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for placing Helen Keller's portrait on the $10.00 bill.

http://www.wbrc.com/story/3165...eller-on-new-10-bill

http://yellowhammernews.com/fa...NmJkN2UxYzgifQ%3D%3D

Helen Keller is one of several notable American women being considered for this honor.  Personally, I believe having her likeness on the bill would be a good thing for our state and the idea should be encouraged by all Alabamians. This remarkable liberal, socialist, co-founder of the ACLU would be a great representative for our state!  Doubt any of this?  Then read on:

http://historynewsnetwork.org/article/11976

 

 

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Surprisingly to Condie, I would have little problem with Helen Keller being on the ten dollar bill -- especially, as compared with most of the other women recommended.

Ms. Keller, deaf and blind, was dependent upon those around her for almost everything she knew and learned.  Unfortunately, many around her used her to further their left wing and, sometimes just weird beliefs.

As to the ACLU, it was founded by communists as a red front organization to further the party's ends.  That is well known, but usually hidden from the public.  Even now, new evidence has come to light. The old communist archives are yielding new evidence of the treachery of those amongst us.

http://dailycaller.com/2011/01...-stalinist-heritage/

No, the ACLU is no longer a red front, just another left wing group.

Ms. Keller was also influenced by the Theosophists lead by Madame Blavatsky, sometimes called "The Devil's Handmaiden."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Blavatsky

Theosophy included spiritualism and claimed mental contact with aliens. I've read that Ms. Keller was in contact with a higher being on Jupiter, or Saturn, I forget.

Theosophy influenced both the founders of the NSDAP and Soviet communists.  

Again, I hold Ms. Keller as mostly blameless.  She overcame much to even communicate with the world outside her mind.  That evil and unscrupulous persons used her fame and accomplishments to further their terrible aims is not her fault, but the fault of those who used her.  Unfortunately, useful idiots still exist, long after the death of Lenin. No, Lenin was a Marxist, not a misspelling of a tablecloth fabric.  

FYI, as a child I heard her speak in Tuscumbia and still treasure the moment.

 

direstraits posted:

Surprisingly to Condie, I would have little problem with Helen Keller being on the ten dollar bill -- especially, as compared with most of the other women recommended.

Ms. Keller, deaf and blind, was dependent upon those around her for almost everything she knew and learned.  Unfortunately, many around her used her to further their left wing and, sometimes just weird beliefs.

As to the ACLU, it was founded by communists as a red front organization to further the party's ends.  That is well known, but usually hidden from the public.  Even now, new evidence has come to light. The old communist archives are yielding new evidence of the treachery of those amongst us.

http://dailycaller.com/2011/01...-stalinist-heritage/

No, the ACLU is no longer a red front, just another left wing group.

Ms. Keller was also influenced by the Theosophists lead by Madame Blavatsky, sometimes called "The Devil's Handmaiden."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Blavatsky

Theosophy included spiritualism and claimed mental contact with aliens. I've read that Ms. Keller was in contact with a higher being on Jupiter, or Saturn, I forget.

Theosophy influenced both the founders of the NSDAP and Soviet communists.  

Again, I hold Ms. Keller as mostly blameless.  She overcame much to even communicate with the world outside her mind.  That evil and unscrupulous persons used her fame and accomplishments to further their terrible aims is not her fault, but the fault of those who used her.  Unfortunately, useful idiots still exist, long after the death of Lenin. No, Lenin was a Marxist, not a misspelling of a tablecloth fabric.  

FYI, as a child I heard her speak in Tuscumbia and still treasure the moment.

 

_____

So now you say that in addition to being a socialist, she also was a theosophist, thus in league with Satan.  Still, you have no problem endorsing her for the $10.00 bill? Interesting standards you have there, dire.

Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:

Surprisingly to Condie, I would have little problem with Helen Keller being on the ten dollar bill -- especially, as compared with most of the other women recommended.

Ms. Keller, deaf and blind, was dependent upon those around her for almost everything she knew and learned.  Unfortunately, many around her used her to further their left wing and, sometimes just weird beliefs.

As to the ACLU, it was founded by communists as a red front organization to further the party's ends.  That is well known, but usually hidden from the public.  Even now, new evidence has come to light. The old communist archives are yielding new evidence of the treachery of those amongst us.

http://dailycaller.com/2011/01...-stalinist-heritage/

No, the ACLU is no longer a red front, just another left wing group.

