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In the first place, the Bible itself doesn't say anywhere in it's 73 books that it's

all you will ever need to be a Christian. If it were totally sufficient then all the

information regarding Christianity would be in said Bible. The information to

determine just exactly what is Christianity isn't anywhere in the Bible, so it can't

be the sole source of Christian teaching. History or history of the Bible shows

clearly it was the Church who made the Bible. It speaks of Christians before

the New Testament was written. The book of Acts describes the early church

from the ascension and going forward with christian people.

 

How could Peter, John, Paul, James ans Andrew be christians if they never

had a copy of the New Testament? They had the Old Testament, the preaching

and tradition of the Church. The Church is older than the New Testament.

 

 

And I know who will quote 2 Tim 3: 14-17.

14 But continue thou in those things which thou hast learned, and which have been committed to thee: knowing of whom thou hast learned them;

15 And because from thy infancy thou hast known the holy scriptures, which can instruct thee to salvation, by the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

16  All scripture, inspired of God, is profitable to teach, to reprove, to correct,

to instruct in justice,

17 That the man of God may be perfect, furnished to every good work.

 

 

The word is "Profitable" but it doesn't say "all you need" or even sufficient.

It does say a person can be well prepared for doing good works.

Paul is expressing what he means by the scriptures of the Old Testament and

that would be the Seputagint. The Bible is helpful and some points may be

necessary but not absolute and end of the conversation.

 

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Hi all,

 

Wisdom from Vic (please, no laughing!):  "In the first place, the Bible itself doesn't say anywhere in it's 73 books that it's all you will ever need to be a Christian.  If it were totally sufficient then all the information regarding Christianity would be in said Bible.  The information to determine just exactly what is Christianity isn't anywhere in the Bible, so it can't be the sole source of Christian teaching.  History or history of the Bible shows clearly it was the Church who made the Bible.   It speaks of Christians before the New Testament was written.  The book of Acts describes the early church from the ascension and going forward with christian people."

 

The Biblically illiterate, Vatican brainwashed has spoken -- and the anti-God crowd has chirped in, "Yeah, you go, Vic!  We all know the Bible is just a myth!"

 

And, so, our dear Friend, Vic, slips further into his Vatican induced coma. 

 

I ask all true Christians to pray for Vic -- and for all his supporting cast -- the atheists, agnostics, secularists, and just plain old "I don't believe God" crowd.  Just maybe our prayers can save at least one of them.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

 

2 Timothy 3-16,17a - Canyon

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Guess what Vic nobody cares. If you can show clear proof of traditions handed down by the apostles not contained in the Bible show us. Jesus and the Apostles had the law and the prophets we have the Bible. I don't worship the Bible but I do look there for guidance.If you have traditions that you feel help you in your walk good for you. But you and Crusts repeated belittling of other beliefs prove you're as narcissistic as Bill ever thought about being.

Originally Posted by Red Baron:

Guess what Vic nobody cares. If you can show clear proof of traditions handed down by the apostles not contained in the Bible show us. Jesus and the Apostles had the law and the prophets we have the Bible. I don't worship the Bible but I do look there for guidance.If you have traditions that you feel help you in your walk good for you. But you and Crusts repeated belittling of other beliefs prove you're as narcissistic as Bill ever thought about being.

I disagree RB, billie has belittled me from day one and still does with everything
I post. No one I know of here is more critical of just about everyone and every-

thing than billie. He will immediately put me in a defensive mode if I think about

saying something.

Originally Posted by Red Baron:

Guess what Vic nobody cares. If you can show clear proof of traditions handed down by the apostles not contained in the Bible show us. Jesus and the Apostles had the law and the prophets we have the Bible. I don't worship the Bible but I do look there for guidance.If you have traditions that you feel help you in your walk good for you. But you and Crusts repeated belittling of other beliefs prove you're as narcissistic as Bill ever thought about being.

_____________

Do you put up a Christmas tree in December?

