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From the current health care debate going back to FDR and the New Deal and his second bill of rights, we've heard about rights...It's a right to have health care...a job...a home, etc.

These are not rights...they are goods.

Judge Andrew Napolitano succinctly explains in THIS recent article:


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"What is a right? A right is a gift from God that extends from our humanity. Thinkers from St. Thomas Aquinas, to Thomas Jefferson, to the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., to Pope John Paul II have all argued that our rights are a natural part of our humanity. We own our bodies, thus we own the gifts that emanate from our bodies.

So, our right to life, our right to develop our personalities, our right to think as we wish, to say what we think, to publish what we say, our right to worship or not worship, our right to travel, to defend ourselves, to use our own property as we see fit, our right to due process – fairness – from the government, and our right to be left alone, are all rights that stem from our humanity. These are natural rights that we are born with. The government doesn’t give them to us and the government doesn’t pay for them and the government can’t take them away, unless a jury finds that we have violated someone else’s rights."
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The government doesn't give them or grant them to us...they are ours.


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"What is a good? A good is something we want or need. In a sense, it is the opposite of a right. We have our rights from birth, but we need our parents when we are children and we need ourselves as adults to purchase the goods we require for existence. So, food is a good, shelter is a good, clothing is a good, education is a good, a car is a good, legal representation is a good, working out at a gym is a good, and access to health care is a good.

Does the government give us goods? Well, sometimes it takes money from some of us and gives that money to others. You can call that taxation or you can call it theft; but you cannot call it a right.

A right stems from our humanity. A good is something you buy or someone else buys for you."
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Does that make someone heartless or uncharitable
to acknowledge that health care, food, etc are not a right? No. It doesn't mean we as a society can't be charitable. But it is impossible to be charitable with someone else's money.

The Judge again:

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"Charity comes from your own heart, not from the government spending your money. When we pay our taxes to the government and it gives that money away, that’s not charity, that’s welfare.

When the government takes more from us than it needs to secure our freedoms, so it can have money to give away, that’s not charity, that’s theft. And when the government forces hospitals to provide free health care to those who can’t or won’t care for themselves, that’s not charity, that’s slavery."
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FULL ARTICLE

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The Constitution. Every Issue, Every time. No Exceptions, No Excuses.

 

"When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. When the government fears the people, there is liberty."---Thomas Jefferson

 

"That's what governments are for... get in a man's way."---Mal Reynolds Capt. of Serenity, "Firefly-Class" spaceship

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"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" is one of the most famous phrases in the United States Declaration of Independence, and considered by some as part of one of the most well crafted, influential sentences in the history of the English language. These three aspects are listed among the "unalienable rights" or sovereign rights of man.....Wikipedia



It's hard to live and be happy if you are sick,dead,or deep in debt from hospital bills?
quote:
Originally posted by ka-0-hub:
"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" is one of the most famous phrases in the United States Declaration of Independence, and considered by some as part of one of the most well crafted, influential sentences in the history of the English language. These three aspects are listed among the "unalienable rights" or sovereign rights of man.....Wikipedia



It's hard to live and be happy if you are sick,dead,or deep in debt from hospital bills?

Pursuit of happiness. It's not a guarantee. People WANT to be happy while sitting at home on their fat, lazy butts while someone else works and pays taxes. That's not "pursuit' of happiness. They have the opportunity to better themselves, they are just too lazy and consider themselves 'deserving' without effort.
quote:
Originally posted by ka-0-hub:
"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" is one of the most famous phrases in the United States Declaration of Independence, and considered by some as part of one of the most well crafted, influential sentences in the history of the English language. These three aspects are listed among the "unalienable rights" or sovereign rights of man.....Wikipedia



It's hard to live and be happy if you are sick,dead,or deep in debt from hospital bills?




The title of this thread is a question. My post merely answers the question. If you don't like the answer ,better take it up with the Founding Fathers. That's who you all are fond of quoting.Thats what "Fundamental Conservatism" is all about. Isn't it?
quote:
Originally posted by ka-0-hub:
quote:
Originally posted by ka-0-hub:
"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" is one of the most famous phrases in the United States Declaration of Independence, and considered by some as part of one of the most well crafted, influential sentences in the history of the English language. These three aspects are listed among the "unalienable rights" or sovereign rights of man.....Wikipedia



It's hard to live and be happy if you are sick,dead,or deep in debt from hospital bills?




The title of this thread is a question. My post merely answers the question. If you don't like the answer ,better take it up with the Founding Fathers. That's who you all are fond of quoting.Thats what "Fundamental Conservatism" is all about. Isn't it?


It really depends on if it was your behavior that got you into the situation.
quote:
It's right next to the "right to privacy."


The concept of privacy is perfectly compatible with natural rights.

According to Webster's privacy is defined as:

quote:
the quality or state of being apart from company or observation


How is that not a natural right? If an individual chooses to be "apart from company or observation," no other individual is obligated with a duty to ensure that state of being.
quote:
"Compatible" doesn't mean it's in there. Sorry.


First, the Bill of Rights does not confer rights to individuals. The rights already exist - the Bill of Rights just reiterates them. That's why there is no mention of "the people have the right to _______." The rights are unalienable, and the first ten amendments just set specific restrictions on what the government can do.

Now, to address the lack of a mention of "right to privacy:" that is irrelevant because many other unalienable right are excluded from the Bill of Rights. There is no mention of the right to get married, the right choose where you live, etc... The first 8 amendments were deemed necesary to set specific limits on the government, and the ninth amendment covers remaining rights not mentioned in the first 8:

quote:
The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.


So, again, how is privacy not a right?
quote:
Originally posted by dolemitejb:
quote:
"Compatible" doesn't mean it's in there. Sorry.


First, the Bill of Rights does not confer rights to individuals. The rights already exist - the Bill of Rights just reiterates them. That's why there is no mention of "the people have the right to _______." The rights are unalienable, and the first ten amendments just set specific restrictions on what the government can do.

Now, to address the lack of a mention of "right to privacy:" that is irrelevant because many other unalienable right are excluded from the Bill of Rights. There is no mention of the right to get married, the right choose where you live, etc... The first 8 amendments were deemed necesary to set specific limits on the government, and the ninth amendment covers remaining rights not mentioned in the first 8:

quote:
The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.


So, again, how is privacy not a right?


And, if Privacy is a right, and it is guaranteed, by the IV Amendment, "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." Note that the people are to be secure in their persons
And finally that X Amendment, the one you did not mention: "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."

What we have here is Republicans, demanding a weak republic of independent states, and Democrats, seeking a republic of interdependent states, with individual rights equal throughout all the states.
quote:
It would seem, on the surface, that the right to LIFE is the preeminent right. That would encompass the right to ANY and all of the latest medical advances, and full access to medical care. What else do you need to know?


You have the right to seek the latest in medical advances as much as you have the right to seek the latest model of new cars. No one can stop you from purchasing these things. You don't have a right to have them for free just because they exist.
quote:
Originally posted by Karl Leuba:
It would seem, on the surface, that the right to LIFE is the preeminent right. That would encompass the right to ANY and all of the latest medical advances, and full access to medical care. What else do you need to know?
Let's say I smoke 3 packs a day for 40 years and develop lung cancer. It's my right to demand every medical 'advance' be used to treat my disease?

Many people in large cities have access to 'better' care - or at least more adavnced equipment. People should not have to travel more than X miles to have access to EVERY advanced piece of medical equipment? How far? Who pays for all of this?

