Skip to main content

I've voted for Democrats as well as Republicans in the past and consider myself (or I did) Independent but today I call myself Republican leaning.  I am more conservative than liberal but have in the past voted for a liberal feeling that a diversity of leadership at times strengthens our Government.

 

That said I have a question for my Democratic supporting forum members.  BEFORE Democratic Healthcare (aka Obamacare, I call it Democratic Healthcare because it was enacted by Democrats as a whole and not just Obama).   Before Democratic Healthcare I paid less than $100.00 a month for my family Insurance policy, through my employer, and had an individual deductible of $400.00 a person.   NOW after Democratic Healthcare my same policy cost over $220 a month and the deductible has increased to $2000.00 a person and $5,000.00 family.  

 

My cost has doubled and my deductible or what I have to pay out of my own pocket has more than quadrupled meaning I'm paying a huge amount of money out of my pocket now compared to before Democratic Healthcare.  What was billed as AFFORDABLE is anything but for me and I'm surly not rich but middle class. 

 

So tell me WHY should I be happy that the Democrats and President Obama has created this situation for me?   I also blame John Roberts and many Republicans for they could have by now at least tried to correct these problems but the fact is had it not been for the Democrats we would have never had this problem.  So why should I even think about rewarding them with another vote and why should I believe government imposed Healthcare is something good for us?  Where is the good?

Be as the Bereans ( Acts 17:11 )

Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

gbrk, I don't know the details of your insurance or company policy. Since I retired, my wife's health policy through the company has been costing me about $800 per month with a $600 per year deductable. Has your company saw a way to cut insurance costs by blaming the changes on "Obama care"?

Hiflyer2, do you think a political party or person is setting the prices?

 

Bulldog63, the 5 democrats running for president has a combined net worth of $86, 615,000. One of the republicans running has a net worth of between 3 and 10 BILLION dollars. 

3,0000,000,000 divided by 86,615,000 equals 34.6. Trump is worth at least 34.6 times the entire pack of democrats and at most 115.4 times their worth. I'm glad you posted that picture and figure so that we can see what income inequality really is.

Well stated.
 
 
Donald Major
Soldier at US Army
 
Never been a fan of Hilary Clinton. When her husband went through his personal scandals, I was left with a strong feeling that she stuck with him in order to use his presidency to further her own goals and it seems that is just what happened. She has never proven herself to be that strong and knowledgeable. She and her husband are owned and operated by "big money" and, in my opinion, every word that comes out of her mouth comes from them...our country cannot continue to grow under this type of governing.

Why are we rewarding lawlessness & incompetence? Obama was re-elected despite the incredi
bly low labor usage, declining wage growth, and skyrocketing health care costs. He made it his mission to provide “affordable” care with the ACA, yet my rates doubled up to $500/month (compare this with my ever decreasing car insurance rates… only $25/month from Insurance Panda now). Yet we voted him in for 8 years? And we want to elect Hillary?

I regret that Vice President Biden chose not to run...probably due to pressure from the Democratic party. They would not want to risk dividing the vote and losing the election. Sadly, Clinton is not her husband and will only damage America even further.
Last edited by Bestworking
Originally Posted by jtdavis:

gbrk, I don't know the details of your insurance or company policy. Since I retired, my wife's health policy through the company has been costing me about $800 per month with a $600 per year deductable. Has your company saw a way to cut insurance costs by blaming the changes on "Obama care"?

Hiflyer2, do you think a political party or person is setting the prices?

 

Bulldog63, the 5 democrats running for president has a combined net worth of $86, 615,000. One of the republicans running has a net worth of between 3 and 10 BILLION dollars. 

3,0000,000,000 divided by 86,615,000 equals 34.6. Trump is worth at least 34.6 times the entire pack of democrats and at most 115.4 times their worth. I'm glad you posted that picture and figure so that we can see what income inequality really is.

I'm not a trump fan and I'm not 100% sure how he made his $$.  I am pretty sure Hillary made it by selling influence while at the State Dept. 

Bulldog63, the 5 democrats running for president has a combined net worth of $86, 615,000. One of the republicans running has a net worth of between 3 and 10 BILLION dollars. 

3,0000,000,000 divided by 86,615,000 equals 34.6. Trump is worth at least 34.6 times the entire pack of democrats and at most 115.4 times their worth. I'm glad you posted that picture and figure so that we can see what income inequality really is.

 

jtdavis I have not heard Donald say we need income equality. The Dems on the other hand are the ones who are spreading the "redistribute the wealth" platform like the Socialist they are. How much are you willing to give up to answer their call for equal money among everyone? Do you live in a house that is to big for you. A single bedroom is all you really need. And how much money do you have saved or in pensions you have worked for but have not shared with the rest of us? Do you have a nice car? You only need to have one that will get you to work and back. If you spout equality then demonstrate it but giving all your stuff to everyone. BUT like a Democrat that would only apply to you AFTER everyone else is forced to give up their excess. And you would be exempt because you are of higher intelligence and know better than the masses.

I have not heard Donald say we need income equality. The Dems on the other hand are the ones who are spreading the "redistribute the wealth" platform like the Socialist they are. How much are you willing to give up to answer their call for equal money among everyone? Do you live in a house that is to big for you. A single bedroom is all you really need. And how much money do you have saved or in pensions you have worked for but have not shared with the rest of us? Do you have a nice car? You only need to have one that will get you to work and back. If you spout equality then demonstrate it but giving all your stuff to everyone. BUT like a Democrat that would only apply to you AFTER everyone else is forced to give up their excess. And you would be exempt because you are of higher intelligence and know better than the masses.

-------------------------------

Not "redistribute wealth", pay a living wage.

How much am I willing to give up? I don't have much to give up. If I did, I'd probably be a republican.

The house is app. 1100 sq ft with 4 people in it. One bedroom wouldn't get it.

I don't have any savings, am living off what I can draw.

I wrecked my 2007 Malibu in Birmingham while getting chemo and radiation. It was replaced by a 2012 chevy. Is that too much for me?

Again, I do not advocate government redistribution of income, I do think that CEOs could get by on less than 350 times the average worker pay.

Where I retired from, in 1990, the boss made about 150,000, I could make about 50, 000. When I retired in 2014, the boss made 5,000,000 and I could make about 80,000, Is this fair? In 20 years, the bosses money went up about 30 (is that 3,000%)something times, mine went up about 50%

Where I retired from, in 1990, the boss made about 150,000, I could make about 50, 000. When I retired in 2014, the boss made 5,000,000 and I could make about 80,000, Is this fair? In 20 years, the bosses money went up about 30 (is that 3,000%)something times, mine went up about 50%----jt

 

It was during the Clinton administration with both houses of Congress controlled by Dems when the rules changed. I think that much of the rule changes were to get around executive pay caps for federal goobermint bosses.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/08....html?pagewanted=all

 
Originally Posted by Chuck Farley:
Originally Posted by jtdavis:

gbrk, I don't know the details of your insurance or company policy. Since I retired, my wife's health policy through the company has been costing me about $800 per month with a $600 per year deductable. Has your company saw a way to cut insurance costs by blaming the changes on "Obama care"?

Hiflyer2, do you think a political party or person is setting the prices?

 

Bulldog63, the 5 democrats running for president has a combined net worth of $86, 615,000. One of the republicans running has a net worth of between 3 and 10 BILLION dollars. 

3,0000,000,000 divided by 86,615,000 equals 34.6. Trump is worth at least 34.6 times the entire pack of democrats and at most 115.4 times their worth. I'm glad you posted that picture and figure so that we can see what income inequality really is.

I'm not a trump fan and I'm not 100% sure how he made his $$.  I am pretty sure Hillary made it by selling influence while at the State Dept. 