Red, I care. I also would love to see the proof of those traditions not contained in the Bible. I would also love to see proof of OSAS. I’ve given scriptures many times that disprove OSAS but no one can prove to me that those scriptures are not true. Give 10 people the same scripture & you will get 10 different opinions of what that scripture means. How do you determine which one is correct? You can’t.

 

Baptist, Methodist, COC, Pentecostal, Catholic……all denominations believe their beliefs to be the correct one.

 

Vic says the Catholic church is the “one true church” but has never presented any proof. If they are the one “True” church, how is anyone belonging to or being a part of another church going to Heaven if they are not part of the “True” church? The COC believe they are the only ones going to Heaven but they’ve never proven it to my satisfaction. 

 

The OSAS Baptist bunch believe once they’re saved, they always will be no matter what they do. I hope you get what I’m saying. It has to be one, not all. That’s probably why the Bible says there will be more people in Hell than Heaven. Gonna be a bunch of Christians going that had it all wrong.

 

As far as Bill’s narcissistic behavior, have you read the symptoms of NPD? He has the majority of them, they describe him to a T. How anyone sees Bill’s behavior as “Christ Like” is beyond me. If you believe the Bible, & I think you do, it says a Christian is someone that’s Christ Like.

 

You may not see it, but to anyone standing out looking in, Bill Gray is not one that could lead someone to Christ, or even make a person want to be led to Christ.

 

You said you look to the Bible for guidance. Get your Bible out, compare the work of Satan to the work of Christ & if you're honest, you will see who Bill is working for.

 

I'm not putting anyone down in the way they believe. My post is just giving you an idea of the many questions I have. I know most of you don't care, some of you get tired of my opinions/questions & I have no problem with that.

 

Originally Posted by jtdavis:

Reading about the books left out of the bible (King James ?) got me to wondering, can anyone suggest a book that I can buy that names the books left out, a condensed account of the contents, and why they were left out. (I don't want to read a 1,000 page book)

jt, this is a very short answer for those seven books. RB mentions a good
book for this, Lost Scriptures by Bart Ehrman.

 

 

Those books would be

I and 2 Maccabees, Sirach, Wisdom, Baruch, Tobit and Judith.

He removed these primarily for doctrinal reasons, II Maccabees

supports the doctrine of Purgatory but this isn't the only source for this subject.

Maybe he was told the council of Jamnia around 100AD rejected these books.

History is unclear about that but it's possible they did, one thing's for sure and

that would be they didn't have the authority and it was never a official council.

 

These books weren't written in Hebrew but they were a part of the Septuagint

of the Jewish scripture. During the Hellenic period many Jews spoke Greek.

So the Jewish scriptures were translated  into Greek. They wern't written in

Hebrew but they were scripture used by the Hebrew people.

 

So if billie chooses to reject the Septuagint because the Jews did, why not

reject Christ in the New Tesyament? The Jews didn't reject the seven books

as a whole for about 250 years. From the completion of the Septuagint to the

school of Jamnia a large group of Greek speaking Jews were happy to use

the Septuagint. This group of Jews included Jesus and His disciples.

 

 

Jerome didn't really reject the Septuagint but he did have misgivings about them.

He felt the scriptures written in Hebrew were superior but agreed to the authority

of the Church and the pope and included them in his translation. Jerome was

criticized for his views on the Septuagint, and he flew in the face of most

scholarship of the time.

Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:

And when did someone come up with the notion that good Christians should go about name calling and mud slinging. 

_________

I've never found it in the Bible. I think the notion came from those "Christians' that believe they have all the answers & gets angry if someone tries to show them differently. And of course, those that are working for Satan.

Hi JT,

You ask, "Reading about the books left out of the bible (King James ?) got me to wondering, can anyone suggest a book that I can buy that names the books left out, a condensed account of the contents, and why they were left out.  (I don't want to read a 1,000 page book)"

I will give you two short articles regarding the Apocrypha.   The first is an article from CARM (Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry).  I have shown only the initial introduction of the article.  But, if you want to read, it will explain what the apocrypha is and why it is not a legitimate part of the Christian Bible.

 
Reasons Why The Apocrypha Does Not Belong In The Bible
by Ryan Turner
http://carm.org/why-apocrypha-not-in-bible

Catholics and Protestants disagree regarding the exact number of books that belong in the Old Testament Scriptures.  The dispute between them is over seven books, part of what is known as the Apocrypha: 1 and 2 Maccabees, Sirach (Ecclesiasticus), Wisdom
(Wisdom of Solomon), Baruch, Tobit, Judith, and additions to Daniel and Esther.1  However, there are a number of reasons why the Old Testament Apocrypha should not be part of the Canon, or standard writings of Scripture.


Article continued on the CARM web page.

 

This next article or web page is what you had asked for -- a brief description of each of the Apocryphal books.  On this web page, if you will scroll down about half way you will find these descriptions.


The Old Testament Canon and Apocrypha
http://www.bible-researcher.com/canon2.html

The Apocryphal Books:

Apocrypha is a Greek word meaning things hidden, and in ancient times this word was applied to religious writings esteemed almost as scripture by some, but which were not read to the unlearned in public. In modern Protestant usage the word "apocrypha" refers to all those writings which have wrongly been regarded as scripture by many in the church.

Brief Descriptions of the Apocryphal Books:

 

Article continued on the web page.


In 382 AD, Pope Damasus I commissioned Jerome to translate Scripture into Latin for the Roman Catholic church.  By the 16th century the Latin Vulgate had become the definitive and officially promulgated Latin version of the Bible in the Roman Catholic Church.

When Jerome translated the Bible into Latin for the Roman Catholic church -- he initially left out the Apocryphal books because he did not believe them to be accepted Bible canon.  However, since he was working for he Pope -- and the Pope insisted that the Apocryphal books be included -- Jerome put them into the Latin Vulgate Bible.

Why did Pope Damasus insist upon having the Apocryphal books in their Bible?   Because most of the Roman Catholic doctrines are found in Apocrypha and not in the 66 book of the canonized Bible.  Without the Apocrypha, most of the Roman Catholic teachings would have no support. 

 

This is why the Roman Catholic church cannot allow the Apocrypha to be removed -- for then the Roman Catholic church would be a house with no foundation.

I pray this has been helpful.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

Bible - 66 BOOKS

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True Catholics don't have a disagreement of what books belong in the Bible.

That was settled in the year 382 AD. The Holy Spirit closed the Christian

Bible back then and will never change. Martin Luther wanted to invent a new

theology with a bible to better fit his thinking. The origin of the books have

been explained many times and it's still the same books Jesus taught from

along with the Apostles. If someone would disagree with this, OK, take the

bible of your choice and go with it. Leave others to their choice.

 

Just don't tell me I'm wrong when you haven't a valid reason. When all you

have is the wish of some guy 1500 years after the fact.

 

semi said

Vic says the Catholic church is the "one true church" but has never presented any proof. If they are the one "True" church, how is anyone belonging to or being a part of another church going to Heaven if they are not part of the "True" church?

 

semi, first, there's a unbroken line of documentation from the early Church

writers to the present day. They personally knew and were taught by the

Apostles, especially John who lived the longest. They were committed to the

record keeping of all goings on concerning Church and personal and histories.

They made the Bible from the knowledge and information of the Apostles and

earlier Church writers that supplied significant and valid sources of Christian

knowledge and understanding.

 

Taking into account the words of Jesus from the book of Matthew there isn't

any doubt Jesus made Peter the head of his Church and he would protect it

until he returned. He gave Peter the Keys to Heaven and power over the

Church. And the succession of the Church leaders would be protected

to the end of time. Which again, will be until the second coming of Christ.

This line of church leaders and history has been recorded and backed up

with the natural history of the world.

 

I never said Catholics were the only ones going to Heaven. There will be

people from every walk of life going there. No one on earth can make that

call except God. I did say the Church called Catholic is the Church Jesus

created was recorded in the Bible. The earliest Doctors and writers of the

Church called themselves Catholic when the name was first used in the year

110 AD and the name stuck. If this isn't enough semi tell me.

 

Originally Posted by semiannualchick:

 Give 10 people the same scripture & you will get 10 different opinions of what that scripture means. How do you determine which one is correct? You can’t.

