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Hi to my Forum Friends,

In the discussion begun by Vic titled "Put Up Or Shut Up" -- Chick told me that she is considering becoming an atheist because of my Christian witness.  And, I respond to her, "Chick, my dear Friend, that is the beauty of our God.   If atheism is more to your taste than Jesus Christ -- you get to make that choice."

Now, Chick tells me, "First of all, Billy, if you are such a wonderful Christian, why aren't you in church on a Sunday night?   Second, I am not your "dear friend" & I resent being referred to as such.

I'm sure your lady friend, IF she was your friend, left the forum, (it was) because you were ragging her about being New Age & (in) what you call a cult.  You pray I make a good choice???  Another lie, Billy......you despise me as much as I do you -- because I see you for what you truly are."

Where to start?  Let me see.  First, I suppose I should address the church issue.  For the past 25 years I have been in Filipino-American churches which most often uses the facilities of established morning churches.  And, we typically have our services around 1:30 PM on Sunday.  In virtually all those morning churches, that congregation uses the facility on Sunday evenings -- which means that we have to be out.   But, we do, at times, have joint Sunday evening services with them.

And, this works nicely for me, since I am not a morning person -- I can sleep later and still enjoy worship service and fellowship in the afternoon.   Love it!

You mention my "lady friend."  Actually, she is OUR lady friend, our Religion Forum lady Friend who told us she is a "Wiccan Christian" -- and I told her that is an oxymoron.  One cannot be Wiccan, which is a form of witch craft, and be a Christian at the same time.  The two are mutually exclusive. And, Chick, since you were involved in our discussions about her New Age peccadilloes -- I would assume you know who I have in mind.

Now, this third one I must address head on.  You write, "You pray I make a good choice??????  Another lie, Billy......you despise me as much as I do you -- because I see you for what you truly are."

No, Chick, I do not despise you, nor do I even dislike you.  My heart hurts when I think of you turning your back on God; but, that is no reason for me to dislike you nor to hate you.  Most likely, when one gets past the anger and hurt you are holding inside -- I imagine you are a rather nice person.

The last time I hated anyone was well over 25 years ago.   I was Director of Sales for a California computer company.  The man who founded the company 20 years earlier and was still president, was my friend.  But, he liked to tilt a few drinks.  He asked me to interview a person, and after the interview I told him that I would not hire the man.  When he asked why, I told him it was because the man could not look me in the eye and answer a question.  Just chatting, he would look me in the eye.  But, when I asked a question -- he always looked at his shoes when answering.

In my mind that was indicative that he was not being truthful.   Well, the man went out for a few drinks with the president -- and was hired anyway.   Less than two years later, while I was in Alabama for a relative's funeral, there was a meeting of the Board of Directors.  This man had worked himself into the confidences of the Chairman of the Board and used that connection to back stab the founder/president -- causing him to be forced out of the company he had founded.  And, of course, when they fired him -- they fired all the other company officers who might be loyal to him.  I lost a very nice job.

So, at that time, not yet being a Christian -- I hated that man.  However, after I became a Christian and was reading the Bible, I found Job 42.  Job's friends had been attacking him, telling him that God was punishing him for past sins.  Job knew this was not true; but, it did cause him great concern and anguish.

In Job 42 we read:


Job 42:7-8, "It came about after the LORD had spoken these words to Job, that the LORD said to Eliphaz the Temanite, 'My wrath is kindled against you and against your two friends, because you have not spoken of Me what is right as My servant Job has.  Now therefore, take for yourselves seven bulls and seven rams, and go to My servant Job, and offer up a burnt offering for yourselves, and My servant Job will pray for you.  For I will accept him so that I may not do with you according to your folly, because you have not spoken of Me what is right, as My servant Job has.'"

 

Then, we read, in Job 42:10:


"The LORD restored the fortunes of Job when he prayed for his friends, and the LORD increased all that Job had twofold."

 

Shortly after I became a Christian in 1987, I began to pray for the man who had wronged me and caused me to lose the job I had worked years to attain.  And, guess what?  When I began to pray for that man -- the hatred I had felt for him disappeared.  We cannot carry hatred for a person when we are praying for that person.  So, in praying for him -- I removed the burden of hatred I had been carrying.

