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Originally Posted by JimiHendrix:
Originally Posted by FirenzeVeritas:

Jimi, you seem to have some trouble with reading comprehension. Do you believe man evolved from a cell planted from outer space (in whatever manner) or from inorganic matter innate to earth? Simple question.

Yes, a simple question from a simple-minded person. Look up either-or fallacy.

 

So oh great and wise jimi, what is the answer if you don't like A or B?

Originally Posted by DarkAngel:
Originally Posted by FirenzeVeritas:
Originally Posted by DarkAngel:
Originally Posted by FirenzeVeritas:

As far as studying evolution, I have a minor in biology and a BS in nursing. That's quite a few science courses, many of which more than touched on evolution.

Really? So how did you NOT know that evolution is a fact just as gravity? Why did you confuse origin of life with evolution? I'm not trying to be a smart az about it, I am truly confused on how you went through college and got a degree in nursing, yet still don't understand what evolution is.

If you will read my initial question, it is two parts. 1. Which version of the initial one cell organism do you accept. You did not answer that. Uno did quite well. 2. Where did this cell come from? We have no answers so far.

 

As for education...my genetics prof? A Methodist who did not believe in evolution at all. Neither did my Botany I or Micro or A&P II. As I stated in another topic, the only professor I had at three institutions who stressed evolution was an English prof. All these men were brilliant in different ways and ensured their students received a well-rounded education.

I would be pizzed at the lack of education/information I recieved at a college where I paid money to be taught REAL science. Wow. I hate that for you. It is sad that so many teachers these days put their own bias into what they teach. Evolution is a fact, not up for someone in a professor position to decide he or she just don't want to believe it so they won't teach it.

 

I did answer your question in my first response. I don't think any of the origination ideas have enough evidence, as of yet, to make a decision. So I wait.

It's a tragedy and a failure of modernity that someone can claim a bachelor of science in nursing with a minor in biology or similar and not understand the scientific theory of evolution. That several science professors at the college level can express rejection of evolutionary facts is just an embarrassment to our country.

Originally Posted by skippy delepepper:
Originally Posted by JimiHendrix:
Originally Posted by Jennifer:

Hey jimi, wanna see something funny? Google Jimi Hendrix in Huntsville.

You have obviously mistaken me for someone who wants to see something funny. If you think it's funny, I am not interested.

Why ya so uptight Jimbo?

 

Skippy

 

His Obama Garanimals are dirty and he has to wear Spongebob jammies.

Originally Posted by b50m:

They have to associate with a church, true, but if they didn't, no one could homeschool...

Tell me why you think this would be so.

 

btw, religiously based daycares can eschew all regulation and supervision in this state solely because they're religious, to the detriment and even demise of some of our state's children. That's crap too. These and more are the type of things that rub atheists the wrong way. The unconstitutional state intrusion in it's citizen's lives by the promotion of and support for certain religions to the exclusion of the rest of the populace.

I know exactly why it is true. To be able to homeschool your own child in the State OF Alabama, you have two options.

You have to opt out of public school for religious reasons and have a church cover school.

You have a teacher's certification from the state.

There are not any other options.

 

You can always pay for a private school if you have the funds.

Originally Posted by b50m:

I know exactly why it is true. To be able to homeschool your own child in the State OF Alabama, you have two options.

You have to opt out of public school for religious reasons and have a church cover school.

You have a teacher's certification from the state.

There are not any other options.

 

You can always pay for a private school if you have the funds.

Right. Again a religious reason is the only acceptable reason to opt out.

Originally Posted by A. Robustus:
Originally Posted by b50m:

I know exactly why it is true. To be able to homeschool your own child in the State OF Alabama, you have two options.

You have to opt out of public school for religious reasons and have a church cover school.

You have a teacher's certification from the state.

There are not any other options.

 

You can always pay for a private school if you have the funds.

Right. Again a religious reason is the only acceptable reason to opt out.

 

 

And so many wonder why we are angry.

 

The only way to home school my own children is to claim a religion or have a teaching degree! I really wish I knew some atheist couple that would be willing to challenge this in our state. It needs to be done. Of course it would put them in the hot seat in a state that can be quite scary if you publicly announce your atheism. With children to think about it makes it hard for a couple to put themselves out there like that.

Originally Posted by DarkAngel:
Originally Posted by A. Robustus:
Originally Posted by b50m:

I know exactly why it is true. To be able to homeschool your own child in the State OF Alabama, you have two options.

You have to opt out of public school for religious reasons and have a church cover school.

You have a teacher's certification from the state.

There are not any other options.

 

You can always pay for a private school if you have the funds.

Right. Again a religious reason is the only acceptable reason to opt out.

 

 

And so many wonder why we are angry.

 

The only way to home school my own children is to claim a religion or have a teaching degree! I really wish I knew some atheist couple that would be willing to challenge this in our state. It needs to be done. Of course it would put them in the hot seat in a state that can be quite scary if you publicly announce your atheism. With children to think about it makes it hard for a couple to put themselves out there like that.

If you move to Tennessee, you only have one option, teaching degree.

What really ****es the the folks off about "Home Schooling" is how well the student score opposed to those who took the public route. What drives so many to consider home schools and private schools is when the see someone like Jimi. Just my opinion mind you. Public school did apparently teach Jimi something though, how to call someone stupid and the like but now that first and second grade is covered I wonder what he did for the remaining time? I'm still waiting for the folks to answer the initial questions ask about what sparked all life in the first place. Since, as some have remarked, it's so undeniable fact you would think they, above all others could provide the answer.
Originally Posted by b50m:
Originally Posted by JimiHendrix:
Originally Posted by FirenzeVeritas:

Jimi, you seem to have some trouble with reading comprehension. Do you believe man evolved from a cell planted from outer space (in whatever manner) or from inorganic matter innate to earth? Simple question.

Yes, a simple question from a simple-minded person. Look up either-or fallacy.

 

So oh great and wise jimi, what is the answer if you don't like A or B?

The answer is far too complicated for your feeble mind to grasp.

Originally Posted by gbrk:
 I'm still waiting for the folks to answer the initial questions ask about what sparked all life in the first place. Since, as some have remarked, it's so undeniable fact you would think they, above all others could provide the answer.

 

Did you read the thread before you posted? No one knows for sure what "sparked" life. I don't know any intelligent people who would state at this point in time that they knew "undeniably" how it started. I only know one group of people that say things like that, and it is not the atheist. Evolution is undeniable, origin is still an unanswered question. Even though we have some pretty viable and reasonable ideas. Its a wait and see kind of thing at this point.

Originally Posted by DarkAngel:

Really? So how did you NOT know that evolution is a fact just as gravity? Why did you confuse origin of life with evolution? I'm not trying to be a smart az about it, I am truly confused on how you went through college and got a degree in nursing, yet still don't understand what evolution is.

Originally Posted by semiannualchick:

Another good question, B. You're on a roll today.

Originally Posted by DarkAngel:

On behalf of myself and B, I say thank you.

Oops...my bad....sorry.

First, I'm an alumna of UNA, Calhoun, & UAH. I'm sure they're all reeling from the pronouncement that their education is substandard, but perhaps with time they'll get over it.

 

Despite having syllibi for their courses, professors are able to do just that--profess what they wish, whether it be creation or the John Birch Society (and most UNA grads know who that was).

 

AR, I do understand the basic teachings of evolution, I just don't unconditionally accept it, and certainly not without divine guidance. Evolution as taught is conjoined with the origin of life since, if we discount the alien life theory/premise, then cellular life evolved from the inert. Many things evolve, not just biological entities. For an inanimate particle to become organic, it evolved/changed.

 

Just a random thought: As I conduct my day to day activities, I meet many individuals. I have no idea if they are atheist or agnostic, if they believe in evolution or not. I do get a pretty quick take on their ability to conjugate. Uno represents his beliefs/tenets/etc. quite well. Road Puppy is both humorous and interesting as always. Sadly those who show no insight or curiosity of their own do not come across as well.

Originally Posted by Jennifer:

GB, who said what was an undeniable fact?  And settling on the idea it was a man that was "always there" and not questioning where that man came from is a true lack of curiosity. I've never been satisfied with "just cause" as an answer.

 

 

 

I've figured it out. Your Ol' Man got you a computer to keep you outa' HIS hair all day...

Every day.

Nice move there..."Mr Jennifer".

Originally Posted by FirenzeVeritas:

 surely you must have a desire to know the origin of that first cell, to know the origin of the inert material that produced that cell and still composes our planet.