Ms. Keller was also influenced by the Theosophists lead by Madame Blavatsky, sometimes called "The Devil's Handmaiden."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Blavatsky

Theosophy included spiritualism and claimed mental contact with aliens. I've read that Ms. Keller was in contact with a higher being on Jupiter, or Saturn, I forget.

Theosophy influenced both the founders of the NSDAP and Soviet communists.  

Again, I hold Ms. Keller as mostly blameless.  She overcame much to even communicate with the world outside her mind.  That evil and unscrupulous persons used her fame and accomplishments to further their terrible aims is not her fault, but the fault of those who used her.  Unfortunately, useful idiots still exist, long after the death of Lenin. No, Lenin was a Marxist, not a misspelling of a tablecloth fabric.  

FYI, as a child I heard her speak in Tuscumbia and still treasure the moment.

 

_____

So now you say that in addition to being a socialist, she also was a theosophist, thus in league with Satan.  Still, you have no problem endorsing her for the $10.00 bill? Interesting standards you have there, dire.

Did you read my post?  While it appears you did, you certainly didn't understand what I posted.  The back story was much more complicated than you realized.  You attempted to portray the lady as a willing enthusiastic leftist, while leaving out much data.  I'll assume you are guilty of nothing more than ignorance -- a trait you reveal quite often.  The whole in league with Satan statement is, I suppose, a reference to Emanuel Swedenborg, late 16th/early 17th century preacher who's theology influenced Blavatsky.  Not my call. Perhaps, you can take it up with them some day.  I really don't care. 

Everything I stated was sourced, or is easily researched. Which is an easy task for most with the faculties about them.

Last edited by direstraits
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:

Surprisingly to Condie, I would have little problem with Helen Keller being on the ten dollar bill -- especially, as compared with most of the other women recommended.

Ms. Keller, deaf and blind, was dependent upon those around her for almost everything she knew and learned.  Unfortunately, many around her used her to further their left wing and, sometimes just weird beliefs.

As to the ACLU, it was founded by communists as a red front organization to further the party's ends.  That is well known, but usually hidden from the public.  Even now, new evidence has come to light. The old communist archives are yielding new evidence of the treachery of those amongst us.

http://dailycaller.com/2011/01...-stalinist-heritage/

No, the ACLU is no longer a red front, just another left wing group.

Ms. Keller was also influenced by the Theosophists lead by Madame Blavatsky, sometimes called "The Devil's Handmaiden."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Blavatsky

Theosophy included spiritualism and claimed mental contact with aliens. I've read that Ms. Keller was in contact with a higher being on Jupiter, or Saturn, I forget.

Theosophy influenced both the founders of the NSDAP and Soviet communists.  

Again, I hold Ms. Keller as mostly blameless.  She overcame much to even communicate with the world outside her mind.  That evil and unscrupulous persons used her fame and accomplishments to further their terrible aims is not her fault, but the fault of those who used her.  Unfortunately, useful idiots still exist, long after the death of Lenin. No, Lenin was a Marxist, not a misspelling of a tablecloth fabric.  

FYI, as a child I heard her speak in Tuscumbia and still treasure the moment.

 

_____

So now you say that in addition to being a socialist, she also was a theosophist, thus in league with Satan.  Still, you have no problem endorsing her for the $10.00 bill? Interesting standards you have there, dire.

Did you read my post?  While it appears you did, you certainly didn't understand what I posted.  The back story was much more complicated than you realized.  You attempted to portray the lady as a willing enthusiastic leftist, while leaving out much data.  I'll assume you are guilty of nothing more than ignorance -- a trait you reveal quite often.  The whole in league with Satan statement is, I suppose, a reference to Emanuel Swedenborg, late 16th/early 17th century preacher who's theology influenced Blavatsky.  Not my call. Perhaps, you can take it up with them some day.  I really don't care. 

Everything I stated was sourced, or is easily researched. Which is an easy task for most with the faculties about them.

____

If Helen were still among us, she would take issue with your characterization of her as a duped victim of socialist manipulators.  In the link below are some "back data" that thoroughly de-bunk your take and that of others who get bent out of shape by the facts of her case, namely that she was a brilliant and independent thinker who adopted socialism after much practical research. Speaking for herself, Keller had this to say of her critics:

"So long as I confine my activities to social service and the blind, they compliment me extravagantly . . . but when it comes to discussion of a burning social or political issue, especially if I happen to be, as I so often am, on the unpopular side, the tone changes completely. They are grieved because they imagine I am in the hands of unscrupulous persons who take advantage of my afflictions to make me a mouthpiece for their own ideas. . . . I like frank debate, and I do not object to harsh criticism so long as I am treated like a human being with a mind of her own."

So much for her critics then and critics now, including you, dire!

Much more here: 

http://isreview.org/issue/96/politics-helen-keller

 

Last edited by Contendahh
direstraits posted:

The archives of the old Soviet Comintern isn't good enough for Condie.  The man is hopeless.  An woman who overcame great difficulties in her life was manipulated by cultists and the left for their own despicable ends. 

____

If there is something in those archives that counters what Helen Keller herself said about the matter, then serve it up and let's discuss.  Otherwise, I will have to conclude that you are doing your usual thing of bluffing by referring to some arcane source as allegedly supporting your position all the while declining to SHOW us what it says.  

As a polemicist, dire, you are predominantly a poseur!

Again, in Keller's own words:

"So long as I confine my activities to social service and the blind, they compliment me extravagantly . . . but when it comes to discussion of a burning social or political issue, especially if I happen to be, as I so often am, on the unpopular side, the tone changes completely. They are grieved because they imagine I am in the hands of unscrupulous persons who take advantage of my afflictions to make me a mouthpiece for their own ideas. . . . I like frank debate, and I do not object to harsh criticism so long as I am treated like a human being with a mind of her own."

Are you calling this lady a liar?  Are you saying that someone with the exceptional brilliance to overcome the enormous handicaps she endured was easily led by the nose, as it were, to accept the political position that she embraced after much personal contemplation and defended so articulately?  Keep fantasizing, dire;  Your delusion is obvious.

Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:

The archives of the old Soviet Comintern isn't good enough for Condie.  The man is hopeless.  An woman who overcame great difficulties in her life was manipulated by cultists and the left for their own despicable ends. 

____

If there is something in those archives that counters what Helen Keller herself said about the matter, then serve it up and let's discuss.  Otherwise, I will have to conclude that you are doing your usual thing of bluffing by referring to some arcane source as allegedly supporting your position all the while declining to SHOW us what it says.  

As a polemicist, dire, you are predominantly a poseur!

Again, in Keller's own words:

"So long as I confine my activities to social service and the blind, they compliment me extravagantly . . . but when it comes to discussion of a burning social or political issue, especially if I happen to be, as I so often am, on the unpopular side, the tone changes completely. They are grieved because they imagine I am in the hands of unscrupulous persons who take advantage of my afflictions to make me a mouthpiece for their own ideas. . . . I like frank debate, and I do not object to harsh criticism so long as I am treated like a human being with a mind of her own."

Are you calling this lady a liar?  Are you saying that someone with the exceptional brilliance to overcome the enormous handicaps she endured was easily led by the nose, as it were, to accept the political position that she embraced after much personal contemplation and defended so articulately?  Keep fantasizing, dire;  Your delusion is obvious.

The founder behind the  ACLU as a Soviet red front, purposefully sent his papers to the third Communist International (Comintern) assuming that it would never be exposed.  Helen Keller could have no idea she WAS being used by unscrupulous persons.  Most of the nation didn't.  Unless, you believe she was a Soviet agent or a useful idiot, to use Lenin's phrase, yes, she was used. No delusion, no fantasizing!

direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:

The archives of the old Soviet Comintern isn't good enough for Condie.  The man is hopeless.  An woman who overcame great difficulties in her life was manipulated by cultists and the left for their own despicable ends. 

____

If there is something in those archives that counters what Helen Keller herself said about the matter, then serve it up and let's discuss.  Otherwise, I will have to conclude that you are doing your usual thing of bluffing by referring to some arcane source as allegedly supporting your position all the while declining to SHOW us what it says.  

As a polemicist, dire, you are predominantly a poseur!

