what do you think?

Personally, I don't believe that a loving God would approve of the death penalty.
I believe in protecting life from conception, to natural death. God has the final and only judgement, in my opinion.

God, I feel, gave to the Israel people their form of Government (Exodus, Lev, Deut, & Numbers) and it was so that the people could govern themselves. I don't believe that God loves Divorce but permits it due to man's inadequacies and imperfections.

I do feel that God was Just in His givings of the Laws but also, more important, gave to Man/Human a way to Salvation, ultimate Salvation in Christ Jesus and a new system by which man ultimately could find Salvation and ultimate Forgiveness, something that the Law could never give.

Remember also that statement of Christ. "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesars and unto God the things that are God's" Capital Punishment is for the Physical world. God's ultimate judgement, that which Christ Died for to protect man against, is the ultimate Spiritual Judgement or so I believe.

if God is all you say how come he would tell Israel to utterly destroy People that israel wold have wars with, even women, Children, and Livestock. yes God is a Loving God and he is a Jealous God, and he is a severe God. In 1st Cor 6:9 Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with men,
1Cor 6:10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

you say you don't believe God likes Divorce, neither do I, do you see above where he says no Adulterer will enter the Kingdom of Heaven? surely he don't mean that though, you can bet your loving bottom Dollar he means it.

Jews Are not God’s Chosen People! All people are and the jews are God's Chosen People! Read your Bible!! Jews have no more pull with God than you do!

quote:

Originally posted by prince albert:
if God is all you say how come he would tell Israel to utterly destroy People that israel wold have wars with, even women, Children, and Livestock. yes God is a Loving God and he is a Jealous God, and he is a severe God. In 1st Cor 6:9 Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with men,
1Cor 6:10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

you say you don't believe God likes Divorce, neither do I, do you see above where he says no Adulterer will enter the Kingdom of Heaven? surely he don't mean that though, you can bet your loving bottom Dollar he means it.

The Bible says the same about liar's and drunks!
Why did God add thou shall not kill?

no Blue you say read your Bible, I do read mine 3 Chapters every Morning after Breakfast, how much you read? I was just using that to show that God was not such a loving God that he didn't go along with People being Killed, he has the power to instill such Love in mans heart that they would never kill anybody again but evidently that is not his will so I will go along with whatever he wants.

quote:

Originally posted by Nobluedog:

quote:

Originally posted by prince albert:
if God is all you say how come he would tell Israel to utterly destroy People that israel wold have wars with, even women, Children, and Livestock. yes God is a Loving God and he is a Jealous God, and he is a severe God. In 1st Cor 6:9 Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with men,
1Cor 6:10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

you say you don't believe God likes Divorce, neither do I, do you see above where he says no Adulterer will enter the Kingdom of Heaven? surely he don't mean that though, you can bet your loving bottom Dollar he means it.

The Bible says the same about liar's and drunks!
Why did God add thou shall not kill?

the phrase was translated poorly. the original greek reads ' thou shalt not murder." which is far different.

another noteable bad translation is in genesis:
" go forth, be fruitful, and replenish the earth".

ok, if adam and eve are the only two people, then how can they 'replenish' the earth? replenish implies to fill was was once full, but it now empty. the waiter replenishes your supply of iced tea. noah's folk 'replenished'...but the earth had always been empty when He plonked down adam and eve. not possible for them to 'replenish'.

the line is acctually 'go forth and fill the earth'.

king james was a little emphatic that his scribes got the job done asap, and unnecessary mistakes were made because of haste.

Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with men

Question- Do you believe that if a person divorces, and remarries, he/she is guilty of adultery?

quote:

Originally posted by vplee123:
Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with men

Question- Do you believe that if a person divorces, and remarries, he/she is guilty of adultery?

The only rason Given by the Bible for Divorce is Infidelity and in some cases being married to an unbeliever, other than that Yes anyone else is living in Adultery, but thats not the way people wants it to be, if you will notice as soon as somebody trangresses Gods Law then they start searching the Bible to find something to justify their actions.

quote:

Originally posted by prince albert:
Rom 13:1 Let every soul be in subjection to the higher powers: for there is no power but of God; and the powers that be are ordained of God.
Rom 13:2 Therefore he that resisteth the power, withstandeth the ordinance of God: and they that withstand shall receive to themselves judgment.
Rom 13:3 For rulers are not a terror to the good work, but to the evil. And wouldest thou have no fear of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise from the same:
Rom 13:4 for he is a minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is a minister of God, an avenger for wrath to him that doeth evil.
Rom 13:5 Wherefore ye must needs be in subjection, not only because of the wrath, but also for conscience’ sake

I have heard it Preached that God condones the Death Penalty by these Verses, I know it is talking about those who enforce the Law, they enforce it by Gods Will.

