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As some may know, our family is moving to Tuscumbia after 29 yrs in GA so I can be part of a church family in Muscle Shoals. I have been in Muscle Shoals for a church conference and then for a couple of days to buy a house. Just wondering if anyone else would do this or has ever done this too. (Not speaking of having a job at a church but being a lay member)
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quote:
Tuscumbia after 29 yrs in GA so I can be part of a church family in Muscle Shoals.


One would think that one would receive a direct answer from one's deity if one asked.

My suggestion would be to kinda sorta maybe make a smallish humble attempt to DISCUSS THIS WITH YOUR FAMILY instead of some strangers on the internet.

But, as usual, that might just be me.
quote:
Originally posted by Cookey:
quote:
Tuscumbia after 29 yrs in GA so I can be part of a church family in Muscle Shoals.


One would think that one would receive a direct answer from one's deity if one asked.

My suggestion would be to kinda sorta maybe make a smallish humble attempt to DISCUSS THIS WITH YOUR FAMILY instead of some strangers on the internet.

But, as usual, that might just be me.


Something tells me this individual is the "head" of HIS household and need not consult with them about such decisions. Probably headed for "Six Flags Over Jesus" - or what ever Jeff
Noblett's place is called these days.

"Grace Life Church" - I looked it up. Not a single woman on the entire website.
Last edited by meanasasnake
quote:
Originally posted by dlytle:
quote:
It sounds "cult like" to me.



What leads you to say that, meanasasnake?


When you move hundreds of miles to a specific "church" there has to be a reason. What are you looking for? Who are you "following"? Are there not any nice, Christian churches in Georgia? Is it indeed the church I suspected it was?
The vestry and members and the Bishop of Alabama are the "head" of Trinity Parish and all Episcopal churches in the US. The members vote on the rector, he/she swears her/his allegiance to the bishop and signs a contract the vestry draws up in the name of the congregation.

NO Methodist or Episcopal congregation is under the control of anyone save ultimately the bishops, the conference/convention and the congregation. The priests and minister perform sacerdotal, teaching, and pastoral duties, not lead, that is the bishops' job.

If there are problems with the bishops, they have to answer to the Conference/Convention and the national House of Bishops. It is like a constitutional monarchy, not a " pure democracy" or an oligarchy as are found in some Protestant churches.

The Lutherans and Presbyterians have similar setups, the Presbyterians, of course, have presbyters and elders and not bishops as have the others mentioned.

p.s. I miss Father Tim.
quote:
Originally posted by dlytle:
As some may know, our family is moving to Tuscumbia after 29 yrs in GA so I can be part of a church family in Muscle Shoals. I have been in Muscle Shoals for a church conference and then for a couple of days to buy a house. Just wondering if anyone else would do this or has ever done this too. (Not speaking of having a job at a church but being a lay member)


Welcome, dlytle! Thrilled to have you!! Smiler
quote:
Originally posted by dlytle:
As some may know, our family is moving to Tuscumbia after 29 yrs in GA so I can be part of a church family in Muscle Shoals. I have been in Muscle Shoals for a church conference and then for a couple of days to buy a house. Just wondering if anyone else would do this or has ever done this too. (Not speaking of having a job at a church but being a lay member)

As a Preacher's kid -- this is something I dealt with all my life. We went where dad went and didn't have a say-so in it. Now, as an adult and making my own choices -- if I think God wants me to go somewhere else -- then yes, I would consider it...so long as it's not a Jim JOnes cult or anything...Many people move for their jobs -- why not for your faith?
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Originally posted by Ron P.:
No way I'd ever move for a church. That being said I think someone from Trinity needs to wait about 3-4 more years before criticizing the head of a church. Wink


I love our Priest, Bishop Parsley AND Katharine Jefferts Schori,our Presiding Bishop. Of course I have no issue with women Priests or Bishops in the church - that being the intent of your inane remark. It fell short considering I did not "criticize" the head of any "church".
Move for a church? No way. Wait . . . Is the church paying for the move? Is the church hiring me for a significant salary increase? Nah, I still wouldn't trust them.

WARNING - Before you move make sure you have a job in the area. Jobs aren't exactly plentiful and most people don't live off of honey and locusts these days. In fact, getting the honey could land you in jail for trespassing.
quote:
Originally posted by Neal Hughes: The vestry and members and the Bishop of Alabama are the "head" of Trinity Parish and all Episcopal churches in the US. The members vote on the rector, he/she swears her/his allegiance to the bishop and signs a contract the vestry draws up in the name of the congregation.

NO Methodist or Episcopal congregation is under the control of anyone save ultimately the bishops, the conference/convention and the congregation. The priests and minister perform sacerdotal, teaching, and pastoral duties, not lead, that is the bishops' job.

If there are problems with the bishops, they have to answer to the Conference/Convention and the national House of Bishops. It is like a constitutional monarchy, not a " pure democracy" or an oligarchy as are found in some Protestant churches.

The Lutherans and Presbyterians have similar setups, the Presbyterians, of course, have presbyters and elders and not bishops as have the others mentioned.

p.s. I miss Father Tim.

Hi all,

Just curious; did anyone else notice that God and Jesus Christ were not mentioned AT ALL in this chain of command? Neal tells us, "The vestry and members and the Bishop of Alabama are the "head" of Trinity Parish and all Episcopal churches in the US."

Silly me. All these years I have always thought it was God's church and that Jesus Christ is "head" of the church. If we take a close look at 1 Corinthians 11:3, Ephesians 1:22, Ephesians 4:15 -- and then even closer at Ephesians 5:23, ". . . As Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body." -- we appear to be at odds with Neal's church, or, at least, Neal's vision of his church.

Neal, you tell us, "The members vote on the rector, he/she swears her/his allegiance to the bishop and signs a contract the vestry draws up in the name of the congregation."

You are advocating swearing allegiance to a man -- not to God; you are advocating signing a contract with an organization -- but, no mention of God. Where does God, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Bible -- fit into your religion?

Be careful, my Friend, that you do not get so caught up in the "works of your church" -- that you totally exclude God.

I am reminded of the story of the "economically challenged" -- i.e., poor man, who went into an affluent local church to worship. The people in the congregation were aghast at his ragged clothing. After the service, the minister told him that he is welcomed in their church -- but, next week, please wear more appropriate clothing.

The next week, the poor man came for worship again; still wearing his only clothing -- old, tattered. Once again the minister chastised him, "Didn't I tell you that you should dress more appropriately to worship here? You should pray about your situation."

The poor man told the minister, "Sir, this week I spent much time in prayer; asking Jesus Christ what I should do -- and how I should dress to worship in your church."

"And," asked the minister somewhat impatiently.

Jesus told me, "I don't know. I have never been invited into that church either."

Neal, have you and your church leaders ever thought about inviting God and Jesus Christ into your church?

Just a thought.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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quote:
Originally posted by Bill Gray:
quote:
Originally posted by Neal Hughes: The vestry and members and the Bishop of Alabama are the "head" of Trinity Parish and all Episcopal churches in the US. The members vote on the rector, he/she swears her/his allegiance to the bishop and signs a contract the vestry draws up in the name of the congregation.


NO Methodist or Episcopal congregation is under the control of anyone save ultimately the bishops, the conference/convention and the congregation. The priests and minister perform sacerdotal, teaching, and pastoral duties, not lead, that is the bishops' job.

If there are problems with the bishops, they have to answer to the Conference/Convention and the national House of Bishops. It is like a constitutional monarchy, not a " pure democracy" or an oligarchy as are found in some Protestant churches.

The Lutherans and Presbyterians have similar setups, the Presbyterians, of course, have presbyters and elders and not bishops as have the others mentioned.

p.s. I miss Father Tim.

Hi all,

Just curious; did anyone else notice that God and Jesus Christ were not mentioned AT ALL in this chain of command? Neal tells us, "The vestry and members and the Bishop of Alabama are the "head" of Trinity Parish and all Episcopal churches in the US."

Silly me. All these years I have always thought it was God's church and that Jesus Christ is "head" of the church. If we take a close look at 1 Corinthians 11:3, Ephesians 1:22, Ephesians 4:15 -- and then even closer at Ephesians 5:23, ". . . As Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body." -- we appear to be at odds with Neal's church, or, at least, Neal's vision of his church.

Neal, you tell us, "The members vote on the rector, he/she swears her/his allegiance to the bishop and signs a contract the vestry draws up in the name of the congregation."

You are advocating swearing allegiance to a man -- not to God; you are advocating signing a contract with an organization -- but, no mention of God. Where does God, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Bible -- fit into your religion?

Be careful, my Friend, that you do not get so caught up in the "works of your church" -- that you totally exclude God.

I am reminded of the story of the "economically challenged" -- i.e., poor man, who went into an affluent local church to worship. The people in the congregation were aghast at his ragged clothing. After the service, the minister told him that he is welcomed in their church -- but, next week, please wear more appropriate clothing.

The next week, the poor man came for worship again; still wearing his only clothing -- old, tattered. Once again the minister chastised him, "Didn't I tell you that you should dress more appropriately to worship here? You should pray about your situation."

The poor man told the minister, "Sir, this week I spent much time in prayer; asking Jesus Christ what I should do -- and how I should dress to worship in your church."

"And," asked the minister somewhat impatiently.

Jesus told me, "I don't know. I have never been invited into that church either."

Neal, have you and your church leaders ever thought about inviting God and Jesus Christ into your church?

Just a thought.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill


Bill, blow it out your ear. Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

It should go without saying that God is the head of all churches, whatever the denomination. Neal was just explaining the human hierachy. Roll Eyes
quote:
Originally posted by Rather-b-fishin:
Would You Move for a Church?

No,but I am thinking of moving to Hunstville if the Shoals doesn't open a strip club.

Hi Rather,

Thank you for your proposed suggestion to improve the Shoals area. Of course, I am speaking of your proposed move out of the Shoals and to Huntsville. Just a thought -- but, maybe New York would fit you better. That is a place where you can find anything.

As I said, just a thought. But, thanks again for your Shoals Improvement Goal.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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Originally posted by autumn1964:
Bill, blow it out your ear. It should go without saying that God is the head of all churches, whatever the denomination. Neal was just explaining the human hierachy.

Hi Autumn,

Your eloquence and articulation are admirable.

Yes, it should go without saying that God, i.e., Jesus Christ, is head of the church. And, given that, we do not need a human hierarchy nor a contract with an organization to worship God.

God gave us the Holy Spirit and the Bible to teach, guide, and convict us. Nowhere in the Bible does He gives us a liturgical chain of command and contracts to sign -- to be saved.

All we need is defined in Ephesians 2:8-9,"For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, that no one should boast."

That seems very clear, straight forward, and to the point -- by the grace of God, through faith in Jesus Christ -- we are saved. No mention of contracts, liturgies, robes, bishops, chain of commands, etc. That stuff is all works -- and, you cannot "work" your way into heaven.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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Originally posted by Bill Gray:
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Originally posted by Rather-b-fishin:
Would You Move for a Church?

No,but I am thinking of moving to Hunstville if the Shoals doesn't open a strip club.

Hi Rather,

Thank you for your proposed suggestion to improve the Shoals area. Of course, I am speaking of your proposed move out of the Shoals and to Huntsville. Just a thought -- but, maybe New York would fit you better. That is a place where you can find anything.

As I said, just a thought. But, thanks again for your Shoals Improvement Goal.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill


Hey Bill Bray,it was a joke.Thanks for making Christians look like uptight *******es.
quote:
Originally posted by Rather-b-fishin:
Hey Bill Bray,it was a joke.Thanks for making Christians look like uptight *******es.

Hi Rather,

It appears that you are the reincarnation of another Friend. What's wrong; do you need multiple names to spread your dislike of Christians? When one is using multiple names; it is much like lying -- you always have to keep track of previous lies -- so that you don't fall into your own pits. Your Freudian slip is showing.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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Last edited by Bill Gray
Yes I would move for a church. One of the biggest blessings Christ gives the believer is fellowship in the body. That body should be guarding truth at all costs.We learn from Paul that men- even from among ourselves- will slip in and teach perverse things, distorting the Gospel and causing blasphemy. We can see that in America through prosperity preaching to all sorts of falsehoods, some claiming homosexuality is not a sin and even being led by those who remain in that lifestyle of sin and are double-tongued. Paul and other early church leaders suffered for Truth. Godly churches will also suffer for truth. But the pure Gospel of Jesus Christ is worth more than all the treasures of Egypt. I know that many Christians are frustrated with hearing how to have their best life now or trying to find their driven purpose, but Scripture is enough. Preach the Word-in season and out. Blessings.
quote:
Originally posted by bettybornagain:
Yes I would move for a church. One of the biggest blessings Christ gives the believer is fellowship in the body. That body should be guarding truth at all costs. We learn from Paul that men- even from among ourselves -- will slip in and teach perverse things, distorting the Gospel, and causing blasphemy. We can see that in America through prosperity preaching to all sorts of falsehoods, some claiming homosexuality is not a sin and even being led by those who remain in that lifestyle of sin and are double-tongued. Paul and other early church leaders suffered for Truth. Godly churches will also suffer for truth. But the pure Gospel of Jesus Christ is worth more than all the treasures of Egypt. I know that many Christians are frustrated with hearing how to have their best life now or trying to find their driven purpose, but Scripture is enough. Preach the Word-in season and out. Blessings.

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Originally posted by meanasasnake: Bill, Your nastiness is showing. The Southern Baptist Convention has a president does it not? I attended a Baptist College and I can tell you that the invisible "hierarchy" exists in that Church as well as in all others. Once again, you are trying to divide rather than unite - although you would claim to the contrary.

Hi Mean,

No, not being nasty. Just stating that I would not be part of ANY church which told me that I must honor and follow a man. Yes, the different Baptist conventions, including the Southern Baptist, do have organizations to offer help and leadership to members and member churches. However, those organizations are figure head only -- they do not control nor set law for any Baptist church. That is one desirable trait of Baptist churches -- they are autonomous, meaning that the local church determines what will and will not happen in that local church.

This, of course, does have some drawbacks, i.e., there are some Baptist churches, in the Southern Baptist as well as other Baptist conventions, which have lady pastors. Then, there is the Cooperative Baptist Convention, Jimmy Carter's group -- which is extremely liberal in that respect and in many other areas. But, praise God, there is only one Cooperative Baptist Convention.

On the whole, none of the Baptist conventions have a hierarchy which governs the denomination. If they did; I would choose to be non-denominational -- for I will honor and follow only Jesus Christ. I respect many pastors and church leaders -- but, I also will not hesitate to disagree with them when I feel they are wrong.

In Acts 17:11, the apostle Paul tells us of the church in Berea, "Now these were more noble-minded than those in Thessalonica, for they received the word with great eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily to see whether these things were so."

And, we are encouraged to do the same, be like the Bereans -- test what our teachers and leaders tell us -- against what Scripture teaches us.

Often, I have gone to pastors and asked why they taught a specific passage as they had done. At times, when they explained, I agreed with them. At other times, I did not agree with their understanding and told them so; yet, we never divided over it -- just agreed to disagree.

So, no Mean, I was not being nasty -- just questioning why Neal's comments about church leadership and rule -- never once mentioned God nor Jesus Christ. No matter what -- we can never leave Them out and still have a Christian church. No, I am not trying to divide; just to make sure we are all on the same page -- with God included in all aspects of our worship and fellowship.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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Originally posted by LMM: Bill, You never answered the question. Would YOU move to another area just to attend a specific church???????????

Hi LMM,

That depends. I have chosen to attend specific churches because I felt that God could use me there. About ten years ago, we lived in Orange County; but, felt that God wanted us in the new church in Corona. Later, we moved to the area and have been here for ten years. During the first part of the time, we had a strong desire to move to North San Diego County to set up a Bible Study/Music Ministry. Yet, because we felt that God wanted us in the Corona church, we stayed. One day, God willing, we still want to do that Bible Study/Music Ministry in North San Diego County.

Would I move to another state just to attend a specific church? That all depends upon what God puts on my heart. I would not do it of my own volition; but, I would follow His lead and His guidance. How would I know if it is God's will? Pray, pray, pray -- then, listen, listen, listen. If I have made a decision and I feel at peace with that decision -- then, I can be sure that is God's will. However, if tomorrow, or next week, or next month -- I pray about the situation and do not feel at ease with it -- then, I know that God has given me a new direction.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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Originally posted by Ron P.:
I'm talking about your last Priest. Need I say more?


Dear sanctimonious prig going by the style of Bill Gray, Slave of God:

My Dearest Cloacal Lowness: May it please Your Cloacal Lowness to be informed that this lowly imperfect Prayerbook Reading, whiskey drinking, kneeling when not standing and rarely sitting it seems pseudo-Christian was referring to the above referenced quotation and nothing more or less when you gave us our beloved daily ex cathedra infallible Bull, and this lowly heretic does not mean to imply either meaning of the term when not meaning a male of the species bovine, although it is actually fitting at times. Therefore me, in my humble attitude not rapture rapture self must clarify why this lowly individual did not mention Our Lord at all in reply.
When we meet, must I in order to follow protocol kiss your ring or your cloven hoof or your forked tail, because I think your C.L. might be enjoined to kiss my (as the French so cleverly term it) "Coul" in greeting.

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