Again, in Keller's own words:

"So long as I confine my activities to social service and the blind, they compliment me extravagantly . . . but when it comes to discussion of a burning social or political issue, especially if I happen to be, as I so often am, on the unpopular side, the tone changes completely. They are grieved because they imagine I am in the hands of unscrupulous persons who take advantage of my afflictions to make me a mouthpiece for their own ideas. . . . I like frank debate, and I do not object to harsh criticism so long as I am treated like a human being with a mind of her own."

Are you calling this lady a liar?  Are you saying that someone with the exceptional brilliance to overcome the enormous handicaps she endured was easily led by the nose, as it were, to accept the political position that she embraced after much personal contemplation and defended so articulately?  Keep fantasizing, dire;  Your delusion is obvious.

The founder behind the  ACLU as a Soviet red front, purposefully sent his papers to the third Communist International (Comintern) assuming that it would never be exposed.  Helen Keller could have no idea she WAS being used by unscrupulous persons.  Most of the nation didn't.  Unless, you believe she was a Soviet agent or a useful idiot, to use Lenin's phrase, yes, she was used. No delusion, no fantasizing!

____

Your delusion is still obvious.

Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:

The archives of the old Soviet Comintern isn't good enough for Condie.  The man is hopeless.  An woman who overcame great difficulties in her life was manipulated by cultists and the left for their own despicable ends. 

____

If there is something in those archives that counters what Helen Keller herself said about the matter, then serve it up and let's discuss.  Otherwise, I will have to conclude that you are doing your usual thing of bluffing by referring to some arcane source as allegedly supporting your position all the while declining to SHOW us what it says.  

As a polemicist, dire, you are predominantly a poseur!

Again, in Keller's own words:

"So long as I confine my activities to social service and the blind, they compliment me extravagantly . . . but when it comes to discussion of a burning social or political issue, especially if I happen to be, as I so often am, on the unpopular side, the tone changes completely. They are grieved because they imagine I am in the hands of unscrupulous persons who take advantage of my afflictions to make me a mouthpiece for their own ideas. . . . I like frank debate, and I do not object to harsh criticism so long as I am treated like a human being with a mind of her own."

Are you calling this lady a liar?  Are you saying that someone with the exceptional brilliance to overcome the enormous handicaps she endured was easily led by the nose, as it were, to accept the political position that she embraced after much personal contemplation and defended so articulately?  Keep fantasizing, dire;  Your delusion is obvious.

The founder behind the  ACLU as a Soviet red front, purposefully sent his papers to the third Communist International (Comintern) assuming that it would never be exposed.  Helen Keller could have no idea she WAS being used by unscrupulous persons.  Most of the nation didn't.  Unless, you believe she was a Soviet agent or a useful idiot, to use Lenin's phrase, yes, she was used. No delusion, no fantasizing!

____

Your delusion is still obvious.

What delusions?  What I cited about the origin of the ACLU is well known.  The circumstances of the founder sending his papers to Moscow was documented in the link I cited.  Of course, I don't believe Ms, Keller was a red agent, nor knowing a pawn of the hard left.  She was a follower of Theosophy and spiritualism -- that is also cited in my links.  Spiritualism was quite popular in the 1920s to 1930s.  That otherwise intelligent persons become pawns of the unscrupulous is not uncommon.  Observe all those caught up in Scientology.  Or, Will Rogers and Irving Berlin, among others who were enamored with Mussolini.  Bernie Madoff scammed an number of similar persons.  Unfortunately, IQ and common sense do not always go hand in hand. 

Contenduhh, you need to cease your rants and whines and simply go on to another thread.  

direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:

The archives of the old Soviet Comintern isn't good enough for Condie.  The man is hopeless.  An woman who overcame great difficulties in her life was manipulated by cultists and the left for their own despicable ends. 

____

If there is something in those archives that counters what Helen Keller herself said about the matter, then serve it up and let's discuss.  Otherwise, I will have to conclude that you are doing your usual thing of bluffing by referring to some arcane source as allegedly supporting your position all the while declining to SHOW us what it says.  

As a polemicist, dire, you are predominantly a poseur!

Again, in Keller's own words:

"So long as I confine my activities to social service and the blind, they compliment me extravagantly . . . but when it comes to discussion of a burning social or political issue, especially if I happen to be, as I so often am, on the unpopular side, the tone changes completely. They are grieved because they imagine I am in the hands of unscrupulous persons who take advantage of my afflictions to make me a mouthpiece for their own ideas. . . . I like frank debate, and I do not object to harsh criticism so long as I am treated like a human being with a mind of her own."