"Smoke 'em if you got'em."

I believe that these verses can be used to show that the death penalty is acceptable. However, to me the main point of the passage is to show that Christians are to be good citizens of their country. Civil disobedience is not approved of God unless the law clearly contradicts scripture.

quote:

Originally posted by tigrtrek:
I believe that these verses can be used to show that the death penalty is acceptable. However, to me the main point of the passage is to show that Christians are to be good citizens of their country. Civil disobedience is not approved of God unless the law clearly contradicts scripture.

quote:

Originally posted by vplee123:
Personally, I don't believe that a loving God would approve of the death penalty.
I believe in protecting life from conception, to natural death. God has the final and only judgement, in my opinion.

Then what application do you make of this?

Rom 13:4 for he is a minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is a minister of God, an avenger for wrath to him that doeth evil.

I believe that in this nation there have been all too many persons sentenced to death for crimes they did not commit, and that result is predictable, since there are too many over-zealous prosecutors and too many under-qualified court-appointed defense lawyers. That said, however, I continue to believe that the above-cited passage is scriptural justification for a death penalty under the laws of the land. I see no way to interpret it other than that. How can you conclude otherwise, given the terminology used ("sword" "avenger for wrath")? Will you not apply the same literality here that you do in your defense of transubstantiation?

Thankfully, there are initiatives in this nation to seek out those cases where the death penalty has been wrongly meted out. There have been well over 200 cases in the U.S. where the Death Penalty Project and allied organizations have gotten unjustly sentenced persons off death row, often using DNA evidence. In Alabama, the Equal Justice Initiative, a nationally-recognized, non-profit public interest law firm, contends for justice for the under-represented and unjustly condemned. Hard-liners with the "lock 'em up and throw away the keys mentality" might not appreciate the work of these groups, but in my opinion, they are truly doing God's work!

Here is an example of the kind of prosecutorial chicanery that is sometimes encountered in Alabama:

http://www.eji.org/eji/node/307

Excerpt: "The facts of this case -- where a lawyer from the Attorney General's office lied to a judge and suppressed evidence that should have been turned over to the defense -- raise important questions about the reliability of Alabama’s death penalty system, including whether other people currently are on death row as a result of improper conduct by prosecutors."

Yes, Beter....you're right. (swallow lumps..)
I do think that the notion of the death penalty is biblical. However, I don't think that it is applicable in every literal sense of the world. (picking up sticks on Sunday)?

I guess I think that in extreme cases, for the protection of society is where it would be applicable. But I do maintain that God would not approve of the death penalty as we use it today-
This is a tough one, because I think that the protection of life is paramount to Christianity.
And God's Mercy also has to come into play
King Saul's life was spared, Paul was still made an apostle...
I have mixed feelings on the biblical teaching here, but my personal view is that the death penalty is an expensive, not foolproof.Innocent people can be wrongly convicted. I believe it is better to imprison these people, and show them mercy, and show them God's love, and pray for a conversion of heart. Practical? no....Popular? no. especially with violent criminals and evil people. Impractical Pipedream that will never happen? ... most definetly.
But we are taught to comfort the prisoners, also. And whatsoever we do to the least of our people, we do to Christ. I think I could make more arguments for mercy than I could for executions.
So, yes I agree that the notion of the death penalty is biblical, I shudder at the conflict between "Thou shalt not kill", and "comfort the prisoner".
I don't know how to reconcile the teachings.

Hi VP and Beter,

I think the best way to say it is: Yes, the death penalty is Biblical. However, I could not sit on a Jury where the death penalty was a possibility.

If asked to sit on any Jury, I would have to tell the judge that I cannot vote for death.

I, too, believe in the sanctity of life; but, God has given us the choice of the death penalty in the Bible. But, He has not declared that we MUST apply it.

As much as I detest rats; I cannot bring myself to kill even a rat. So, no way I could vote to put another human to death.

Yet, if I were still in the military and the situation came where I had to defend myself, my friends, and my country -- I would do my duty.

Yes, it is Biblical.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill