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Written as a compliment to Hitchens, who may not be with us much longer.

How long as humankind been around? Some say as long as 250,000 years, others more like 100,000 years. Let's take the conservative value of 100,000 years.

For 97,000 of those years, god regarded his ultimate creation with folded arms. We often died in childbirth, or our mothers did. Few of us survived childhood, and those of us who did lived to about 40, if they were lucky. Dental disease, ignorance of sanitation, and other things our primitive ancestors could not have imagined killed us slowly, painfully, and in the youth of our ancestors.

But about 3000 years ago, God said "Enough, it's time to intervene. And the best way to do this is by a human sacrifice in the illiterate, backwards Levantine. Not China or India, where people could write, No, but in a savage backwater of the Roman Empire that even Rome despised."

And so a human sacrifice that was sufficient to God did the trick. Of course, it was not much of a sacrifice, since the sacrificed arose two days later, but let's not split hairs.

But human sacrifice it was. This is totally OT stuff. Blood and death pleases god. In this situation, however, the sacrifice was of himself, to himself, and fairly temporary (He arose). Jesus, presumably knowing he would arise, sacrificed little. Certainly he sacrificed less than the thousands of other "criminals" similarly sacrificed for whom death was final.


What thinking person can accept this? What person of self-respect can allow vicarious redemption of his/her sins, especially on such thin grounds? One may be forgiven for sins, but one cannot say they did not happen, that there is no responsibility for them. And one can only really be forgiven for sins by those affected, not Jesus, who allegedly took all sins onto himself. That concept is not only fantastic, but immoral.

It's madness.

C.S. Lewis wrote that either Jesus was the son of god or a madman. His preachments, Jesus, that is, to abandon responsibility for the morrow, to leave one's family, to live for only the moment were either the preachings of a totally mad person who thought the world was coming to a prophesied end Very Soon, or the words of god. Poor Lewis, he never could finish a syllogism, and he concluded that Jesus was god. Even though the end of the world eluded him.

It gets better. From what was Jesus supposed to redeem us? Hell? Jesus invented Hell. The OT does not curse unbelievers to Hell, that is a NT invention, and a somewhat more advanced recognition of the human response to the carrot/stick reaction. The Prince of Peace invented the most hateful, violent, and despicable institution imaginable.

So much for his love for us all.

The Christian idea of Original Sin is now obviously absurd. Fundamentalists, and their moderate enablers, cite Eve's Fall as the source of this hateful and wicked institution. We all know now that there was no Eden, nor were there literal Adam and Eve. The story is metaphorical, at best.

The time has come to regard life, the universe, and everything for what the are. This is why atheism is growing so quickly. It's liberating. Atheism strips away the mind-forged manacles of superstition and allows the mind to function honestly.

We know the story of Noah's Ark is fiction. It belongs in the book between Rapunzel and Hansel-and-Gretel. The data are known, and the conclusions are iron-clad.

Now is the time to free yourself, and especially your children, from the self-imposed slavery of religion. The Hubble Telescope is a far, far, more impressive and humbling instrument than the Bible could ever be.

nsns

Make time for great justice.  Expect us.

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quote:
Of course, it was not much of a sacrifice, since the sacrificed arose two days later, but let's not split hairs.



NSNS,

sir, it was clearly THREE days. THREE, Friday nightm Saturday night then sunday. OK, that;s not three days, more like two,

but still, the inerrant literal bible says THREE days just like jonah spent three days in the whale's belly.

THREE,

either way, not much of a sacrifice to inherit control of a whole universe.
quote:
Originally posted by Unobtanium:
quote:
Of course, it was not much of a sacrifice, since the sacrificed arose two days later, but let's not split hairs.



NSNS,

sir, it was clearly THREE days. THREE, Friday nightm Saturday night then sunday. OK, that;s not three days, more like two,

but still, the inerrant literal bible says THREE days just like jonah spent three days in the whale's belly.

THREE,

either way, not much of a sacrifice to inherit control of a whole universe.


It was 3 days and 3 nights....that is what the bible claims. Just like Jonah, right. So lets count again. Friday around sunset (so we will go a head and count that as a day and night) then Saturday (day and night 2) then Sunday morning he arose!!! That's.....wait a minute...thats not 3 days and 3 nights?!?!?!

Ok lets start again......
quote:
Originally posted by DarkAngel:
quote:
Originally posted by buffalo:
Dark nagel,

The person that wrote the first half of that post and the second half were two different souls.

Deep needs to somehow find his way back home where we can look after him.


Home? And who are you referring to with "we"?


you would be best served by going ahead and putting buffy on ignore now.
it's a rare thing for him to write something that makes sence, much less something that is relevent to the topic at hand.
quote:
Originally posted by Unobtanium:
quote:
Of course, it was not much of a sacrifice, since the sacrificed arose two days later, but let's not split hairs.