As I recently read: If you have the right to health care, who has the duty to pay for it? If you have the right to cash for your clunker, who has the duty to pay for it? In inventing new rights for all Americans, the government makes a promise it cannot keep except by violating the natural rights of some Americans.
quote:
Originally posted by dolemitejb:
quote:
It would seem, on the surface, that the right to LIFE is the preeminent right. That would encompass the right to ANY and all of the latest medical advances, and full access to medical care. What else do you need to know?


You have the right to seek the latest in medical advances as much as you have the right to seek the latest model of new cars. No one can stop you from purchasing these things. You don't have a right to have them for free just because they exist.


That is a concept that is totally foreign to millions of people in this country. I'm sure even old lyndie johnson didn't expect it to get THIS bad.
quote:
Originally posted by dolemitejb:
quote:
"Compatible" doesn't mean it's in there. Sorry.


First, the Bill of Rights does not confer rights to individuals. The rights already exist - the Bill of Rights just reiterates them. That's why there is no mention of "the people have the right to _______." The rights are unalienable, and the first ten amendments just set specific restrictions on what the government can do.

Now, to address the lack of a mention of "right to privacy:" that is irrelevant because many other unalienable right are excluded from the Bill of Rights. There is no mention of the right to get married, the right choose where you live, etc... The first 8 amendments were deemed necesary to set specific limits on the government, and the ninth amendment covers remaining rights not mentioned in the first 8:

quote:
The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.


So, again, how is privacy not a right?


Sure, privacy is a given. I'm sure they never intended for a "right to privacy" to mean a right to kill a baby. Wouldn't you agree?
quote:
Sure, privacy is a given. I'm sure they never intended for a "right to privacy" to mean a right to kill a baby. Wouldn't you agree?


Well, that's really a whole different issue. I fundamentally agree that the SCOTUS was far over-reaching in Roe V Wade, but that really is more of a beef with the SCOTUS, and has nothing to do with whether or not we have a fundamental right to privacy.
quote:
Originally posted by dolemitejb:
quote:
Sure, privacy is a given. I'm sure they never intended for a "right to privacy" to mean a right to kill a baby. Wouldn't you agree?


Well, that's really a whole different issue. I fundamentally agree that the SCOTUS was far over-reaching in Roe V Wade, but that really is more of a beef with the SCOTUS, and has nothing to do with whether or not we have a fundamental right to privacy.


As far as I've seen, that's the only problem most people have with the right to privacy. It's only exercise is from people defending baby-killing.
quote:
Originally posted by ka-0-hub:
"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" is one of the most famous phrases in the United States Declaration of Independence, and considered by some as part of one of the most well crafted, influential sentences in the history of the English language. These three aspects are listed among the "unalienable rights" or sovereign rights of man.....Wikipedia



It's hard to live and be happy if you are sick,dead,or deep in debt from hospital bills?


We are also created equally. What you do after being created is up to the individual. Life is not fair or easy. Survival of the fittest is not just something that happens on the African plains. A person can choose to get an education then a job. Through hard work and desire a person can climb to higher positions with better pay. Or, he can choose to be lazy, blame everything for his predicament, and expect the government to support him. That is what life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness is all about. I don't feel compelled to support those who choose not to pursue happiness.
quote:
Originally posted by ka-0-hub:
quote:
Originally posted by ka-0-hub:
"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" is one of the most famous phrases in the United States Declaration of Independence, and considered by some as part of one of the most well crafted, influential sentences in the history of the English language. These three aspects are listed among the "unalienable rights" or sovereign rights of man.....Wikipedia



It's hard to live and be happy if you are sick,dead,or deep in debt from hospital bills?




The title of this thread is a question. My post merely answers the question. If you don't like the answer ,better take it up with the Founding Fathers. That's who you all are fond of quoting.Thats what "Fundamental Conservatism" is all about. Isn't it?


The title is a question...and the body of the post quoted from The Judge is the answer to what a right is...

I'm not sure what your reference to the founding fathers is...but they certainly would not support your notion of:

"It's hard to live and be happy if you are sick,dead,or deep in debt from hospital bills?"

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