Are you calling this lady a liar?  Are you saying that someone with the exceptional brilliance to overcome the enormous handicaps she endured was easily led by the nose, as it were, to accept the political position that she embraced after much personal contemplation and defended so articulately?  Keep fantasizing, dire;  Your delusion is obvious.

The founder behind the  ACLU as a Soviet red front, purposefully sent his papers to the third Communist International (Comintern) assuming that it would never be exposed.  Helen Keller could have no idea she WAS being used by unscrupulous persons.  Most of the nation didn't.  Unless, you believe she was a Soviet agent or a useful idiot, to use Lenin's phrase, yes, she was used. No delusion, no fantasizing!

____

Your delusion is still obvious.

What delusions?  What I cited about the origin of the ACLU is well known.  The circumstances of the founder sending his papers to Moscow was documented in the link I cited.  Of course, I don't believe Ms, Keller was a red agent, nor knowing a pawn of the hard left.  She was a follower of Theosophy and spiritualism -- that is also cited in my links.  Spiritualism was quite popular in the 1920s to 1930s.  That otherwise intelligent persons become pawns of the unscrupulous is not uncommon.  Observe all those caught up in Scientology.  Or, Will Rogers and Irving Berlin, among others who were enamored with Mussolini.  Bernie Madoff scammed an number of similar persons.  Unfortunately, IQ and common sense do not always go hand in hand. 

Contenduhh, you need to cease your rants and whines and simply go on to another thread.  

___

YOU need to apologize to the brilliant and remarkable Ms. Keller for portraying her as  pliant dupe.

Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:

The archives of the old Soviet Comintern isn't good enough for Condie.  The man is hopeless.  An woman who overcame great difficulties in her life was manipulated by cultists and the left for their own despicable ends. 

____

If there is something in those archives that counters what Helen Keller herself said about the matter, then serve it up and let's discuss.  Otherwise, I will have to conclude that you are doing your usual thing of bluffing by referring to some arcane source as allegedly supporting your position all the while declining to SHOW us what it says.  

As a polemicist, dire, you are predominantly a poseur!

Again, in Keller's own words:

"So long as I confine my activities to social service and the blind, they compliment me extravagantly . . . but when it comes to discussion of a burning social or political issue, especially if I happen to be, as I so often am, on the unpopular side, the tone changes completely. They are grieved because they imagine I am in the hands of unscrupulous persons who take advantage of my afflictions to make me a mouthpiece for their own ideas. . . . I like frank debate, and I do not object to harsh criticism so long as I am treated like a human being with a mind of her own."

Are you calling this lady a liar?  Are you saying that someone with the exceptional brilliance to overcome the enormous handicaps she endured was easily led by the nose, as it were, to accept the political position that she embraced after much personal contemplation and defended so articulately?  Keep fantasizing, dire;  Your delusion is obvious.

The founder behind the  ACLU as a Soviet red front, purposefully sent his papers to the third Communist International (Comintern) assuming that it would never be exposed.  Helen Keller could have no idea she WAS being used by unscrupulous persons.  Most of the nation didn't.  Unless, you believe she was a Soviet agent or a useful idiot, to use Lenin's phrase, yes, she was used. No delusion, no fantasizing!

____

Your delusion is still obvious.

What delusions?  What I cited about the origin of the ACLU is well known.  The circumstances of the founder sending his papers to Moscow was documented in the link I cited.  Of course, I don't believe Ms, Keller was a red agent, nor knowing a pawn of the hard left.  She was a follower of Theosophy and spiritualism -- that is also cited in my links.  Spiritualism was quite popular in the 1920s to 1930s.  That otherwise intelligent persons become pawns of the unscrupulous is not uncommon.  Observe all those caught up in Scientology.  Or, Will Rogers and Irving Berlin, among others who were enamored with Mussolini.  Bernie Madoff scammed an number of similar persons.  Unfortunately, IQ and common sense do not always go hand in hand. 

Contenduhh, you need to cease your rants and whines and simply go on to another thread.  

___

YOU need to apologize to the brilliant and remarkable Ms. Keller for portraying her as  pliant dupe.

I will assume you've read my links. But, not been able to understand what was stated.  That's on you.  I own no apology to the lady,  I've stated, at least twice, that she over came great obstacles.  That she was used by unscrupulous persons to further their aims is on them.  She lived in a closed world, dependent upon them for much of what she learned.  If, you can't understand this, I must assume you are much further along in your mental deterioration than I supposed.

direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:

The archives of the old Soviet Comintern isn't good enough for Condie.  The man is hopeless.  An woman who overcame great difficulties in her life was manipulated by cultists and the left for their own despicable ends. 

____

If there is something in those archives that counters what Helen Keller herself said about the matter, then serve it up and let's discuss.  Otherwise, I will have to conclude that you are doing your usual thing of bluffing by referring to some arcane source as allegedly supporting your position all the while declining to SHOW us what it says.  

As a polemicist, dire, you are predominantly a poseur!

Again, in Keller's own words:

"So long as I confine my activities to social service and the blind, they compliment me extravagantly . . . but when it comes to discussion of a burning social or political issue, especially if I happen to be, as I so often am, on the unpopular side, the tone changes completely. They are grieved because they imagine I am in the hands of unscrupulous persons who take advantage of my afflictions to make me a mouthpiece for their own ideas. . . . I like frank debate, and I do not object to harsh criticism so long as I am treated like a human being with a mind of her own."

Are you calling this lady a liar?  Are you saying that someone with the exceptional brilliance to overcome the enormous handicaps she endured was easily led by the nose, as it were, to accept the political position that she embraced after much personal contemplation and defended so articulately?  Keep fantasizing, dire;  Your delusion is obvious.

The founder behind the  ACLU as a Soviet red front, purposefully sent his papers to the third Communist International (Comintern) assuming that it would never be exposed.  Helen Keller could have no idea she WAS being used by unscrupulous persons.  Most of the nation didn't.  Unless, you believe she was a Soviet agent or a useful idiot, to use Lenin's phrase, yes, she was used. No delusion, no fantasizing!

____

Your delusion is still obvious.

What delusions?  What I cited about the origin of the ACLU is well known.  The circumstances of the founder sending his papers to Moscow was documented in the link I cited.  Of course, I don't believe Ms, Keller was a red agent, nor knowing a pawn of the hard left.  She was a follower of Theosophy and spiritualism -- that is also cited in my links.  Spiritualism was quite popular in the 1920s to 1930s.  That otherwise intelligent persons become pawns of the unscrupulous is not uncommon.  Observe all those caught up in Scientology.  Or, Will Rogers and Irving Berlin, among others who were enamored with Mussolini.  Bernie Madoff scammed an number of similar persons.  Unfortunately, IQ and common sense do not always go hand in hand. 

Contenduhh, you need to cease your rants and whines and simply go on to another thread.  

___

YOU need to apologize to the brilliant and remarkable Ms. Keller for portraying her as  pliant dupe.

I will assume you've read my links. But, not been able to understand what was stated.  That's on you.  I own no apology to the lady,  I've stated, at least twice, that she over came great obstacles.  That she was used by unscrupulous persons to further their aims is on them.  She lived in a closed world, dependent upon them for much of what she learned.  If, you can't understand this, I must assume you are much further along in your mental deterioration than I supposed.

___

The correct assumption is that YOU are much further along in your polemical incompetence than I had supposed, as seen in part by your continuing resort to low ad hominem insult 

Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:

The archives of the old Soviet Comintern isn't good enough for Condie.  The man is hopeless.  An woman who overcame great difficulties in her life was manipulated by cultists and the left for their own despicable ends. 

____

If there is something in those archives that counters what Helen Keller herself said about the matter, then serve it up and let's discuss.  Otherwise, I will have to conclude that you are doing your usual thing of bluffing by referring to some arcane source as allegedly supporting your position all the while declining to SHOW us what it says.  

As a polemicist, dire, you are predominantly a poseur!

Again, in Keller's own words:

"So long as I confine my activities to social service and the blind, they compliment me extravagantly . . . but when it comes to discussion of a burning social or political issue, especially if I happen to be, as I so often am, on the unpopular side, the tone changes completely. They are grieved because they imagine I am in the hands of unscrupulous persons who take advantage of my afflictions to make me a mouthpiece for their own ideas. . . . I like frank debate, and I do not object to harsh criticism so long as I am treated like a human being with a mind of her own."

Are you calling this lady a liar?  Are you saying that someone with the exceptional brilliance to overcome the enormous handicaps she endured was easily led by the nose, as it were, to accept the political position that she embraced after much personal contemplation and defended so articulately?  Keep fantasizing, dire;  Your delusion is obvious.

The founder behind the  ACLU as a Soviet red front, purposefully sent his papers to the third Communist International (Comintern) assuming that it would never be exposed.  Helen Keller could have no idea she WAS being used by unscrupulous persons.  Most of the nation didn't.  Unless, you believe she was a Soviet agent or a useful idiot, to use Lenin's phrase, yes, she was used. No delusion, no fantasizing!

____

Your delusion is still obvious.

What delusions?  What I cited about the origin of the ACLU is well known.  The circumstances of the founder sending his papers to Moscow was documented in the link I cited.  Of course, I don't believe Ms, Keller was a red agent, nor knowing a pawn of the hard left.  She was a follower of Theosophy and spiritualism -- that is also cited in my links.  Spiritualism was quite popular in the 1920s to 1930s.  That otherwise intelligent persons become pawns of the unscrupulous is not uncommon.  Observe all those caught up in Scientology.  Or, Will Rogers and Irving Berlin, among others who were enamored with Mussolini.  Bernie Madoff scammed an number of similar persons.  Unfortunately, IQ and common sense do not always go hand in hand. 

Contenduhh, you need to cease your rants and whines and simply go on to another thread.  

___

YOU need to apologize to the brilliant and remarkable Ms. Keller for portraying her as  pliant dupe.

I will assume you've read my links. But, not been able to understand what was stated.  That's on you.  I own no apology to the lady,  I've stated, at least twice, that she over came great obstacles.  That she was used by unscrupulous persons to further their aims is on them.  She lived in a closed world, dependent upon them for much of what she learned.  If, you can't understand this, I must assume you are much further along in your mental deterioration than I supposed.

___

The correct assumption is that YOU are much further along in your polemical incompetence than I had supposed, as seen in part by your continuing resort to low ad hominem insult 

Of course, I directed the argument against you.  Where else should I aim, as you've given nothing of substance, just whingeing and whining. Certainly no proof that you've read or understood what I've posted and linked.  The only other conclusions one might reach is that you did not comprehend such, or are simply throwing up chaff to deflect that you have no counter arguments.

 
v

___

The correct assumption is that YOU are much further along in your polemical incompetence than I had supposed, as seen in part by your continuing resort to low ad hominem insult 

Of course, I directed the argument against you.  Where else should I aim, as you've given nothing of substance, just whingeing and whining. Certainly no proof that you've read or understood what I've posted and linked.  The only other conclusions one might reach is that you did not comprehend such, or are simply throwing up chaff to deflect that you have no counter arguments.

___

How callous and how cavalier of you to dismiss Ms. Keller's own explanation of her socio-political leanings [her words: "burning social or political issue[s]",as "nothing of substance, just whinging [sic] and whining." She has made it plain that she has "a mind of my own." By your desperate  reckoning, her mind is simply the pliant tool of insidious manipulators. A shameful, unsupported, speculative and disrespectful analysis! 

Contendahh posted:
 
v

___

The correct assumption is that YOU are much further along in your polemical incompetence than I had supposed, as seen in part by your continuing resort to low ad hominem insult 

Of course, I directed the argument against you.  Where else should I aim, as you've given nothing of substance, just whingeing and whining. Certainly no proof that you've read or understood what I've posted and linked.  The only other conclusions one might reach is that you did not comprehend such, or are simply throwing up chaff to deflect that you have no counter arguments.

___

How callous and how cavalier of you to dismiss Ms. Keller's own explanation of her socio-political leanings [her words: "burning social or political issue[s]",as "nothing of substance, just whinging [sic] and whining." She has made it plain that she has "a mind of my own." By your desperate  reckoning, her mind is simply the pliant tool of insidious manipulators. A shameful, unsupported, speculative and disrespectful analysis! 

