LinkI`m wondering would this man be alive if he lived in this country?Even without insurance I believe he would have had a better chance of survival here with our health care system as opposed to the one he lived under.Any thoughts?
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Hospitals can not refuse treatment due to a lack of insurance.Try again.quote:Originally posted by luvurnabor:
Are you kidding? this happens every day in this country.
Except in this country he would have been sent home, then he could have called an ambulance, which would have taken him to another hospital, which would have refused to admit him without insurance.
You two must be living in the twilight zone.
quote:Tape shows woman dying on waiting room floor
NEW YORK (CNN) -- A 49-year-old woman collapsed and died on the floor of a waiting room at a Brooklyn psychiatric hospital and lay there for more than an hour as employees ignored her, according to the New York Civil Liberties Union, which on Tuesday released surveillance camera video of the incident.
Surveillance video shows a woman lying on the hospital floor for almost an hour before anyone helped her.
Esmin Green was involuntarily admitted to the psychiatric emergency department of Kings County Hospital Center on June 18 for what the hospital describes as "agitation and psychosis."
Upon her admission, Green waited nearly 24 hours for treatment, said the civil liberties union, which was among the groups filing suit against the facility last year seeking improved conditions for patients.
The surveillance camera video shows the woman rolling off a waiting room chair, landing face-down on the floor and convulsing. Her collapse came at 5:32 a.m. June 19, the NYCLU said, and she stopped moving at 6:07 a.m. During that time, the organization said, workers at the hospital ignored her.
At 6:35 a.m., the tape shows a hospital employee approaching and nudging Green with her foot, the group said. Help was summoned three minutes later. Video Watch the surveillance video »
In addition, the organization said, hospital staff falsified Green's records to cover up the time she had lain there without assistance.
"Contrary to what was recorded from four different angles by the hospital's video cameras, the patient's medical records say that at 6 a.m., she got up and went to the bathroom, and at 6:20 a.m. she was 'sitting quietly in waiting room' -- more than 10 minutes since she last moved and 48 minutes after she fell to the floor."
Linkquote:Kings County Hospital Center is a hospital located at 451 Clarkson Avenue in East Flatbush, Brooklyn, New York City. It is under the umbrella of the New York City Health and Hospitals Corporation (HHC), the municipal agency which runs New York City's public hospitals.
quote:Originally posted by geddon97:Hospitals can not refuse treatment due to a lack of insurance.Try again.quote:Originally posted by luvurnabor:
Are you kidding? this happens every day in this country.
Except in this country he would have been sent home, then he could have called an ambulance, which would have taken him to another hospital, which would have refused to admit him without insurance.
You two must be living in the twilight zone.
quote:Originally posted by autumn1964:
That's true, DHS. Privately owned hospitals can refuse treatment or send the patient to a publicly owned hospital.
ECM, Shoals, and Keller are all publicly owned, and can't refuse treatment. They treat everyone, insurance or no insurance.
Just an FYI to everyone, if it's after hours and you are sick, your best bet is to call your primary care doctor (if you have one). Their answering service will take a message and call him/her or whatever doctor is on call for him/her. The doctor should call you back, and MAY call you in a prescription IF they feel the situation is not serious. I suggest you try that first before heading to the ERs to wait for hours.
If you think ER wait time is bad now, it would only be worse if it becomes socialized.
quote:Originally posted by excelman:
To date, there are no plans in this country for single payer (what you refer to as "socialized medecine". However, there are plans for an affordable universally available health insurance, and I personally believe that that is a very important issue.
I disagree with the assumption that things will get worse at ERs. On the contrary, if everybody has insurance, then hopefully they will not use the ER as their primary doctor, and therefore ERs can go back to being for emergencies.
Also, since everyone will be paying for their own health care needs, the hospital, will not have reason to pass the cost of indignant health care along to those of us who have insurance.
The total outcome, hopefully , should be more affordable health care for all, and insurance rates will go down.
quote:Originally posted by Smooth operator:
One experience that I had at Keller recently really got me to thinking. I was there for an outpatient procedure. I have very good insurance, but there are still deductibles and co-pays. While I was being admitted, I was told that before they would do the procedure, I had to pay my deductible (No one had mentioned this beforehand). Fortunately, I was able to pay the $250, but while I was writing my check out, there was a Latino girl in obvious labor. She could not speak any English, and could not even read Spanish. Needless to say, she had no insurance, and was never asked to make a payment. Although, I feel it was the right thing to do to treat her and her baby, I was was a little miffed at how payment was demanded from me, and my insurance had already guaranteed over 90% of the total amount. What do others of you think about this?
quote:Originally posted by Backwoods:quote:Originally posted by Smooth operator:
One experience that I had at Keller recently really got me to thinking. I was there for an outpatient procedure. I have very good insurance, but there are still deductibles and co-pays. While I was being admitted, I was told that before they would do the procedure, I had to pay my deductible (No one had mentioned this beforehand). Fortunately, I was able to pay the $250, but while I was writing my check out, there was a Latino girl in obvious labor. She could not speak any English, and could not even read Spanish. Needless to say, she had no insurance, and was never asked to make a payment. Although, I feel it was the right thing to do to treat her and her baby, I was was a little miffed at how payment was demanded from me, and my insurance had already guaranteed over 90% of the total amount. What do others of you think about this?
I'd say that and deadbeat pillheads are two of the biggest causes of rising health costs.I don't like the thought of refusing medical care to anyone but you have got to draw the line with illegal immigrants somewhere.It is not the taxpayers burden to feed feed and doctor everyone,ecspecially those who aren't even citizens.Plus,look how bad the Federal government screws up every thing else(except for our great military.)Do you really want them messing with your health insurance?
quote:Originally posted by DoctorDawg:
The single payor you speak of would have to be the federal government. Hospitals, doctors, other healthcare providers, could not stay afloat with the federal governments rate of payment alone. They would have to change their operating practices radically. They maintain their current practices because of private health insurers in general. Therefore, it is socialized medicine because the federal government would be telling us how to practice. Next, there could be potentially socialized Walmart. But remember, you never get something for nothing. When the government funds it, it usually ends up like section 8 housing.
Thanks for the info.quote:Originally posted by DHS-86:quote:Originally posted by geddon97:Hospitals can not refuse treatment due to a lack of insurance.Try again.quote:Originally posted by luvurnabor:
Are you kidding? this happens every day in this country.
Except in this country he would have been sent home, then he could have called an ambulance, which would have taken him to another hospital, which would have refused to admit him without insurance.
You two must be living in the twilight zone.
If they are government funded hospitals they can't refuse treatment for not having insurance. A private owned hospital, such as Humana, can and frequently does.
quote:Originally posted by SHELDIVR:
Okay, let's go over this once more,
S L O W L Y, Socialized medicine (government funded health care for everyone), is not that different from Social Security (government funded retirement). NOW, we know how well the government has administered that program (Social Security), it is fiscally broke and physically broke. We have paid in from our private funds, with the federal government as caretaker, more than three times sufficient monies to cover our social security retirement, but the federal government, CONGRESS, has raided, robbed, pillaged, pilfered, stolen, embezelled and otherwise stolen enough of our money from Social Security that they now declare THEY CAN'T fix it...Hmmmmmm you want these people to provide your health care???
quote:Originally posted by Smooth operator:
.. but while I was writing my check out, there was a Latino girl in obvious labor. She could not speak any English, and could not even read Spanish. Needless to say, she had no insurance, and was never asked to make a payment. Although, I feel it was the right thing to do to treat her and her baby, I was was a little miffed at how payment was demanded from me, and my insurance had already guaranteed over 90% of the total amount. What do others of you think about this?
quote:Originally posted by AlabamaSon:quote:Originally posted by Backwoods:quote:Originally posted by Smooth operator:
One experience that I had at Keller recently really got me to thinking. I was there for an outpatient procedure. I have very good insurance, but there are still deductibles and co-pays. While I was being admitted, I was told that before they would do the procedure, I had to pay my deductible (No one had mentioned this beforehand). Fortunately, I was able to pay the $250, but while I was writing my check out, there was a Latino girl in obvious labor. She could not speak any English, and could not even read Spanish. Needless to say, she had no insurance, and was never asked to make a payment. Although, I feel it was the right thing to do to treat her and her baby, I was was a little miffed at how payment was demanded from me, and my insurance had already guaranteed over 90% of the total amount. What do others of you think about this?
I'd say that and deadbeat pillheads are two of the biggest causes of rising health costs.I don't like the thought of refusing medical care to anyone but you have got to draw the line with illegal immigrants somewhere.It is not the taxpayers burden to feed feed and doctor everyone,ecspecially those who aren't even citizens.Plus,look how bad the Federal government screws up every thing else(except for our great military.)Do you really want them messing with your health insurance?
Who said she was an illegal immigrant?
quote:As to the hospitals and medical payment problems we choose to spend billions in Iraq rebuilding their economy rather than help our people here. Doesn't make sense to me. Those folks in Iraq are Iraqi citizens, not American. It only makes sense if we want Haliburton to take our money. Of course now we choose to help Cerberus and John Snow as well as Dick Cheney and Haliburton
quote:Originally posted by Backwoods:quote:As to the hospitals and medical payment problems we choose to spend billions in Iraq rebuilding their economy rather than help our people here. Doesn't make sense to me. Those folks in Iraq are Iraqi citizens, not American. It only makes sense if we want Haliburton to take our money. Of course now we choose to help Cerberus and John Snow as well as Dick Cheney and Haliburton
This discussion has NOTHING to do with the situation in Iraq.This has nothing to with Haliburton.All I'm saying is that everytime the Federal Government gets involved in something that has long been handled by private sector they mess it up.(Example:Fannie Mae,Freeie Mac,Social Security and a whole list of things.)After all,you hear that Social Security will be gone before I retire.So would I be better off to take the money the government steals from my check every week and invest myself or trust them to save ift for me along with bail out every doggone big businees that can't stay afloat.Let's face it.Our current crop of politicians (democrats and republicans alike)coulld screw up a steel ball with a rubber mallet.My main point is giving government more control over our healthcare options ain't the way to fix it.
quote:The US Health Care system ranks 37th behind industrialized nations. We have our share of horror stories and Insurance Premiums as well as Medical Costs are becoming unaffordable for millions of Americans.
I believe the Health System needs to be Socialized but a private system can also compete.
quote:You ignore high premiums which millions of people are denied or struggle to meet and control of the system by Insurance Companies where $$$ is the bottom line. Drug Companies too.