 

Baptist, Methodist, COC, Pentecostal, Catholic……all denominations believe their beliefs to be the correct one.

 -------------------------------

Semi, I believe all true Christians, regardless of their denomination, have one thing in common... They share in their trust in God's love and their belief that God sent His son Jesus to die on the Cross to purge us of our sins. And they believe that we need to accept Jesus Christ as our Savior and lead our lives in a way that would please Him... 

 

Much of what you read here bears little resemblance to true Christian life... Too much real hatred, intolerance and name calling... I too slip into name calling myself sometimes and I beg God's forgiveness... Some others deny their intolerance of others and their bigotry, or refuse to admit to it. Yet others actually believe that they are doing God's work when in reality they are doing quite the opposite...

 

All in all, it presents a very sad picture of Christianity... What can a true Christian do? I believe that we can simply live a life of truth and honesty which we believe will be pleasing to God and to give thanks to Him daily...

God is love!

 

 

Originally Posted by Dove of Peace:
Originally Posted by semiannualchick:

 Give 10 people the same scripture & you will get 10 different opinions of what that scripture means. How do you determine which one is correct? You can’t.

 

Baptist, Methodist, COC, Pentecostal, Catholic……all denominations believe their beliefs to be the correct one.

 -------------------------------

Semi, I believe all true Christians, regardless of their denomination, have one thing in common... They share in their trust in God's love and their belief that God sent His son Jesus to die on the Cross to purge us of our sins. And they believe that we need to accept Jesus Christ as our Savior and lead our lives in a way that would please Him... 

 

Much of what you read here bears little resemblance to true Christian life... Too much real hatred, intolerance and name calling... I too slip into name calling myself sometimes and I beg God's forgiveness... Some others deny their intolerance of others and their bigotry, or refuse to admit to it. Yet others actually believe that they are doing God's work when in reality they are doing quite the opposite...

 

All in all, it presents a very sad picture of Christianity... What can a true Christian do? I believe that we can simply live a life of truth and honesty which we believe will be pleasing to God and to give thanks to Him daily...

God is love!

 

 

----------------------------------

God is Love!

Originally Posted by INVICTUS:

I never said Catholics were the only ones going to Heaven. There will be

people from every walk of life going there. No one on earth can make that

call except God. I did say the Church called Catholic is the Church Jesus

created was recorded in the Bible. The earliest Doctors and writers of the

Church called themselves Catholic when the name was first used in the year 110 AD and the name stuck. If this isn't enough semi tell me.

_________

No, you've never said Catholics were the only ones going to Heaven, & I'm sorry if it sounded like I was saying that. The point I was trying to make was a question, not a statement, & certainly not a statement that you made. I ask how anyone belonging to or being a part of another church can go to Heaven if they are not part of the “True” church? If people from every walk of life can go to Heaven, then why did God make one "True" church? Why wouldn't "just a church" do instead of a "true" church. A "True" church could be taken to mean the only church. 

Do you not agree that the reason there will be more people in Hell then Heaven is because there's some people possibly in the wrong church? Notice I said some, not all.

Semi,

I have bounced around from church to church under the denomination I was raised in. Recently, I went to a church of another denomination and the minute I walked in I felt true peace.

 

i have joined this church and am becoming more involved with it. I feel that God led me to this church and it is my "true church". I have come to believe that I needed to stop and listen to what God is trying to tell me. I haven't been a good listener in the past.

 

I think that each of us must find our own "true church", a place where we can stop and listen........

Originally Posted by Ubu:

Semi,

Recently, I went to a church of another denomination and the minute I walked in I felt true peace.

i have joined this church and am becoming more involved with it. I feel that God led me to this church and it is my "true church".

______

Except for the Recently part, I think you're my husband.

 

I think when Vic uses the term "true church", he means the only church that God invented/made.

Hi all,

 

My agnostic Friend, Chick, tells us, "Give 10 people the same scripture and you will get 10 different opinions of what that scripture means.  How do you determine which one is correct?  You can’t."

 

Regardless of how many opinions you get from different people -- there is still only one true intended meaning for all of Scripture.   God is not a God of confusion (1 Corinthians 14:33).  He has given His full revelation to man for our salvation and to guide us in our Christian walk.  That is found in His Bible.

 

So, where do all the different Scripture interpretations come from?  How can, as my agnostic Friend tells us, ten people read the same Scripture verse and come up with different meanings?

 

I believe that can be traced to three words:  Hermeneutics, Exegesis, and Eisegesis

  • Hermeneutics:  The science of Biblical interpretation.  The "science" involves the study of the ancient languages and the individual words in which a Biblical passage is written.  We find the meaning, the original intent, of what the inspired original writer meant to convey to the reader -- by taking into consideration the historical time period, the culture of those times, and information within the entire context of the text.  And, we often need to use information from other Scripture verses or passages to confirm our understanding of the Scripture passage being explored.   There is a very true maxim which comes into play:  "Scripture illuminates and explains Scripture."
  • Exegesis:  Reading FROM Scripture the message God inspired to be originally written.
  • Eisegesis:  Reading INTO Scripture what is not there, in an attempt to make it fit a preconceived theology, theory, or desired meaning.  That is the main reason there are so many different church groups, fellowships, and denomination.  In planting or starting a new church fellowship -- people have often started with a desired theology in mind, and then attempted to make Scripture fit that desired theology.  We adapt to the Bible; we cannot make the Bible adapt to our desires and ideas.

More about Hermeneutics:

 

Question:  "What is biblical hermeneutics?"
http://www.gotquestions.org/Bi...al-hermeneutics.html

Answer:  Biblical hermeneutics is perhaps summarized best by 2 Timothy 2:15, "Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."

 

Biblical hermeneutics is the science of properly interpreting the various types of literature found in the Bible.  For example, a psalm should often be interpreted differently from a prophecy.  A proverb should be understood and applied differently from a law.  This is the purpose of biblical hermeneutics -- to help us to know how to interpret, understand, and apply the Bible.

The most important law of biblical hermeneutics is that the Bible should be interpreted literally.  Literal Bible interpretation means we understand the Bible in its normal/plain meaning.   The Bible says what it means and means what it says

 

Many make the mistake of trying to read between the lines and come up with meanings for Scriptures that are not truly in the text.  Yes, of course, there are some spiritual truths behind the plain meanings of Scripture.  That does not mean that every Scripture has a hidden spiritual truth, or that it should be our goal to find all such (hidden) spiritual truths. 

 

Biblical hermeneutics keeps us faithful to the intended meaning of Scripture and away from allegorizing and symbolizing Bible verses and passages that should be understood literally.

A second crucial law of biblical hermeneutics is that a verse or passage must be interpreted historically, grammatically, and contextually. 

 

Historical interpretation refers to understanding the culture, background, and situation which prompted the text. 

 

Grammatical interpretation is recognizing the rules of grammar and nuances of the Hebrew and Greek languages and applying those principles to the understanding of a passage. 

 

Contextual interpretation involves always taking the surrounding context of verses/passages into consideration when trying to determine the meaning.

 The goal of biblical hermeneutics is to point us to the correct interpretation which the Holy Spirit has already inspired into the text. 

 

The purpose of biblical hermeneutics is to protect us from improperly applying a Scripture to a particular situation. 

 

Biblical hermeneutics points us to the true meaning and application of Scripture.   Hebrews 4:12 declares, "For the word of God is living and active.  Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart."  Biblical hermeneutics is keeping the sword sharp!

Recommended Resource: "Basic Bible Interpretation" by Roy Zuck.

 

So, my agnostic Friend, Chick asks, "How do you determine which one is correct?"

Simple!  First, one must lay aside all preconceived ideas and desires.  Then, one must approach the Bible with an open mind, seeking to draw FROM Scripture the messages God has inspired into those writings.

 

If the person applies proper hermeneutics in his/her exegetical approach to the Bible -- that person will find the true interpretation and message intended by God.

 

God created man in His image; but Adam blew it and brought physical death and spiritual separation from God upon all mankind.  But, God, in His divine love for man, gave us one sure means to be reconciled to Him -- Jesus Christ, the Perfect Lamb upon the cross. 

 

And, He gave us one complete revelation, His Holy Spirit inspired Bible, showing us how we can obtain that salvation which Jesus Christ has purchased for us, His "paid in full" gift of eternal life for all who, by grace, through faith, will believe and receive that precious free gift of life.

 

So, my Friend, yes, we can truly know what Scripture is telling us -- if we will lay aside what we want to tell Scripture.  Then, we can truly KNOW God's message and plan for our lives -- which He has given us in His Written Word, the Bible.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

 

2 Timothy 2-15 - Bible Inspired By God

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Originally Posted by Bill Gray:

 

 

My agnostic Friend, Chick, tells us, "Give 10 people the same scripture and you will get 10 different opinions of what that scripture means.  How do you determine which one is correct?  You can’t."

 ~~~~~~~~~

>>> Useless ramblings clipped<<<

 ~~~~~~~~~

So, my Friend, yes, we can truly know what Scripture is telling us -- if we will lay aside what we want to tell Scripture.  Then, we can truly KNOW God's message and plan for our lives -- which He has given us in His Written Word, the Bible.

 

So billie, if you believe what you said above, would you tell me what this

scripture is truly saying.

 

Ephesians 1: 13

 13 In whom ye alsotrusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

 

 

quote:   Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
quote:  Originally Posted by Bill Gray:

My agnostic Friend, Chick, tells us, "Give 10 people the same scripture and you will get 10 different opinions of what that scripture means.  How do you determine which one is correct?  You can’t."

. . .

So, my Friend, yes, we can truly know what Scripture is telling us -- if we will lay aside what we want to tell Scripture.  Then, we can truly KNOW God's message and plan for our lives -- which He has given us in His Written Word, the Bible.

 

So billie, if you believe what you said above, would you tell me what this scripture is truly saying.

 

Ephesians 1:13, "In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise," 

Hi Vic,

 

So happy to see you accurately quoting Scripture; even if it is, as usual, without your own personal interpretation and/or explanation of what YOU believe that Scripture verse/passage is telling us. 

 

Yes, my Friend, I can help you understand that Scripture verse.   I see that you have chosen to quote the King James which is fine.  The New King James and the New American Standard say basically the same thing:

 

Ephesians 1:13 (kjv), "In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,"

 

Ephesians 1:13 (nkjv), "In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the Gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,"

 

Ephesians 1:13 (nasb), "In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the Gospel of your salvation -- having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,"

Let's go one step further and look at the actual Greek:

 

Ephesians 1:13 (TR), "In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the Gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,"

 

And, with English and Greek together:

 

Ephesians 1:13 (TR), "In (en) whom (hos) ye (hymeis) also (kai) trusted, after that ye heard (akouo) the word (logos) of truth (aletheia), the gospel (euaggelion) of your (hymon) salvation (soteria): in (en) whom (hos) also (kai) after that ye believed (pisteuo), ye were sealed with (sphragizo) that holy (hagios) Spirit (pneuma) of promise (epaggelia)."

 

Textus Receptus (TR):  The Textus Receptus (latin, "Received Text") is the Greek text originally compiled by Erasmus around 1516.  Though the earliest work was prepared by Desiderius Erasmus, his work was later revised by Robert Estienne (or, Stephanus) and further revised by Theodore Beza.  The text produced by each is substantially the same, aside from some minor variations.  The Blue Letter Bible utilizes Stephanus' edition from 1550.

So, now that we are sure of what that Scripture verse tells us -- what does it mean?   Glad you asked!

