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Let us pray.

Almighty God, our Father, everything we see and everything we can’t see exists because of you alone. It all comes from you. It all belongs to you. It all exists for your glory.

History is your story. The Scripture tells us, “Hear O Israel, the Lord is our God. The Lord is One.” And you are the compassionate and merciful one. And you are loving to everyone you have made.

Now, today, we rejoice not only in America’s peaceful transfer of power for the 44th time. We celebrate a hingepoint of history with the inauguration of our first African American president of the United States. We are so grateful to live in this land, a land of unequaled possibility, where the son of an African immigrant can rise to the highest level of our leadership. And we know today that Dr. King and a great cloud of witnesses are shouting in heaven.

Give to our new President, Barack Obama, the wisdom to lead us with humility, the courage to lead us with integrity, the compassion to lead us with generosity. Bless and protect him, his family, Vice President Biden, the cabinet, and every one of our freely elected leaders.

Help us, O God, to remember that we are Americans, united not by race, or religion, or blood, but to our commitment to freedom and justice for all. When we focus on ourselves, when we fight each other, when we forget you, forgive us. When we presume that our greatness and our prosperity is ours alone, forgive us. When we fail to treat our fellow human beings and all the earth with the respect that they deserve, forgive us. And as we face these difficult days ahead, may we have a new birth of clarity in our aims, responsibility in our actions, humility in our approaches, and civility in our attitudes, even when we differ.

Help us to share, to serve and to seek the common good of all. May all people of goodwill today join together to work for a more just, a more healthy and a more prosperous nation and a peaceful planet. And may we never forget that one day all nations and all people will stand accountable before you. We now commit our new president and his wife, Michelle and his daughters, Malia and Sasha, into your loving care.

I humbly ask this in the name of the one who changed my life, Yeshua, Isa (Koranic term for Jesus), Jesus (Hey-sous, as in the Spanish way of saying Jesus), Jesus, who taught us to pray:

“Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. For thine is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.”

My hat off to Rick Warren and his ministry!
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Isa is not merely the "Koranic" way to say "Jesus," which Our Lord was never called in life, by the way, this is a Greek translation of Yeshua, which is the same name as Joshua. Isa is the Arabic name for Yeshua, like Yaya is for John, which was actually Yohannes in Hebrew, and Miriam in both Hebrew and Arabic for Mary. Boutros is Peter in Arabic, and his actual name was Cephas, and "Peter" is a nickname given to him, and means "Rock," in Greek that is Petros.

El, Al, and Allah are all cognate in Arabic and Hebrew. All the "el" elements in Hebrew names have the same two or three letter root as do the Arabic versions. Allah is the same meaning as "El" or "Elohim" in Hebrew. they are almost the same word. Saalam in Arabic, Shalom in Hebrew. Beth in Hebrew for house and Bet in Arabic.

That prayer was nice, but Lowrey's rocked!
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I'm wondering why didn't mention any other Gods, at least recognize religions or religious groups like the Hindus(Vishnu or Shiva), and maybe a few others.

I would think being inclusive would be a good gesture for all the people around the world watching.


Because Warren was speaking with his God, not with us or the gods other people believe in.
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Originally posted by NashBama:
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I'm wondering why didn't mention any other Gods, at least recognize religions or religious groups like the Hindus(Vishnu or Shiva), and maybe a few others.

I would think being inclusive would be a good gesture for all the people around the world watching.


Because Warren was speaking with his God, not with us or the gods other people believe in.


Yes, Nash, I understand that, and I'm not discounting the entire prayer, but as the whole world was watching, I thought he might have been more inline with the concept of social (and even religious/spiritual)solidarity to appeal to the masses(especially the poor and marginalized) to help promote the common good, worldwide.

I just thought that he'll probably never get the chance to send a message to this many people again.

I dunno, just my thoughts.

Regards
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Yes, Nash, I understand that, and I'm not discounting the entire prayer, but as the whole world was watching, I thought he might have been more inline with the concept of social (and even religious/spiritual)solidarity to appeal to the masses(especially the poor and marginalized) to help promote the common good, worldwide.