For anyone reading this, besides Condie, one sees a rather crude sophist argument considered so in ancient Athens.  Anyone reading my original statement would understand that "nothing of substance,  just whinging and whining" refers to Condie, not Ms. Keller.  Condie is attempting, in a crude fashion, to bend my statement against her, not him.  I've shown she was a follower of spiritualism and Theosophy and used unknowingly by those with ulterior motives.  Plus, given examples of other good people used in such fashion.

Contenduhh, enough of you and this crudeness of mind.  Obviously, you have nothing of substance left to say. Do so, please!

direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
 
v

___

The correct assumption is that YOU are much further along in your polemical incompetence than I had supposed, as seen in part by your continuing resort to low ad hominem insult 

Of course, I directed the argument against you.  Where else should I aim, as you've given nothing of substance, just whingeing and whining. Certainly no proof that you've read or understood what I've posted and linked.  The only other conclusions one might reach is that you did not comprehend such, or are simply throwing up chaff to deflect that you have no counter arguments.

___

How callous and how cavalier of you to dismiss Ms. Keller's own explanation of her socio-political leanings [her words: "burning social or political issue[s]",as "nothing of substance, just whinging [sic] and whining." She has made it plain that she has "a mind of my own." By your desperate  reckoning, her mind is simply the pliant tool of insidious manipulators. A shameful, unsupported, speculative and disrespectful analysis! 

For anyone reading this, besides Condie, one sees a rather crude sophist argument considered so in ancient Athens.  Anyone reading my original statement would understand that "nothing of substance,  just whinging and whining" refers to Condie, not Ms. Keller.  Condie is attempting, in a crude fashion, to bend my statement against her, not him.  I've shown she was a follower of spiritualism and Theosophy and used unknowingly by those with ulterior motives.  Plus, given examples of other good people used in such fashion.

Contenduhh, enough of you and this crudeness of mind.  Obviously, you have nothing of substance left to say. Do so, please!

______

When you used those terms ("whinging and whining") you were directing them to the substance of what I posted, which included, pertinently, the remarks of Ms. Keller herself concerning the development of her socio-political perspective. Your transparently cheap and evasive tactic of passing off what I wrote as somehow entirely original with me simply flunks any credible standard of argumentation.

By the way, what IS "whinging"?

Contendahh posted:
direstraits posted:
Contendahh posted:
 
v

___

The correct assumption is that YOU are much further along in your polemical incompetence than I had supposed, as seen in part by your continuing resort to low ad hominem insult 

Of course, I directed the argument against you.  Where else should I aim, as you've given nothing of substance, just whingeing and whining. Certainly no proof that you've read or understood what I've posted and linked.  The only other conclusions one might reach is that you did not comprehend such, or are simply throwing up chaff to deflect that you have no counter arguments.

___

How callous and how cavalier of you to dismiss Ms. Keller's own explanation of her socio-political leanings [her words: "burning social or political issue[s]",as "nothing of substance, just whinging [sic] and whining." She has made it plain that she has "a mind of my own." By your desperate  reckoning, her mind is simply the pliant tool of insidious manipulators. A shameful, unsupported, speculative and disrespectful analysis! 

For anyone reading this, besides Condie, one sees a rather crude sophist argument considered so in ancient Athens.  Anyone reading my original statement would understand that "nothing of substance,  just whinging and whining" refers to Condie, not Ms. Keller.  Condie is attempting, in a crude fashion, to bend my statement against her, not him.  I've shown she was a follower of spiritualism and Theosophy and used unknowingly by those with ulterior motives.  Plus, given examples of other good people used in such fashion.

Contenduhh, enough of you and this crudeness of mind.  Obviously, you have nothing of substance left to say. Do so, please!

______

When you used those terms ("whinging and whining") you were directing them to the substance of what I posted, which included, pertinently, the remarks of Ms. Keller herself concerning the development of her socio-political perspective. Your transparently cheap and evasive tactic of passing off what I wrote as somehow entirely original with me simply flunks any credible standard of argumentation.

By the way, what IS "whinging"?

My original statement below.  Obviously referring to you and you only.

"Of course, I directed the argument against you.  Where else should I aim, as you've given nothing of substance, just whingeing and whining."

Definition

"Complain persistently and in a peevish or irritating way: stop whingeing and get on with it!"

http://www.oxforddictionaries....ition/english/whinge

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