You betcha I want to know!   But there are some questions that we may never know.  The very first molecule that reproduced itself,  or the first bit of floatsom did not leave a fossil that we can study, It didn't impact the environment, didn't leave a DNA sample.  It was far too tiny to leave anyhting but the legacy of intelligent life we now enjoy.  I'm afraid the only way we will ever know for sure is to invent a time machine that would let us see it in action.

But what we can do is study various ways of how it might have come about. Transpermia, volcanic vents, primordial soup and, yes, even a vastly intelligent alien Presence that seeded the planet.  Perhaps so advance that we would perceive it as "godlike,"

I simply see no need to assert "magic" where physics and chemistry explain things as well as can be until we invent a time machine.

Originally Posted by Winston Niles Rumfoord:

How many of you "believe" that the universe, space, and time, popped out of nothing in an instant?

 

That's what orthodox science purports. 


That is not what "orthodox science" purports.  And this extreme ignorance of current understanding comes from a self professed "geologist"?  Really?

There are a few but you would dismiss them all unob. No point is going over all that again.

The professors at UNA told my son that they noticed homeschool kids already have the ability to read, study, and grasp information better than the kids from public school who had the answers handed to them so they could   ' teach to the test.'

 

Now you can believe what ever you want to.

 

Here is a list of reguirements by state.

http://www.hslda.org/laws/default.asp

Last edited by b50m

I'll give you one.  You can look up the rest.

 

Can Homeschoolers Do Well in College?

http://moneywatch.bnet.com/spe...ell-in-college/2551/



Here are some of Cogan’s findings:

    Homeschool students earned a higher ACT score (26.5) versus 25.0 for other incoming freshmen.
    Homeschool students earned more college credits (14.7) prior to their freshmen year than other students (6.0).
    Homeschooled freshmen were less likely to live on campus (72.4%) than the rest of the freshmen class (92.7%).
    Homeschoolers were more likely to identify themselves as Roman Catholic (68.4%).
    Homeschool freshmen earned a higher grade points average (3.37) their first semester in college compared with the other freshmen (3.08).
    Homeschool students finished their freshmen year with a better GPA (3.41) than the rest of their class (3.12).
    The GPA advantage was still present when homeschoolers were college seniors. Their average GPA was 3.46 versus 3.16 for other seniors.
    Homeschool students graduated from college at a higher rate (66.7%) than their peers (57.5%).

Originally Posted by FirenzeVeritas:

First, I'm an alumna of UNA, Calhoun, & UAH. I'm sure they're all reeling from the pronouncement that their education is substandard, but perhaps with time they'll get over it.

 

 

 

I don't know when you attended UAH but I think Dr. Boyd (Genetic Development) would be shocked to here you received an education there in the sciences and were not taught evolution as a scientific theory.  Dr. Leahy (microbiology) would be reeling as you said.

 

I'm sorry you didn't get the answers you wanted out of us. I too think Uno did great and I didn't see anything that anyone needed to add to that. When you start with a question that lacks the understanding or suggest a fallacy of the subject you are speaking of, it makes it hard to answer. Since no one knows how life originated I personally am not going to start making broad statements as to which ideas I believe in. Mostly because I don't believe in ANY of them yet. I do find a couple more plausible than others. At one time the Miller/Urey experiment was the end all be all, not so much anymore. So I try not to jump to conclusions.

 

Yes I am very curious about it.  I just don't see the need to start proclaiming which hypothesis I find more evidenced when the jury is still out.

 

I am totally amused by this thread.

 

First of all, the spontaneity claim as you admitted in your opening statement had a cause therefore it was not spontaneous. I agree with you that there was a cause.

 

The only tested theory comes from an eye witness account found in Genesis.

 

From the posts here on this thread I see no depth of knowledge on the subject that would require any other than the 6k package with a book of instructions as a satisfactory companion in your quest for answers.

 

Originally Posted by Jennifer:

GB, who said what was an undeniable fact?  And settling on the idea it was a man that was "always there" and not questioning where that man came from is a true lack of curiosity. I've never been satisfied with "just cause" as an answer.

Actually there should have been one name pop up in your mind when I mentioned that for although there may be others that fell that way I was only referring to one.   Jimi.  He made such a statement in one of his replies.

Originally Posted by b50m:

I'll give you one.  You can look up the rest.