And, my Friend, this I can assure you, beyond all doubt.  When a person is carrying hatred for another -- the person who is hurt most is the person carrying the hatred.  This can cause all kinds of physical and emotional illnesses -- ulcers being the least of them.

So, Chick, when I say you are my Friend -- in my heart, that is exactly what you are -- my Friend.  An odd thing about having a Friend -- it does not have to be a two-way street.  So, I will continue to consider you my Friend; and, you may consider me whatever -- but, I will not be the one with the ulcer.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

Romans 10-1 -- Oldest Tree

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Originally Posted by: Bill Gray

Chick told me that she is considering becoming an atheist because of my Christian witness.

when one gets past the anger and hurt you are holding inside.

When a person is carrying hatred for another -- the person who is hurt most is the person carrying the hatred.  This can cause all kinds of physical and emotional illnesses -- ulcers being the least of them.

So, Chick, when I say you are my Friend -- in my heart, that is exactly what you are -- my Friend.  An odd thing about having a Friend -- it does not have to be a two-way street.  So, I will continue to consider you my Friend; and, you may consider me whatever -- but, I will not be the one with the ulcer.

__________

Good Grief!!

It’s amazing how you will go out of a topic to start another topic about the same thing in the other topic. I think you love to see your name in the forum list, & it especially pleases you when it’s at the top of that list.

 

First of all, Billy, where did you get that I was thinking of becoming an atheist because of YOUR Christian witness? What Christian witness????

I said what I did because of that long discussion between you & Invictus that was going nowhere. There comes a time when a discussion is pointless & it's time to let it go. I was trying to make a point, do you get it yet?

 

I’m not holding any anger & hurt inside. I love how you claim to know things about most of us on this forum. You don’t realize how foolish you look doing that.

Carrying hatred for you? Most certainly not, you’re not worth the effort. For a person to say they despise someone doesn’t say they hate them. I dislike you because I know you to be a liar & a very deceitful human being. I would dislike anyone that pretends to be something they're not.

BTW, I do not have ulcers. That’s just another one of those lies that you tell.

 

Billy, do you know the definition of Friend? Evidently you don’t so I’ll tell you what it means.

A friend is a person whom one knows, likes, and trusts. A person attached to another by feelings of affection or personal regard . A relationship between two people who hold mutual affection for each other .

 

See, friendship does have to be a two-way street. I’m not your friend & you are not mine, so get over yourself.

Ok, I’ve responded so now you can take my response & run start another topic about the same thing.

Your NPD is in full form. You really should get help for that.

BTW, I'm not sure who your Wiccan Christian friend is, there were 3 of them on this forum at one time but I would bet that she was not your friend.

That is what i responded about; if that is not hate i would dread seeing you make a statement of hate toward him. There has got to be a better person under that red dress than you portray. i don't even dislike you semi much less hate you or anyone else on here and i think Bill truly considers you as a "friend" and would give you the shirt off his back if you needed it. I truly cannot see how you and others can make such statements of dislike for Bill.  i just don't understand semi.

Originally Posted by vega:

Bill truly considers you as a "friend" and would give you the shirt off his back if you needed it. 

 

With conditions. with xtians, there's always conditions that have nothing to do with basic human need. Better to get what ya need on your own or do without than compromise your principles.

 

People like BeeG don't have friends, they have enemies and disciples.

 

Even if they only exist in his mind.

 

prayer_large

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Originally Posted by vega:

That is what i responded about; if that is not hate i would dread seeing you make a statement of hate toward him. There has got to be a better person under that red dress than you portray. i don't even dislike you semi much less hate you or anyone else on here and i think Bill truly considers you as a "friend" and would give you the shirt off his back if you needed it. I truly cannot see how you and others can make such statements of dislike for Bill.  i just don't understand semi.

__________

When I make a statement of hate, you will know it exactly for what it is.

 

Don't hold your breath, sweetheart, you'll never get to see under that red dress.