 

"In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the Gospel of your salvation."   That seems pretty clear, we heard the Gospel of salvation -- that Jesus Christ died on the cross so that ALL who, by the grace of God, through FAITH in Jesus Christ and His finished work on the cross -- will believe and receive His gift HAS eternal life.  Eternal meaning NEVER ending!

 

"having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit"   Once again, very clear.  When we heard the Gospel and believed that Gospel -- we were INDWELLED and SEALED by the Holy Spirit.   Once the Holy Spirit has SEALED a believer -- nothing or NO ONE can break that seal. 

 

It is unbreakable since He, God, is omnipotent, all powerful.  For anyone to break God's SEAL, that person would have to be more powerful than God

 

My Friend, do YOU know anyone who is more powerful than God?

 

And, in Ephesians 4:30, we are told, "Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption."

 

In other words, the believer who has put his/her FAITH in Jesus Christ -- is SEALED until the day our Redeemer Kinsman, Jesus Christ, comes for us.  That will be the moment of our death in this mortal body -- or the time when we are Raptured out of this mortal body.

 

My Friend, that IS "eternal security" -- KNOWING that we have eternal life in Christ and that NO ONE can take that from us.   Praise God!

 

I am so happy we have had this opportunity to discuss Scripture and God's message of salvation and eternal life found in it.   Do you have any questions or thoughts on Ephesians 1:13 that I have missed?

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

 

Ephesians 1-13 - Lone Cypress - Monterey, CA - Pastor Ed Dacio

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quote:  Originally Posted by INVICTUS:

Just what I thought, ridiculous, why didn't you throw some pig Latin in that mix of useless information. Anyway, after I said what I thought Eph 1:13 was about I just wanted to see your latest home remedy.

Hi Vic,

 

Your previous comment on Ephesians 1:13 was:

 

So billie, if you believe what you said above, would you tell me what this scripture is truly saying.

 

Ephesians 1: 13

 13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

 

And, I did give you a full explanation of Ephesians 1:13 and what it really means.

 

Then, you come back with this absolutely inane comment.  Is this what you meant when you wrote:  "after I said what I thought Eph 1:13 was about"?  All you have done in that previous quote was to quote the Scripture verse -- and then ask my help in understanding it.  Which I was happy to do, for I like the help the Biblically challenged.

 

But, if that is what you consider explaining a Scripture passage or verse -- I have to believe that you even flunked Catechism 101.  My Friend, can you even spell BIBLE?

 

Vic, my Friend, I am not sure if you are just that brainwashed, or just that confused -- very definitely Biblically illiterate -- or if you are just like the little kid who bangs his head against the wall while yelling to himself, "I am right!  I am right!  I am right!  Mommy, make those bad people leave me alone!"

 

Vic, my Friend, since your priests will not allow you to try to interpret Scripture -- I will be happy to help you at any time.  We can have a one-on-one Bible study -- but, only from the 66 books of the true Bible canon.

 

Maybe you can even invite your alter-ego, Dove, to join us in a Bible study.

 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

 

Bill

Bible - 66 BOOKS

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  • Bible - 66 BOOKS
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
So billie, would you tell me what this scripture is truly saying.

Ephesians 1: 13

 13 In whom ye alsotrusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

__________

I hope your asking Bill for knowledge about any scripture is sarcasm? The man is a fool & knows nothing.

Originally Posted by semiannualchick:
Originally Posted by INVICTUS:
So billie, would you tell me what this scripture is truly saying.

Ephesians 1: 13

 13 In whom ye alsotrusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

__________

I hope your asking Bill for knowledge about any scripture is sarcasm? The man is a fool & knows nothing.

 

No I wasn't, billie doesn't have Biblical knowledge. I wasn't asking him

for help I just wanted to see what he would say about that verse.

 

Originally Posted by Bestworking:

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, guess that means someone IS paying him after all. At least it wasn't another picture of that ugly little baby with the smushed up face, or the ugly little troll with the spaghetti on it's head. Poor kids, hope their looks improved as they grew.

Dam Best, those are his great great great grandkids-in-law. They have
papers on them and stuff. California thumpers in the fast lane. nice

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