Yes, Obamacare is setting the prices via the Cadillac Tax that is looming and the required overages for previously elective treatments such as gender reassignment etc.   How do you think they were going to pay for all of this, I guess you believed the lairs i.e. Obama and the architect of Obamacare Gruber.

You were warned the cost would be high.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/th...n-nearly-all-states/

Covering reassignment

http://www.politico.com/story/...care-coverage-108853

Finally they laughed at you who supported it!

http://www.forbes.com/sites/th...ies-from-the-public/

 

If you were making 80 grand, for doing nothing but showing up, because you're union I'm sure there were three or more of you doing a one man job, and still cried poor you should be ashamed. But then again, if you had any shame or pride you wouldn't be a dem.  But no, you have to cry because someone that worked harder than you made more money. Sorry, but I don't buy your sad sack story. You could have afforded much more on your salary, and should have savings too,  Tell us what Republicans have to give up, and who told you they had it? You greedy old dems are terrified that someone that works for a living might get a dime more than you think they should get. A 2012 is more than a lot of hard working people have today, so is a '07, but yes, other demoslops would probably think it's too much. What were you supposed to do with that 80 grand a year? A salary is supposed to be used to live on. I know, you think you should get to keep it while others paid for everything else for you.

If you were making 80 grand, for doing nothing but showing up, because you're union I'm sure there were three or more of you doing a one man job, and still cried poor you should be ashamed. But then again, if you had any shame or pride you wouldn't be a dem.  But no, you have to cry because someone that worked harder than you made more money. Sorry, but I don't 

-----------------------

I worked, but there wasn't 3 of us doing a one man job. That's another of your lies.

I have pride and compassion and am a democrat. Does your republican qualification consist of being closed mined, heartless and having a wicked witch of the west personality? How much does you posting these hundreds of posts per week cost your company?

If someone accomplished more production than me, they deserved more. The boss did not do 350 times as much work as me. In fact, he was fired from his last job.

Originally Posted by jtdavis:

gbrk, I don't know the details of your insurance or company policy. Since I retired, my wife's health policy through the company has been costing me about $800 per month with a $600 per year deductable. Has your company saw a way to cut insurance costs by blaming the changes on "Obama care"?

Hiflyer2, do you think a political party or person is setting the prices?

 

Bulldog63, the 5 democrats running for president has a combined net worth of $86, 615,000. One of the republicans running has a net worth of between 3 and 10 BILLION dollars. 

3,0000,000,000 divided by 86,615,000 equals 34.6. Trump is worth at least 34.6 times the entire pack of democrats and at most 115.4 times their worth. I'm glad you posted that picture and figure so that we can see what income inequality really is.

I think there has been far too much attention attempted to be put on people's worth.  I think the reason that the Democrats were cited was basically Income inequality was as major part of their platform and I believe it was cited to reference it as a measure of hypocrisy rather than attempting to say wealth is bad.  Heck most every Politician in Washington, in the Federal Government, are Millionaires and far richer than the average American and they live isolated lives and really don't have much related to the average American, and that includes Democrats and Republicans.  Mark Rubio though is one in a very small minority who as of yet may not be worth a million or more but then, and I don't know, he may have been worth over a million a while back and through various moves lost net worth.

 

As for their wealth, like with Hillary or Trump, I'm more interested in HOW they achieved what they have rather than how much they have.  Did they actually earn it based upon their work or their knowledge and intelligence or was it given to them potentially for future favors or favoritism.   I think all voters should want to know that.   The "Average American" has no voice or power in this Nation.  As far as who gets the most money from Donors looking for favors both democrats and republicans are guilty.

 

I'm also still waiting for some Democratic supporter to tell me how I or my family (or anyone working or in Middle Class) is benefiting from the Democrats putting this upon us?   It's also interesting that they gave themselves an out and don't have to abide by the laws that they saddled us with.

 

Last edited by gbrk
Originally Posted by gbrk:
Originally Posted by jtdavis:

gbrk, I don't know the details of your insurance or company policy. Since I retired, my wife's health policy through the company has been costing me about $800 per month with a $600 per year deductable. Has your company saw a way to cut insurance costs by blaming the changes on "Obama care"?