 

Billy considers everyone on here his friend. It's because he really doesn't have any. It's all part of his NPD.

 

I wouldn't take the shirt off his back if he offered. There's much better people than him that would offer me a shirt if I needed it, & there would be no conditions attached.

 

You don't see how myself & others can make such statements of dislike for Bill?? Where have you been? Do you read the man's post at all? You must not see anything wrong with someone being a hypocrite.

If you don't understand something as simple as dislike for another person, then I can't help you. Maybe someone else can.

Hi Vega,

 

Thank you, my Friend, for your support.   Yes, I do consider Chick and all the other people on the Religion Forum to be my Friends.  Why?  Because, when folks are your Friends -- you care enough about them to want to show them the way to happiness and joy, i.e., eternal life.

 

And, if Chick prefers to wish me into hell -- God bless her.  Such a wish and a couple of dollars will get her a cup of coffee.

 

On the other hand, who knows what miracle my wish, i.e., my prayer, can accomplish in pointing some, maybe only one, toward the right path.  And, those who absolutely refuse to listen, because it is Bill Gray sharing, or because they do not want to follow God and His Way -- they do not want God to interfere with their present life -- well, they have just chosen the wrong door

 

But, no matter how much they huff and puff, screaming that Bill Gray condemned them to hell -- in the end they will realize that it is they who have condemned themselves to hell -- by rejecting God and Jesus Christ.  I pray that they all realize this while there is still time to change direction.

 

Why do they get so angry with me?  Because I am shining the Light of Jesus Christ into the darkness of their worldly lifestyle.  And, like most who dwell in spiritual darkness -- they hiss, scream, and growl when someone shines a Light upon them and their worldly lifestyle.

 

So, yes, for now -- my atheist, agnostic, secular, and vanilla-flavored non-believing Friends will get all ticked off at this post.  But, just maybe, in all that anger -- a wee spot of Light just might shine through.  And, then, it will be worth all the stones thrown at us for sharing the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

1 John 4-10

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But, no matter how much they huff and puff, screaming that Bill Gray condemned them to hell -- in the end they will realize that it is they who have condemned themselves to hell -- by rejecting God and Jesus Christ.  I pray that they all realize this while there is still time to change direction.

 

Why do they get so angry with me?  Because I am shining the Light of Jesus Christ into the darkness of their worldly lifestyle.  And, like most who dwell in spiritual darkness -- they hiss, scream, and growl when someone shines a Light upon them and their worldly lifestyle.

 

-----------------------------

 

Who is "they" bill? Who are you referring to? I posted before, you "shine" nothing, you give nothing, you have nothing of any value to offer anyone. The only things you bring to this forum are hate, lies, prejudice, and a truly mean spirit, all things we teach our children to avoid.  I'll toss in "bearing false witness". Worldly lifestyles bill? Like chasing that almighty dollar long after a person should have retired?? So come on bill, how about you "name names". Who are these people that you claim "huff and puff, hiss, scream and growl". Have you got the backbone to do that bill? Do you have the nerve to post the IDs of the people you're talking about? Let's "shine some light" on your lies bill. 

I enjoy Bill's posts on this forum, and were he a little closer than Southern California, would probably enjoy sharing a conversation over a cup of coffee or a glass of tea. The reason is two fold, first I'm old too, and secondly he is such a transparent sycophant. They are always good for a laugh. I also consider him a friend under the broadest defination of the term. I have to deal with christians all the time, and have learned how.

Main Entry:
hate
Part of Speech:noun
Definition:extreme dislike
Synonyms:abhorrence, abomination, anathema, animosity, animus, antagonism, antipathy, aversion, black beast, bother, bugbear, bête noire, detestation, disgust, enmity, execration, frost*, grievance, gripe, hatred, horror, hostility, ill will, irritant, loathing, malevolence, malignity, mislike, nasty look, no love lost, nuisance, objection, odium, pain, rancor, rankling, repugnance, repulsion, resentment, revenge, revulsion, scorn, spite, trouble, venom
Notes:hate means to 'dislike intensely, loathe' and despise means 'look down on contemptuously'
Antonyms:liking, love, loving
Originally Posted by FirenzeVeritas:

Despise, but not hate... I'm going to have think of an instance when one would not be synonymous with the other. Until then...