 

Can Homeschoolers Do Well in College?

http://moneywatch.bnet.com/spe...ell-in-college/2551/



Here are some of Cogan’s findings:

    Homeschool students earned a higher ACT score (26.5) versus 25.0 for other incoming freshmen.
    Homeschool students earned more college credits (14.7) prior to their freshmen year than other students (6.0).
    Homeschooled freshmen were less likely to live on campus (72.4%) than the rest of the freshmen class (92.7%).
    Homeschoolers were more likely to identify themselves as Roman Catholic (68.4%).
    Homeschool freshmen earned a higher grade points average (3.37) their first semester in college compared with the other freshmen (3.08).
    Homeschool students finished their freshmen year with a better GPA (3.41) than the rest of their class (3.12).
    The GPA advantage was still present when homeschoolers were college seniors. Their average GPA was 3.46 versus 3.16 for other seniors.
    Homeschool students graduated from college at a higher rate (66.7%) than their peers (57.5%).

 

 

I've no reason to doubt any of those.  But you are comparing apples to elephants.  Yes, ON AVERAGE, private/home schooled kids do better compared to the AVERAGE of public.  But if you compare the SAME DEMOGRAPHIC the differences evaporate.

 

How this obvious point can consistently be ignored is simply beyond my reasoning powers.

Originally Posted by FirenzeVeritas:

AR, I do understand the basic teachings of evolution, I just don't unconditionally accept it, and certainly not without divine guidance. Evolution as taught is conjoined with the origin of life since, if we discount the alien life theory/premise, then cellular life evolved from the inert. Many things evolve, not just biological entities. For an inanimate particle to become organic, it evolved/changed.

FV,

By the tone you set with this thread is it not even clear that you understand what a scientific theory is. And if you understood the basics of evolutionary theory (they're not teachings) you would know that it states nothing about the origin of all life. It appears from your writing that you think the scientific theory of evolution explains a whole lot of things which it does not, and that may be causing you to reject something that is quite different from what you think it is based on what you misunderstand and the implications you think it has on the way you choose to view the world due to your religious beliefs. If so, you are not alone in this. Our part of the country is awash in misinformation and ignorance about science, as evidenced, in part, by your schooling experience. The mistaken premises you are starting from are far too common. I don't think believers and non can have an apples to apples conversation about evolution or other matters until we're on the same plane. Until then, you guys are only confronting a straw man.

Originally Posted by DarkAngel:
Originally Posted by FirenzeVeritas:

First, I'm an alumna of UNA, Calhoun, & UAH. I'm sure they're all reeling from the pronouncement that their education is substandard, but perhaps with time they'll get over it.

 

 

 

I don't know when you attended UAH but I think Dr. Boyd (Genetic Development) would be shocked to here you received an education there in the sciences and were not taught evolution as a scientific theory.  Dr. Leahy (microbiology) would be reeling as you said.

 

I'm sorry you didn't get the answers you wanted out of us. I too think Uno did great and I didn't see anything that anyone needed to add to that. When you start with a question that lacks the understanding or suggest a fallacy of the subject you are speaking of, it makes it hard to answer. Since no one knows how life originated I personally am not going to start making broad statements as to which ideas I believe in. Mostly because I don't believe in ANY of them yet. I do find a couple more plausible than others. At one time the Miller/Urey experiment was the end all be all, not so much anymore. So I try not to jump to conclusions.

 

Yes I am very curious about it.  I just don't see the need to start proclaiming which hypothesis I find more evidenced when the jury is still out.

In the interest of clarity, I received my biology minor at UNA when I received my degree in English. Any other biology GERS needed for nursing were taken at Calhoun. I took strictly nursing and history courses at UAH--no biology for those degrees. I'll inject two of the strongest "creationists" were a Muslim and a Jew, with the interesting sidelight that in the class of the Jewish prof, one was not allowed to say "creationism," since to her is was comparable to a believer in a higher power saying they believed in "godism." There was a creation, but no creationism.

 

Of course, I can further shock you by the treatment of a fellow nursing student there. Our Professional Practice 101 prof told him she had no use for him since he was homosexual.

 

Actually, I think most answered to the best of their ability and intelligence and that was all I asked.

Originally Posted by JimiHendrix:
Originally Posted by b50m:

I've no reason to doubt any of those.  But you are comparing apples to elephants.  Yes, ON AVERAGE, private/home schooled kids do better compared to the AVERAGE of public.  But if you compare the SAME DEMOGRAPHIC the differences evaporate.

 

Prove that.

Disprove it.

LOL, he posted it, he has to prove it.  I already put up info for my opinion. You got anything to add here jimi, or you just blowing through again?

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