Hiflyer2, do you think a political party or person is setting the prices?

 

Bulldog63, the 5 democrats running for president has a combined net worth of $86, 615,000. One of the republicans running has a net worth of between 3 and 10 BILLION dollars. 

3,0000,000,000 divided by 86,615,000 equals 34.6. Trump is worth at least 34.6 times the entire pack of democrats and at most 115.4 times their worth. I'm glad you posted that picture and figure so that we can see what income inequality really is.

I think there has been far too much attention attempted to be put on people's worth.  I think the reason that the Democrats were cited was basically Income inequality was as major part of their platform and I believe it was cited to reference it as a measure of hypocrisy rather than attempting to say wealth is bad.
Well, I don't know anybody in any party thinks wealth is a bad thing. However, the ridiculous inequality in wealth in this country is about where it was in 1920, and you know what happened then. Here's the thing, when I was a kid, the Great Depression was just back of us, and I ask my dad what caused it. The answer he gave me , I have found to be quite profound< even as an adult, :  "The rich men have all the money and won't put it into circulation so the poor can buy things".  About 85% or more of our economy is consumer driven. While the uber rich do spend money buying jet planes, yachts, etc, the very few can only eat so many meals at restaurants, and will only buy so many cars, and other stuff from the butcher, baker and candlestick maker . If the people on the other end of the scale have no money , and there are so many more of them, then they can't spend, and commerce stops. Since the 1980s the middle class has shrunk, while the uber rich 1% has received all that money , and they have done it on the back of the middle class, and now all the R presidental candidates , except Trump, are on record to cut now, and end later Social Security , and Medicare, in order to give even more millions of dollars to the 1%.  That is the problem that the Democrats have with the inequality .

  
 Heck most every Politician in Washington, in the Federal Government, are Millionaires and far richer than the average American and they live isolated lives and really don't have much related to the average American, and that includes Democrats and Republicans.  Mark Rubio though is one in a very small minority who as of yet may not be worth a million or more but then, and I don't know, he may have been worth over a million a while back and through various moves lost net worth.  A million dollars aint what it used to be. 

 

 

As for their wealth, like with Hillary or Trump, I'm more interested in HOW they achieved what they have rather than how much they have.  Both Hillary and Bill made millions writing their books. Trump inherited a lot of money and also "made a SMALL loan of about $1million from his father" to start him off in the real estate business.

or was it given to them potentially for future favors or favoritism.   I think all voters should want to know that.   The "Average American" has no voice or power in this Nation.  As far as who gets the most money from Donors looking for favors both democrats and republicans are guilty.

 What you say there is absolutely true, but it is because our country is becoming more and more an oligarchy and less and less a democracy. Voter turnout is relatively small (as a percentage) and certain big businessmen , like for instance the Koch brothers, want to keep it that way. The one thing that can keep them at bay, is a large vote turnout, and as you can read most any day in the news, some are doing everything they can do to prevent or at least make voting a very difficult thing for people, especially the elderly, the young and the poor. 

 

I'm also still waiting for some Democratic supporter to tell me how I or my family (or anyone working or in Middle Class) is benefiting from the Democrats putting this upon us?   It's also interesting that they gave themselves an out and don't have to abide by the laws that they saddled us with.

 It is almost impossible for someone on this forum (like myself) to explain your particular situation, except to say that since you get your insurance thru your employer, "Obamacare" probably has little or nothing to do with what you are paying, or any of the particulars of your plan. That is determined by your company. If they want to pay less, and put more of the burden on you, well, far as I know, there is no law against that.  However, I can tell of one situation I know of. Until Obamacare came along, I was paying the insurance for 2 of my kids at about $200 / month each. One of them did get insurance from their employer and I don't know what that cost is, but the other went to the Obamacare exchange and got a plan with a high deductible (which suits him at his age) and his wife for $50 / month. It also includes his 2 children, but somewhere or another, (that I don't fully understand) , the kids are on
what I think they call ALA care.  And as for me, Obamacare is saving me about $400 / month>

 As far as who gets the most money from Donors looking for favors both democrats and republicans are guilty

Well, here is what a couple of businessmen want. Their father was a founding member of the "John Birch Society" , and they are still pushing that old philosophy, and they have bought and paid for many , many politicians in the Republican party, the poster boy of which is Scott Walker. They want to privatize education because , of course , an educated person is quite difficult to control. These private schools wouldl teach only the Koch docterine. They are , even as I type, petitioning their paid for Republicans in Congress , to give them our national parks for exploitation , even if they have to buy them. End SS, Medicare, Environmental regulations, and basically end any governmental controls on their business, all while reducing their taxes to $0.. Inn short, they want to own the United States, be kings and have the rest of us begging for the scraps (jobs) from their table at whatever starvation wages they decide to pay. You need to decide if that is what you want for our country.
Too much to type this late, read more here:
http://www.truthdig.com/report...o_they_want_20140418

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07...s-for-2016.html?_r=0

 

http://obamacarefacts.com/obam...-insurance-premiums/

FACT: Some regions saw bigger premium hikes than others under the ACA. Also lower-income adults (under the 400% Federal Poverty Level) are the most likely to see a reduction in what they pay. Those with high-end plans, who had been in exclusive groups due to being healthy, saw the biggest premium increase. Post 2015 fluctuations, common as the law was transitioning to it’s new protections, are projected to curb and remain curbed over time.

 

Why Are Health Insurance Premiums Rising Under ObamaCare?

The primary cause of the insurance premium rate hikes under ObamaCare is the requirement for insurers to cover high-risk consumers. Insurance companies can no longer deny Americans with pre-existing conditions and can’t charge higher rates based on health status or gender. These factors, along with a few other required benefits, rights and protections (like the elimination of lifetime and annual dollar limits) led to rate increases between 2010 and 2014.

As far as I'm concerned, from what I've seen so far, Democratic Healthcare, (aka Obamacare or Affordable Healthcare act) is exactly like every other Government run program.  It cost the consumer far more than it would if the government had not got involved in the first place and it's cost overruns are much greater than ever proposed or promised.   Almost every promise about what it would bring has been a lie or false and Cost are far more than promised and stated whereas benefits are greatly lower.

 

It should be interesting to note that a great many of the Democrats who forced this upon us paid with their jobs as it should be.  Far more need to go and if the Republicans cannot reverse it or eliminate it then they also should go and allow someone who can get the government out of our homes and pockets.  Just my own opinion mind you.

 

You can almost guarantee yourself though that as the Democratic Healthcare plan gets worse and worse and people get more and more fed up with it the Democrats will find some way to blame it on the republicans who not one voted for it.  Why?  Because there are countless numbers of people who believe everything the DNC tells them and believe that the Democrats can never do wrong.  Somewhere along the line they lost track of when the Democratic party was lost to uber liberals and socialist.

 "The rich men have all the money and won't put it into circulation so the poor can buy things".  About 85% or more of our economy is consumer driven. 

-------------------

That is where we are at as a nation 

 

All the comments against Obama care, if you knew of a better plan, put it out there for the rest of us to see. Not just no, no, no. Something had to change. Pre-existing conditions, who covered them before?

Originally Posted by jtdavis:

 "The rich men have all the money and won't put it into circulation so the poor can buy things".  About 85% or more of our economy is consumer driven. 

-------------------

That is where we are at as a nation 

 

The above statement proves your dad had no idea of the causes of the Great Depression.  Of course, we are a consumer driven economy.  Most businesses that have products and/or services the public won't buy go bankrupt.  Government is the exception of course.  It either forces the public to use their services or has a monopoly on such. 

 

 

 

All the comments against Obama care, if you knew of a better plan, put it out there for the rest of us to see. Not just no, no, no. Something had to change. Pre-existing conditions, who covered them before?