You're Despicable

_________

I assume this is meant for me? If it makes you feel important to think of an instance when hate/despise wouldn't be synonymous with the other, go for it.

 

I stand by what I said, which was "For a person to say they despise someone doesn’t say they hate them".

 

Despise: To regard with contempt or scorn.

Hate: to have strong dislike or ill will for; loathe; or wish to avoid; intense animosity.

 

You can keep your English lesson, I don't need it & not impressed by your "genius".

Hi Jennifer and Chick,

 

Jennifer, you tell us, "Notes: hate means to 'dislike intensely, loathe' and despise means 'look down on contemptuously.' 

 

And, Chick, you give the definition, "Despise: To regard with contempt or scorn.  Hate: to have strong dislike or ill will for; loathe; or wish to avoid; intense animosity."

 

Is there really any difference?   We can get into semantics; but, is it really possible to "look down on contemptuously" or to "To regard with contempt or scorn" --  without having a hatred for that person?

     

As I said, we can play semantic games, ask rhetorical questions all we like -- we can debate which is more destructive, a hurricane or a tornado -- but, aren't both very destructive?   Just as "hate" and "despising" are both destructive.

 

It has been my experience over the years that a person who carries hatred toward another, or who despises another intensely -- does more harm to themselves than to the object of that scorn.  Very often, as a matter of fact, most often -- when a person carries such feeling of scorn for another -- the person who is the object of the scorn is not even aware of it.  Most often, that person has moved on.  Leaving the one carrying the scorn to cultivate and nourish his/her crop of ulcers alone.

 

As I have mentioned several times, there was a man, about 27 years ago, whom I hated with a passion.  But, when I became a Christian believer in 1987 and began to pray for that man -- I saw my hatred dissipate.  Why?  Because one cannot pray for a person and, at the same time, hate that person.

 

You really should try the prayer approach.  It's a lot cheaper than ulcer medicine.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Bless My Friend Mouse

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Jennifer, you tell us, "Notes: hate means to 'dislike intensely, loathe' anddespise means 'look down on contemptuously.' 

 

And, Chick, you give the definition, "Despise: To regard with contempt or scorn.  Hate: to have strong dislike or ill will for; loathe; or wish to avoid; intense animosity."

 

Is there really any difference?   We can get into semantics; but, is it really possible to "look down on contemptuously" or to "To regard with contempt or scorn" --  without having a hatred for that person?


=======================

 Apparently the people giving the definition saw a difference. Argue with them.

Please, people.  In the definitions given, it is mentioned that hate means ill will toward someone. You can DESPISE someone without wishing them bad things. If someone lies about you for example, you will likely despise that person. That means you have no respect for them and don't want to be around them. But it doesn't mean you have ill will for them.

 

There are people whom I despise. But I pray for them and truly hope they will open their eyes before it is too late.

 

I TRY not to HATE anyone though. I say try because when I think of the person who deliberately killed my cat, driving into the wrong lane just so he could run her over, well, in that case I pray for ME, so that I can overcome the pure hatred I feel toward that person.

 

 

When you're attacked,  find solace in humbleness. It is why Christ said to turn the other cheek. Only in humility will you find peace. It is the casting out of pride that often must precede healing, protection, and a heart filled with love. When faced with a person filled with umbrage: Turn the other cheek and you are also turning a deaf ear. Let it pass. Let it be. Let others think what they want. Seek humility. That way, you need never second- guess yourself.

******************

I think this is good advice, I don't think I can do it.





Originally Posted by Bill Gray:

Hi Jennifer and Chick,

As I said, we can play semantic games,  

It has been my experience over the years that a person who carries hatred toward another, or who despises another intensely -- does more harm to themselves than to the object of that scorn.  Very often, as a matter of fact, most often -- when a person carries such feeling of scorn for another -- the person who is the object of the scorn is not even aware of it.  Most often, that person has moved on.  Leaving the one carrying the scorn to cultivate and nourish his/her crop of ulcers alone.

Bill

_________

I don't see anyone but you playing semantic games.

No matter how much you want to play your "look at me, I'm such a good person" role, you don't impress most people on this forum.

I don't hate you, I do not wish you ill will. I don't like wolves in sheeps clothing, & if God exist, you will gets yours from Him. He doesn't care for wolves in sheeps clothing either.

As I've said before, I don't have ulcers, & you certainly won't cause my getting them. No matter how much you wish it, you don't have that kind of power.

 

Originally Posted by O No!:

I TRY not to HATE anyone though. I say try because when I think of the person who deliberately killed my cat, driving into the wrong lane just so he could run her over, well, in that case I pray for ME, so that I can overcome the pure hatred I feel toward that person.

 ____________

 I'm sorry about your cat. Karma.......it will eventually bite that person in the butt. 

 

I can't think of anyone I hate. I don't know anyone that would be worth wasting that kind of energy on. 

In the discussion begun by Vic titled "Put Up Or Shut Up" -- Chick told me that she is considering becoming an atheist because of my Christian witness.


=======================


She told you no such thing. 



This was her post. Show where she told you she is considering becoming an atheist because of your  "christian witness". 

--------------------------

"You people sure are confusing.

There's alot of people in the wrong church going to Hell because they thought they were in the right church. Looks like it's no more than a hit & miss game.

 

I'm sure those people that "read but don't post" that Billy says is the reason he's here is just as confused. I wonder if Atheism is looking as good to them as it is to me?"


Hi Jennifer and Chick,

 

Jennifer, you tell us, "Notes: hate means to 'dislike intensely, loathe' anddespise means 'look down on contemptuously.' 

 

And, Chick, you give the definition, "Despise: To regard with contempt or scorn.  Hate: to have strong dislike or ill will for; loathe; or wish to avoid; intense animosity."

 

Is there really any difference?   We can get into semantics; but, is it really possible to "look down on contemptuously" or to "To regard with contempt or scorn" --  without having a hatred for that person?


============================

Once more you lie. I didn't TELL you anything. I posted the definition of a word. 

Originally Posted by: Bill Gray

Hi Vega,

Yes, I do consider Chick and all the other people on the Religion Forum to be my Friends.   And, if Chick prefers to wish me into hell --  

who knows what miracle my wish, i.e., my prayer, can accomplish in pointing some, maybe only one, toward the right path.  And, those who absolutely refuse to listen, because it is Bill Gray sharing 

But, no matter how much they huff and puff, screaming that Bill Gray condemned them to hell -- in the end they will realize that it is they who have condemned themselves to hell 

Why do they get so angry with me? 

Because I am shining the Light of Jesus Christ into the darkness of their worldly lifestyle.  And, like most who dwell in spiritual darkness -- they hiss, scream, and growl when someone shines a Light upon them and their worldly lifestyle. 

 my atheist, agnostic, secular, and vanilla-flavored non-believing Friends will get all ticked off at this post.  But, just maybe, in all that anger -- a wee spot of Light just might shine through.  And, then, it will be worth all the stones thrown at us for sharing the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Bill

_____________

Look up the word friend in the dictionary, read what it means. Can you comprehend the meaning?

Where has Chick ever said she wished you into Hell? Another lie, Billy. Why would I wish you there when you’re allowing Satan to be your Master & He will be sending you there?

 

You expect us to believe your prayer, your wish can accomplish a miracle? There's people suffering, dying, but prayers for those people go unanswered while your prayer brings on miracles? Hog wash!!

 

Your prayer doesn’t get pass the ceiling & you know it.

If you don’t want to read Matthew  7:15, I’ll show you what it says. “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves”. That scripture suits you to a capital T.

 

You are so full of yourself that you probably won’t listen, but no one on this forum doesn’t listen to you simply because it’s Bill Gray sharing. It’s your delivery of it & how you put yourself out there as the authority. It’s your smart remarks & your stupid cartoons, your constant condemnation of most everyone on this forum. Several people on this forum have told you this many times but you are the one that absolutely refuses to listen.

 

We huff & puff that Bill Gray condemns us to Hell? I got news for you, Billy. No matter how much you may wish for the power, you do not possess it. Yes, you constantly have a condemning nature but no one has ever said you can send us to Hell. I have said all along that if Hell exist, I’m going there. I have never denied it, & I don’t have to wait until the end to realize anything!

 

Why do we get angry? Again, many of us have said it many times. Delivery, Billy, delivery!! Smug attitude, trying to convince us of something you’re not.

 

I think that sentence I underlined of yours takes best prize for anything you have ever said. You have been doing your best to convince us & everyone reading this forum that you are that “shining light” & it just ain’t gonna happen. Yes, you have a couple of fans here that believe you have the power to deliver the sinners out of the pits of Hell. They think of you like the followers of Jim Jones thought of him but the ones here & those reading that have any common sense at all, will know you ain’t no shining light for Jesus.

Satan yes, but not Jesus. (That’s considering if both are real).

 When have you ever shone that light you speak of? All I’ve ever seen & felt out of you was darkness. What is this worldly lifestyle you speak of & how do you know we live it?

I suppose you'll run from these questions too. The ball is in your court.

 

Two scriptures you could learn from but Satan doesn't want you learning anything.

Proverbs 12:22

Lying lips are an abomination to the Lord, but those who act faithfully are his delight.

 

Matthew 6:1-34

“Beware of practicing your righteousness before other people in order to be seen by them, for then you will have no reward from your Father who is in heaven.

 

 

 

 

Originally Posted by Bestworking:

But, no matter how much they huff and puff, screaming that Bill Gray condemned them to hell -- in the end they will realize that it is they who have condemned themselves to hell -- by rejecting God and Jesus Christ.  I pray that they all realize this while there is still time to change direction.

 

Why do they get so angry with me?  Because I am shining the Light of Jesus Christ into the darkness of their worldly lifestyle.  And, like most who dwell in spiritual darkness -- they hiss, scream, and growl when someone shines a Light upon them and their worldly lifestyle.

 

-----------------------------

 

Who is "they" bill? Who are you referring to? I posted before, you "shine" nothing, you give nothing, you have nothing of any value to offer anyone. The only things you bring to this forum are hate, lies, prejudice, and a truly mean spirit, all things we teach our children to avoid.  I'll toss in "bearing false witness". Worldly lifestyles bill? Like chasing that almighty dollar long after a person should have retired?? So come on bill, how about you "name names". Who are these people that you claim "huff and puff, hiss, scream and growl". Have you got the backbone to do that bill? Do you have the nerve to post the IDs of the people you're talking about? Let's "shine some light" on your lies bill. 

===============-----------------------------===============

best, as Gengee says, "that don't help you case" whatever your case is that is. You are just too full of hate and resentment. It is eating you and your scab business alive.

best, as Gengee says, "that don't help you case" whatever your case is that is. You are just too full of hate and resentment. It is eating you and your scab business alive.

======================


Well, as we all know, anything "gengee" might "say" doesn't make any sense anyway.  Now, why don't you tell me what my business is, and tell me which union should be in my business. Tell me what my employees do for their living and tell me what we pay them. I offered to lay everyone off, send them to you and let YOU hire them and pay them whatever you wanted, but I notice your big mouth didn't have an answer for that. EPOSADAND is the best thing you can do. As far as "hate and resentment", I'd say it's you that it's eaten alive and left just a husk. I'm fine, I'm certainly not the , dried up, shriveled up, bitter and nasty old troll here. You're working under that bridge.

Hi Chick,

 

You tell me, "Look up the word friend in the dictionary, read what it means.  Can you comprehend the meaning?"

 

I would rather use the Biblical meaning of Friend.

 

Matthew 26:48-50, "Now he who was betraying Him gave them a sign, saying, 'Whomever I kiss, He is the one; seize Him.'  Immediately Judas went to Jesus and said, 'Hail, Rabbi!' and kissed Him.   And Jesus said to him, 'Friend, do what you have come for.'  Then they came and laid hands on Jesus and seized Him."

 

If Jesus could call His betrayer Friend -- why should I call you less?

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Free To Choose

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