I just thought that he'll probably never get the chance to send a message to this many people again.


He's a Christian and as a Christian we're taught that there is only one God. We don't honor or recognize other gods. Besides, I think he sent a great message of acceptance.

Warren included the world in the prayer with the many different names for Jesus as He is known through different cultures. Also, he said "to remember that we are Americans, united not by race, or religion, or blood, but to our commitment to freedom and justice for all." I think he did include everyone in his conversation, but in the end it wasn't a speech to the masses but a personal conversation with God.

Freedom of religion and expression protects the individual. Obama is a Christian and made a personal choice by asking Warren to deliver the invocation. Warren expressed himself and his own religious views with his prayer. He wasn't praying to the world or the masses, he was leading the country in prayer to the God he believes in. Each individual was free to make a choice to pray along with him or not to. To me, that's what a living in a free country is all about.
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He's a Christian and as a Christian we're taught that there is only one God. We don't honor or recognize other gods.



Exactly what he is doing when he trys to associate the Christian Jesus, with the Muslim Jesus. They are not the same. The lineage is the same...from the point of birth they are TWO different beings. TWO different Gods.
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Exactly what he is doing when he trys to associate the Christian Jesus, with the Muslim Jesus. They are not the same. The lineage is the same...from the point of birth they are TWO different beings. TWO different Gods.


They're the same, just a different view on His role. Same as Jews don't regard Jesus as the Messiah. Do Jews worship a different God as well?

You also have to look at the context of what Warren said. "I humbly ask this in the name of the one who changed my life,"
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Originally posted by NashBama:
He's a Christian and as a Christian we're taught that there is only one God. We don't honor or recognize other gods.


And I can respect that(I don't really agree with it tho), it just might not bring us any international goodwill or win us any hearts and minds.

I'm hoping that one day religions can honor and respect one another(I think some do, do they not?), at least enough to stop the fighting and start being more reasonable.

Wisdom Commons.

Religious Tolerance

Beliefnet

Regards
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And I can respect that(I don't really agree with it tho), it just might not bring us any international goodwill or win us any hearts and minds.

I'm hoping that one day religions can honor and respect one another(I think some do, do they not?), at least enough to stop the fighting and start being more reasonable.


His prayer wasn't meant to win international goodwill, it was his own personal conversation. He wasn't obligated to mention the beliefs of everyone else in the world, but I thought he did a good job of including the many different cultures of Christianity.

He didn't condemn people of other beliefs or their gods, so I'm not sure why what he said would be offensive. Should there be a type of fairness doctrine that applies to public prayer?
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They're the same, just a different view on His role. Same as Jews don't regard Jesus as the Messiah. Do Jews worship a different God as well?




Messianic Jews do believe Christ is the Messiah. Orthodox Jews don't. And no...it is not the same Jesus. The Orthodox Jews believe in the same God, just not Jesus' divine birth.


The Muslims have copied the Christian religion changing things to make their OWN God. Their book does include Jesus (Isa), but, as the book is false, therefore the God and Jesus of that book is simply non existent


To recognize the Muslim (Isa) you are in fact denying the divinity of Jesus.
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The Muslims have copied the Christian religion changing things to make their OWN God. Their book does include Jesus (Isa), but, as the book is false, therefore the God and Jesus of that book is simply non existent


To recognize the Muslim (Isa) you are in fact denying the divinity of Jesus.


No, it's considered the same God, not separate. Islam was started as a way to build a conquering army that would be completely devoted and freely give their lives for their leader, Mohamed. Technically, it's the same God. The difference is that it's not the real message or teachings that God wanted to have. Mohamed didn't really speak for God, evidence is that his tomb has a corpse in it, the tomb of Jesus is empty.

To be a Muslim or Orthodox Jew is to deny the divinity of Jesus, neither see Him as a messiah.
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No, it's considered the same God, not separate. Islam was started as a way to build a conquering army that would be completely devoted and freely give their lives for their leader, Mohamed. Technically, it's the same God. The difference is that it's not the real message or teachings that God wanted to have. Mohamed didn't really speak for God, evidence is that his tomb has a corpse in it, the tomb of Jesus is empty.




You say its the same God. I must ask, do you believe in the trinity?


Also I must ask, If a person believes on the Muslim Jesus (Isa), will they find a place in heaven?
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Originally posted by NYTrooper:
You say its the same God. I must ask, do you believe in the trinity?


"...the demons believe..."

Were I irreverent, I'd admit to believing in threesomes. Wink But I'm not, of course.


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Also I must ask, If a person believes on the Muslim Jesus (Isa), will they find a place in heaven?


If you believe in the Hebrew Jesus, will you find a place in heaven? My understanding is that it takes more than simple "belief".

All this ado about a political prayer...
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If you believe in the Hebrew Jesus, will you find a place in heaven?



Yes. Many Jews will go to heaven according to the bible. Those that believe the divinity of Jesus.

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My understanding is that it takes more than simple "belief".




Your understanding is wrong.


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All this ado about a political prayer...




This is a discussion board, what did you expect to find?
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Originally posted by Backwoods:
I'm a little offended that he prayed to Jesus instead of the new "Messiah."Everyone one else was that day.


So backwoods one day when you stand at the throne of Christ and He ask you why you were offended I hope you have a great answer for Him. Believe me you will need one or its off to the lake of fire for you!
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You say its the same God. I must ask, do you believe in the trinity?


Yes. Whether or not Muslims believe in the Trinity or not makes no difference in the matter. Christians believe He is the Son of God, Muslims believe He was a prophet of God. It still comes down to the same God.

Mohammad claimed that God also spoke to him and gave him new teachings. The difference is that what Mohammad taught goes directly against Jesus' teachings. Therefore Christians rule him out as a false prophet

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Also I must ask, If a person believes on the Muslim Jesus (Isa), will they find a place in heaven?


That's not for me, you, or anyone else to decide. We're specifically told not to judge others, only God can make that decision.
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That's not for me, you, or anyone else to decide. We're specifically told not to judge others, only God can make that decision.





I'm not asking you to judge, I'm asking what the religion teaches.

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Yes. Whether or not Muslims believe in the Trinity or not makes no difference in the matter. Christians believe He is the Son of God, Muslims believe He was a prophet of God. It still comes down to the same God.

Mohammad claimed that God also spoke to him and gave him new teachings. The difference is that what Mohammad taught goes directly against Jesus' teachings. Therefore Christians rule him out as a false prophet



Same name...two different beings. It doesn't matter if you call a thorn a rose...its still a thorn.
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I'm not asking you to judge, I'm asking what the religion teaches.


Christianity teaches not to judge.

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Same name...two different beings. It doesn't matter if you call a thorn a rose...its still a thorn.


That makes no sense. Using that logic, then Mormons are worshiping a completely separate God as well. Joseph Smith did the same thing Mohamed did, he claimed he was a prophet and had new teachings. He wrote a new addition to the Bible and gathered followers, the exact same formula as Islam. So do you think Mormons worship a completely separate God as well?

This should be moved to the religion section, it's diverted far from politics.
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Originally posted by NYTrooper:
Yes. Many Jews will go to heaven according to the bible. Those that believe the divinity of Jesus.


The Hebrew Jesus is the Jesus of the New Testament. Scary thought, but he was referred to as "rabbi".

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Your understanding is wrong.


Actually, as the NT says, "The demons also believe, and tremble." It takes more than simple belief; it takes acceptance of Christ as your savior. At least in my Christianity.

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This is a discussion board, what did you expect to find?


Intelligence, rationality. Failing that, some measure of entertainment.
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Christianity teaches not to judge.



Actually it teaches not to judge unless your are righteous. But that is not the subject at hand. I didn't ask you to judge anyone either.


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That makes no sense. Using that logic, then Mormons are worshiping a completely separate God as well. Joseph Smith did the same thing Mohamed did, he claimed he was a prophet and had new teachings. He wrote a new addition to the Bible and gathered followers, the exact same formula as Islam. So do you think Mormons worship a completely separate God as well?



