Hi to my Forum Friends,
In the long, long running discussion begun by our atheist Friend, Deep, and titled "Good Without God" -- my Friend, Firenze, has written, "There isn't a perfect person in the world, be it Christian, Jew, Buddhist, etc. Saying that Christians commit immoral acts is hardly a surprise to anyone. The basic difference is that Christians strive to do better."
And, I respond to her, "So true! A Christian believer is only a 'forgiven sinner.' Yes, we continue to fail, we continue to fall into sin, we continue to be weak humans. But, the difference is that we are convicted of our failures (the indwelling Holy Spirit) and we ask forgiveness and do our best to avoid that sin again. Will we always be successful in avoiding that sin? No. But, we continue to be convicted, we continue to ask forgiveness, and we continue to strive toward eliminating that sin from our repertoire of sins."
Our new Friend, OK, tells me, "It would seem you are convinced that man’s role on earth is to sin constantly, believer or not. That's certainly not the case with me. I can’t remember the last time I sinned. Maybe it’s been years. I don’t know. If I were God I would certainly put a stop to all this uncontrollable sinning.
If I might ask, why do you continue to fail? What sins are you falling into? I’m not convinced of failure nor do I consider myself weak. I don’t strive not to sin, I just don’t see sinning as a priority."
First, OK, maybe we should make clear the meaning of "sin." What is sin? Sin is disobedience to God, sin is disobeying God's command. Period. Which is the greatest sin? None, they are all equal. Disobedience is disobedience. The difference being -- is a person living a life of disobedience, or just occasionally, in a moment of weakness, falling into disobedience?
A chosen life of disobedience will lead, eventually, to the one unforgivable sin. What is the unforgivable sin? It is blaspheming the Holy Spirit by refusing to follow His leading toward a life in Christ -- and dying while still a non-believer. Once a person passes that threshold of death -- there is no second chance.
Why do I fail and why do I sin? Because, although I am a "forgiven sinner" -- I am not perfect. Isn't that why Jesus Christ had to die in our place -- because no man is perfect and, therefore, no man could satisfy God's perfect justice? Only a perfect sacrifice could have satisfied God's perfect justice -- so, He sent His perfect Son, the only perfect human -- to die in our place.
Why do I fail? Because I have inherited the Adamic sin nature and will have that sin nature until I either die or am Raptured, i.e., until the day of my redemption (Ephesians 4:30).
Then, OK tells me, "Bill, I’m not saying I have never sinned. I’m saying the frequency of your sinning makes me a little nervous. It seems to me you are sinning so grace may abound. I hope you are not in the sinning business. If so, I think your time could be better spent. “Go and sin no more” (Jesus)"
OK, you tell us in your statement above, "That's certainly not the case with me. I can’t remember the last time I sinned. Maybe it’s been years."
Really? How did you obtain this perfection? And, more importantly -- why did Jesus Christ have to die for you -- if you cannot remember if, or when, you have sinned?
Paul tells us in Romans 5:8, "But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."
Paul also tells us in Romans 7:14-17, "For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am of flesh, sold into bondage to sin. For what I am doing, I do not understand; for I am not practicing what I would like to do, but I am doing the very thing I hate. But if I do the very thing I do not want to do, I agree with the Law, confessing that the Law is good. So now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me."
But, Paul goes on to tell us, in Romans 8:1, "There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." Praise God!
You tell me, "It seems to me you are sinning so grace may abound." Here you are referencing Romans 6:1-2 which tells us, "What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it?"
Pastor David Guzik, writes in his commentary on the book of Romans:
http://www.blueletterbible.org...omans&ar=Rom_6_1
Shall we continue in sin: The verb tense of the phrase "continue in sin" (the present active tense) makes it clear that Paul describes the practice of habitual sin. In this first part of Romans 6, Paul writes about someone who remains in a lifestyle of sin, thinking that it is acceptable so that grace may abound.
Here, as an example, we can use the sin of homosexuality (or it could just as easily be the sin of adultery, fornication, stealing, lying, murder, or even just stealing paper clips from the office, etc.). Homosexuality is a sin -- but, a person who is a homosexual can walk away from that lifestyle and become a Christian believer. Will that person still be a homosexual? Well, most likely that person will still have the homosexual urges. Is that a sin? No, not unless he/she gives in to that urge and commits the sin of homosexuality.