 

It's just the facts. My insurance went up after uca. I personally know a man whose premiums tripled and copay went to  five thousand dollars.  And yes the Cadillac tax will eventually affect the middle class.  The current crop of democratic presidential candidates are promising all kinds of "free stuff". Who do you think is gonna pay for it!?

Jt's problem is the same as all the other demoslops, he doesn't think he should be told no about anything, and handed anything he can think of. HE'S not going to pay for it. He's going to squawk about "the rich", Republicans that is, and talk about how they should pay. People that work for a living are not responsible for the rest of the world and it is not fair to try to make them responsible.  Helping the truly needy is one thing, but old greedy, thieving, scamming things like we have today, with more coming in by the hundreds of thousands should not be our problem. There are people who go to work every day and still can't afford insurance, there are some that could afford it but think medical care should be given to them, and there are people that have lived off the system all their lives, generations of them, with more being shipped in and put on the system,  and they have medical care. Jt doesn't see anything wrong there because he thinks that is how people should live, laying around on their butts while "the rich" gives them everything. The rich in jt's case being any Republican or person making a dime more than he thinks they should get.

Originally Posted by jtdavis:

 "The rich men have all the money and won't put it into circulation so the poor can buy things".  About 85% or more of our economy is consumer driven. 

-------------------

Are you saying the rich should buy from the poor so they can have the

money of the rich.? The rich already put in 90% of Fed money so the poor

can buy things, it's called welfare. What do you suggest the rich do to put

money into the hands of the poor.? More are on the take than those on

the give.

 

And that's where we are at as a nation........ 

 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

All the comments against Obama care, if you knew of a better plan, put it out there for the rest of us to see. Not just no, no, no. Something had to change. Pre-existing conditions, who covered them before?

As well as the economy,,, I wish you had one ounce of sense of American

Health Care.

   

Even the the left knows Obamadon'care is a failure. While it's not a better plan, the goobermint-knows-best crowd in Colorado want single payer healthcare. I doubt that the plan will have the same quality of the best single payer system in the world, the VA hospital system; but you can bet it will have the same patient killing waiting periods on steroids.

 

http://www.denverpost.com/news...titions-single-payer

Originally Posted by HIFLYER2:

Hey

Seeweed why always mention the Kochs and never Soros?

Kochs are trying to buy the USA, and turn us into an oligarchy.

What is Soros trying to do that would hurt us ?
As to Soros, what is your problem with him anyway ? He fled his native country because he was ask by the ****s to out Jews, of which he was one in the closet. Went to England and eventually to the US. He made a fortune (actually , isn't that the supposed American dream ?), then spent from his own fortune to help free his native country (along with a lot of Eastern Europe) from Communism (I would think that would make him a hero ).
He started being a whipping boy for the Republicans when he openly opposed George Bush and spent large sums of money to defeat him. (Again a show of extreme patriotism to rid the world and the US of a terrible oppressive leader)
So, you want to compare that to the leaders of the John Birch Society , and their push to : end Social Security, end Medicare and Medicaid , end all environmental controls on any business, end unions, replace public education with private education teaching only what they want taught ,and drive their taxes to $0 . Think about a country like that - they (and a few of their coneys)  would LITTERLY be kings in this country, and most everybody else would be fighting for the scraps (jobs) from their table at whatever starvation wage they elect to pay. 
If you think that in any way these two are somehow equal , you are sadly mistaken . That is not the country I want to leave to my grandchildren, and if that is what you want for yours, then shame on you.

 

Originally Posted by gbrk:

As far as I'm concerned, from what I've seen so far, Democratic Healthcare, (aka Obamacare or Affordable Healthcare act) is exactly like every other Government run program.  It cost the consumer far more than it would if the government had not got involved in the first place and it's cost overruns are much greater than ever proposed or promised.   Almost every promise about what it would bring has been a lie or false and Cost are far more than promised and stated whereas benefits are greatly lower.

 

It should be interesting to note that a great many of the Democrats who forced this upon us paid with their jobs as it should be.  Far more need to go and if the Republicans cannot reverse it or eliminate it then they also should go and allow someone who can get the government out of our homes and pockets.  Just my own opinion mind you.

 

You can almost guarantee yourself though that as the Democratic Healthcare plan gets worse and worse and people get more and more fed up with it the Democrats will find some way to blame it on the republicans who not one voted for it.  Why?  Because there are countless numbers of people who believe everything the DNC tells them and believe that the Democrats can never do wrong.  Somewhere along the line they lost track of when the Democratic party was lost to uber liberals and socialist.

Truth is that I supported (and still do) a single payer plan - Medicare for all. What we all now call Obamacare was not the original Liberal solution , but was dreamed up by the Heritage Foundation, a right wing think tank, to replace "Hillary Care" . Romney used it as a model , and Obama thought he could get support from the Republicvans for universal health care if he used their own model. He was very naive, either not realizing , or not accepting that the Republicans had all set a pact to obstruct ANYTHING that Obama wanted, even if it was good for the country.
So, don't blame it all on the Dems. Blame the Dems for not having the balls to stand up and put forth a truly Liberal solution.
In fact, my primary objection to the entire Obama presidency , until about a year or so ago, is that he tried too hard to negotiate with Republicans who had no intention of negotiating with him on anything.
That sort of thing can be seen still as Paul Ryan has publically stated that he will NOT consider taking up immigration reform as long as Obama is president, just to spite him.
Let that sink in awhile.

 

No place in the world is the liberal solutions working for the average  "working person".  I looked up the shining example, Denmark, that the communist bernie sanders is always talking about. Taxes out the wazoo, and what really takes the cake is a $5.41 tax per gallon of gas!  That ain't the price, that is the tax.  Please, for the sake of all the working folks, if that is what you want, move to denmark!

Originally Posted by Jack Flash:
Originally Posted by jtdavis:

 "The rich men have all the money and won't put it into circulation so the poor can buy things".  About 85% or more of our economy is consumer driven. 

-------------------

Are you saying the rich should buy from the poor so they can have the

money of the rich.? The rich already put in 90% of Fed money so the poor

can buy things, it's called welfare. What do you suggest the rich do to put

money into the hands of the poor.? More are on the take than those on

the give.

 

And that's where we are at as a nation........ 

 

At current tax rates on the wealthy, starting with Reagan, it is more tempting to "take the money and run"  AKA take corporate profits  and put them offs**** in bank accounts, than to reinvest that money back in their businesses, which would grow the businesses , and hire more people. The need to hire more people would put pressure on the salary end of the job market , causing salarys to rise. (a similiar approach FDR used to lift the US out of the Great Depression, except he used high paying government jobs to create the job competition  that forced big business to pay higher wages)

 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

All the comments against Obama care, if you knew of a better plan, put it out there for the rest of us to see. Not just no, no, no. Something had to change. Pre-existing conditions, who covered them before?

A better plan would be single payer, aka Medicare for all. Currently , as far as I know, only Bernie Sanders supports that  publicly .

As well as the economy,,, I wish you had one ounce of sense of American

Health Care.

   

 

Jt's problem is the same as all the other demoslops, he doesn't think he should be told no about anything, and handed anything he can think of. HE'S not going to pay for it. 

-------------------

Best, I've probably paid for more in my life than you ever have.

==============

 Jt doesn't see anything wrong there because he thinks that is how people should live, laying around on their butts while "the rich" gives them everything. 

Some more of your DA lies. If you ever find out how much you don't know as opposed to what you think you know, you'll need some professional counseling.

 

 

 

Originally Posted by seeweed:
Originally Posted by HIFLYER2:

Hey

Seeweed why always mention the Kochs and never Soros?

Kochs are trying to buy the USA, and turn us into an oligarchy.