Are you judging the Mormons?


Joseph didn't claim to be a prophet. Mormons also believe in Jesus' divinity and the trinity.

You are wrong about the Koran. The Koran is a re-writing of the Christian bible, most of it written after Muhammads death.
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Originally posted by NYTrooper:
Are you judging the Mormons?


Joseph didn't claim to be a prophet.


Joseph Smith's position was "Prophet, Seer, and Revelator." The Doctrine and Covenants is a compilation of Joseph Smith's prophecies. In fact, Joseph Smith was convicted of fraud in New York for using a "seeing stone" and selling treasure-finding services to gullible fools.

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Mormons also believe in Jesus' divinity and the trinity.


They also believe that Jesus and Lucifer were brothers during their pre-mortal existence.

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You are wrong about the Koran. The Koran is a re-writing of the Christian bible, most of it written after Muhammads death.


Not even close. It's the compilation of writings by mohammed. However, since the historical record shows mohammed to have not known how to write, it's origin is fuzzy. In addition, early parts of the koran (written when mohammed was militarily weak) have been abrogated by later parts, written when he was very strong.
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Actually, as the NT says, "The demons also believe, and tremble." It takes more than simple belief; it takes acceptance of Christ as your savior. At least in my Christianity.



Research the meanings of the word "believe". When someone says they "believe" upon Jesus, Their are saying they have accepted him as their savior.


Do you believe in Isa?
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Originally posted by NYTrooper:
Its a simple question. And yes, The Mexican pronunciation of Jesus is referring to the same Christian bible Jesus.


I guess it depends on whether or not the same holds true with the Arabic pronunciation of Jesus. Islam does not, in fact, accept the divinity of Jesus; merely that he was a prophet, and a lesser prophet than Mohammed. But they're talking about the same person.

If you're an Arabic-speaking Christian, I expect the perception changes.
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Actually it teaches not to judge unless your are righteous. But that is not the subject at hand. I didn't ask you to judge anyone either.


Wrong. Matthew 7:1, "Do not judge, or you too will be judged." Nothing there about being righteous.

John 8:7, "If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her." Nothing there about being righteous either. In other words, don't judge others, period.

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Are you judging the Mormons?


Joseph didn't claim to be a prophet. Mormons also believe in Jesus' divinity and the trinity.


No, I'm not judging Mormons. I never said they were going to heaven or hell, I said I don't believe Joseph Smith was a prophet.

Joseph Smith absolutely claimed to be a prophet and he is still believed to be one to this day. See for yourself.

Link

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You are wrong about the Koran. The Koran is a re-writing of the Christian bible, most of it written after Muhammads death.


The Koran is not a rewriting of the Christian Bible, as Zip said, it's the collected works of Mohamed.

Besides, if you believe the Koran is a re-writing of the Christian Bible, then how is that a separate and unrelated God as you're claiming?

Jews, Christians, and Muslims all believe in the same God. The difference is that some Jews believe the messiah has not come, Christians believe Jesus was the messiah, and Muslims believe Jesus (Isa) and Mohamed were prophets. Same God, different views.
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Jews, Christians, and Muslims all believe in the same God. The difference is that some Jews believe the messiah has not come, Christians believe Jesus was the messiah, and Muslims believe Jesus (Isa) and Mohamed were prophets. Same God, different views.




Then every religion believes in the same God?

And...Joseph Smith never claimed to be a prophet...
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Then every religion believes in the same God?


No.

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And...Joseph Smith never claimed to be a prophet...


Still wrong, you didn't look at the web site I posted. Here it is for you again.

Link

From Wikipedia.

Link.

From PBS.

Link

"In 1823, Joseph Smith said he was visited by an angel named Moroni, who told him of an ancient record containing God's dealings with the former inhabitants of the American continent. In 1827, Joseph retrieved this record, inscribed on thin golden plates, and shortly afterward began translating its words by the "gift of God."3 The resulting manuscript, the Book of Mormon, was published in March 1830."

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