NSNS,

sir, it was clearly THREE days. THREE, Friday nightm Saturday night then sunday. OK, that;s not three days, more like two,

but still, the inerrant literal bible says THREE days just like jonah spent three days in the whale's belly.

THREE,

either way, not much of a sacrifice to inherit control of a whole universe.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOrgLj9lOwk

Enjoy!

nsns
Scripture repeatedly states Jesus Christ rose on the third day! So
which day is presented as 'the third day'?


Luke 24:12 But Peter arose and ran to the tomb; and stooping
down, he saw the linen cloths lying by themselves;
and he departed, marveling to himself at what had
happened.
:13 Now behold, two of them were traveling that same day
to a village called Emmaus, which was about seven
miles from Jerusalem.

:15 So it was, while they conversed and reasoned, that
Jesus Himself drew near and went with them.

:17 And He said to them, "What kind of conversation
is this that you have with one another as you walk
and are sad?"

:19 ... And they said to Him, "The things concerning
Jesus of Nazareth, who was a Prophet mighty in deed
and word before God and all the people,
:20 "and how the chief priests and our rulers
delivered Him to be condemned to death, and
crucified Him.
:21 But we were hoping that it was He who was going
to redeem Israel. Indeed, besides all this, today
is the third day since these things happened".


Jesus Christ met and talked with the two apostles traveling to Emmaus on
the afternoon of the same day that His resurrection was first apparent to
His disciples. This day, was the day following the weekly Sabbath.


This Sunday is described in Luke 24:21 as the 'third day since', suggesting
Sunday was the prophesied 'third day' of resurrection. Luke 24:21 uses the
word 'since', however, one should keep in mind the Bible in counting days
normally counts inclusively, ie without the implication of such notions as
'since' or 'after'.
Here is what Jesus said in Matt 12:39,40

39But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:

40For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.


Even if you want to count Sunday as a whole day how do you get 3 nights? Also, 35-37 hours does not even come close to 3 days and nights. Just curious about this contradiction found in the bible. Of course I have been told by a few here that they do not exist. Obviously they do.
We all knew you were the author of the whole thing deep but waxing philosophical interrupted by ejaculations of nonsense about Cdot Sdot Lewis, a telescope and hell sandwiched in between left me with the fear you were unable to continue a train of thought for over short periods.

The “we” Darknagel? I would certainly take a turn walking him in the park.
quote:
Originally posted by DarkAngel:
Here is what Jesus said in Matt 12:39,40

39But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:

40For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.


Even if you want to count Sunday as a whole day how do you get 3 nights? Also, 35-37 hours does not even come close to 3 days and nights. Just curious about this contradiction found in the bible. Of course I have been told by a few here that they do not exist. Obviously they do.


Several thinking people who know a bit about ancient cultures and modes of expression have fully answered your old stale challenge:

http://www.examiner.com/method...-3-days-and-3-nights
quote:
Originally posted by beternU:
quote:
Originally posted by DarkAngel:
Here is what Jesus said in Matt 12:39,40

39But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:

40For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.


Even if you want to count Sunday as a whole day how do you get 3 nights? Also, 35-37 hours does not even come close to 3 days and nights. Just curious about this contradiction found in the bible. Of course I have been told by a few here that they do not exist. Obviously they do.


Several thinking people who know a bit about ancient cultures and modes of expression have fully answered your old stale challenge:

http://www.examiner.com/method...-3-days-and-3-nights


still doesnt add up, better, as DA said, the bible says he will suffer 3 days and three nights. he suffered friday night, saturday night and dies on sunday. no third night no matter how you cut it.

this is, of cousrse, assuming the story of jesus isn't just another retelling of much older and very similar crucifition stories of men/gods.
quote:
Originally posted by beternU:
quote:
Originally posted by DarkAngel:
Here is what Jesus said in Matt 12:39,40

39But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:

40For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.


Even if you want to count Sunday as a whole day how do you get 3 nights? Also, 35-37 hours does not even come close to 3 days and nights. Just curious about this contradiction found in the bible. Of course I have been told by a few here that they do not exist. Obviously they do.


Several thinking people who know a bit about ancient cultures and modes of expression have fully answered your old stale challenge:

http://www.examiner.com/method...-3-days-and-3-nights


So I read your link. They basically said what I and others have been saying all along. The bible in not the literal, inerrant, word of God.

I like the way these thinking people seem to know what Matthew and Jesus REALLY meant. If they are right, then that would mean that the bible doesn't always mean what it says. So maybe it wasn't really 6 days to create the world and then he rested on the 7th. Maybe he didn't really mean repent and be baptized to be saved.

Seriously the whole thing is neither here nor there. The bible is a work of fiction put together by a bunch of ancient men who picked and chose from even more ancient writings what they wanted to put in this "book of Gods words" Most of this stuff was written so long after the supposed savior had died for all our sins that it was hear say at best. More than likely just a play on other more ancient stories that had came before. It sure does steal pretty liberally from some others I can think of. Mithra comes to mind.

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