What is Soros trying to do that would hurt us ?
As to Soros, what is your problem with him anyway ? He fled his native country because he was ask by the ****s to out Jews, of which he was one in the closet. Went to England and eventually to the US. He made a fortune (actually , isn't that the supposed American dream ?), then spent from his own fortune to help free his native country (along with a lot of Eastern Europe) from Communism (I would think that would make him a hero ).
He started being a whipping boy for the Republicans when he openly opposed George Bush and spent large sums of money to defeat him. (Again a show of extreme patriotism to rid the world and the US of a terrible oppressive leader)
So, you want to compare that to the leaders of the John Birch Society , and their push to : end Social Security, end Medicare and Medicaid , end all environmental controls on any business, end unions, replace public education with private education teaching only what they want taught ,and drive their taxes to $0 . Think about a country like that - they (and a few of their coneys)  would LITTERLY be kings in this country, and most everybody else would be fighting for the scraps (jobs) from their table at whatever starvation wage they elect to pay. 
If you think that in any way these two are somehow equal , you are sadly mistaken . That is not the country I want to leave to my grandchildren, and if that is what you want for yours, then shame on you.

 

Ok Ill bite two sides of the same coin the Kochs & Soros.  Soros funds many things I cannot stand and I think are against Americans best interest such as ACORN, the Ferguson Riots etc.

http://www.washingtontimes.com...es-to-spur/?page=all

For a lengthy list here

http://www.discoverthenetworks...Category.asp?id=1237

 

Originally Posted by seeweed:
Originally Posted by gbrk:

As far as I'm concerned, from what I've seen so far, Democratic Healthcare, (aka Obamacare or Affordable Healthcare act) is exactly like every other Government run program.  It cost the consumer far more than it would if the government had not got involved in the first place and it's cost overruns are much greater than ever proposed or promised.   Almost every promise about what it would bring has been a lie or false and Cost are far more than promised and stated whereas benefits are greatly lower.

 

It should be interesting to note that a great many of the Democrats who forced this upon us paid with their jobs as it should be.  Far more need to go and if the Republicans cannot reverse it or eliminate it then they also should go and allow someone who can get the government out of our homes and pockets.  Just my own opinion mind you.

 

You can almost guarantee yourself though that as the Democratic Healthcare plan gets worse and worse and people get more and more fed up with it the Democrats will find some way to blame it on the republicans who not one voted for it.  Why?  Because there are countless numbers of people who believe everything the DNC tells them and believe that the Democrats can never do wrong.  Somewhere along the line they lost track of when the Democratic party was lost to uber liberals and socialist.

Truth is that I supported (and still do) a single payer plan - Medicare for all. What we all now call Obamacare was not the original Liberal solution , but was dreamed up by the Heritage Foundation, a right wing think tank, to replace "Hillary Care" . Romney used it as a model , and Obama thought he could get support from the Republicvans for universal health care if he used their own model. He was very naive, either not realizing , or not accepting that the Republicans had all set a pact to obstruct ANYTHING that Obama wanted, even if it was good for the country.
So, don't blame it all on the Dems. Blame the Dems for not having the balls to stand up and put forth a truly Liberal solution.
In fact, my primary objection to the entire Obama presidency , until about a year or so ago, is that he tried too hard to negotiate with Republicans who had no intention of negotiating with him on anything.
That sort of thing can be seen still as Paul Ryan has publically stated that he will NOT consider taking up immigration reform as long as Obama is president, just to spite him.
Let that sink in awhile.

_____________________________________________________________

Once more, Canada and the Soviet Union were the only nations that have tried single payer. 

 

Medicare with Part B, necessary supplemental insurance and Part D is not a single payer.

There are conflicting reports as to doctors dropping Medicare or not accepting new Medicare patients.

 

I member when Democrats used to cite VA as an exemplar of single payer.  Yesterday, VA officials took the Fifth 16 times when queried by a Congressional committee. 

 

 

 

Add Reply

Post

Untitled Document
×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×