rate. Where is the point of irreversible damage? I think that the earth goes through natural cycles of warming and cooling. Are we speeding it up? Probably somewhat.
I definitely agree that man is having a terrible effect on this planet. The pollution is mind blowing. I'm also sure that there is a correlation between the two, but not as much as some would say. In my opinion this whole argument should be center around pollution, something we know we can control, versus a planetary cyclic event based on things we cannot.
We all know that natural resources and population growth are not infinite, there are limits, and that if we are going to be here for any length of time, our plan has to be viable and sustainable. Clearly our short term interests and actions don't belie that.
Who in our government/leadership has the credibility to illustrate this without political motivation???
Greenland, when settled by the vikings had pasture land for their animals and crops were grown. As it got colder the crops failed and they begin to eat their animals.
Pressure from invading inuit and the climate changes probably tolled the death nell for the vikings. We know this from the remains of their dwellings and inuit tales.
Pressure from invading inuit and the climate changes probably tolled the death nell for the vikings. We know this from the remains of their dwellings and inuit tales.
quote:Originally posted by Sassy Kims:quote:Originally posted by excelman:
Found the following facts from TVA today, although it is not yet on their web page.
> "The three-month period-- January to March 2007-- was the driest in 118 years of record for that time of year, with only 6.4" of rainfall, or 46 percent of normal for the area above Chattanooga."
>" Runoff was the seventh lowest in 133 years, with only 4.7" of water reaching the resevoirs above Chattanooga."
Maybe we need to ask Fred Thompson (quoted above as the expert) what's going on.
Neither I nor Fred Thompson called Fred Thompson an "expert". He was acting in the role of a commentator on an issue...I found it interesting and posted it.
For every expert and every statistic you quote saying it's a reality, I can quote one that says it's junk science. For every "driest in 118 years" I can come up with a "coldest in 110". It would be a urination contest of the highest magnitude, and neither you nor I could prove anything.
I don't care about your distorted views. The current dry spell , if it continues , will affect you and me directly! With less runoff, TVA will move the river slower. There will be less water avaliable for peaking and that could cause TVA to operate combuston turbines instead, which is the most expensive way TVA produces electricity. If the river moves slower, it will get warmer, and could fource TVA power plants to use cooling towers instead of cooling with river water. Again , more expensive.
All this could raise your power rates.
Also, a slower moving and warmer river will be far less clean for us to enjoy .
Maybe you don't care about any of that, but I do! Whether any of us can do anything about it or not in the long run, I don't know.
quote:Maybe you don't care about any of that, but I do! Whether any of us can do anything about it or not in the long run, I don't know.
Be sure to keep us up to date on the situation over the next ten or fifteen centuries...I'll decide if it was worth the fuss then. Less than that is just too little information to make a decision.
I think I'll cut short the flow on this urination contest...you have a nice day.
i am suprised noone has brought up global dimming.
Whatever happened to the fact that we are suppose to be good stewards of the land and its resources? Americans have been and still are a "meism" country--if it satisfies my needs, then so be it if it hurts someone or something else. We've been ravaging this land since the day the Mayflower docked. If we all have a vulture attitude about the land and its resources, eventually the "bones" will be picked clean and there will not be anything left. So, if you cut it down, replant something to replace it; if you can recycle it or reuse it, do it; if you can find an alternative fuel source, go for it; if you are going to shoot it or catch it, make sure you can eat it; and if you live on it or in it, respect it.
The FACT is the "nay-sayers" are losing and will lose this argument. The tide has turned and its not in your direction. School children believe it, the majority of industrialized nations believe it, many leading scientists believe it, all but one of our front runners for the next presidential election believe it, and many regular joes believe it. Like I said before - many of you dont really care because you will be dead before its proven one way or the other. You people would rather let someone else worry over it - someone like your grandchildren. Its over, the fat lady has bellowed. Unless something dramatic happens in the next few years to change the belief that global warming is indeed fact - its over. That IS fact.
http://mysite.verizon.net/mhieb/WVFossils/greenhouse_data.html
I'm having a hard time finding the Global Warming Potential (GWP) of water vapor. Does anyone know what it is?
DF
I'm having a hard time finding the Global Warming Potential (GWP) of water vapor. Does anyone know what it is?
DF
To paraphrase: "1500 years ago, everybody "knew" that the earth was the center of the universe. 500 years ago, everybody "knew" that the earth was flat. And 15 minutes ago, you "knew" that 'the belief' in global warming was a reality. Imagine what you'll "know" tomorrow."
You are arguing that the "belief in global warming" is the issue? And insist the belief "IS fact"?
Get back to me in 10 or 15 centuries with proof instead of an badly written argument that says "the majority" believe in it (which indicates you have no supporting facts)...maybe you can convince me then.
quote:The FACT is the "nay-sayers" are losing and will lose this argument. The tide has turned and its not in your direction. School children believe it, the majority of industrialized nations believe it, many leading scientists believe it, all but one of our front runners for the next presidential election believe it, and many regular joes believe it. Like I said before - many of you dont really care because you will be dead before its proven one way or the other. You people would rather let someone else worry over it - someone like your grandchildren. Its over, the fat lady has bellowed. Unless something dramatic happens in the next few years to change the belief that global warming is indeed fact - its over. That IS fact.
You are arguing that the "belief in global warming" is the issue? And insist the belief "IS fact"?
Get back to me in 10 or 15 centuries with proof instead of an badly written argument that says "the majority" believe in it (which indicates you have no supporting facts)...maybe you can convince me then.
quote:Originally posted by Sassy Kims:
To paraphrase: "1500 years ago, everybody "knew" that the earth was the center of the universe. 500 years ago, everybody "knew" that the earth was flat. And 15 minutes ago, you "knew" that 'the belief' in global warming was a reality. Imagine what you'll "know" tomorrow."quote:The FACT is the "nay-sayers" are losing and will lose this argument. The tide has turned and its not in your direction. School children believe it, the majority of industrialized nations believe it, many leading scientists believe it, all but one of our front runners for the next presidential election believe it, and many regular joes believe it. Like I said before - many of you dont really care because you will be dead before its proven one way or the other. You people would rather let someone else worry over it - someone like your grandchildren. Its over, the fat lady has bellowed. Unless something dramatic happens in the next few years to change the belief that global warming is indeed fact - its over. That IS fact.
You are arguing that the "belief in global warming" is the issue? And insist the belief "IS fact"?
Get back to me in 10 or 15 centuries with proof instead of an badly written argument that says "the majority" believe in it (which indicates you have no supporting facts)...maybe you can convince me then.
The effect is the same - we will sign on to the Kyoto Treaty in 2 years. The argument may still be there but the steps to control greenhouse gas will be enacted. Even IF you are right - the long term effects on the environment will be positive. Sorry, you are just on the wrong side of history. I will GLADLY say "I told you so" - in the next 2 years. Your, mildly clever, remark about "10 or 15 centuries" really exemplifies the remark I made earlier - none of you "nay-sayers" really care, you will all be dead by the time any tangible proof exists. Thats such a moral reason to take a stand.
Yeah we've got global warming this decade. In the 70's the scientists said we were headed towards another ice age and they had all the data to prove it. This country is full of chicken-littles and it would be kind of funny if we did hit an ice age in 20 years or so just to see the looks on the faces of albert gore and his cult. Of course its not going to happen (thank God) and by the way I think He will have more to do with the world's doom than my Corolla.
quote:Originally posted by meanasasnake:quote:Originally posted by Sassy Kims:
To paraphrase: "1500 years ago, everybody "knew" that the earth was the center of the universe. 500 years ago, everybody "knew" that the earth was flat. And 15 minutes ago, you "knew" that 'the belief' in global warming was a reality. Imagine what you'll "know" tomorrow."quote:The FACT is the "nay-sayers" are losing and will lose this argument. The tide has turned and its not in your direction. School children believe it, the majority of industrialized nations believe it, many leading scientists believe it, all but one of our front runners for the next presidential election believe it, and many regular joes believe it. Like I said before - many of you dont really care because you will be dead before its proven one way or the other. You people would rather let someone else worry over it - someone like your grandchildren. Its over, the fat lady has bellowed. Unless something dramatic happens in the next few years to change the belief that global warming is indeed fact - its over. That IS fact.
You are arguing that the "belief in global warming" is the issue? And insist the belief "IS fact"?
Get back to me in 10 or 15 centuries with proof instead of an badly written argument that says "the majority" believe in it (which indicates you have no supporting facts)...maybe you can convince me then.
The effect is the same - we will sign on to the Kyoto Treaty in 2 years. The argument may still be there but the steps to control greenhouse gas will be enacted. Even IF you are right - the long term effects on the environment will be positive. Sorry, you are just on the wrong side of history. I will GLADLY say "I told you so" - in the next 2 years. Your, mildly clever, remark about "10 or 15 centuries" really exemplifies the remark I made earlier - none of you "nay-sayers" really care, you will all be dead by the time any tangible proof exists. Thats such a moral reason to take a stand.
According to your statement, we'll all be dead before any proof is available...do you think reincarnation will enable you to say, "I told you so"? Unless you're planning on dying in the next two years.
"Wrong side of history"? I want to stay out of history for as long as possible!!!
You're right..."you can't know how little I care" about "global warming". Why??? Because it's a farce, a lie, a falsehood that has been thrust onto the world. It does not exist...not in the terms indicated by Mr. Gore or any of his cronies and sycophants. The earth's climate has changed gradually over millions of years...from hotter to colder, from wetter to dryer. What once was seas and oceans are now the world's greatest deserts. Under parts of the current ocean, you can find old civilizations. The climate of planet Earth has been changing for millions of years, and humans have barely scratched the surface. What the human race has done to the face of the earth has not changed the climate one degree.
Foolish and unlearned people have been tricked into believing in this farce, this trickery. It all boils down to a Chicken Little tale..."The sky is falling, the sky is falling".
I've had enough of this urination contest. On to believable things.
The effect is the same - we will sign on to the Kyoto Treaty in 2 years. The argument may still be there but the steps to control greenhouse gas will be enacted. Even IF you are right - the long term effects on the environment will be positive. Sorry, you are just on the wrong side of history. I will GLADLY say "I told you so" - in the next 2 years. Your, mildly clever, remark about "10 or 15 centuries" really exemplifies the remark I made earlier - none of you "nay-sayers" really care, you will all be dead by the time any tangible proof exists. Thats such a moral reason to take a stand.[/QUOTE]
Hey bud, I've got a great idea how to stop global warming. Why don't you and albert and all the "millions and millions"take care of this for us. If all of you who have drank the koolaid will put away your SUV's, limos, and private jets and start riding bicycles. Turn off the air conditioning in your houses in the summer and wear heavy clothes in the winter. With the "millions and millions" of true believers doing this our problems should be solved pronto.
Hey bud, I've got a great idea how to stop global warming. Why don't you and albert and all the "millions and millions"take care of this for us. If all of you who have drank the koolaid will put away your SUV's, limos, and private jets and start riding bicycles. Turn off the air conditioning in your houses in the summer and wear heavy clothes in the winter. With the "millions and millions" of true believers doing this our problems should be solved pronto.
quote:Originally posted by NashBama:
You've got a glass of ice water, there is plenty of ice in the glass. You forget about it, leaving it sitting on the table for several hours. You come back and see that all the ice has melted in the glass. Has all the water overflowed and made a mess on the table?
That depends. If the level of the ice and the water is relatively equal, you are correct, all of the water has already been displaced by the ice and will, therefore, remain at about the same level. However, if the ice is piled up over the top of the glass and well above the level of the water, the glass will overflow when the ice melts. In case you have not noticed, the ice that is now melting and falling into the water is well above the level of the water and will, therefore, cause the level to rise once it has melted.