If the person, in a moment of weakness, does give in and commits the sin -- does this mean that this person has lost his/her salvation because of this sin of homosexuality he/she has committed? No. But, it does mean that he/she must recognize that act of sin -- ask forgiveness -- and also ask for the strength to resist that sin in the future. Will this person always be successful in resisting that sin? Most likely not; but, he/she must make every effort to do so. And, if, in a moment of weakness -- does commit the sin again -- he/she must, again, pray for forgiveness and for more strength to resist.
Now, the other side of that coin is the person who is actively living a homosexual lifestyle -- while at the same time declaring himself/herself to be a Christian believer. In no way, can this person live that sin lifestyle -- and still be a Christian believer. This is what the apostle Paul is addressing when he asks, "Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound?"
In the passage found in Romans 5:12-21, the apostle Paul teaches that Jesus Christ is the basis of our salvation -- and that, by the grace of God.
Romans 5:17-21, "For if by the transgression of the one (Adam), death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ. So then as through one transgression (Adam) there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness (Jesus Christ) there resulted justification of life to all men. For as through the one man's (Adam) disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One (Jesus Christ) the many will be made righteous. The Law came in so that the transgression would increase; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more, so that, as sin reigned in death, even so grace would reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
This passage is teaching us that through the Law man was made aware that his sins, i.e., transgressions, were exposed and increasing. But, the Law could not remove man's sins, only offer temporary atonement -- and man's sacrifices had to continue year after year -- for this was temporal atonement, temporal forgiveness.
What does this passage mean when we read, "The Law came in so that the transgression would increase;"?
Romans 5:12-14, "Therefore, just as through one man (Adam)sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned -- for until the Law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over those who had not sinned in the likeness of the offense of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come."
This passage tells us that, when Adam sinned and brought both spiritual and physical death upon all mankind, i.e., his sin brought the condemnation of sin upon all mankind. Yet, God, being the Supreme Judge, could not impute, or attribute, sins to the accounts of man without man having a knowledge of sin. Therefore, God gave Israel the Ten Commandments and the Law to clearly define for them their sins. After this, man had no excuse for his sins -- and was, and is, held responsible for them.
This is the meaning of that phrase that, before the Law, even though death had entered the creation -- sin per se was not accounted to man. Yet, once man had the Law -- the sin count exploded. Why? Because now God had put it is writing, no more excuses, no "ignorance of the law" defenses allowed in His courtroom from that point in time.
That was the Dispenation of Law -- and provided temporal atonement for sins through repeated sacrifices. Then, Jesus Christ, when He came to earth as the Incarnate God, brought us into the Dispensation of Grace -- that by the grace of God, through faith in Jesus Christ (Ephesians 2:8-9) -- a person might find complete atonement and eternal life, eternal security, in Christ.
Was the apostle Paul still a sinner after he became a believer and the most prolific writer of New Testament books? Well, he tells us in Romans 5:8, ". . .while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us." And, he tells us in Romans 7:17, "So now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me."
And, in 2 Corinthians 12:7-10, Paul talks about his "thorn in his flesh." The Bible does not tell us the source of this "thorn in the flesh" -- and many Bible scholars and theologians have speculated that it is many things, from bad eye sight to bad health. Yet, I have trouble relating this "thorn in the flesh" to bad eyes or bad health.
For why would Paul equate this to "a messenger of Satan to torment me"? This sounds to me more like a sin of the flesh, i.e., lust, sexual desires, etc. Yes, for a man such as Paul, who at the time we meet him in the Bible does not appear to have a wife -- sexual desires could and would seem to be from Satan, i.e., a "thorn in the flesh."
2 Corinthians 12:7-10, "Because of the surpassing greatness of the revelations, for this reason, to keep me from exalting myself, there was given me a thorn in the flesh, a messenger of Satan to torment me -- to keep me from exalting myself! Concerning this I implored the Lord three times that it might leave me. And He has said to me, 'My grace is sufficient for you, for power is perfected in weakness.' Most gladly, therefore, I will rather boast about my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may dwell in me. Therefore I am well content with weaknesses, with insults, with distresses, with persecutions, with difficulties, for Christ's sake; for when I am weak, then I am strong."
So, OK, when you tell me, "I hope you are not in the sinning business" -- from Scripture, it is abundantly clear to me that you should be asking the same question of the apostle Paul -- for he most certainly is what I would call a "forgiven sinner."
And, when you declare, "That's certainly not the case with me. I can’t remember the last time I sinned. Maybe it’s been years. I don’t know" -- well, in my mind, you are putting yourself on the same level as Jesus Christ -- who we know is the only perfect, sinless Man.
Perhaps, OK, you will want to rethink your "perfect status" and come back to dwelling among we mere mortals.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill
